Taylor Swift - "Look What You Made Me Do"

[deepston]

Sept 30, 2017 6:36:54 GMT -5 Juanca said:

Yeah I don't get some arguments here in terms of this song's performance. Taylor is at the peak of her (pop) career. 1989 was as huge an era as it could be. Just like Fame, Teenage Dream, 21. Her debut single was expected to be huge. So yeah she has the same insane expectations as Gaga, Katy, Adele had.

This is turning out to be much closer to Hold It Against Me. Great visuals, sort of a new sound for her, high initial impact and then quick fizzling. I won't be surprised if it starts to show a huge weekly decrease stat. The fact that this barely has been out for a month is concerning. I can't see why this IS what it was supposed to do. At this point this won't even be top 20 for the yearend chart.
And I do feel that RFI is a culprit as it diverted attention from this.
Anyway. Good luck to her, even though I'm not too fond of the start of this era. It just has a negative aura to me that I'm not digging. The attitude, persona, even the whole video, and her limited but effective singing being more replaced by talk-singing and Becky rapping are just not what I was expecting this era...
Hope there are better bops as next singles...

I'd say we have to wait for the 2nd single to see what will come out of this. She can either underperform or overperform 1989 at this point because she's just as huge as the 1989 era but she failed to release a crowd-grabbing hit like Shake It Off. Maybe the 2nd single will be more on the smash pop line like Blank Space/IKYWT and that will probably translate into more album sales and popularity. 
One thing I find really strange though is that her team and her probably knew this would happen and that this song is not a bop like SIO. Are they releasing a 2nd single extra early to make up for this because they already knew this would happen? More promo singles? I guess that we'll have to wait.

[Enigma.]

Sept 30, 2017 6:36:54 GMT -5 Juanca said:

Anyway. Good luck to her, even though I'm not too fond of the start of this era. It just has a negative aura to me that I'm not digging. The attitude, persona, even the whole video, and her limited but effective singing being more replaced by talk-singing and Becky rapping are just not what I was expecting this era...
Hope there are better bops as next singles...

Basically this

[Deleted]

I think Taylor is very savvy but I find hard to believe this was the best she could come up with. It won't ruin the album sales or her career at all, so that's a plus. She needs to release a new single really soon before Look starts freefalling on its own

[dhill92]

Sept 30, 2017 5:16:39 GMT -5 Az Paynter said:

So the premature death begins, the damage from RFI has already been done. Nice job screwing this up, Team Swift. :sip2:

POP:
5 4 TAYLOR SWIFT Look What You Made Me Do 13977 13437 540 78.915

+36 Spins
-82 Bullet
+0.253 Audience

HOT AC:
8 7 TAYLOR SWIFT Look What You Made Me Do 4361 4346 15 24.635

-11 Spins
-39 Bullet
-0.282 Audience

AC:
20 21 TAYLOR SWIFT Look What You Made Me Do 194 215 -21 0.673

-8 Spins
-12 Bullet
-0.042 Audience

RHYTHMIC:
22 18 TAYLOR SWIFT Look What You Made Me Do 1567 1529 38 4.175

-33 Spins
-61 Bullet
-0.335 Audience

Wow. Just, wow. I have no words to describe this...

[deepston]

Sept 30, 2017 7:06:05 GMT -5 @pete said:

I think Taylor is very savvy but I find hard to believe this was the best she could come up with. It won't ruin the album sales or her career at all, so that's a plus. She needs to release a new single really soon before Look starts freefalling on its own

Shake It Off was arguably one of the worst singles from 1989. Same with WANEGBT from Red. Her 2nd singles from her last 2 albums were probably the best in terms of overall performance excluding inicial hype from her lead singles. With that considered, I have high hopes for the next single.

[theflying]

I still *literally* don't understand the RFI damage comments. It's nonsensical.

Either people aren't really feeling the song or they love it and radio is inexplicably dropping it prematurely for RFI. It's not both, and hint, the latter doesn't make sense.

