Usher Discussion

[Jazzy]

Usher's working on his 8th full-length studio album. He's been in the studio with Jermaine Dupri.

[Agent Yoncé]

This was expected after his last effort didn't do so well & that he's on The Voice now. I wonder what's his direction for this album.

[Deleted]

I don't know how I feel about JD but I usually like their work together.

[jamrock16]

I'm always up for another Usher album, can't wait!

[Linnethia Monique]

Also in the studio with The Neptunes.

[Deleted]

I was just thinking the other day that it really annoys me when I accidentally click page one of the L4M thread b/c I always see that "Usher is working on a new album" post and get prematurely excited. Glad that's over!

JD + the Neptunes sounds like he's riding on the throwback bandwagon with Justin and Beyonce. OTOH there was this interview he did after his set with Afghan Whigs at the Fader Fort, where he wouldn't mention what was in his Shazaam but vaguely stated his next album was influenced by what he was currently listening to and that it was "out of this world...space and sky." Considering the set, it made me think he was possibly experimenting with a more rock direction....maybe it's a blend of both? IDK. I'm pretty anticipatory though.



Oh, and here is the Fader set in full:



In my dream world he'd go full 70s-80s Marvin on us; I figure he envisions himself to be a modern-day Marvin anyway. But I suppose that's something that wouldn't possibly happen until he was really ready to settle down in the old folks' home urban AC territory. I don't think his mentality is quite there yet, and he's still young enough that it doesn't have to be.

[Would've Been The One]

I hope and pray he goes back to good solid r&b.

[Jazzy]

"Climax" is one of my favorites by him, but Looking 4 Myself had very little replay value for me.

[Mic Technique]

Mar 20, 2013 19:23:47 GMT -5 @cynthiarose said:

Oh, and here is the Fader set in full

This is so cool. Not to sound like a dick or anything but I didn't expect his frame of reference to include the Afghan Whigs. But it's not my fault his peers can't seem to mine anything beyond 70's soul and 90's R&B! And, OMG, that "Climax" bridge really endures. The voice on this man...

[Caviar]

Is this going to be another pop album?

[#LisaRinna]

Pharrell better give him something better than that dry ass production he made on 'Twisted'. I was not pleased.

[Deleted]

Mar 21, 2013 13:02:15 GMT -5 Mic Technique said:

Mar 20, 2013 19:23:47 GMT -5 @cynthiarose said:

Oh, and here is the Fader set in full

This is so cool. Not to sound like a dick or anything but I didn't expect his frame of reference to include the Afghan Whigs. But it's not my fault his peers can't seem to mine anything beyond 70's soul and 90's R&B! And, OMG, that "Climax" bridge really endures. The voice on this man...

Yeah, goodness knows 70s and 90s r&b is the only thing that made puberty worth surviving for me, so I won't complain about anyone who sufficiently outsources that sound. But I've been thinking for a while now that Usher's musical tastes are probably wider than either the pop or r&b side of his fanbase would really allow him to get away with fully exploring (a few album tracks maybe, but certainly not for an entire album or for single choices). That's a shame.

Maybe I should stop being so pessimistic and give his fanbase more credit than that; suppose that it's not that "Scream" or "Numb" were dance pop, but that they weren't exceptional dance pop. They were good, but not good enough. (Remains convinced that "Euphoria" was flawless and should have been the lead second pop single after "Climax")

[Sure Thing]

No one wants to hear pop Usher. No one wants to hear "out of space" Usher. We want to hear Usher. We want "U Got It Bad", "U Remind Me", "Confessions, Part Two", "Burn", "Nice & Slow". His fans don't mind hearing a "Caught Up" or a "OMG" type song once per album. But he made several pop sounding songs and his fan base left him.

He's trying to "evolve" and he's leaving the base that got him successful. His brand is failing and if he wants to see an example if he stays loyal to his own sound, he needs to look at Justin Timberlake.

[josh]

Plenty of people want to hear pop Usher.

[fire]

^yeah maybe a single, but not an album full of pop usher. i agree with what's been said before: give us r&b usher back. it's what made you famous in the first place. and changing your sound does not necessarily mean you've "evolved" (quite to the contrary, i'd say)

[Sure Thing]

Mar 23, 2013 14:01:23 GMT -5 josh said:

Plenty of people want to hear pop Usher.

Looking 4 Myself's album sales prove otherwise.

[Deleted]

L4M is a 14 (or 18 deluxe-)track album with 3 pop songs on it. Its sales don't prove anything regarding pop Usher, really, since there were a few different factors at the time that likely played a factor in its performance. Makes for a convenient scapegoat though.

