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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Dec 16, 2020 11:45:59 GMT -5
So for major artists adds don't make much difference? Pretty much. Unless it's a single released later in the era that needs a formal push. Although, there have been exceptions to that custom as well. Cheers by Rihanna took off without an official adds date. I'm sure there have been several others since then. It seems to be more common with album tracks that radio picks up on once the album comes out, like I think with Dark Horse by Katy, for example, or maybe even songs that become hits elsewhere, either other formats or digital/online/viral somehow.
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Post by Mayman on Dec 16, 2020 11:46:16 GMT -5
Love Taylor, but I feel like all this with the remixes is a bit much. If it was just the one I might feel a little different, but to already have a song discounted in its first week, as well as three remixes discounted as well that are all released within the first week just makes it feel inorganic. Swifities don't come for me as I love Taylor and her music, but what Taylor needs is longevity and even if this goes #1 probably won't give her longevity. To be fair there is no way to ensure longevity now is there, so what else can Taylor do? She can perhaps not pull songs from radio (I am still salty about her pulling Cardigan from radio before the callouts came in), but it wouldn't be a Taylor Swift single rollout without big blunders. Willow is a lovely song, but it's too un-ubiquitous to do well at radio. It sounds more like a song a wandering minstrel would sing, not something that would top pop radio charts in 2021. Her track record at radio has also been relatively poor recently, since her previous 3 singles didn't even reach top ten at pop radio. In these circumstances striking while the iron is hot is a great move. There won't be much momentum after this week, so she needs to get as high as she can this week. I think there is a bit of confusion from people about being "pulled" from radio. Songs don't get pulled. Labels can stop promoting it but they don't "pull" the song from radio. Typically radio themselves decide when they will stop playing the song.
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zdm1998
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Post by zdm1998 on Dec 16, 2020 11:46:28 GMT -5
Love Taylor, but I feel like all this with the remixes is a bit much. If it was just the one I might feel a little different, but to already have a song discounted in its first week, as well as three remixes discounted as well that are all released within the first week just makes it feel inorganic. Swifities don't come for me as I love Taylor and her music, but what Taylor needs is longevity and even if this goes #1 probably won't give her longevity. To be fair there is no way to ensure longevity now is there, so what else can Taylor do? She can perhaps not pull songs from radio (I am still salty about her pulling Cardigan from radio before the callouts came in), but it wouldn't be a Taylor Swift single rollout without big blunders. Willow is a lovely song, but it's too un-ubiquitous to do well at radio. It sounds more like a song a wandering minstrel would sing, not something that would top pop radio charts in 2021. Her track record at radio has also been relatively poor recently, since her previous 3 singles didn't even reach top ten at pop radio. In these circumstances striking while the iron is hot is a great move. There won't be much momentum after this week, so she needs to get as high as she can this week. I mean I get why she’s doing it because as you said after this week there will be a big drop off, but it does feel like a lot to have 4 versions of a song all released within the past 7 days to be discounted. She needs something like Delicate; which while not reaching top 5 on the Hot 100 did more for her career than these that are reaching an artificial #1 peak then dropping off. Her name can only take it so far, eventually that front loading won’t work anymore.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 11:48:56 GMT -5
To be fair there is no way to ensure longevity now is there, so what else can Taylor do? She can perhaps not pull songs from radio (I am still salty about her pulling Cardigan from radio before the callouts came in), but it wouldn't be a Taylor Swift single rollout without big blunders. Willow is a lovely song, but it's too un-ubiquitous to do well at radio. It sounds more like a song a wandering minstrel would sing, not something that would top pop radio charts in 2021. Her track record at radio has also been relatively poor recently, since her previous 3 singles didn't even reach top ten at pop radio. In these circumstances striking while the iron is hot is a great move. There won't be much momentum after this week, so she needs to get as high as she can this week. I think there is a bit of confusion from people about being "pulled" from radio. Songs don't get pulled. Labels can stop promoting it but they don't "pull" the song from radio. Typically radio themselves decide when they will stop playing the song. I have heard that pulling means that labels tell DJs they are no longer promoting the song so the radio DJs start removing it from their playlist.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 11:49:59 GMT -5
It is what it is — higher chart placement purposes, since this suprise release wouldn’t such an epic moment like she did the first time.
Plus tricks and promotions have been used for years to help with chart placements.
