SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Apr 16, 2015 13:12:14 GMT -5
"Trying to be Beyonce but failing miserably"? I don't see the unnecessary comparison, but nevertheless "Four Five Seconds" was/is significantly bigger than everything on 4 - the first album where Beyonce moved from pop, & all but "Drunk On Love" on her recent self-titled. "Bitch Better Have My Money" has potential to do better than "Flawless" & "Partition" (its already out-peaked both on the Hot 100) which are the comparable urban singles if we're going to make this comparison. "Bitch" is climbing the urban and rhythmic charts strongly and has remained stable just outside the top 10 on iTunes..with a video, it'll surely return even without pop support. How is she failing miserably? They might not be up to the chart standards of RIHANNA'S first singles, but It's clear that goals are different this go around and the material is far more left lane of top 40 radio. She is still making waves on social media and critics with the release of each new piece of music, and I think most here will be surprised to see how this direction will be rewarded in the future. I'm sure there's a "Rude Boy" somewhere on the album anyway for those looking exclusively for a top 40 smash to deem the project a success unfortunately. I don't like Beyoncé either. But at the same time, I understand how songs like Drunk in Love, Partition, and Flawless were considered "good" urban songs. They eventually clicked with me cuz there was an element of catchiness or melody, even when that genre is not of interest to me. So I get that it was a quality album in the urban genre. FFS was ok, eventually clicked but nothing I would ever buy or purposely listen to. BBHMM won't ever click with me, and American Oxygen isn't even a song. It's more like an interlude or something. I can't imagine hearing it 1000's of times on the radio. So to me, it seems she is trying to pull a Beyoncé, but the quality is not there. None of it is catchy enough.
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Disco🌶️📖
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Post by Disco🌶️📖 on Apr 16, 2015 13:21:08 GMT -5
I really love this! It's so unexpected.
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Glove Slap
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Post by Glove Slap on Apr 16, 2015 13:22:06 GMT -5
I think this would have more potential at this format if it was remixed a bit for a radio version.
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 16, 2015 13:23:47 GMT -5
"Trying to be Beyonce but failing miserably"? I don't see the unnecessary comparison, but nevertheless "Four Five Seconds" was/is significantly bigger than everything on 4 - the first album where Beyonce moved from pop, & all but "Drunk On Love" on her recent self-titled. "Bitch Better Have My Money" has potential to do better than "Flawless" & "Partition" (its already out-peaked both on the Hot 100) which are the comparable urban singles if we're going to make this comparison. "Bitch" is climbing the urban and rhythmic charts strongly and has remained stable just outside the top 10 on iTunes..with a video, it'll surely return even without pop support. I think SPREE meant Bey's Beyoncé (Album) era not 4's....which I agree also. And I think its more of a Kanye thing than a Rihanna idea. This whole era, so far, does seem like they are trying to pull a Beyoncé, musically. IMO
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jjose712
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Post by jjose712 on Apr 16, 2015 13:24:28 GMT -5
Well, no. In my opinion the worst first three releases of a Rihanna's album.
45S benefited from being her first release in a good while, but she is going to improve her game if she wants another hit this era
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skizzo
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Post by skizzo on Apr 16, 2015 13:57:00 GMT -5
This is all kinds of meh. So far I've liked nothing from this era.
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Wave.
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Post by Wave. on Apr 16, 2015 14:03:50 GMT -5
@touch, make a mix and send it to radio.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2015 14:46:36 GMT -5
I have to admit the "trying to be Beyonce" criticism is somewhat amusing, since I distinctly remember some people (not necessarily here, but in general) accusing Beyonce's self-titled of being full of a bunch of Rihanna wanna-bes/rejects. Comparisons are inevitable when you're in the same genre, likely have the same taste in music, and often work with the same producers all the time...but maybe, just maybe, that is where the comparisons should begin and end. I doubt either one would ever say that she is trying to be the other. In fact they both probably go out of their way to try to put their own touch on whatever they're offered.
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 16, 2015 15:03:31 GMT -5
I have to admit the "trying to be Beyonce" criticism is somewhat amusing, since I distinctly remember some people (not necessarily here, but in general) accusing Beyonce's self-titled of being full of a bunch of Rihanna wanna-bes/rejects. Comparisons are inevitable when you're in the same genre, likely have the same taste in music, and often work with the same producers all the time...but maybe, just maybe, that is where the comparisons should begin and end. I doubt either one would ever say that she is trying to be the other. In fact they both probably go out of their way to try to put their own touch on whatever they're offered. I really do think that Kanye is the one who pulled the strings though...not Riri. I think he wants Riri to follow in her footsteps and make a splash the way Bey did with the album Beyoncé. But ofcourse its all speculation.