I don't know why it still irks me that people try to call L4M a pop album, but it does. I could more easily accept it if people were saying it was a mediocre r&b album; I'd disagree but at least they would recognize that the pop music wasn't by any means the majority of it.

I'm not going to say that hit pop songs absolutely sell albums (DJ didn't sell Versus, for example) but at least DJ did sell itself. "Scream" and "Numb" didn't even do that much. (I say this as someone who likes both "Scream" and "Numb.") I agree with Josh that there is still interest in pop Usher as long as the pop song is immediately infectious, and not just passably decent. He's set a high bar for himself with previous dance-pop songs and "Scream" and "Numb" just didn't meet that bar for a lot of people, nor was he coming off a huge career high or a six+ year break with people still anticipating his next move enough to give him a pass for an "aiight" song. Justin's situation isn't comparable at all to where Usher is in his career; if Usher were to take notes from JT the results would not be the same.

[allow that]

Mar 23, 2013 13:47:55 GMT -5 Sure Thing said:

His brand is failing and if he wants to see an example if he stays loyal to his own sound, he needs to look at Justin Timberlake.

HELL NO.

[Live Your Life]

I still think they should have put together a greatest hits. I think it would be the best thing for his career, right now.

As far as the album, I don't know what sound he should go for, but I have one request: No Max Martin.

[Sure Thing]

Mar 23, 2013 20:27:03 GMT -5 @cynthiarose said:

L4M is a 14 (or 18 deluxe-)track album with 3 pop songs on it. Its sales don't prove anything regarding pop Usher, really, since there were a few different factors at the time that likely played a factor in its performance. Makes for a convenient scapegoat though.

I don't know why it still irks me that people try to call L4M a pop album, but it does. I could more easily accept it if people were saying it was a mediocre r&b album; I'd disagree but at least they would recognize that the pop music wasn't by any means the majority of it.

I'm not going to say that hit pop songs absolutely sell albums (DJ didn't sell Versus, for example) but at least DJ did sell itself. "Scream" and "Numb" didn't even do that much. (I say this as someone who likes both "Scream" and "Numb.") I agree with Josh that there is still interest in pop Usher as long as the pop song is immediately infectious, and not just passably decent. He's set a high bar for himself with previous dance-pop songs and "Scream" and "Numb" just didn't meet that bar for a lot of people, nor was he coming off a huge career high or a six+ year break with people still anticipating his next move enough to give him a pass for an "aiight" song. Justin's situation isn't comparable at all to where Usher is in his career; if Usher were to take notes from JT the results would not be the same.

3 pop songs? I'm assuming your saying Scream, Numb and Euphoria are the only ones.

Look - I'm not going to waste time making a point about the (lack) of success for Looking 4 Myself. Fact is, JT is the exception to the rule on album sales in his "genre". My point is this - Justin has a cohesive sound on his album, and in my opinion has released a solid overall album.

I don't agree with the direction Usher has went with the dual release singles. "Scream" and "Climax" - "Lemme See" and "Numb" are all so different from each other it's hard for any "new" fans to understand what direction to gain from him on an album. It's hard for any "old" fans to understand what they are getting from him also.

Honestly, I think in a perfect world, he would make a hardcore R&B album with a couple of crossovers. Usher is a perfect crossover artist but his pop only singles are so generic that it's so hard for people to buy in on him.

[Me. I Am Justin...]

Mar 24, 2013 9:25:17 GMT -5 Live Your Life said:

I still think they should have put together a greatest hits. I think it would be the best thing for his career, right now.

He's long overdue for a greatest hits. A double disc release would be mandatory. He's been in the game for 20 years now...

[irice22]

Hopefully no dance pop.

And yes, he a needs a Greatest Hits. He could call it Usher: CHR/POP #2's.

[Deleted]

Mar 24, 2013 13:38:16 GMT -5 Sure Thing said:

3 pop songs? I'm assuming your saying Scream, Numb and Euphoria are the only ones.

Look - I'm not going to waste time making a point about the (lack) of success for Looking 4 Myself. Fact is, JT is the exception to the rule on album sales in his "genre". My point is this - Justin has a cohesive sound on his album, and in my opinion has released a solid overall album.

I don't agree with the direction Usher has went with the dual release singles. "Scream" and "Climax" - "Lemme See" and "Numb" are all so different from each other it's hard for any "new" fans to understand what direction to gain from him on an album. It's hard for any "old" fans to understand what they are getting from him also.

Honestly, I think in a perfect world, he would make a hardcore R&B album with a couple of crossovers. Usher is a perfect crossover artist but his pop only singles are so generic that it's so hard for people to buy in on him.

Yes, anything outside of those three is either urban, urban AC, or in "Show Me"'s case, sounds so much like an outtake from 05-06 that it's hard to place it in any genre's context by today's standards.

