Web
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Post by Web on Sept 29, 2017 8:15:38 GMT -5
idk maybe I'm just happy to see an inactive/new player come in with some decent content to sift through. Gave me a town read initially but obviously isn't a strong one yet.
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Az Paynter
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Post by Az Paynter on Sept 29, 2017 8:29:12 GMT -5
'Hai lol I been busy' doesn't really work for me lol cause I've literally been out all day with only my phone to spaz out whenever I try to check in on Pulse/the game, and I have *still* been able to post and address in-thread discussion, if not to the best of my ability. I don't see it as an impatience issue exactly either, 'cause we're only just past the halfway point. The point isn't to rush anyone to contribute, it's that they contribute at all.
Typical Pulse would be floundering at day's end and our D1 would end up being an inactive. Even with our chances at nailing scum being low so early, this tactic has never really played out well for us in the past. Better to try and nip that in the bud now. There is enough to talk about, we just need to, y'know, talk about it. ;)
Does the fact that Traitor!Town isn't aware of their scum partners (and vice versa) change the read on the deputy? We'd already decided deputy has zero utility as scum, would that change if they don't know who their partners are? Personally, I think since it's a two-way blind partnership they could just as easily be accidentally killed off by their unsuspecting buddies, but maybe someone might have an alternate spin I haven't considered.
Based on prior discussions I gravitate more toward Mayor/Sheriff as secret scum.
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zaclord π
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Post by zaclord π on Sept 29, 2017 8:35:34 GMT -5
Sorry y'all I traveled home to visit family for the weekend so I didn't get on last night! Here are my thoughts on what we've learned so far: The mafia not knowing who the traitor is immediately is an interesting twist. To clarify what BackwoodsBarbie said with you castleoblivion26 - if the mafia try to NK the traitor, they will then know who the traitor is because they'll get to NK someone else, correct? If this isn't correct, do we all just hear that there was an attempted murder on this user, but they didn't die? Do we as town know when the doctor saves people, or do we just hear that they didn't die? Do we know exactly who doesn't die (aka who the mafia targeted) or do we just hear that there was a failed attempt at murder? [Sorry lots of questions - just trying not to make any assumptions of how this game works compared to how I've played irl mafia]. Essentially my thoughts are: if mafia don't get a redo NK when they try and kill the traitor, then the traitor will be easier to spot, but I feel like that would make things way too easy to spot out the traitor unless we all don't get to know who was attacked and/or how they were saved (obviously we'll know in the case of the Deputy because they'll die). So my questions are do mafia get a redo vote when they try and kill the traitor and does town know specifically who had the attempted NK on them when they don't die? It's extremely difficult to read people so far since nothing has even happened yet and we're just speculating possibilities and strategies, so I'll keep my vote as is for now.
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zaclord π
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Post by zaclord π on Sept 29, 2017 8:44:52 GMT -5
Does the fact that Traitor!Town isn't aware of their scum partners (and vice versa) change the read on the deputy? We'd already decided deputy has zero utility as scum, would that change if they don't know who their partners are? Personally, I think since it's a two-way blind partnership they could just as easily be accidentally killed off by their unsuspecting buddies, but maybe someone might have an alternate spin I haven't considered. Based on prior discussions I gravitate more toward Mayor/Sheriff as secret scum. Well the deputy's role is to pick someone to protect each night and if the mafia target that townie, then the deputy dies instead of the townie. So if the deputy was scum, they would only die by lynching because the mafia aren't going to kill themselves. Even if the deputy were to try and throw the town off by saving a townie and sacrificing themselves, we then would know that the deputy was scum (because they'd be dead) and that the townie that was saved isn't the mafia. So any way you spin it I don't think a scum deputy would have any benefit. While I agree that Sheriff probably is the best fit to be scum (best chance at figuring out who the mafia they are working with are), even mayor and doctor could still somewhat play both their role and the traitor. Deputy on the other hand is absolutely useless as scum unless I'm missing something here.
