Eloqueen™
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Post by Eloqueen™ on Sept 19, 2018 13:44:47 GMT -5
Seriously though, why the references to gun violence in the first verse? They seem disconnected from the rest of the song, unless that actually is the message she's trying to send. Because gun violence speaks to the general sense of the presence of hate in the world today, which would signify the need for and lack of more.....love? It kinda is what the whole song is about. Love conquering hate. That is the sentiment here. With that said, I am not about to get into a long discussion of dissection on this, as I find it to be a tad much to begin with, so this will be my last response.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2018 14:16:06 GMT -5
I’m sure the very first thing the writers thought to do upon sitting down to write this was, “How do we combine a message of unity & love with something that carries the dilemma of gun violence in this country, in order to manipulate both situations for our own gain?” Because everyone listening to this song has been on the wrong end of a gun at least once in their life, right? I know I can't even walk to McDonald's without someone pointing a gun at me. Here we go again with you not being able to relate to song automatically meaning it is worthless. There are other people in the world who do experience things, so just because you haven't doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Do you have eyes, ears, or anything to let you know that literally things happen?
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Ten Pound Hammer
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Post by Ten Pound Hammer on Sept 19, 2018 14:34:04 GMT -5
Because everyone listening to this song has been on the wrong end of a gun at least once in their life, right? I know I can't even walk to McDonald's without someone pointing a gun at me. Here we go again with you not being able to relate to song automatically meaning it is worthless. There are other people in the world who do experience things, so just because you haven't doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Do you have eyes, ears, or anything to let you know that literally things happen? How many listeners of this song do YOU think have been directly impacted by gun violence? As in they, or a close relative, has literally had a gun pointed at their person. I would bet the number doesn't even reach five digits. Maybe not even four.
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Kat5Kind
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Post by Kat5Kind on Sept 19, 2018 14:37:00 GMT -5
You have serious empathy issues.
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14887fan
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Post by 14887fan on Sept 19, 2018 14:45:27 GMT -5
Here we go again with you not being able to relate to song automatically meaning it is worthless. There are other people in the world who do experience things, so just because you haven't doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Do you have eyes, ears, or anything to let you know that literally things happen? How many listeners of this song do YOU think have been directly impacted by gun violence? As in they, or a close relative, has literally had a gun pointed at their person. I would bet the number doesn't even reach five digits. Maybe not even four. Not that it took this post to prove it (it was proven several posts back already), but you've missed the entire point of this song. I'm so sorry that 4 fragmented lines of a song have you in such a significant personal bind.
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Ten Pound Hammer
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Post by Ten Pound Hammer on Sept 19, 2018 14:47:19 GMT -5
Not that it took this post to prove it (it was proven several posts back already), but you've missed the entire point of this song. I'm so sorry that 4 fragmented lines of a song have you in such a significant personal bind. Okay, then why is the gun stuff even in the song? What is the point of the rest of the song besides its thuddingly obvious "Good > evil" message that we've already heard 40 billion times?
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14887fan
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Post by 14887fan on Sept 19, 2018 14:57:24 GMT -5
Not that it took this post to prove it (it was proven several posts back already), but you've missed the entire point of this song. I'm so sorry that 4 fragmented lines of a song have you in such a significant personal bind. Okay, then why is the gun stuff even in the song? What is the point of the rest of the song besides its thuddingly obvious "Good > evil" message that we've already heard 40 billion times? Because gun violence is one of the biggest issues this country deals with on a daily basis. "Politics & prejudice." It's literally the next line that follows. How is this even a discussion? You're finding the silliest issue in the smallest part of a very generic song. Yes, got it. You don't like cliches, and you've heard the message of this song 40 billion times before. But to sit here and imply that she/her team are manipulating, glorifying, or unnecessarily discussing gun violence in a song that talks about how the world needs a little more empathy, is obnoxious.
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Ten Pound Hammer
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Post by Ten Pound Hammer on Sept 19, 2018 15:33:51 GMT -5
Okay, then why is the gun stuff even in the song? What is the point of the rest of the song besides its thuddingly obvious "Good > evil" message that we've already heard 40 billion times? Because gun violence is one of the biggest issues this country deals with on a daily basis. "Politics & prejudice." It's literally the next line that follows. How is this even a discussion? You're finding the silliest issue in the smallest part of a very generic song. Yes, got it. You don't like cliches, and you've heard the message of this song 40 billion times before. But to sit here and imply that she/her team are manipulating, glorifying, or unnecessarily discussing gun violence in a song that talks about how the world needs a little more empathy, is obnoxious. That's because it's the only part of the song that gives me anything to discuss besides how cliched it is
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Post by Naos on Sept 19, 2018 15:34:02 GMT -5
Not only are the gun violence points spot-on, I also have to point out there have been a rise in hate crimes over the past couple of years. One of the few crimes that aren't going down. Anti-black hate crimes have stabilized, while anti-white and anti-Muslim have been reported to be on the rise. When all of these should be going down. Stopping prejudice, and hate, and promoting love, care, and empathy is part of stopping hate crimes. Showing that we are all equal. Hence "Love Wins". Is it incredibly broad? Sure. But that was the intention. Not everything needs to be some big specific statement. Tension is high, and hate is more prevalent than it's been in a while.
