back2blk
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Post by back2blk on Apr 21, 2021 0:08:17 GMT -5
Not really though. She’s been more political during the #BLM movement and 45’s presidency and recent election, being more vocal during the past 5 years or so. Prior to that, she’s always played it very safe when it comes to statements of social commentary. She also had contribution to the #metoo movement. Being vocal and being woke are two different things. MC has been woke for a long time, trust. Well she's never represented herself as woke. And if anything, has expressed much more complacency and silence at the expense of her career. She's now being more VOCAL about her WOKENESS than she has ever been in her career.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2021 6:56:39 GMT -5
It’s easy to be vocal when it’s the popular thing to do now. I respect the people who speak up when it’s against the grain to do so.
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 21, 2021 8:16:55 GMT -5
Being vocal and being woke are two different things. MC has been woke for a long time, trust. Well she's never represented herself as woke. And if anything, has expressed much more complacency and silence at the expense of her career. She's now being more VOCAL about her WOKENESS than she has ever been in her career. The topic at hand....yes she has. You yourself haven’t been woke enough to realize it. 🤷🏻♂️
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2021 8:27:17 GMT -5
Mariah's been speaking on racial/social justice issues since early in her career... I mean, she has a song on her first album about it.
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Hefty Hanna
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Post by Hefty Hanna on Apr 21, 2021 9:08:47 GMT -5
Being vocal and being woke are two different things. MC has been woke for a long time, trust. Well she's never represented herself as woke. And if anything, has expressed much more complacency and silence at the expense of her career. She's now being more VOCAL about her WOKENESS than she has ever been in her career. I disagree with this. I think that from 1990-1997 she was also stifled by her husband and record label, as she had to stick to the script. The song 'One Night' off of the rarities seems to be about the HIV epidemic and it's clear to me that it was pushed aside because Tommy didn't want Mariah to be "woke" or "vocal". You don't really get to be woke when you are a puppet. Her being a biracial woman and identifying as black has been a huge part of her story as an artist since the beginning as well. When she broke from the script, she really became the artist she truly wanted to be, which truly established her as R&B/Hip-Hop royalty. I love that she seems to be really "woke" now, and I do agree that it seems like it's more "wokeness" than ever, but we have to keep in mind her being entrapped for years. We know that Tommy & Co. have made horrible racist comments about Mariah being "too black" and when you are in an abusive marriage, you don't really have the platform to speak your truths. She has also made it a point since she disbanded from Tommy/Sony to work with mostly black artists and to raise awareness of black-mixed people everywhere. She has always been an artist with an important point to make, and if anything this began with the separation of her ex-husband and ex-record label.
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back2blk
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Post by back2blk on Apr 21, 2021 9:42:40 GMT -5
Mariah's been speaking on racial/social justice issues since early in her career... I mean, she has a song on her first album about it. I'm talking about situations like in the interviews below where she explicitly dodges direct questions regarding diversity, women's issues, and politics, and instead her only input is that for reasons, that include creating divide, she doesn't answer political questions because she sees herself as an "entertainer". And this was 17 years after her first album. And long after her stronghold from Sony. And arguably, post Emancipation. In early 1993, she gets asked about racism. She doesn't really address racism. But now we're getting her thoughts and opinions and she's putting that energy out into the world. I understand her music spoke about it, I understand she has the Fresh Air Fund. She's told intimate stories in her Memoir. But she hasn't been without her political insensitivity, either, recently performing for Qaddaffi for a cash grab. But, in recent years, she has been engaging her fans on social media with her political and social thoughts in line with events as they have been occurring. And that's what's been a breath of fresh air for me, and what I have enjoyed seeing from her. We can say she's been woke her whole life - but she's now also choosing to put that side of her forward in the press, and her social persona.
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Post by back2blk on Apr 21, 2021 10:19:35 GMT -5
BOW FUCKING DOWN!!
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 21, 2021 11:29:20 GMT -5
I wonder what it is she did privately.
#wokequeensincedayone
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Apr 21, 2021 11:32:36 GMT -5
Well and this is misleading/annoying because in the streaming era artists have been able to run up their certs because singles are so easily multi-platinum. Mariah was one of the very few - if not only - artists in the 80s and 90s to have two multi-platinum singles. Now random artists can get several multi-platinum singles with songs that aren't even real hits.
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Post by sundaymorningguy on Apr 21, 2021 11:38:51 GMT -5
I mean didn’t Mariah dodge a lot of questions about Trump because she lived in one of his properties at one point?
