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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2016 15:23:28 GMT -5
Does anyone "in the know" have any explanation why the fiddle died a quick and painful death? Just listen to the latest albums from Carrie Underwood, Jason Aldean, Luke Bryan, Blake Shelton, Tim McGraw, Rodney Atkins, Keith Urban, Craig Morgan, Chris Young, Sara Evans, Rascal Flatts, Billy Currington, Joe Nichols and then listen to their earlier albums. What gives? Anybody?
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.indulgecountry
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Post by .indulgecountry on Jan 24, 2016 21:53:24 GMT -5
Just taking a stab and I'll say that it's because the fiddle is the most 'hicky'-sounding instrument there is. It definitely has this connotation with it of "hillbilly music" and I'm sure that it's died in popularity because country as a genre is now trying to appeal to the people who want to like country without feeling like they're listening to "hillbilly music."
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sabre14
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Post by sabre14 on Jan 24, 2016 22:10:42 GMT -5
Non-Country fans listen to mainstream country radio nowadays. They like pop music. The fiddle is for core country fans. It's natural that would be one of if not the first instrument to get axed.
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bksouthga
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Post by bksouthga on Jan 25, 2016 0:15:44 GMT -5
I have to disagree here. I don't think the fiddle has "died" in any sense. These things go in cycles. I have mentioned before in this thread how the banjo was somewhat of a recent phenomenon. Thats not quite true. The banjo was very popular in the late 70s early 80s, particularly with songs associated with movies like Smokey and the Bandit and Deliverance. It went through a dormant period in the late 80s early 90s. Brought back by the Dixie Chicks (forgot to mention them) and sustained by Keith Urban, Josh Turner, Dierks Bentley, some others. It seems like the fiddle is going through a similar dormant period right now. I think it will come back.
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.indulgecountry
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Post by .indulgecountry on Jan 25, 2016 13:59:12 GMT -5
Maybe "died" isn't the best word to use because I don't think it's completely gone or gone forever, but it's pretty dead or close to it in the mainstream scene at the moment.
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Uncle Lumpy
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Post by Uncle Lumpy on Jan 26, 2016 14:25:35 GMT -5
Does anyone "in the know" have any explanation why the fiddle died a quick and painful death? Just listen to the latest albums from Carrie Underwood, Jason Aldean, Luke Bryan, Blake Shelton, Tim McGraw, Rodney Atkins, Keith Urban, Craig Morgan, Chris Young, Sara Evans, Rascal Flatts, Billy Currington, Joe Nichols and then listen to their earlier albums. What gives? Anybody? While I would argue that it is far , far from a "quick death" of the fiddle. They have been slowly fading out the fiddle for years ....decades even (just like they did steel guitar & harmonica before it). It started with less fills & solos and then just slowly fadied it back into the wall of sound over the years where it was indistinguishable from all the guitar noise. As for why , that's simple in my opinion. Mainstream country radio wants the genre to be "cool" . You can't have fiddles or steel guitars in there. Folks might think they are actually listening to country music. Can't have that. The cool kids don't listen to country music.
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sabre14
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Post by sabre14 on Jan 26, 2016 14:28:39 GMT -5
Fiddles and steel guitars (solos, especially) are cool to me.
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carriekins
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Post by carriekins on Jan 26, 2016 17:23:12 GMT -5
Fiddles and steel guitars (solos, especially) are cool to me. Amen.
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bksouthga
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Post by bksouthga on Jan 26, 2016 18:15:24 GMT -5
Does anyone "in the know" have any explanation why the fiddle died a quick and painful death? Just listen to the latest albums from Carrie Underwood, Jason Aldean, Luke Bryan, Blake Shelton, Tim McGraw, Rodney Atkins, Keith Urban, Craig Morgan, Chris Young, Sara Evans, Rascal Flatts, Billy Currington, Joe Nichols and then listen to their earlier albums. What gives? Anybody? While I would argue that it is far , far from a "quick death" of the fiddle. They have been slowly fading out the fiddle for years ....decades even (just like they did steel guitar & harmonica before it). It started with less fills & solos and then just slowly fadied it back into the wall of sound over the years where it was indistinguishable from all the guitar noise. As for why , that's simple in my opinion. Mainstream country radio wants the genre to be "cool" . You can't have fiddles or steel guitars in there. Folks might think they are actually listening to country music. Can't have that. The cool kids don't listen to country music. The cool kids never listened to country music. They started listening to it after they grew up. All that aside, I think if you look back at your history and check your data you will find that this is not the case. I think the cyclical model that I have proposed is more accurate.