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Post by countryisking on Sept 19, 2018 15:39:26 GMT -5
Not only are the gun violence points spot-on, I also have to point out there have been a rise in hate crimes over the past couple of years. One of the few that aren't going down. Anti-black hate crimes have stabilized, while anti-white and anti-Muslim have been reported to be on the rise. When all of this should be going down. Stopping prejudice, and hate, and promoting love, care, and empathy is part of stopping hate crimes. Showing that we are all equal. Hence "Love Wins". Is it incredibly broad? Sure. But that was the intention. Not everything needs to be some big specific statement. Tension is high, and hate is more prevalent than it's been in a while. I echo this 100%. Yes the song is basic, vague, and cliche. But so what? How can we legitimately find fault in this topic? Is it cliche to say "I love you" to your significant other on a regular basis? Is it cliche to eat breakfast every morning? I just see no problem with this message delivered over and over in new musical ways.
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musicfix18
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Post by musicfix18 on Sept 19, 2018 15:47:51 GMT -5
Yea, personally I wish she was doing just another bro country song ala @allmalecountrysingers; we have too many songs about love on the radio these days! And to top it off, the song is full of cliches that make me SO.ANGRY. because they are about love! and not girls getting drunk in cutoff jeans!!!! w.t.f.
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matty005
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Post by matty005 on Sept 19, 2018 15:49:09 GMT -5
Not only are the gun violence points spot-on, I also have to point out there have been a rise in hate crimes over the past couple of years. One of the few that aren't going down. Anti-black hate crimes have stabilized, while anti-white and anti-Muslim have been reported to be on the rise. When all of this should be going down. Stopping prejudice, and hate, and promoting love, care, and empathy is part of stopping hate crimes. Showing that we are all equal. Hence "Love Wins". Is it incredibly broad? Sure. But that was the intention. Not everything needs to be some big specific statement. Tension is high, and hate is more prevalent than it's been in a while. I echo this 100%. Yes the song is basic, vague, and cliche. But so what? How can we legitimately find fault in this topic? Is it cliche to say "I love you" to your significant other on a regular basis? Is it cliche to eat breakfast every morning? I just see no problem with this message delivered over and over in new musical ways. Just to play devils advocate here, I will post similar to what I posted in the Kenny Chesney, "Get Along," thread. Yes, of course, to love all is a great message. No one should say otherwise. However, it's not just super easy to love all. If you were born non white, you probably have dealt with daily comments either directed to you or read about stories about your race online being treated unfairly. Can you see how someone who hasn't been dealt such a great hand (this isn't addressing you specifically... we all have had things in our lives that we have had to deal with - but most not on a daily basis only because the color of our skin) might find it annoying that someone is telling them to, "love everyone?" If only it were that easy. Now with that said, I still want this song to do well. I want the message out. Because it's a start. It's a start to maybe some of those Carrie fans that think gay people shouldn't get married that hey, maybe I am wrong. But, like I said before, I just wish it was that easy.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2018 16:25:25 GMT -5
Here we go again with you not being able to relate to song automatically meaning it is worthless. There are other people in the world who do experience things, so just because you haven't doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Do you have eyes, ears, or anything to let you know that literally things happen? How many listeners of this song do YOU think have been directly impacted by gun violence? As in they, or a close relative, has literally had a gun pointed at their person. I would bet the number doesn't even reach five digits. Maybe not even four. You're something else.
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SHOOTER
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Post by SHOOTER on Sept 19, 2018 16:30:11 GMT -5
An accurate title for every post I’ve ever seen from that troll that somehow continues to thrive without being directly fed. Amazing commitment to brand.
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Ten Pound Hammer
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Post by Ten Pound Hammer on Sept 19, 2018 17:41:10 GMT -5
I echo this 100%. Yes the song is basic, vague, and cliche. But so what? How can we legitimately find fault in this topic? Is it cliche to say "I love you" to your significant other on a regular basis? YES IT IS. I literally do not know a single person who has been affected by a hate crime. Not a single person. I don't know anyone who's even OWNED a gun. I think that specifics speak better than broad-strokes genericness ever will. Remember how angry I was at "Life Changes" at first? Then I came around to enjoy it when I realized that it used specifics and detail to get its message across. That made me realize the underlying personality and uniqueness in which that song delivered its message. But this song, other than the throwaway line about shooting, there is no specificity. There is no detail. There is no HEART. It's just a bunch of platitudes that a fuckton of other songs before it have used, oftentimes verbatim. Because it's so broad-stroke, there are no details that anyone can latch onto and identify with.