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2017 7:19:37 GMT -5 deepston said:

Sept 30, 2017 7:06:05 GMT -5 @pete said:

I think Taylor is very savvy but I find hard to believe this was the best she could come up with. It won't ruin the album sales or her career at all, so that's a plus. She needs to release a new single really soon before Look starts freefalling on its own

Shake It Off was arguably one of the worst singles from 1989. Same with WANEGBT from Red. Her 2nd singles from her last 2 albums were probably the best in terms of overall performance excluding inicial hype from her lead singles. With that considered, I have high hopes for the next single.

I disagree, Shake It Off is her biggest hit as far as chart performance. Debuted at 1, spent 24 weeks at top 10 and 50 at top 50. The video is her most watched with over 2B. This however doesn't necessarily should be a reason for someone to like a song. I think I still prefer her older pop country songs, but I know she ain't going to be doing this type of music anytime soon

[deepston]

Sept 30, 2017 7:41:08 GMT -5 @pete said:

Sept 30, 2017 7:19:37 GMT -5 deepston said:

Shake It Off was arguably one of the worst singles from 1989. Same with WANEGBT from Red. Her 2nd singles from her last 2 albums were probably the best in terms of overall performance excluding inicial hype from her lead singles. With that considered, I have high hopes for the next single.

I disagree, Shake It Off is her biggest hit as far as chart performance. Debuted at 1, spent 24 weeks at top 10 and 50 at top 50. The video is her most watched with over 2B. This however doesn't necessarily should be a reason for someone to like a song. I think I still prefer her older pop country songs, but I know she ain't going to be doing this type of music anytime soon

I said excluding the initial hype from her lead singles. Those always get tons of attention whether they are good or average, tbh they have always been average. Shake worked that well because pop + taylor swift + dropping country + catchy + lead single (hype). If Blank Space had been the lead it'd have had the same if not better chart success. Same with IKYWT.

[upsidedown]

Sept 30, 2017 7:38:05 GMT -5 theflying said:

I still *literally* don't understand the RFI damage comments. It's nonsensical.

Either people aren't really feeling the song or they love it and radio is inexplicably dropping it prematurely for RFI. It's not both, and hint, the latter doesn't make sense.

I mean, it's not hard to figure out. There's always a chance that when an artist has two songs on the radio at the same time that they could cannibalize each other, or one will hurt the other. A station may give 'Look' a few less spins b/c they need to fit in spins for RFI. Now, whether or not LWYMMD would've performed the same with or without RFI is debatable b/c I don't think it would've gone to #1 anyway, but I think the case can definitely be made that it's not *helping* it when another Taylor song is getting over +100 updates.

I think the comparisons of Look to Hold It Against Me are pretty accurate

[theflying]

Sept 30, 2017 7:51:57 GMT -5 Codex said:

Sept 30, 2017 7:38:05 GMT -5 theflying said:

I still *literally* don't understand the RFI damage comments. It's nonsensical.

Either people aren't really feeling the song or they love it and radio is inexplicably dropping it prematurely for RFI. It's not both, and hint, the latter doesn't make sense.

There is a third option:

It's clear that people aren't feeling the song no matter if RFI exists or not. The difference is, that if there was no second single yet, radio would be forcing themselves to play this. They want to be playing Taylor right now due to the hype. If there is no other song, they'd be giving this the plays that they're giving RFI now. But because they see that she has a better song out, they'll switch to that instead.

I hope it's clear now.

It's the pinnacle of the logic that doesn't make sense.

You people keep inversing what's important. The important part is to have a song out that people like, not a Song that gets 17,000 spins vs 14,000 just for the sake of it.

Having RFI out is BETTER if people aren't feeling Look as much, it's not WORSE.

[SPRΞΞ]

Sept 30, 2017 7:18:38 GMT -5 dhill92 said:

Wow. Just, wow. I have no words to describe this...

How about a picture?

[deepston]

Sept 30, 2017 7:51:57 GMT -5 Codex said:

Sept 30, 2017 7:38:05 GMT -5 theflying said:

I still *literally* don't understand the RFI damage comments. It's nonsensical.

Either people aren't really feeling the song or they love it and radio is inexplicably dropping it prematurely for RFI. It's not both, and hint, the latter doesn't make sense.