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Uncle Lumpy
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Post by Uncle Lumpy on Jan 26, 2016 18:46:28 GMT -5
^Agreed on the cool kids only listening to country after they grew up. The problem is nobody wants to cater to those adults now. That young demo is where the advertising cash is.... even if I really don't understand how.
To each their own. The only problem I see with your "cycle" opinion is it really only applies to banjo. While traditional vs. pop country cycles have indeed happened since the beginning , the general instrumentation has remained the same. Up until fairly recently you could get away without a steel guitar maybe but you couldn't skimp on the fiddle. Even Shania at her Pop zenith was fairly heavy on featuring fiddle. Its certinaly never approached the level of todays country music where a fiddle or steel sound positively foreign. That being said , I hope you are right but I'm starting to have bigger and bigger doubts as the Sam Hunts & the Thomas Rhetts become bigger and bigger stars.
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Uncle Lumpy
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Post by Uncle Lumpy on Jan 26, 2016 19:44:33 GMT -5
That was my above point , Ive never understood it either unless younger people are just easier to sell products to? I know Im officially aged out of any important demo but I have more desposable income today than I ever have.
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bksouthga
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Post by bksouthga on Jan 26, 2016 20:26:05 GMT -5
This is not a new phenomenon. Sixteen candles make a lovely light.
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Andy
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Post by Andy on Jan 26, 2016 20:51:52 GMT -5
I apologize if I stray too off topic from what this thread is about, but I never really understood where the appeal came from targeting to a younger demographic (cool kids). I mean isn't a little obvious that college kids aren't going to have as much money as you know, adults? I could be wrong, but my guess is that teenagers and young adults hit the sweet spot of being both influenceable and having some disposable income. In contrast, children are even more impressionable but have little to no disposable income, and while older adults may have the most money to spend, they tend to be more entrenched in their opinions/habits and are thus less susceptible to advertising.
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carriekins
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Post by carriekins on Jan 26, 2016 21:18:59 GMT -5
I apologize if I stray too off topic from what this thread is about, but I never really understood where the appeal came from targeting to a younger demographic (cool kids). I mean isn't a little obvious that college kids aren't going to have as much money as you know, adults? I could be wrong, but my guess is that teenagers and young adults hit the sweet spot of being both influenceable and having some disposable income. In contrast, children are even more impressionable but have little to no disposable income, and while older adults may have the most money to spend, they tend to be more entrenched in their opinions/habits and are thus less susceptible to advertising. That is exactly it.
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bboat11
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Post by bboat11 on Jun 22, 2016 9:35:06 GMT -5
In honor of her new album, it is time for Martina! Note: I did not keep track of banjo. Martina uses literally zero banjo. I replaced it with piano and mandolin instead!!
ITALICS = piano, BOLD = fiddle/violin, UNDERLINE = slide, * = Mandolin
THE TIME HAS COME (1992) 1) The Time Has Come* 2) That's Me 3) True Blue Fool 4) Losing You Feels Good 5) Walk That Line* 6) Cheap Whiskey 7) I Can't Sleep 8) A Woman Knows 9) The Rope 10) When You Are Old
Piano = 4/10 (40%) Fiddle/Violin = 7/10 (70%) Slide = 10/10 (100%) Mandolin = 2/10 (20%)
RECKLESS (2016) 1) Reckless* 2) It Ain't Pretty 3) Just Around The Corner* 4) Everybody Wants To Be Loved* 5) The Real Thing* 6) That's The Thing About Love* 7) Low All Afternoon* 8) Diamond 9) We'll Pick Up Where We Left Off* 10) You And You Alone
Piano = 8/10 (80%) Fiddle/Violin = 6/10 (60%) Slide = 8/10 (80%) Mandolin = 7/10 (70%)
Those numbers are still pretty darn good in my opinion! The biggest difference I noticed was that the newer album almost always used violin instead of fiddle (I think "Low All Afternoon" is the only blatant fiddle on the album). However, Martina continues to be very consistent with the steel (less prominent than the first album, but it is still definitely there). Also, Reckless is an extremely mandolin-heavy album! Holy cow! Just about every song features it prominently. It almost feels as if they chose to use mandolin in place of fiddle to go for a specific sound, because there is surprisingly little fiddle considering how sonically-country the album actually sounds.