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zaclord π
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Post by zaclord π on Sept 29, 2017 8:49:50 GMT -5
Also another question: if the doctor and the deputy both choose the same person to save and the mafia also targeted that same townie (unlikely I know), is it the doctor or the deputy that actually "saves" the townie? Does the doctor take precedence or does the deputy die either way?
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Az Paynter
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Post by Az Paynter on Sept 29, 2017 8:53:21 GMT -5
I feel like the Doctor would take priority in that particular action resolution; Mafia kills, Doctor saves, Deputy lives because they protected someone that didn't die. But that's up to Castleoblivion to determine; it's his set-up so I should trust he knows what would happen in any given scenario.
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BackwoodsBarbie
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Post by BackwoodsBarbie on Sept 29, 2017 9:15:14 GMT -5
Does the fact that Traitor!Town isn't aware of their scum partners (and vice versa) change the read on the deputy? We'd already decided deputy has zero utility as scum, would that change if they don't know who their partners are? Personally, I think since it's a two-way blind partnership they could just as easily be accidentally killed off by their unsuspecting buddies, but maybe someone might have an alternate spin I haven't considered. Based on prior discussions I gravitate more toward Mayor/Sheriff as secret scum. Deputy or other power role that is actually a scum can not be killed at night by mafia - post #71 ( If the Mafia were to NK the Traitor, the traitor will not die meaning the traitor can only die by lynching, same with the 3 mafia.) If you are talking about Lynching then Yes mafia and power roll that is actually a scum don't know each other so they can vote for each other without even knowing that they have the same goal.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2017 9:15:31 GMT -5
I canβt speak for castle, but typically actions that are resolved arenβt made public to town unless specified in the specific role PM, which are not typically public. IE if the doctor targets someone and theyβre successful, then that person wonβt die, but neither scum nor the doctor will be told if the protection was successful meaning the doctor wonβt know if they actually saved someone that night, and scum wonβt be able to tell if they targeted the traitor or someone the doctor protected.
Iβm also going to say that, based on the above, it would make sense for Doctor to be town aligned for the purposes of the setup as it doesnβt give scum the luxury of trying to figure out their teammate by simply targeting someone they think is scummy, as that doesnβt necessarily mean theyβre the traitor.
Typically the ONLY thing made public after a night phase, and by that I mean revealed by the moderator to the whole game, is when someone dies. (Please guys re-read old games this information is literally in the OP lol....)
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Albie
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Post by Albie on Sept 29, 2017 10:56:14 GMT -5
So, since castleoblivion's clarifying post, it seems the discussion has turned back into a setup discussion. I'm glad we got those answers but i'm going to go ahead and post my thoughts on everyone so far and try to get back to talking about that.
Current reads: Gravey β null. Has had nothing of meaning to contribute. I know we shouldnβt bring in past game play but this is usually how things go with him. So eager to play but is never quite up for the challenge.
Zeddβ null. Confused newbie that asked for clarification of terms but still has done nothing to sift through the information. Albie β hi =)
Max/Rose β null. Has gone back to do thinking on the set up a few times. Voting for thewebinator at the moment though Iβm still unclear as to why. Thewebinator is probably the most town-leaning in everyoneβs opinion but max is keeping his vote on him so I find that something to watch as we get closer to deadline.
Galaxy Girl β null. One post about having played IRL before and thatβs it. Probably just busy/preoccupied town but I canβt say for sure with only that to go on.
Normusic β null. Has only posted about trying to take it all in and thewebinator seems suspicuios for trying to talk strategy (what?) and voted for him. But at least he took a stance so its something to look at. But not much.
Jordan/Stacey β slight town lean. Seems like he is still trying to get into the game but has made some contributions and probed others. Voting for miloninja due to his willingness to just be lynched but as miloninja comes off more and more townish to me, it leaves me with some doubts on Jordan.