There is a third option:

It's clear that people aren't feeling the song no matter if RFI exists or not. The difference is, that if there was no second single yet, radio would be forcing themselves to play this. They want to be playing Taylor right now due to the hype. If there is no other song, they'd be giving this the plays that they're giving RFI now. But because they see that she has a better song out, they'll switch to that instead.

I hope it's clear now.

I can do nothing but agree to this and I'm a Taylor stan lol

[Deleted]

This thread has 73 pages. Probably the first 40 were before the song was even released. I think these types of hyped songs should have the first few weeks ignored and only take into consideration whether it's a success after the hype. This is clearly a flop imo. She really wasted a lot money on the video so I do think this was intended to be a smash.

[deepston]

Sept 30, 2017 7:59:46 GMT -5 @pete said:

This thread has 73 pages. Probably the first 40 were before the song was even released. I think these types of hyped songs should have the first few weeks ignored and only take into consideration whether it's a success after the hype. This is clearly a flop imo. She really wasted a lot money on the video so I do think this was intended to be a smash.

Not a flop, it's still doing ok in sales and streams and let's not pretend top 5 in pop is that bad. But yeah, I agree this is def underperforming right now and the song will probably bomb in the next month.

[Az Paynter]

Sept 30, 2017 7:51:57 GMT -5 Codex said:

Sept 30, 2017 7:38:05 GMT -5 theflying said:

I still *literally* don't understand the RFI damage comments. It's nonsensical.

Either people aren't really feeling the song or they love it and radio is inexplicably dropping it prematurely for RFI. It's not both, and hint, the latter doesn't make sense.

There is a third option:

It's clear that people aren't feeling the song no matter if RFI exists or not. The difference is, that if there was no second single yet, radio would be forcing themselves to play this. They want to be playing Taylor right now due to the hype. If there is no other song, they'd be giving this the plays that they're giving RFI now. But because they see that she has a better song out, they'll switch to that instead.

I hope it's clear now.

THIS. THIS. SO MUCH THIS. Obviously Codex and I are on different sides on LWYMMD (he's rooting against it and I'm rooting for it) but this is the situation. No matter what people think of LWYMMD, if this was their ONLY option then radio would have a laser focus on this and it would be in a much stronger position airplay-wise (also putting the label in a better position to push it to the top). But because they allowed radio to have this second option stations don't strictly *have* to play LWYMMD because they have RFI instead.

I don't see the point of them allowing stations to play RFI if it's not meant to be a radio single. Sure, put it on sale if they must, but it was an incredibly dumb move to give radio an out when LWYMMD is they song they're *supposed* to be playing.

[deepston]

On a side note, the playlist from Taylor on spotify "Songs Taylor Loves" is amazing. Just to shake off the negativity here.

[Deleted]

I think is going to pick up a little steam once she realizes that she needs to promote. I don't want her to become like Britney and Beyonce, they only perform in their concerts.

[deepston]

Sept 30, 2017 8:16:13 GMT -5 jules said:

I think is going to pick up a little steam once she realizes that she needs to promote. I don't want her to become like Britney and Beyonce, they only perform in their concerts.

I hope she heavily promotes the 2nd single during October. When are the AMA's this year?

[theflying]

Sept 30, 2017 8:18:01 GMT -5 Codex said:

Sept 30, 2017 7:55:46 GMT -5 theflying said:

It's the pinnacle of the logic that doesn't make sense.

You people keep inversing what's important. The important part is to have a song out that people like, not a Song that gets 17,000 spins vs 14,000 just for the sake of it.

Having RFI out is BETTER if people aren't feeling Look as much, it's not WORSE.

You're right about that; and if they handled it well, it would have been the right strategy. For example, when Judas started doing horribly and they threw out The Edge Of Glory 3 weeks later. Or, when Katy's team tried killing Bon Appetite for Swish Swish (that didn't work though).

But the difference here is that Ready For It is not officially a second single. They're helping to kill of LWYMMD without giving them something to play instead. They're not going to go all out for RFI if it's not the second single, it'll just do enough to kill LWYMMD and then they both fall together and she'll have no songs on rotation when the actual second single starts getting spins on album release week.

Also, RFI isn't exactly the anti-LWYMMD. It's goal should have been to catch the people who hate the first single. But it's the same sing-talk-rap Becky style with cheap electro. Only reason it's somewhat better is because it has a melody in the chorus. (I prefer the lead). It turns people off further.