I know I’m not as excited for this album as the last. It sounds like pt 2, and she needs all the help she can get at success.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Dec 16, 2020 11:51:51 GMT -5
A song (usually one from a major artist) can be serviced to radio stations, digitally prior to going for adds. In this case, Willow was digitally serviced to radio for airplay availability last Friday. Being serviced means that the song is formally available for airplay. Going for adds means that a label is formally submitting a song to radio stations to be added to said station's playlist. For major artists, it's fairly common for a song to get airplay or be added by stations without having an official adds dates. However, it's still fairly customary for a song to receive an official adds date, usually the following Monday (HAC/Country/AC) and Tuesday (Pop, Rhythmic, Urban, etc) after it's Friday premiere since Monday and Tuesday are the traditional days in which stations add new songs to their playlist. Someone else feel free to pitch in if I'm making zero sense... Sorry for this question which may be a bit off topic but when a label is "formally submitting a song to radio stations", does it consist in sending a press release to radio stations ? This is where I’ve become stuck too and am curious about. Is there some sort of “process” to make it formal. My guess is yes, but I’m not sure what that would be. Maybe it’s a formal plan that labels create around a song, which would include communicating to radio PDs (or people who represent them) to say, “Hey! I want to let you know that we’re promoting the new single by so-and-so. Here’s why you should consider adding it to your playlists!” and the reasons might be: -the artist has pulled good ratings with past hits -the album is a top seller -the song got early plays in these markets -it tested well in these other markets that have similar demographics to yours -you recognize who we are and trust that we’d only promote singles that would work for your audience. That sort of thing. Then stations would decide to play the song by testing it during low-listening times (at night) or, if they’re convinced outright (such as if a song is a high-profile release), they might add it into daytime rotation and make it “official” by adding it to their playlist. A station can play a song without officially “adding” it. Likewise, a station might report an “add” for a song but not play it often.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Dec 16, 2020 11:53:26 GMT -5
she needs all the help she can get at success. Does she tho?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 11:54:03 GMT -5
she needs all the help she can get at success. Does she tho? Who wants a flop era? No one.
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NeRD
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Post by NeRD on Dec 16, 2020 11:54:55 GMT -5
To be fair there is no way to ensure longevity now is there, so what else can Taylor do? She can perhaps not pull songs from radio (I am still salty about her pulling Cardigan from radio before the callouts came in), but it wouldn't be a Taylor Swift single rollout without big blunders. Willow is a lovely song, but it's too un-ubiquitous to do well at radio. It sounds more like a song a wandering minstrel would sing, not something that would top pop radio charts in 2021. Her track record at radio has also been relatively poor recently, since her previous 3 singles didn't even reach top ten at pop radio. In these circumstances striking while the iron is hot is a great move. There won't be much momentum after this week, so she needs to get as high as she can this week. I think there is a bit of confusion from people about being "pulled" from radio. Songs don't get pulled. Labels can stop promoting it but they don't "pull" the song from radio. Typically radio themselves decide when they will stop playing the song. I do believe a song can be "pulled" from radio in a promotional sense where a label removes it from their newsletters sent to stations, and other radio industry hubs like All Access, which would subsequently encourage a radio station to drop the song from their playlist.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Dec 16, 2020 11:55:59 GMT -5
Who wants a flop era? No one. A song not performing high on pop radio (or even the Hot 100 for that matter) wouldn’t make it a flop era. People really need to drop that idea.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 11:58:07 GMT -5
Who wants a flop era? No one. A song not performing high on pop radio (or even the Hot 100 for that matter) wouldn’t make it a flop era. People really need to drop that idea. They were asking about discounts and remixes. 😴 and yes, if a song peaks low on the Hot 100 it looks like a flop to most people.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Dec 16, 2020 11:58:43 GMT -5
I think there is a bit of confusion from people about being "pulled" from radio. Songs don't get pulled. Labels can stop promoting it but they don't "pull" the song from radio. Typically radio themselves decide when they will stop playing the song. I do believe a song can be "pulled" from radio in a promotional sense where a label removes it from their newsletters sent to stations, and other radio industry hubs like All Access. I think it’s a semantics thing and saying it like that makes it sound not like what it actually is. Labels can stop promoting a song, that doesn’t mean they’re pulling the song. “Pulling” implies an action is being performed and I doubt labels would ask stations to stop playing their songs - unless you’re Clive Davis and Kelly Clarkson has just written an album. Otherwise, people may have been shocked when “Circles” was “pulled” from radio last winter only for it to go on and break longevity records into the summer.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Dec 16, 2020 12:00:44 GMT -5
A song not performing high on pop radio (or even the Hot 100 for that matter) wouldn’t make it a flop era. People really need to drop that idea. They were asking about discounts and remixes. 😴 and yes, if a song peaks low on the Hot 100 it looks like a flop to most people. Okay, so your replies didn’t respond directly to that when you refer to “needing success” and “flop eras”. Discounts and remixes are only small portions of what contributes to an era. Folklore didn’t exactly light up any singles chart anywhere with regards to longevity but anyone who says that was a flop era is trolling very poorly.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 12:02:27 GMT -5
Are you bored, Rose? Jesus. And yes, my first reply did (what I wanted to discuss anyway). I don’t know why I click display posts on yours. Moving on.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Dec 16, 2020 12:07:37 GMT -5
Are you bored, Rose? Jesus. And yes, my first reply did (what I wanted to discuss anyway). I don’t know why I click display posts on yours. Moving on. If you’re not interested in having discussions, why bother posting on here? If you’re content having a limited viewpoint in regards to charts where Hot 100 is the only factor in a successful era, so be it, but people may respond. I wasn’t trying to be rude. Too bad the same can’t be said for you.