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 21, 2021 14:10:24 GMT -5
I mean didn’t Mariah dodge a lot of questions about Trump because she lived in one of his properties at one point? False
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 21, 2021 14:14:11 GMT -5
Well and this is misleading/annoying because in the streaming era artists have been able to run up their certs because singles are so easily multi-platinum. Mariah was one of the very few - if not only - artists in the 80s and 90s to have two multi-platinum singles. Now random artists can get several multi-platinum singles with songs that aren't even real hits. Yeah, just like anything can chart on the HOT100. So many new artists have tons of HOT100 “hits” because streaming enables them to get every song on their album chart on the HOT100. Before only official singles were able to.
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Dreams
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Post by Dreams on Apr 21, 2021 14:37:47 GMT -5
Yeah, I’m with back2blk here. Mariah had been neutral, very careful not to offend, alienate opposing opinions, be too obvious when it came to her political beliefs or her stance on major social issues. This had been going on for YEARS and I remember a portion of her fan base nagging about her “detached,” for lack of a better word, attitude, and another portion defending her with the “she’s a singer, it’s not her place to sway or dictate people’s opinions” argument. It’s only recently that she’s become more outspoken (which is awesome).
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kmbgs
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Post by kmbgs on Apr 21, 2021 15:41:23 GMT -5
I don’t fault Mariah for not being outspoken in the past. It’s only in the last decade (5-7 years really) that pop stars have been “expected” to speak up politically. Aside from calling on people to vote I don’t recall many of her peers back in the day being extremely politically active or getting too deep in social issues.
Let’s also not forget she released a song abt Apartheid on her debut!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2021 15:56:47 GMT -5
I don’t fault Mariah for not being outspoken in the past. It’s only in the last decade (5-7 years really) that pop stars have been “expected” to speak up politically. Aside from calling on people to vote I don’t recall many of her peers back in the day being extremely politically active or getting too deep in social issues. Let’s also not forget she released a song abt Apartheid on her debut! This. Plus a lot of Mariah's "outspokeness" (if we're comparing it to her more general statements on social issues years ago) has been via social media which didn't exist at her peak.. Twitter and Instagram really took off at the tail-end of her hit-making days... and social media has led to a culture where people expect you to be vocal about where you stand on issues. In the 90s and 00s, there was definitely more of a culture of "shut up and sing" if you were a pop star. So, no Mariah wasn't shading political candidates, persuading people to vote for one candidate over another, etc. in the 90s, but that was taboo then (and Mariah had a massive team behind her ensuring she was only asked what they wanted her to be asked and answered the questions exactly how they wanted her to answer them). Madonna came to mind as the outspoken pop star in the 90s, and she took a big hit commercially when she really started pushing buttons. I guess you could say you wish Mariah would have done that too, but who knows if we'd be talking about Mariah and her career the way we are now if she was shading Newt Gingrich and Bob Dole in 1996?!
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Relaxing Cup
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Post by Relaxing Cup on Apr 21, 2021 16:07:07 GMT -5
WHERE I BELONG is gonna SMACH!
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back2blk
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Post by back2blk on Apr 21, 2021 17:25:28 GMT -5
Okay, but no one wants to address the receipt I brought in above where she recently, in her own words, considers herself an entertainer and that's why she doesn't speak on political topics. If that's common in her industry as an artist, then, yeah, so be it.
But she's singing a different tune now.
Wokeness, as I brought it up, and how it's used in today's times, relates specifically to activism and taking action to events that have occurred since Trayvon Martin and the rise of the Black Lives Matter movement. She's been woke, active, engaging, and opinionated moreso now than she's ever been. She's also been intersectional in speaking up about the #metoo movement to some degree.
I've never faulted her for it, either. People are taking my observations as some sort of attack on her political consciousness.
My original post stated that it's been so great to see her actively outspoken about the George Floyd trial. And that her wokeness is a great look. This isn't a side of her we've seen her entire career.
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 21, 2021 17:26:52 GMT -5
Yeah, I’m with back2blk here. Mariah had been neutral, very careful not to offend, alienate opposing opinions, be too obvious when it came to her political beliefs or her stance on major social issues. This had been going on for YEARS and I remember a portion of her fan base nagging about her “detached,” for lack of a better word, attitude, and another portion defending her with the “she’s a singer, it’s not her place to sway or dictate people’s opinions” argument. It’s only recently that she’s become more outspoken (which is awesome). And we applaud that, yay MC you are now more outspoken! But the topic was WOKE.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2021 17:39:40 GMT -5
In that video you posted, Mariah is clearly annoyed that interviewer put her on the spot about performing for Netanyahu, allegedly giving him and his family free tickets which is "not allowed" (according to what/who? I don't know what she's referring to either).. I don't think she had any idea what the interviewer was asking her but saw exactly what she was doing and deflected by saying she doesn't "pay attention to politics". The interviewer laid a trap she was not about to walk herself into.. that's a bad example of trying to demonstrate Mariah wasn't "woke" or doesn't want to talk about politics. Even lately, when she talks about politics it's been about elections or race issues in the United States.. not the ins and outs of morality, legal issues, etc. with performing for leaders in foreign countries..