A) A fairly sizable amount of people prefer RFI.

B) It's an argument that only has some of the picture to base it off of. We'll see what the second single is, how the album sales are, etc.

Fundamentally having a second song getting publicity and airplay that people like is always a good thing.

[Juanca]

Agree with the third option argument
There are also songs that need a bit more time to grow on people or for people to get more accustomed to them. Had RFI not existed, radios could've still played Look and people get to like it more.

Also, no one is talking about 14k vs 17k spins. That's a misconstrued argument that I've read multiple times. It's about longevity, which is key for long-term successful eras and artists. We are seeing initial signs that Look could have an extremely short shelf life not only in radio but also streaming. I don't think that the behind the scenes videos have been as effective as they could've if RFI hadn't stolen the thunder of Look, and they could've been helpful to extend the shelf life of Look.

Of course, we'll see what happens with the rest of this era. But this is confusing to me.

Also, I agree with lucas in that this is not a SoY-CotH situation or a Single ladies-IIWAB situation where the two singles show different sides of the artist. RFI is slightly more melodic than Look but both are in the same style --I guess Taylor really needed to vomit the Look lyrics and video...
Anyway
Look is of not course not a flop but an underperforming single that could've done better. Some of us chart watchers like analyzing this shit and puzzle at decisions like this (or Adele's multiple self-sabotaging efforts to not turn singles into hits )

[deepston]

Thing is Taylor is extremely smart and calculated with her releases. Idk what happened for them to release RFI that soon or even the MV for Look on the 1st week. It'd have been #1 for like 2 weeks without the mv, releasing the mv on the 3rd week would ensure the longevity of the single. Overall a lot of poor decisions so far.

[Philippe]

The performance of this song is not surprising at all.

[irice22]

Sept 30, 2017 7:38:05 GMT -5 theflying said:

I still *literally* don't understand the RFI damage comments. It's nonsensical.

Either people aren't really feeling the song or they love it and radio is inexplicably dropping it prematurely for RFI. It's not both, and hint, the latter doesn't make sense.

It's simply not nonsensical at all. RFI is absolutely eating spins from LWYMMD. And yes, it can be a combination of both.

There is a reason labels haven't pushed two songs from the same artist to the same format for years.

[irice22]

Sept 30, 2017 4:21:28 GMT -5 dbhmr said:

Sept 29, 2017 19:38:56 GMT -5 irice22 said:

lol

So are you laughing at yourself or?

No need to bully. It was funny we made almost the same comment.

Though my use of the word *had* implies they may have f'ed up the release schedule.

[tinawina]

Sept 30, 2017 9:12:28 GMT -5 deepston said:

Thing is Taylor is extremely smart and calculated with her releases. Idk what happened for them to release RFI that soon or even the MV for Look on the 1st week. It'd have been #1 for like 2 weeks without the mv, releasing the mv on the 3rd week would ensure the longevity of the single. Overall a lot of poor decisions so far.

I think releasing the video fast made sense for this song. It was a pretty polarizing choice and the video was so good that it would likely make some folks warm up to the song. Without the video, the first two weeks of conversation would have been dominated by the bad reviews that were popping up left and right and the sizable part of the audience that hated it. But after the video’s release, the conversation shifted more to dissecting the visuals, and how clever/self aware/funny Taylor is, I mean just really Taylor herself instead of how much the song sucks or doesn’t suck.

RFI being released to radio has its pluses and minuses as a strategy, but the bottom line to me really is the quality of LWYMMD itself. Maybe doing this or that differently could have squeezed another couple of weeks into this run but if people don’t like the song, they don’t like the song. It shouldn’t be THIS hard to keep the thing chugging along after The Mother of All Launches from someone with her level of success. it only had to last like 2 months to launch. It’s not that much under these circumstances,

The song just doesn’t work. It happens.

[Deleted]

There is really nothing good to talk about this song anymore. All the positive moments of it have more to do with Taylors comeback rather than the song itself. Her next "record" with this song could be lowest sales for a #1. With a discount. This is actually a record that speaks more of the song rather than Taylor.
I don't know if she has already planned a release day for next single; but I really would like it by this Friday. That would give new hype, then release video and one month later have album ready with it still being a single. I'm sure she knows how to handle this better to profit it more in the long run and still get away when shit happens, but what is she still gaining from this?