Zaclord β slight town lean. Based solely on the fact that he asked about how the NK results would be given. I would think scum would ask this in their scum PM so with nothing more to work with, Iβm thinking newbie town. But its only a slight town lean because I canβt shake a newbie scum coached vibe. Doing just enough to appear town and asking seemly innocent questions. These are very shaky grounds but its all Iβve got work with so far. Backwoods Barbie β slight town lean. I like that she finally came in and had some analysis and statistics. It at least brings a bit of something fresh to things. Itβs a very, very slight town lean as I need to see more.
Myloninja β town-leaning. Iβm thinking confused newbie town as he started off very erratic but has since tried to gain an understanding of the game and contributed a bit more. His vote remains on Kunt, another who is currently a strong town read for most, so that is something else to keep an eye on as the day expires.
Az/Snark Knight β town lean. Calling out players as needed for not contributing and posing some questions trying to open up discussion. No strong stances on any of the players yet though.
Broccoli β town lean. Not much to go on but from what Iβm getting I think he is a new player and is asking questions out of necessity. If he were scum heβd likely ask the lying about roles question in his scum PM. Thewebinator β town read. The most active of players and also the most helpful to newbies so far. He has put forth various theories, asked questions and been overall the one leading conversation. I suppose he looks extra good because the level of activity from a good half of the players is low so if he is scum its easy enough to cover up at the moment but thatβs nothing that can be gleaned at this time, imo.
Aunt β town read. the second biggest contributor so far and he is being his usual helpful self to town. Very much in the same way as thewebinator, heβd be someone to not leave an easily visible scum trail, especially on day 1 so based on all the positive activity at the moment I canβt help but lean town.
As I finished my reads, I realized that I didnβt have a strong scum suspicious really of anyone yet. At the moment, I would probably turn my null read on normusic into a scum read just based on gut feeling (it would be a weak suspicion). As we are getting closer to the end of D1, Iβll pose the following question to everyone: who do you find the most suspicious and who you find the least suspicious?
And again, because we are nearing our last 24 hours, I think it appropriate to return to the question of lynching inactive newbies soon too as we still have two players with no more than 1 post this entire time and two other players that really not added anything to the discussion.
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Normi
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Post by Normi on Sept 29, 2017 11:03:14 GMT -5
To be fair though, most times i played this game in real life, the person who was most destined to create a strategy and help town turned out to be a traitor (which is why I'm suspicious on thewebinator) I still have no clue what to think of whom - thanks for the summary Albie !
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Albie
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Post by Albie on Sept 29, 2017 11:13:53 GMT -5
To be fair though, most times i played this game in real life, the person who was most destined to create a strategy and help town turned out to be a traitor (which is why I'm suspicious on thewebinator) I still have no clue what to think of whom - thanks for the summary Albie ! You're welcome and I understand what you're saying about scum appearing as helpful town but all that says to me is that you do have thoughts on people actually. For example, you clearly have a stance on thewebinator. We can't know if we're right or wrong but it's at least helpful when you point things out and try to break things down some. Given your feelings on the webinator, what do you make of Kunt, for instance, as compared to thewebinator? What about Max or miloninja or me or Az?
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Normi
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Post by Normi on Sept 29, 2017 11:37:41 GMT -5
So I re-read some things and re-arranged my thoughts, not because I feel threatened or anything but I think I need to I think I do seem like a douchebag lol But it's true we really have to help town and use the different roles wisely People helping doesn't really hurt our chances So I'm changing my vote: Vote: Zedd
Just because I feel like of all people who tried to help he did the least and I just have a strange feeling about him I guess
Willtry to be or active on this and follow along more strongly
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Web
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Post by Web on Sept 29, 2017 11:48:49 GMT -5
^That normusic post, especially the "not that I feel like I'm being attacked" part seems like a small unintnetuonal reveal/TMI. I'll elaborate later today but it makes me feel better about my current vote.