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hitseeker.
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Post by hitseeker. on Apr 16, 2015 15:17:24 GMT -5
I have to admit the "trying to be Beyonce" criticism is somewhat amusing, since I distinctly remember some people (not necessarily here, but in general) accusing Beyonce's self-titled of being full of a bunch of Rihanna wanna-bes/rejects. Comparisons are inevitable when you're in the same genre, likely have the same taste in music, and often work with the same producers all the time...but maybe, just maybe, that is where the comparisons should begin and end. I doubt either one would ever say that she is trying to be the other. In fact they both probably go out of their way to try to put their own touch on whatever they're offered. I really do think that Kanye is the one who pulled the strings though...not Riri. I think he wants Riri to follow in her footsteps and make a splash the way Bey did with the album Beyoncé. But ofcourse its all speculation. I understand it may feel that way, but Rihanna is 10 years into her career and I feel she is making a lot of her decisions by herself. She is in more control of her career more than ever now. I'm not saying it's you, but I've seen people pretty much saying Kanye and Jay Z are forcing her and brainwashing her and stuff LMAO. She's putting out these songs because she likes them and if she's happy, then I'm happy for her. I also don't think she's really after the chart success this time around or this era would have been handled differently. If the album flops or underperforms, she can easily recover and it'll be a learning experience. With that being said, however, I do not like her silence this era and that's the main thing throwing people off. She could say something about the album besides "coming soon". People criticise her and the era and are confused because they don't know what the hell is going on and I can't really say I blame them entirely, lmao. I'll wait for the album to come and the era to unfold more to draw my conclusions on how it was.
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Spidey
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Post by Spidey on Apr 16, 2015 15:33:55 GMT -5
iTunes:
17 Rihanna - American Oxygen 0.1451
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hitseeker.
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Post by hitseeker. on Apr 16, 2015 15:43:19 GMT -5
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Post by when the pawn... on Apr 16, 2015 15:49:38 GMT -5
Meh for me. The best thing about it is the title. The title is epic. But the song just sits there. She's obviously going for the artist/career thing on this album. IMO, FFS was a good execution of that - totally left of center, unexpected and grew to be an actual hit. This falls short - it's nice that she wants to do something political/message-driven but there's no substance in the lyrics, her vocal or the production. Maybe it'll grow on me like the first two singles did but it's my least favorite on my first couple listens.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 16, 2015 15:55:32 GMT -5
I have to admit the "trying to be Beyonce" criticism is somewhat amusing, since I distinctly remember some people (not necessarily here, but in general) accusing Beyonce's self-titled of being full of a bunch of Rihanna wanna-bes/rejects. Comparisons are inevitable when you're in the same genre, likely have the same taste in music, and often work with the same producers all the time...but maybe, just maybe, that is where the comparisons should begin and end. I doubt either one would ever say that she is trying to be the other. In fact they both probably go out of their way to try to put their own touch on whatever they're offered. I really do think that Kanye is the one who pulled the strings though...not Riri. I think he wants Riri to follow in her footsteps and make a splash the way Bey did with the album Beyoncé. But ofcourse its all speculation. If that's the case I think it's less about Ri and more about Kanye's own ego...he wants to be able to say he produced an instant 'classic.' (I also think he's desperate to glom onto anyone relevant who will let him within 10 feet, and Rihanna in particular because of the respect she seems to have from the fashion industry elite. That says a lot about his insecurities about his place in the A-list world.) What Kanye doesn't realize is that when Beyonce made the waves it did, Beyonce herself got much of that credit. You don't actually hear much said about the producers and writers and that is because she very much owned that era, married herself with its vision instead of letting herself be seen as someone else's outlet. So if R8 were to have the same effect, Rihanna is the one who is going to get that shine, not Yeezy. It works in the inverse too; when a project flops it is rare for people to blame the people behind the scenes, the artist is the first one to get thrown under the bus for it. Of course, I don't know that this album is going to be on that high a level, but I do think Rihanna genuinely likes the music she has chosen. She threw damn near her entire discography under the bus for this, lol.
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Nicolexo
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Post by Nicolexo on Apr 16, 2015 16:59:27 GMT -5
Guess I'm in the minority but I love this track. Easily the best track from the era for me. The other two have been disappointments though and I think BBHMM is straight up trash, so I'm glad I at least like something. I hope this does well! I'm curious to hear what the radio edit will sound like.