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robenglund
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Post by robenglund on Jun 24, 2016 18:16:16 GMT -5
Great analysis bboat11! Seeing your post makes me want to do an analysis of Pardi's new album. I'm out with friends right now since it's Friday night and all, so I can't do it right now. Maybe tomorrow. Maybe @nickv1025 can do it if he's free? :)
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Post by Deleted on Jun 24, 2016 19:40:05 GMT -5
Great analysis bboat11! Seeing your post makes me want to do an analysis of Pardi's new album. I'm out with friends right now since it's Friday night and all, so I can't do it right now. Maybe tomorrow. Maybe @nickv1025 can do it if he's free? :) Haha! Even though I've been listening almost nonstop in my car, I'm gonna have to sit down and really pay attention. See most modern songs are easy because you can easily pick out the twang of the fiddle or the ring of the steel because of how the production is mastered and because they are the only twangy instruments. On Jon's CD, everything seems to be mixed together and literally everything has twang (the production reminds me a lot of George Strait's recent albums). I'll be curious to see if we can pick everything out!
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robenglund
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Post by robenglund on Jun 26, 2016 13:52:28 GMT -5
ITALICS indicates banjo used BOLD indicates fiddle used UNDERLINE indicates steel guitar used
SLASH indicates mandolin was used
California Sunrise
1. Out of Style 2. Cowboy Hat 3. Head Over Boots 4. Night Shift 5. Can't Turn You Down 6. Dirt on My Boots 7. She Ain't In It 8. All Time High 9. Heartache on the Dance Floor 10. Paycheck 11. Lucky Tonight 12. California Sunrise
If I made a mistake let me know!
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bboat11
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Post by bboat11 on Jun 27, 2016 17:07:54 GMT -5
Hey @nickv1025 , have you listened to Reba's newest album at all? I just got done paying closer attention to "That's When I Knew", and it uses cello very prominently throughout the song wherever you would expect to hear fiddle. Talk about cool!! I would highly recommend you give it a listen, since you're the fiddle guy :)
Also, the title track, "Love Somebody", is one of the best modern examples of the banjo, fiddle, and steel all being featured prominently that I can think of. They are even playing simultaneously in the intro and the transitions between verses. It is amazing how prominent they are considering how contemporary the song sounds!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 27, 2016 17:19:51 GMT -5
Hey @nickv1025 , have you listened to Reba's newest album at all? I just got done paying closer attention to "That's When I Knew", and it uses cello very prominently throughout the song wherever you would expect to hear fiddle. Talk about cool!! I would highly recommend you give it a listen, since you're the fiddle guy :) Also, the title track, "Love Somebody", is one of the best modern examples of the banjo, fiddle, and steel all being featured prominently that I can think of. They are even playing simultaneously in the intro and the transitions between verses. It is amazing how prominent they are considering how contemporary the song sounds! I have not listened but I will go give it a spin. It seems a lot of artists have abandoned the old twang instruments in hopes of a more modern sound. But as you know, it's perfectly possible to include whatever instruments you want and still have the song sound contemporary!
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Post by lady𝓐fan on Mar 19, 2019 16:35:19 GMT -5
It's been a few years, so I was curious on how much the sound of country radio has changed since the last one of these "charts" was posted:
ITALICS = banjo/mandolin/twangy guitar, BOLD = fiddle/violin, UNDERLINED = slide/steel
Country Airplay chart dated 3/23/19: 1. Beautiful Crazy 2. Millionaire 3. There Was This Girl 4. Girl Like You 5. Here Tonight 6. One That Got Away 7. This Is It 8. Make It Sweet 9. Eyes On You 10. Down to the Honkytonk 11. Love Wins 12. Night Shift 13. Miss Me More 14. Good as You 15. On My Way to You 16. Love Ain’t 17. Burn Out 18. Whiskey Glasses 19. Love Someone 20. Look What God Gave Her 21. Rumor 22. Every Little Honky Tonk Bar 23. Talk You Out of It 24. Caught Up in the Country 25. Girl 26. Raised on Country 27. What Happens in a Small Town 28. Buy My Own Drinks 29. Some of It 30. Feels Like a Party
Banjo/mandolin/twangy guitar: 9/30 (+1 with 2015) Fiddle/Violin: 4/30 (-1 from 2015) Slide: 14/30 (-2 from 2015)
Pretty minor decrease compared to the change in the period between 2011-2015, where bro-country rose to dominate country music, sweeping away more traditional instruments in the name of "progress".
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bboat11
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Post by bboat11 on Mar 20, 2019 2:04:40 GMT -5
Yay, I'm glad to see this thread revived! I always loved this one! I do want to point out that "Love Wins" would fit into the "twangy guitar" category, as the main musical theme is actually driven by mandolin paired with acoustic guitar. There is also steel guitar floating around in the background all throughout the song (for example, right after the "Sirens screaming down the avenue" line). Nothing prominent, but it is definitely there :)
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recordyear
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Post by recordyear on Mar 20, 2019 3:08:59 GMT -5
Fiddle/Violin: 3/30 (-2 from 2015) I think this is 4 instead of 3. It's cool that every song that has a fiddle is a no. 1 contender.
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