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Web
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Post by Web on Sept 29, 2017 11:49:38 GMT -5
Holy shit *unintentional, mobile posts make me invent new words
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rainie
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Post by rainie on Sept 29, 2017 12:48:13 GMT -5
Hey guys, sorry I've been largely inactive lately. I've been busy with school, and frankly kind of overwhelmed with this, as its way harder to tell people's intentions over the internet and there's so much more strategy and intracecies. I'll cast my vote later tonight, but I want to get a better read on things first. Tempted to vote gravey since he isn't likely to ever do anything tho ;)
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Sept 29, 2017 13:13:35 GMT -5
To be fair though, most times i played this game in real life, the person who was most destined to create a strategy and help town turned out to be a traitor (which is why I'm suspicious on thewebinator) I still have no clue what to think of whom - thanks for the summary Albie ! That's kind of the way I feel sometimes too. I don't think we've played with thewebinator before so we don't know if he's being an overeager player or if this is how he'd play regardless of his alignment. One thing I always consider when it comes to thinking who town is vs. scum is that a good scum player will do whatever they can to help town, even if that means throwing one of their own under the bus. So it is important to keep in mind that a helpful player for town can still be scum if they're doing it right. And that's why I'm giving thewebinator side-eye - though with that said, that's a useless reason to suspect someone because a good town player should ALSO be doing what they can to help town. At any rate, I don't really have any solid readings on anyone just yet. I guess my question now is, would I rather vote for a useless player who ends up being town or a helpful player who ends up being scum? For a first day, I think we can afford to lean toward voting out a player whose contributions are minimal. So my vote currently on thewebinator right now is very likely to change unless something comes up to make me legit suspect him.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2017 13:18:11 GMT -5
Hey guys, sorry I've been largely inactive lately. I've been busy with school, and frankly kind of overwhelmed with this, as its way harder to tell people's intentions over the internet and there's so much more strategy and intracecies. I'll cast my vote later tonight, but I want to get a better read on things first. Tempted to vote gravey since he isn't likely to ever do anything tho ;) Ill make a long post later in the day about my thoughts of who is scum/null/town.
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rainie
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Post by rainie on Sept 29, 2017 14:34:24 GMT -5
Alright, after reading through the thread a couple times and thinking about things count me in on the normusic train.
He seemed really quick to throw out accusations and make posts persuading people to vote webinator with very little evidence in very short posts. I agree that he also came across as defensive in his latest post, particularly the "not that I feel attacked part." Also the quick flip to Zedd, while not suspect on its own, shows me that he may just be willing to follow the numbers in order to get people off his own back, which is further shown by the fact that not only did he largely piggy back on other people's arguements for both web and Zedd, he also stole whatever picks were looking popular at the time.
Vote: normusic
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Normi
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Post by Normi on Sept 29, 2017 14:39:00 GMT -5
Lolol whatever Guess I better just not post at all anymore if you just assume things Well, I know I'm part of the town and wanna help so if you want me out - great - one less of us then :) I think we should focus on people who really could be threads instead of making accusations out of nothing
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Albie
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Post by Albie on Sept 29, 2017 14:55:55 GMT -5
Ok Normi so other than a strange feeling about Zedd, who are those other people who really could be threats in your opinion? rainie now that you've read the thread a couple of time, I'm curious what your take on everyone else is?
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Normi
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Post by Normi on Sept 29, 2017 14:58:35 GMT -5
I seriously don't know yet - that's what we're supposed to find out But if you ask others probably me So I made any further suspicions I would be center of suspicion again for some (?) reason
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rainie
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Post by rainie on Sept 29, 2017 15:13:16 GMT -5
Ok Normi so other than a strange feeling about Zedd, who are those other people who really could be threats in your opinion? rainie now that you've read the thread a couple of time, I'm curious what your take on everyone else is? I'm gonna wait till it's been a bit longer and everyone has given their full two cents, but I do have to say that in addition to normusic, I'm growing a bit suspect of a couple of the more talkative people. Don't want to say who yet and start shit because it's only a faint feeling and I want to get a better feel for things first though. Zedd also being so quiet is a bit suspect, but I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and say it's because he's still figuring things out. I don't think people being quiet makes then inheritly suspect, at least at this point.