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back2blk
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Post by back2blk on Apr 21, 2021 17:56:52 GMT -5
In that video you posted, Mariah is clearly annoyed that interviewer put her on the spot about performing for Netanyahu, allegedly giving him and his family free tickets which is "not allowed" (according to what/who? I don't know what she's referring to either).. I don't think she had any idea what the interviewer was asking her but saw exactly what she was doing and deflected by saying she doesn't "pay attention to politics". The interviewer laid a trap she was not about to walk herself into.. that's a bad example of trying to demonstrate Mariah wasn't "woke" or doesn't want to talk about politics. Even lately, when she talks about politics it's been about elections or race issues in the United States.. not the ins and outs of morality, legal issues, etc. with performing for leaders in foreign countries.. I'm talking about the one right above that, where she says she doesn't want to offend anyone, that she's just an entertainer, that she's not a political analyst, that talking about politics is her going into a tangent, that of course she has her opinions but it's difficult for her to express them. That video.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2021 18:05:58 GMT -5
In that video you posted, Mariah is clearly annoyed that interviewer put her on the spot about performing for Netanyahu, allegedly giving him and his family free tickets which is "not allowed" (according to what/who? I don't know what she's referring to either).. I don't think she had any idea what the interviewer was asking her but saw exactly what she was doing and deflected by saying she doesn't "pay attention to politics". The interviewer laid a trap she was not about to walk herself into.. that's a bad example of trying to demonstrate Mariah wasn't "woke" or doesn't want to talk about politics. Even lately, when she talks about politics it's been about elections or race issues in the United States.. not the ins and outs of morality, legal issues, etc. with performing for leaders in foreign countries.. I'm talking about the one right above that, where she says she doesn't want to offend anyone, that she's just an entertainer, that she's not a political analyst, that talking about politics is her going into a tangent, that of course she has her opinions but it's difficult for her to express them. That video. I'm not really seeing what you're seeing in that one either. Based on the comments she made, she said she was a fan of Hillary and wanted to abstain (laughing) when asked about Trump.. which coming from Mariah, you know exactly what that means. As far as I can recall, she's never directly commented on Trump.. she spoke out against specific policies he championed or in support of candidates who ran against him. Mariah is not someone who tends to focus on and dwell on the negative anyway. Mariah's "woke" comments have been on social media, her making the comments when she wants on her own terms about issues she wants to talk about vs. these videos which are interviewers putting Mariah on the spot to answer a political question (and Mariah's been in the game long enough to know that they're trying to get something edgy out of her so they can use it as a headline). She said she's an entertainer, not a political analyst. I don't see the way she speaks about issues now as being incongruent with what she said in that video.
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Post by Positive Tension on Apr 21, 2021 18:11:56 GMT -5
Who's above her? Fifth seems low.
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 21, 2021 18:27:50 GMT -5
Who's above her? Fifth seems low. I believe is Rihanna, Taylor, Nicki, And Katy (who recently passed MC with new certifications) Mariah is tied with Barb as the most certified albums though, they are pretty far ahead. What I don’t get is when it comes to singles (digital etc), are the certifications treated the same as albums? That seems unfair. These youngens are raking in these certifications left and right. I think Halsey and Ariana are already at 80M+ like how?
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back2blk
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Post by back2blk on Apr 21, 2021 18:32:27 GMT -5
I'm talking about the one right above that, where she says she doesn't want to offend anyone, that she's just an entertainer, that she's not a political analyst, that talking about politics is her going into a tangent, that of course she has her opinions but it's difficult for her to express them. That video. I'm not really seeing what you're seeing in that one either. Based on the comments she made, she said she was a fan of Hillary and wanted to abstain (laughing) when asked about Trump.. which coming from Mariah, you know exactly what that means. As far as I can recall, she's never directly commented on Trump.. she spoke out against specific policies he championed or in support of candidates who ran against him. Mariah is not someone who tends to focus on and dwell on the negative anyway. Mariah's "woke" comments have been on social media, her making the comments when she wants on her own terms about issues she wants to talk about vs. these videos which are interviewers putting Mariah on the spot to answer a political question (and Mariah's been in the game long enough to know that they're trying to get something edgy out of her so they can use it as a headline). She said she's an entertainer, not a political analyst. I don't see the way she speaks about issues now as being incongruent with what she said in that video. Okay, so here's an interview with V Magazine she did last year, where she answers very specific political questions and she answers them thoughtfully and eloquently, I may add. She just doesn't do it over social media, it's been also the narrative she's been crafting with press. MARIAH CAREY ON VOTING, RACIAL EQUALITY, AND SELF-CARE
I don't understand why there's so much resistance in accepting that Mariah has recently been called to really be an active voice in the current racial social and political movement of the times. She even admits it in that interview that releasing Save the Day now (a song she made years ago) felt appropriate given the current social political climate.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 21, 2021 18:48:40 GMT -5
I think neither side is incorrect in what they are saying but what is being missed here is being WOKE publicly doesn't mean one cant be woke privately and with friends and people they know. For all yall know Mariah could have been speaking to her people about what she now shares on social media
I didn't talk about politics on Pulse till Donald Trump, however I always watched and kept up since 2001. I debated people I know but I didn't discuss on Pulse or with strangers . That doesn't mean I was less woke or less aware.