And I'd argue that "Papers," "Hey Daddy," "Lil Freak," and "OMG" didn't sound at all similar to each other either. Why did that random assortment of singles thrown at the wall to see what sticks work, but "Climax"/"Scream"/"Lemme See"/"Numb" didn't? I really don't know, and the only thing I can guess is that "OMG" was put out so close to the album's release that people weren't given time to complain about it. (The song may have gone top 5 on urban but it was not without its detractors.) Dare I suggest that he would have possibly done better (or at the least, had no complaints of being a pop album) if he'd released "Climax," "Lemme See," and "I Care 4 U" before the album release and then sent "Scream" to pop the week of? "Scream"'s lyrics were urban enough that it could have easily had an r&b mix. I think that could have helped as well. But he basically would have had to 'trick' people into buying the album and then putting up with the pop songs. One can only get away with doing that one or two times, I would think.

Asking Usher to make a cohesive, solid album is a double edged sword; if he comes back with a cohesive, solid, pop album you are going to be mad. I imagine if "Yeah!" were to come out today - imagine Lil' Jon's ad-libs instead replaced with a bunch of "Dale!"s by Pitbull - it would be an easy CHR hit but r&b fans would be turned off by how dance-influenced it sounded. A lot of Usher's previous uptempo and midtempo hits would be seen as fairly pop-leaning if released today. A crossover hit is ideal but a lot harder to create these days. When was the last r&b crossover, anyway? CHR is starting to diversify again but it looks like r&b will the be the last genre invited to the party. "Suit and Tie" is still an aberration to me.

On a somewhat different tangent, he's been getting a really positive reaction for The Voice ("Nashville is just a state" aside, lmao) so as long as that holds up there seems to be a good chance that the show will help him rebound with the new era.

[think pink.]

I love him on The Voice.

[Sure Thing]

Yes, anything outside of those three is either urban, urban AC, or in "Show Me"'s case, sounds so much like an outtake from 05-06 that it's hard to place it in any genre's context by today's standards..

"Can't Stop Won't Stop" and "Looking 4 Myself" would never get significant airplay on Urban or Urban AC stations. We've named 5 songs that were catered towards a genre that isn't his core. That's almost half the songs on the regular album.

And really, the other "Urban" type songs he had on that album were either outdated or interchangeable. Overall, the album just lacked replay value from the urban perspective.

[wavey.]

Working with Young Jeezy again!!

[Deleted]

^I wonder how his buddy Rick feels about that, lol.

Mar 31, 2013 23:59:15 GMT -5 Sure Thing said:

Yes, anything outside of those three is either urban, urban AC, or in "Show Me"'s case, sounds so much like an outtake from 05-06 that it's hard to place it in any genre's context by today's standards..

"Can't Stop Won't Stop" and "Looking 4 Myself" would never get significant airplay on Urban or Urban AC stations. We've named 5 songs that were catered towards a genre that isn't his core. That's almost half the songs on the regular album.

We'll have to agree to disagree on those two songs b/c I think they're both r&b. CSWS reminds me of "Monstar," actually, in that they both clearly were designed to be album openers and not really made with radio viability in mind (though it would have been interesting to see how either did). And L4M feels urban to me to, albeit different from what's current right now. But then, "Climax" was different too. Different doesn't make it not urban, it just makes it potentially riskier.

And really, the other "Urban" type songs he had on that album were either outdated or interchangeable. Overall, the album just lacked replay value from the urban perspective.

Well that just goes back to my comment about how I'd rather people call it a mediocre r&b album. I can deal with that, I have a bad habit of liking a lot of things most other people don't It's the "omg there is too much pop" that makes me argumentative, though I have no idea why.

[allow that]

It's still unfortunate to me that Urban fans (of which I am one) are so quick to write off this album. I've been a fan since the beginning (well at least since My Way) and I stand by my stance that last year's album is his best (and easily the one with most replay value) since Confessions. I'll concede that having a few Pop songs is nbd to me personally, but those aside, with songs like "2nd Round," "Lessons For The Lover," "I Care 4 U," and arguable career-peak "Climax" it's difficult for me to process comments saying the album had no R&B appeal. Personally, it almost marked a RETURN of R&B Usher after the interchangeable bland balladry of Here I Stand and his imitation of his imitators on Raymond v. Raymond. If I want post-Confessions R&B Usher, I'd much rather skip a few tracks like "Scream" and enjoy the 2012 highlights over revisiting his 2008-2011 collections. It's not even close for me.

[allow that]

The new panel of The Voice got spoofed on SNL last night. Usher was no exception! They took the piss of his one-leg up trademark and even had him sing a line of "Climax."

[Jazzy]

Eric Bellinger said the album is "more R&B; more urban".