[theflying]

Sept 30, 2017 9:53:03 GMT -5 tinawina said:

Sept 30, 2017 9:12:28 GMT -5 deepston said:

Thing is Taylor is extremely smart and calculated with her releases. Idk what happened for them to release RFI that soon or even the MV for Look on the 1st week. It'd have been #1 for like 2 weeks without the mv, releasing the mv on the 3rd week would ensure the longevity of the single. Overall a lot of poor decisions so far.

I think releasing the video fast made sense for this song. It was a pretty polarizing choice and the video was so good that it would likely make some folks warm up to the song. Without the video, the first two weeks of conversation would have been dominated by the bad reviews that were popping up left and right and the sizable part of the audience that hated it. But after the video’s release, the conversation shifted more to dissecting the visuals, and how clever/self aware/funny Taylor is, I mean just really Taylor herself instead of how much the song sucks or doesn’t suck.

RFI being released to radio has its pluses and minuses as a strategy, but the bottom line to me really is the quality of LWYMMD itself. Maybe doing this or that differently could have squeezed another couple of weeks into this run but if people don’t like the song, they don’t like the song. It shouldn’t be THIS hard to keep the thing chugging along after The Mother of All Launches from someone with her level of success. it only had to last like 2 months to launch. It’s not that much under these circumstances,

The song just doesn’t work. It happens.

This is pretty much how I feel. If LWYYMMD isn't connecting, it's not connecting. That's the bottom line.

[Dylan :)]

Sept 30, 2017 7:00:03 GMT -5 Codex said:

Sept 30, 2017 6:22:26 GMT -5 Dylan :) said:

I find it funny that Taylor is so huge that a hit as big as this is what is considered an underperformance for her

On pop radio it's not looking to be a big hit in terms of overall spins. It's probably going to squeeze in a week at #3, but because it started so high, half of its run is cut off. Let's assume its bullet goes 300, 100, -500, -1500, -3000, -3500, -2500, -1500, -700 in the following weeks. These bullets would be typical for a hyped up lead single (Chained To The Rhythm had a similar fall).

At this point it would be at 142,000 overall spins and down to 1250 weekly with a -700 bullet after 15 weeks. Maybe reaching around 150,000 after its run is completely over.

The #3 peaking songs from last year (Ref):
The Chainsmokers ft. Rozes Roses 270,058 #3
The Weeknd In The Night 242,767 #3

If trends continue, its overall Pop performance will be on the level of a typical #8-9 peaking song. This is after following I think 6-7 consecutive #1s combined with lead single hype.

Oh I agree, I'm not saying this is the biggest hit since Closer on pop radio, but if you ignore the fact that this is from Taylor Swift and just looked at it as if this was just a regular song, it would be a really good hit for an artist. You could argue "well, this is Taylor Swift at the end of the day" but my point is that if this is as low as she goes this era (especially when a lot are claiming Ready For It is better, leading me to believe there again are better songs on the album, and others made the point of we didn't hear the other 1989 singles until the album release), I'm not worried at all.

I also completely agree with you and Snark's points on the next page. It's similar to Ed earlier in the year but instead of making that decision for fans, it was being made for radio (an alternative).

[Deleted]

Sept 30, 2017 8:16:13 GMT -5 jules said:

I think is going to pick up a little steam once she realizes that she needs to promote. I don't want her to become like Britney and Beyonce, they only perform in their concerts.

The bigger you get the less you wanna put yourself out there because all it will do is invite criticism. There's a reason most artists scale back promo as their careers progress. Let the music speak for itself, but also make sure the music is fire.

I'm sure Taylor has better stuff on the album than this...

[ILLUSION]

^ Honestly, I think it's because the song is not received as well as those in her previous projects. I mean, a Top 5 hit is still good for any standard, but had this not been Taylor, I don't think this would have even touched Top 10. For me personally, it's that this new image of Taylor is not working. For me, and this is my opinion, it seems forced and fake, which in turn lowers the authenticity of the track.