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¤ Matthea ¤
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Post by ¤ Matthea ¤ on Apr 16, 2015 17:09:58 GMT -5
I like this more than 45S and BBHMM, but I'm not sure about this being a single. I can't imagine this song getting 15 thousand spins on CHR weekly.
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Pollen
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Post by Pollen on Apr 16, 2015 18:41:52 GMT -5
...0 for 3...
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lancey
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Post by lancey on Apr 16, 2015 23:24:10 GMT -5
This quickly went from I kinda like it to next single please... What's happening to Riri ?
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SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Apr 17, 2015 0:00:04 GMT -5
The thing is, Rihanna is the kind of artist who CAN have multiple flops and recover no problem cuz of her work ethic, or at least that's how it used to be.
But then:
First the wait was 2 years, now the material is subpar. The next project will be a long while from now. That's a long time in today's standards for keeping momentum. I don't think people are willing to wait. Of course there will always be stans, but if this era goes the way it has been going, the fanbase will decrease, not increase. TEOM eras don't come around too often. Of course she can rebound, and most likely will, but it almost feels like she is peaking, and there is an Ariana or whoever else ready to take her place amongst the young listening crowd.
Hopefully there is a "Rude Boy" on the album. She definitely needs it.
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Kishi KCM
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Post by Kishi KCM on Apr 17, 2015 0:38:52 GMT -5
Leave Beyonce out of this thread please, don't bring that in here!
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hitseeker.
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Post by hitseeker. on Apr 17, 2015 2:06:20 GMT -5
The thing is, Rihanna is the kind of artist who CAN have multiple flops and recover no problem cuz of her work ethic, or at least that's how it used to be. But then: First the wait was 2 years, now the material is subpar. The next project will be a long while from now. That's a long time in today's standards for keeping momentum. I don't think people are willing to wait. Of course there will always be stans, but if this era goes the way it has been going, the fanbase will decrease, not increase. TEOM eras don't come around too often. Of course she can rebound, and most likely will, but it almost feels like she is peaking, and there is an Ariana or whoever else ready to take her place amongst the young listening crowd. Hopefully there is a "Rude Boy" on the album. She definitely needs it. The material being subpar is just your opinion. The rest of the album isn't even out yet. I also find it funny people criticise albums like Loud for having generic tracks and her for releasing Right Now and now are thirsty for a pop song or a "Rude Boy", lmao. I feel like we stans care more about charts on these boards than Rihanna does. She probably does not give a s**t, lmao. She already has 13 #1's and is putting out songs she feels happy about and that she likes. She's trying other sounds and experimenting and that's what I want for her and I'm happy for her. And why do you always bring other artists when talking about Rihanna? This is Rihanna, not Ariana or Beyoncé.
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YourFaveIsAFlop
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Post by YourFaveIsAFlop on Apr 17, 2015 6:21:45 GMT -5
The thing is, Rihanna is the kind of artist who CAN have multiple flops and recover no problem cuz of her work ethic, or at least that's how it used to be. But then: First the wait was 2 years, now the material is subpar. The next project will be a long while from now. That's a long time in today's standards for keeping momentum. I don't think people are willing to wait. Of course there will always be stans, but if this era goes the way it has been going, the fanbase will decrease, not increase. TEOM eras don't come around too often. Of course she can rebound, and most likely will, but it almost feels like she is peaking, and there is an Ariana or whoever else ready to take her place amongst the young listening crowd. You mean with constant media interest and successful singles? Yeah,what an awful era...
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jjose712
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Post by jjose712 on Apr 17, 2015 7:31:08 GMT -5
I remember a blind item months ago about a delying album because the label was not happy with the material of the diva, i'm starting wondering if it was about Rih (i hope not becuase that was the less negative thing about the item).
It's true Rihanna is able to recover of a flop like nobody else, or even several flops. But a flop album is a very different story (right now there's no reason to think the album will be a flop). If one of her albums has to flop, this is not the best one to do it, because she waited more than usual to release it.
I think now it's more difficult to be completly done just because an album fails. We have tons of examples in the past of incredibly successful singers who were done after an album flopped (from Cyndi Lauper to Paula Abdul) in fact the rare thing was survive to a big flop (Pink did it in the most spectacular way, because everything looked like she was bound to fail for a good while). But in my opinion unless there's problems with the label and it pulls the support, and artist now has more chances to recover. For example i don't think Kesha or Gaga are done at all.
