jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Feb 1, 2018 17:01:01 GMT -5
Nope. I don't see any major distinction between male and female vocals besides the fact that majority males are tenors and females are altos and sopranos, but those "vocal performance" categories were never really about that anyway. Yes, women has to work twice as hard as men, but that has NOTHING to do with separating Pop Solo into male and female, or any of the categories, especially when Pop Solo has been dominated nominations wise by females and the wins have been dominated by Adele (a female) + the other categories have been equally males and females. So, there is NO need for separate categories in this day and age. And that's not the solution to any gender problem. Men dominated last year and that was reflected in the wins. Sorry. Who in their right mind thought Ed Sheeran's "Shape of You" - the biggest hit of the year and by far the biggest song in Pop Solo - was losing Pop Solo? All that Kesha nonsense was always wishful thinking. "Praying" was not that big of a hit (peaking outside of the 20s on the charts), and all of the wins there have gone to #1 or #2 hits since its inception, male or female. That's a problem with the voting body, not the category or a gender problem. Lorde also won Pop Solo (beating out big hits by Bruno and Justin), so it's not even just that Adele has helped the women in the category. Ed Sheeran's "Shape of You" - the biggest hit of the year and by far the biggest song in Pop Solo - was losing Pop Solo? ... and all of the wins there have gone to #1 or #2 hits since its inception, male or female. That's a problem with the voting body, not the category or a gender problem. I don't agree with some of your points, but the above is certainly true. The only reason people even doubted Ed's wins was because the committee didn't allow him on the general categories, which IMO might have helped his chances on the Pop field because it was the only way to recognize the biggest song of the year and one of the biggest albums in recent years. I think it was more hopedicting by people who liked "Praying" for its message, with a few Lady Gaga stans mixed in. Most people here recognize the general nominations are handled differently than the genre ones, plus no one in the Pop Solo category was in the general field so it's not like any of the nominees had that over Ed.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Feb 1, 2018 17:05:38 GMT -5
Why should there be a difference in males and females in terms of the categories? Is there an inherent difference that matters when it comes to making music? I never understood the separation to begin with, so the combination makes more sense to me. I don't know their reasoning for doing it, but I don't see the big deal. I'd also like to see the match on males vs females in terms of winners. Since they combined genders for Pop Solo 4 of 7 winners have been female. In R&B Performance 4 of 7 winners have been female. In Country Solo 4 of 7 winners have been female, despite country being a male-dominated genre. The other genres are certainly more male-dominated in their winners, but considering how few female rock singers and even rappers there are right now, it would be odd to have a Female category for those genres. There may have been more male winners in the general cateogories - I have no idea - but it's not like females can't win. Adele and Taylor Swift have won twice recently. Over the years artists from Carole KIng to Alanis Morissette to Judy Garland to Lauryn Hall to Barbra Streisand to Bonnie Raitt to Natalie Cole and more have won Album fo the Year, for instance. That certainly isn't on the level of relevant hip-hop continually being passed over in Album of the Year. The categories don't say "Vocal" anymore do they? Are you serious? Male and female voices are completely different. You can't honestly say Ed Sheehan had a better vocal performance that anyone else in that category. I dont really care about the numbers, because it also diminishes either sexes in both categories. They have been split as male and female for YEARS. It's like saying the Oscars and Emmys and every other awards show should only honor a single artist. I don't think the #metoo Or Times Up is striving to get both genders under one category. The Grammys did that to save money. And it was a stupid decision. How did it save them money? Meanwhile, here is past Grammy nominee Vanessa Carlton chiming in, going after Portnow...and saying she hasn't voted in 5 years: www.vulture.com/2018/01/vanessa-carlton-oust-grammys-recording-academy-neil-portnow.htmlI remember something a year or two ago where some hip-hop artists said they hadn't voted in years either. So, there is a lot of your problem; if women and people of color aren't voting, then it will be an uphill battle to get winners who are non-white males.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 1, 2018 17:25:02 GMT -5
I also don't think a "Vocal Performance" requires hitting a million notes or even a trained vocal. I'm not saying I would have voted for Ed out of the 5 nominees - I'm just saying that his vocals are done well, effective and appealing to many, obviously. He probably can't out-sang Pink, for example, but that's the difference between MOST male and female singers (not all!). The notes and the way the voices are generally used. Bob Dylan isn't a sang-er, but he can sing, and he gets nominated all the time for his vocal performances.