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matty005
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Post by matty005 on Sept 19, 2018 17:47:40 GMT -5
An accurate title for every post I’ve ever seen from that troll that somehow continues to thrive without being directly fed. Amazing commitment to brand. I don't think that's fair. I usually disagree with him on most of his posts, but to call him troll is flat out wrong, and also is disrespectful. If others can talk about every single Carrie performance as "the best ever!11!1!" and call almost every new song, "a masterpiece," "perfection," "here to steal wigs," (whatever the F that means) then I can put up with him not liking a song (and giving the reasons why). Isn't that what a message board is about? I don't agree with him here, but you're wrong calling him a troll.
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Post by Naos on Sept 19, 2018 17:59:03 GMT -5
YES IT IS. I literally do not know a single person who has been affected by a hate crime. Not a single person. I don't know anyone who's even OWNED a gun. I think that specifics speak better than broad-strokes genericness ever will. Remember how angry I was at "Life Changes" at first? Then I came around to enjoy it when I realized that it used specifics and detail to get its message across. That made me realize the underlying personality and uniqueness in which that song delivered its message. But this song, other than the throwaway line about shooting, there is no specificity. There is no detail. There is no HEART. It's just a bunch of platitudes that a fuckton of other songs before it have used, oftentimes verbatim. Because it's so broad-stroke, there are no details that anyone can latch onto and identify with. "Life Changes" was a personal song to Rhett speaking about his life specifically. The same can't be said for Underwood. She's speaking from the outside, and it's difficult to get the same message from an outsider that you could from someone who actually experienced it. It doesn't matter if you don't know anyone who's been a victim or owned a gun. It wouldn't matter if you did. It's completely anecdotal. A friend of my brother was killed in a drive-by. Doesn't mean it means anymore to me than anyone else. You don't have to specifically relate to a song for it to work. And yes, I remember your ranting about "Life Changes". I believe you said there was no relatability. And then when someone makes a song a lot in the country can relate to (the United States is the only developed nation where gun violence is a major issue and happens at the frequency it does), you bitch about it. You seem to want some middle ground of relating to everyone and no one. You want detail, and then when you get it you're like "no one can relate to this!". Sure, it can't relate to someone in Japan, where gun murders are in the single digits (though you could make an argument from the hate part), a lot of people in the United States CAN connect to it, and the numbers show. There are far more generic songs out there like "Fight Song", or "Roar", or even "Brave". And the latter is held by plenty to be a pretty good self-esteem anthem. I don't see why the same can't be said here. I wasn't expecting a story about little Janey and her friends being gunned down in a school or something.
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.indulgecountry
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Post by .indulgecountry on Sept 19, 2018 18:18:55 GMT -5
An accurate title for every post I’ve ever seen from that troll that somehow continues to thrive without being directly fed. Amazing commitment to brand. I don't think that's fair. I usually disagree with him on most of his posts, but to call him troll is flat out wrong, and also is disrespectful. If others can talk about every single Carrie performance as "the best ever!11!1!" and call almost every new song, "a masterpiece," "perfection," "here to steal wigs," (whatever the F that means) then I can put up with him not liking a song (and giving the reasons why). Isn't that what a message board is about? I don't agree with him here, but you're wrong calling him a troll. There's a wrong and a right way to go about voicing opinions on a song, and I definitely think finding a way to derail threads (i.e. this is not a one-time instance that can be isolated to the "Love Wins" thread) in order to re-iterate said opinion with posts like "[citation needed]" and "this song sucks because idk anyone who owns a gun personally" are... not the right way to go about it.