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zaclord π
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Post by zaclord π on Sept 29, 2017 15:15:56 GMT -5
I seriously don't know yet - that's what we're supposed to find out But if you ask others probably me So I made any further suspicions I would be center of suspicion again for some (?) reason Hey norm, if you look back at the first post, this information is useful for what this stage is supposed to be about (I just had to go back through and re-read everything again to make sure I'm playing this right myself). Here it is from the first page - and this is for everyone, not just norm!: For that bolded part, I feel like Albie is doing a great job at that so far. We should all aim to attempt ask more questions like he's done to get more information on one another, because right now it is nearly impossible to get a good read on anyone. So norm, to defend yourself a little better, you should attempt to come up with something other than "I don't know" because that isn't really working for you right now. I'd also encourage you to call others out to justify their reasoning and to take stances on others too! This game will only get more fun as it goes along and we still have another 24+ hours for people to change their minds about you, so don't get flustered - change their minds! But for now my vote is also switching to normusic
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Normi
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Post by Normi on Sept 29, 2017 15:21:09 GMT -5
Well ok I'm living with the fact now that y'all will be voting me out Just a question to anybody here: Which reason would I have to act so stupid if i were one of the bad other than just being stupid? I don't know but I think some of the people that were not posting much yet are suspicious to me because I would definitely hide in the dark ifI were one of the bad
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Albie
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Post by Albie on Sept 29, 2017 15:32:44 GMT -5
Normusic one thing I will say is that, so far, you have defended yourself without really coming off as defensive. Up until your most recent post, that's probably the most defensive I've seen but it isn't really - its just you taking the direction others have offered and asking questions back, which is fair. These are the types of questions and responses that open up discussion and get people thinking. For instance, you have me questioning myself now and my thoughts on you as I don't think you'd post the way you have been if you were newbie scum being coached by experienced scum.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Sept 29, 2017 15:53:05 GMT -5
Lolol whatever Guess I better just not post at all anymore if you just assume things Well, I know I'm part of the town and wanna help so if you want me out - great - one less of us then :) I think we should focus on people who really could be threads instead of making accusations out of nothing Assumptions are kind of part of the game - or at the very least, hypothetical or perceptions. It's how you choose to respond to people's perceptions of things you say that will determine whether people think you're suspect or not. If you're town and people suspect you, find out why. Worst case scenario, you get voted out, flip town, and are one less distraction for everyone else. My advice to anyone in that situation is, do what you can to help town even if your goose is cooked. When playing this game, everyone is potential scum until they're not (or they are). Even if town players lynch a town player (one of their own), if town wins, that counts as a win for you so it's your duty to go down contributing, even if the entire rest of the players are against you. TL;DR, refraining from posting to keep yourself in the game does nothing to help your team and will get you lynched.
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Web
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Post by Web on Sept 29, 2017 16:55:21 GMT -5
I'm still out for a few hours so I didn't read the recent posts very closely, but while I do think normusic has done some things to make him look a little scummy I'm a little alarmed at how quickly a wagon seems to be forming up when my personal vote on him still isn't on very solid ground atm
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matteeeb
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Post by matteeeb on Sept 29, 2017 17:04:40 GMT -5
For the record I have been quiet because ive been travelling around for the past few days and I won't be back until tomorrow tonight, iil try and get a post up before the first day is over with my thoughts and opinions on everything.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2017 17:18:34 GMT -5
I donβt hate the normusic train but did Galaxy Girl not just bandwagon vote herself which is exactly what sheβs acusing Normusic of doing? Lol
Iβll need to read more closely but I have a brief analysis written up from yesterday that I was sitting on, I was just waiting on some more stuff to happen. Need to make adjustments.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2017 18:08:39 GMT -5
Anyway.