Anyway, I don't feel the genders need to be separated. Either could win and it usually seems like it's more about the record overall than specifically about the vocals. Maybe that's just me.
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Caviar
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Post by Caviar on Feb 1, 2018 17:32:47 GMT -5
^^^ I had to post the article. Vanessa makes a lot of great points.
I wasn’t aware you were an Academy member. When did you become one? They invite you to become a member for certain reasons, like working in the industry. They invited me to join NARAS [National Academy of Recording Arts and Sciences] shortly after I received a nomination in 2002. I don’t recall the exact date I signed up. It’s interesting that you bring that up, because the NARAS voting block needs to be looked at.
What has the gender breakdown looked like to you since you’ve been a NARAS member? Well, I’m not on the board — there are like 25 people on that — and then there’s all of these NARAS voters. This is really worth digging into: I think the voting block of NARAS is predominately white males. It’s so funny Neil thought he could say what he said. It’s his responsibility to oversee the voting environment. I would like to know what the numbers are because I don’t think he thinks there’s an issue, but the numbers will not lie. I would not be surprised if women are not well represented in that group. I’ve never been privy or given a choice as to how the categories are worded or divided. I’ve just been given my sheet and then you pick categories. That’s probably up to the board. And he’s the president. These are important questions.
Did you vote for this year’s Grammys? I did not.
When was the last time that you did? Probably five years ago because my membership expired. But once I saw what was going on and how the environment of the Grammys is not just affected by the president, but also by who’s voting, I was like, “Wait, I’m part of this, too.” One thing women do need to start paying more attention to is figuring out how many of us are represented among the voters. So I just renewed my membership for five years.
Having been a member of NARAS, was Portnow’s attitude about women something you’d heard before? It was just bizarre. I have no idea why he would infer that women are needing to get off the bench in any way shape or form. Women are in the game. A statement like that is just clearly being behind the times. Then his second statement, the backpedaling, was disturbing because the numbers don’t lie: 90 percent of the nominees were male. Then there’s the issue of who’s booking the show and who gets to decide which artists are represented to the world. When you have someone who’s coming from that sort of viewpoint and he’s in charge, along with the producer of the show, you’re not going to get a show that reflects the times. That’s where we’re at with the Grammys. Everyone felt that way before he even made a statement.
I’ve had the opportunity to play on the Grammys, be nominated, and be a NARAS member, and I still feel that now I have to step up to vote, too. I absolutely have to vote. So do many others. Just because I had a fine time at the Grammys and got to play my song, it doesn’t mean that there isn’t a fundamental problem that’s going on in the environment over there. It also comes from the top.
The response among women to Portnow’s comments almost reinforces his point that women have to do all the work to have a voice. I imagine that’s been the industry’s way for your entire career. What he was saying doesn’t make any sense. And it’s not just the “step up” wording that he thinks is what’s bothering everybody. It’s this idea that there are just not enough women out there. You have to be aware of glass ceilings, you have to be aware of brick walls. You can’t say, “Well I know you probably go through that, but I don’t experience that, honey, so I don’t really know what you’re talking about. You’re just gonna have to come to the plate.” You have to have a sensitivity to the environment. There are a million different glass ceilings. I’ve probably hit all of them. Every woman has. That’s where we’re at, but we’re pushing through. The way in which I’ve personally stepped up, then, is to renew my membership and spread this petition around.
So many of your peers have been vocal in denouncing his comments, but you’re the first I’m seeing demand action. How did it get on your radar — and is removing Portnow just a Band-Aid? The president is gonna effect change among the voting system and who’s represented among the voters. So that has to change. A new president will effect change. A woman named Karen Scott emailed my manager this morning and she’s reached out to a number of other artists as well about the petition.
Do you think a collective of female artists will form and mobilize from this? We’re obviously gonna hit 10,000 signatures and then we’ll up the goal. Then we’ll see where the momentum takes us and deliver this to the Recording Academy. We need a new president.