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Ten Pound Hammer
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Post by Ten Pound Hammer on Sept 19, 2018 18:29:44 GMT -5
"Life Changes" was a personal song to Rhett speaking about his life specifically. The same can't be said for Underwood. She's speaking from the outside, and it's difficult to get the same message from an outsider that you could from someone who actually experienced it. But if you're speaking as an outsider, then you don't know anything about the subject matter, right? Meaning you have nothing useful to say. I'm an outsider on the subject matter too, and if I were to write a song about it, it'd be made of whole cloth because I have nothing to say about the subject matter. There are lots of things I don't write about because I have literally nothing to say about them. It doesn't matter if you don't know anyone who's been a victim or owned a gun. It wouldn't matter if you did. It's completely anecdotal. A friend of my brother was killed in a drive-by. Doesn't mean it means anymore to me than anyone else. You don't have to specifically relate to a song for it to work. And yes, I remember your ranting about "Life Changes". I believe you said there was no relatability. And then when someone makes a song a lot in the country can relate to (the United States is the only developed nation where gun violence is a major issue and happens at the frequency it does), you bitch about it. You seem to want some middle ground of relating to everyone and no one. You want detail, and then when you get it you're like "no one can relate to this!". Sure, it can't relate to someone in Japan, where gun murders are in the single digits (though you could make an argument from the hate part), a lot of people in the United States CAN connect to it, and the numbers show. The difference is, I changed my tune on "Life Changes" and now actually think it's my favorite song of his. Because I realized how powerful the specificity was and how people can relate to it even if they've not had the exact same situations happen to them. On the other hand, I don't see how anyone can relate to vague, ultra-broad-strokes genericness like this. I have heard about 80% of this song VERBATIM in other songs, so not a word of it is even remotely meaningful.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 19, 2018 18:38:39 GMT -5
Carrie Underwood is dangerous, she must be stopped immediately! On another note congrats girl on those massive sales that will have you sleeping well, while the haters get all worked up! xoxo toodles.
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Post by lady𝓐fan on Sept 19, 2018 18:42:10 GMT -5
On the other hand, I don't see how anyone can relate to vague, ultra-broad-strokes genericness like this. think differently than me.Corrected.
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Ten Pound Hammer
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Post by Ten Pound Hammer on Sept 19, 2018 18:45:44 GMT -5
On the other hand, I don't see how anyone can relate to vague, ultra-broad-strokes genericness like this. think differently than me.Corrected. Okay then what do YOU get out of it?
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Troublemaker
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Post by Troublemaker on Sept 19, 2018 18:50:01 GMT -5
I gave up on him after he called Martina's "Concrete Angel" a disaster of a song, now he's not only attacking "Love Wins" but also "I Hope You Dance". Who does that?
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Post by lady𝓐fan on Sept 19, 2018 18:51:45 GMT -5
Okay then what do YOU get out of it? Not much honestly, but this song might mean a lot to other people, and you have to respect that. P.S. Using caps doesn’t make your point any more valid, in fact it usually does the opposite.
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Ten Pound Hammer
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Post by Ten Pound Hammer on Sept 19, 2018 18:59:43 GMT -5
Okay then what do YOU get out of it? Not much honestly, but this song might mean a lot to other people, and you have to respect that. P.S. Using caps doesn’t make your point any more valid, in fact it usually does the opposite. I'm seeing quite a lot of posts not by me that criticize this song's lyrics...
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Post by lady𝓐fan on Sept 19, 2018 19:11:05 GMT -5
Not much honestly, but this song might mean a lot to other people, and you have to respect that. P.S. Using caps doesn’t make your point any more valid, in fact it usually does the opposite. I'm seeing quite a lot of posts not by me that criticize this song's lyrics... Yes, but it’s the brashness and lack of empathy in your posts that is off-putting to me...
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14887fan
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Post by 14887fan on Sept 19, 2018 19:15:29 GMT -5
I echo this 100%. Yes the song is basic, vague, and cliche. But so what? How can we legitimately find fault in this topic? Is it cliche to say "I love you" to your significant other on a regular basis? YES IT IS. I literally do not know a single person who has been affected by a hate crime. Not a single person. I don't know anyone who's even OWNED a gun. Not a single one of us cares. Your narrative isn’t the measurement of how good or bad this song is, even though you clearly want to believe otherwise. I hate hate *hate* readdressing this, but I lost friends in the Vegas shooting last year. Any highlighting of gun violence in this genre — a genre that actively avoids it always for the sake of safety and choosing to be generic & paint-by-the-numbers in its content — is important to me. Please, take yourself far, far away from this awful argument you’re fielding that you think justifies the takedown of a song that is so blatantly simple and inoffensive. For someone who’s a church organist, you sure know how to really destroy a song that’s meant to uplift people.
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Ten Pound Hammer
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Post by Ten Pound Hammer on Sept 19, 2018 19:17:12 GMT -5
a genre that actively avoids it always for the sake of safety and choosing to be generic & paint-by-the-numbers in its content Ironic, considering this song is very "generic & paint-by-the-numbers" too.
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14887fan
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Post by 14887fan on Sept 19, 2018 19:19:00 GMT -5
a genre that actively avoids it always for the sake of safety and choosing to be generic & paint-by-the-numbers in its content Ironic, considering this song is very "generic & paint-by-the-numbers" too. You’re a lost cause. Bowing out of this.
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Post by Naos on Sept 19, 2018 19:20:03 GMT -5
No one denied it has a broad message. But it's a step. Country singers tend to be more conservative, just like their audience. This is a step towards waking them up. And uplifting those affected.
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