The problem here is if Rih is unable to have a hit from this album, 45S is a legit hit, but frankly she could release almost anything at that time and become that kind of hit, because radio really was waiting for her new material. She was always surrounded of good songwriters, so there's no reason to think she has noone on the bag to release.
I wouldn't mind a flop or two if the material were interesting (some of my favourite Rih's songs weren't hits) and that's my problem here, none of the three singles are particulary interesting or good.
We'll see how radio receive this. It's Rihanna so probably they will give it a chance, and maybe the song it's even a grower
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Wave.
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Post by Wave. on Apr 17, 2015 7:33:50 GMT -5
#15 on iTunes.
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ILLUSION
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Post by ILLUSION on Apr 17, 2015 9:51:42 GMT -5
This won't do anything on Pop. I'm going to predict a Top 30 peak.
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awwHALEnahh
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Post by awwHALEnahh on Apr 17, 2015 10:02:29 GMT -5
I honestly love this song, but I can't help but think this would have been the perfect album opener for UA transitioning into Diamonds.
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MiniMusic
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Post by MiniMusic on Apr 17, 2015 10:39:38 GMT -5
RE the discussion about how people complain when she releases "generic" albums like Loud and then complain when she releases something left-field like her new material; I think the problem is not that the music isn't as successful as her past projects, the problem is the music is just not very good. To me, her material on Unapologetic was interesting, different, catchy and pretty much perfect. She was releasing tracks that catered to the commercial public but were also just great tracks in general, and in my opinion, not generic. What set Rihanna apart from the rest of the girls is that she always loved to experiment, "We Found Love" and "Diamonds" are great examples of her not taking the typical route (at the time) and going for a new sound, except that the music was GOOD. Now she's going completely left-field with her sound but the melodies are not there, the hooks are not there, the songs are just not good. I don't like how people use the phrases "experimental" and "doing something different" to defend her new music and then call her old stuff generic just because it was successful. Success is not equivalent to being generic or catering to the masses. She's shown that multiple times because most of her biggest songs were pretty different than what was going on musically at the time (Don't Stop the Music, anyone?).
TL;DR : The people saying she should get back to working with her old team are not saying she should go back to being "generic". IMO, Rihanna usually set trends musically and was always ahead of the curve with her tracks. We want melodies, hooks, and awesome music in general. "Bitch Better Have My Money" is an example of something that is just... not even different? I don't find that track different at all. It sounds like all the other urban mess that came out from 2014 to now.
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allow that
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Post by allow that on Apr 17, 2015 10:50:18 GMT -5
RE the discussion about how people complain when she releases "generic" albums like Loud and then complain when she releases something left-field like her new material; If I may? I've been hoping for a left field Rihanna album for a while now. But the problem is this is left field and WEAK. I've missed Rihanna's absence more than most but "45S" is non-listenable for me, "BBHMM" is fun but less than an instant replay, and "American Oxygen" is pleasant but lacks any punch. I think when many of us say we want "left field" it's to say we want Rihanna to introduce new sounds or draw inspiration in her music from some untapped underground genre, but to make it catchy and accessible in her trademark way. None of these new singles are anything new or innovative... they're simply a "different direction." And, most of all, they're not particularly infectious.
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MiniMusic
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Post by MiniMusic on Apr 17, 2015 10:54:29 GMT -5
RE the discussion about how people complain when she releases "generic" albums like Loud and then complain when she releases something left-field like her new material; If I may? I've been hoping for a left field Rihanna album for a while now. But the problem is this is left field and WEAK. I've missed Rihanna's absence more than most but "45S" is non-listenable for me, "BBHMM" is fun but less than an instant replay, and "American Oxygen" is pleasant but lacks any punch. I think when many of us say we want "left field" it's to say we want Rihanna to introduce new sounds or draw inspiration in her music from some untapped underground genre, but to make it catchy and accessible in her trademark way. None of these new singles are anything new or innovative... they're simply a "different direction." And, most of all, they're not particularly infectious. I don't know if you read the rest of my post, but that is literally what I said LOL. But yes, I agree! It's a weak different direction, and it's especially disappointing because of the fact that she usually does songs that aren't what is expected of her anyway, and they are usually great. So for her to try to go REALLY even more different than she usually does, and for it to be no good, is disappointing.
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SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Apr 17, 2015 10:56:10 GMT -5
Diamonds is a perfect example of something totally unexpected and having that wow factor. That intro alone. Gotta give her props on that one.
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