So I admittedly withheld a suspicion before because I want a scum read to change any patterns before they actually became something worth pointing to, so sorry if it seems like I wasn't contributing to scum hunting so much as dropping random advice.
A few observations:
thewebinator strikes me as obvious, if not overzealous, town. I hate that btw, because now I'm inherently second guessing myself because nobody should appear this solid on D1; but innocent until proven guilty I guess.
broccoli is saying jack shit but I'm getting a slight town read for publicly asking if they could lie about their role, lol. That just seems like a new town question, because scum would likely go to their teammates first and I assume the traitor would know they weren't at risk of being NKed, so could claim freely.
miloninja13 looks more confused than anything. Null, I guess, but nothing jumps out at me.
Az is moving discussion, but earlier he tags inactive players but skips gravey. Moving from town to null because, as forgettable as he is, Az has seemingly been on top of things thus far.
gravey is infuriating because he isn't saying shit and nobody is calling him out on it. I'd look up his tag, but that's asking a lot of me rn. That everyone is just letting him get away with it would normally speak volumes but, again, it's gravey. Just, you know, post more dude. Zedd is basically in the "idk, hasn't said shit" camp as well. No idea what to make of him.
Karen Stacey (I can never remember how to spell your name and I'm honestly too lazy to swap a tab rn I just got off work I'm so sorry) does actually grill gravey and Backwoods Barbie, but gives Galaxy Girl a free pass. I'm also FoS'ing the hell out of your proposal to lynch an experienced player of an inexperienced one because of irl mafia. iirc you've played Pulse mafia before and should know that what works in irl mafia doesn't fly online, especially when it's easier for Pulse scum to get coaching behind the scenes.
Galaxy Girl voting for normusic for bandwagon voting (what bandwagon?) when she herself hasn't said shit this entire phase, after everyone has already starting moving to normusic, is sus as hell.
Backwoods Barbie basically regurgitated a bunch of stuff everyone had already said, which is bad but not a scum tell as of yet. I at least see some effort here, though. Post more please.
Max is such a fucking good mafia player when he's scum, lol. I can NEVER tell what his alignment is. Ever. Null in perpetuity, because nothing stands out and he's playing a very vanilla game.
normusic's wagon feels convenient. It's being championed by the only unanimously agreed upon town player and although only a few are actually biting, it seems easy. He's made one defensive statement, but otherwise his questions feel town and he's been grilled for most of the game. Maybe I'm missing something but I have a null read, and although I said I don't hate his wagon as I don't think he's contributed a whole lot thusfar, I think we have better options (Galaxy Girl, gravey, and AlbieβI'll get to that).
zaclord has an approach to this game that says town to me, albeit not strongly, specifically in the questions he's asking (to the point: asking how it would work if scum targeted the traitor at night.) If he was either of these, I question why he would ask openly when he'd probably already know the answer to this.
On that note, vote: Albie for a few reasons. The proposition that mayor should claim SCREAMS scum to me because it benefits scum most to have the double vote wasted, especially when the chances of the role actually being scum is only 1/4, and scum could just not NK the Mayor thus causing us to be down 3 townies because we assumed he was scum *and* we wasted a power role. One other thing I noticed is that he strikes me as buttering up obvtown thewebinator to get an influential town in his camp, which is a tactic scum often uses to secure a safety net (I'm guilty of using this strategy myself). Maybe I'm reaching here, idk, but it stands out to me. Also less scummy more funny but lol at you saying brocolli might be town because you asked a lot of questions your first gameβweren't you actually scum your first game anyway?
Finally Kunt: obvscum lynch pls
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