And that vote should be open to all members of NARAS? It’s interesting, because how was Neil chosen? He’s been president for 16 years. I joke about this: What is it Game of Thrones, where we wait forever and then they pass it down to the their son or something? We need to get with the times. He is behind them.
After #OscarsSoWhite, the Academy made several structural changes to promote inclusively, like inviting new members and deactivating old memberships. Does similar change seem inevitable for NARAS, and is it even possible? It’s been building toward this for years. Remember a couple years ago when Beyoncé was snubbed? That was bizarre. I haven’t watched the Grammys in years. I stopped watching and unplugged. This year, I’m completely back in the game. But in my opinion, it’s been unwatchable for years. I couldn’t believe what I was seeing on Sunday. It was a totally uneven, weird show. A lot of musicians probably feel the same way. With Lorde, they absolutely could’ve carved out an opportunity for her to perform whatever song she wanted. So that’s bullshit.
What made it so unwatchable for you in years past? It’s just a lackluster, corporate-feeling show. Every now and then you’ll get new blood on the stage, and that’s great, but they need to balance the established artists with independent artists. Finally rap records are in the Album of the Year category, which took a minute. There’s just been a lack of diversity in the music that’s up on that stage. It’s fallen into this one routine of a 10-million-album-selling artist getting the chance to perform. The Grammys can be a real window into some amazing talent if they let it be. That would actually help the ratings. It just clearly doesn’t occur to Neil that there’s a problem at all. There is.
If there’s no meaningful change, would you boycott the Grammys? Voting, attending, even submitting your work? Totally. Since I have a feeling there are so few women voting, it’d be a shame to give that up. But I’m not someone who’s gonna be at the Grammys. I’m an independent artist so there’s plenty of artists with way more on the line. Their Grammys performance could totally boost their albums sales and they don’t wanna lose that opportunity. I have nothing to lose. But, at the same time, I do because this is my community, too. That’s an important question for a lot of women artists. We have so much power, that if women would really consider making moves like that if this doesn’t work and there is no change, then [boycotting] would work.
But I’m proud to be part of this conversation and I think Pink’s statement was spot on. We’ve all been in the industry a really long time and it was incredibly inappropriate for someone in that position to make a statement like that, including his backpedaling. His head is completely in the wrong place. That’s why I’m stepping up in a way now that I have not in the past.
Did the white roses for Time’s Up feel meaningful to you? I didn’t even know what that was. I don’t think it makes a difference. I just don’t. What makes a difference are conversations like these and me putting myself on the line. There’s nothing harmful about the roses, but it’s really about taking risks to make change.
But I could easily be called a hypocrite because I’m speaking out but I haven’t voted in a couple years. That’s part of what’s so great about this: I had checked out and thought this Grammys thing was bullshit, but no, I gotta get back in the game and renew.
Portnow’s words got me thinking about how music has managed to slip through the cracks of #MeToo and remain largely unaffected. But is the dam about to burst there, too? Yes. I personally signed an NDA for someone who appeared on the Grammys. It makes my blood boil. Maybe some artists feel that they’re really beholden to their labels, but I hope the dam does break because that behavior has infiltrated the music industry just as much as it has everywhere else.
To your knowledge, have a lot of people in this industry signed NDAs that prevent them from coming forward? Maybe. Until recently, I couldn’t even discuss mine. Those agreements are really powerful and a lot of times you’re signing them so you don’t get sued and can just get out of your contract. I’m sure there’s a lot going on there, but I don’t know anyone who’s personally signed an NDA. But I do know a lot of women in the industry who’ve had very similar situations to me. And I’ve been under my NDA for five years.
I’m so sorry. We soldier on, girl.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Feb 1, 2018 23:35:02 GMT -5
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willapted33
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Post by willapted33 on Feb 1, 2018 23:51:47 GMT -5
please let this happen lol. Kendrick needs to win at least one AOTY before he retires
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Feb 2, 2018 9:45:35 GMT -5
please let this happen lol. Kendrick needs to win at least one AOTY before he retires In the grand tradition of the Grammys he'll probably win one when he's 74 and people will be upset because he beat someone younger and relevant.
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