The right word choice is I'm glad she is more outspoken which is a fact but saying she is more woke isn't correct
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 21, 2021 18:56:16 GMT -5
I think neither side is incorrect in what they are saying but what is being missed here is being WOKE publicly doesn't mean one cant be woke privately and with friends and people they know. For all yall know Mariah could have been speaking to her people about what she now shares on social media I didn't talk about politics on Pulse till Donald Trump, however I always watched and kept up since 2001. I debated people I know but I didn't discuss on Pulse or with strangers . That doesn't mean I was less woke or less aware. The right word choice is I'm glad she is more outspoken which is a fact but saying she is more woke isn't correct Thank you woke queen Coco!
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Apr 21, 2021 19:03:05 GMT -5
What I don’t get is when it comes to singles (digital etc), are the certifications treated the same as albums? That seems unfair. These youngens are raking in these certifications left and right. I think Halsey and Ariana are already at 80M+ like how? For the purposes of this specific statistic, they are added together and in that sense treated the same. That's why I made the point earlier about singles in the streaming era getting much higher certifications. It's actually amazing that Mariah is fifth, as evidenced by all of the women above her essentially being from the streaming era.
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back2blk
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Post by back2blk on Apr 21, 2021 19:25:13 GMT -5
I think neither side is incorrect in what they are saying but what is being missed here is being WOKE publicly doesn't mean one cant be woke privately and with friends and people they know. For all yall know Mariah could have been speaking to her people about what she now shares on social media I didn't talk about politics on Pulse till Donald Trump, however I always watched and kept up since 2001. I debated people I know but I didn't discuss on Pulse or with strangers . That doesn't mean I was less woke or less aware. The right word choice is I'm glad she is more outspoken which is a fact but saying she is more woke isn't correct This is great. I think along the lines of word choice, which I myself have tripped up in this conversation, the concept of wokeness, as it's used today, is very specifically tied to the time span beginning from the Ferguson protests, and is meant to encapsulate the ongoing Black Lives Matter movement era of recent times. If you want to apply it, generally, by all means, that's your prerogative, but when I speak about wokeness, I'm specifically targeting the comments Mariah has made revolving George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, Kapernick, the election, and so forth, where you have seen her political voice and stance take the most shape, in connection with this specific cultural movement. But saying she's more woke now, or she's always been woke, can confuse the historical context of these movements.
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 21, 2021 19:34:15 GMT -5
What I don’t get is when it comes to singles (digital etc), are the certifications treated the same as albums? That seems unfair. These youngens are raking in these certifications left and right. I think Halsey and Ariana are already at 80M+ like how? For the purposes of this specific statistic, they are added together and in that sense treated the same. That's why I made the point earlier about singles in the streaming era getting much higher certifications. It's actually amazing that Mariah is fifth, as evidenced by all of the women above her essentially being from the streaming era. It’s weird they have it counted that way. Doesn’t make sense. The value of a single shouldn’t be the same as an album. The funny thing is they treat genres differently. Like, I noticed the “Latin” certifications are valued much lower.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Apr 21, 2021 19:58:50 GMT -5
For the purposes of this specific statistic, they are added together and in that sense treated the same. That's why I made the point earlier about singles in the streaming era getting much higher certifications. It's actually amazing that Mariah is fifth, as evidenced by all of the women above her essentially being from the streaming era. It’s weird they have it counted that way. Doesn’t make sense. The value of a single shouldn’t be the same as an album. The funny thing is they treat genres differently. Like, I noticed the “Latin” certifications are valued much lower. Latin certification levels are much lower than the general ones since their general sales are much lower. Gold is 30,000 and Platinum is 60,000 (used to be 50,000 and 100,000) instead of 500,000 and 1,000,000. Anyway that stat that was shared was from a Mariah fan account, no? Fans come up with all sort of random stats/rankings/etc.
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