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taylor
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Post by taylor on Dec 16, 2020 12:08:01 GMT -5
Who wants a flop era? No one. An album with no hit singles does not a flop era make. We have got to do away with that line of thinking. folklore had no hit radio singles and still spent eight weeks at #1, five of them consecutively out of the gate, became the best-seller of 2020, and was nominated for AOTY. That's a successful era.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 12:10:30 GMT -5
Who wants a flop era? No one. An album with no hit singles does not a flop era make. We have got to do away with that line of thinking. folklore had no hit radio singles and still spent eight weeks at #1, five of them consecutively out of the gate, became the best-seller of 2020, and was nominated for AOTY. That's a successful era. I would consider cardigan a moderate hit and it went #1, so it “looks” like a hit and gets to be called a number 1 hit. So for all your smart posters, why don’t you answer their question then. Why is she releasing remixes and discounting them?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 12:13:09 GMT -5
Are you bored, Rose? Jesus. And yes, my first reply did (what I wanted to discuss anyway). I don’t know why I click display posts on yours. Moving on. If you’re not interested in having discussions, why bother posting on here? If you’re content having a limited viewpoint in regards to charts where Hot 100 is the only factor in a successful era, so be it, but people may respond. I wasn’t trying to be rude. Too bad the same can’t be said for you. I never said that’s what I believe personally, I know there’s many more aspects to hits. Trust me, I’ve been on this board for years, mediabase, and followed artist charts, sales, and otherwise. I’m just saying the reason she’s doing remixes and discounts, is to have higher chart placements to make it look more successful and that’s how a lot of people that don’t follow charts closely think. “Oh, it was a number one album or song.” Or “ooo, it only peaked at 64 - must be a flop.” She doesn’t need more success but she sure as hell is going to try her hardest to make them as successful and have as many chart peaking highs as possible. If she thought like us — more to success than charts — she wouldn’t be so focused on it.
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taylor
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Post by taylor on Dec 16, 2020 12:17:14 GMT -5
An album with no hit singles does not a flop era make. We have got to do away with that line of thinking. folklore had no hit radio singles and still spent eight weeks at #1, five of them consecutively out of the gate, became the best-seller of 2020, and was nominated for AOTY. That's a successful era. I would consider cardigan a moderate hit and it went #1, so it “looks” like a hit and gets to be called a number 1 hit. So for all your smart posters, why don’t you answer their question then. Why is she releasing remixes and discounting them? Because it's December and AIWFCIY is too damn Final Boss Level at this time of year not to. I really don't like the snarkiness in the "so for all you smart posters" remark.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 12:19:16 GMT -5
She’d still be doing this even if it wasn’t for that song, well, maybe not the discount — but yes, to my point. It’s for higher chart placements.
Sorry but people keep commenting on my posts, but not actually discussing the matter at hand. Instead of critiquing me, why not answer their question. And then we wouldn’t be going around in circles. Nice edit by the way. ;)
You all get so hurt over sarcasm. I’m saying, if you know more than I, then answer the question.
Edit: I shouldnt have said flop era, but flop single. And yes, I know there’s more to it than radio, but I was just speaking from the standpoint of the hot 100 and how people that don’t follow charts closely would think, and why she’s probably releasing remixes and discounts — to make it chart higher.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 12:27:22 GMT -5
She’d still be doing this even if it wasn’t Xmas. Let’s be real. Sorry but people keep commenting on my posts, but not actually discussing the matter at hand. Instead of critiquing me, why not answer their question. And then we wouldn’t be going around in circles. Nice edit by the way. ;) You all get so hurt over sarcasm. I’m saying, if you know more than I, then answer the question. Edit: I shouldnt have said flop era, but flop single. And yes, I know there’s more to it than radio, but I was just speaking from the standpoint of the hot 100 and how people that don’t follow charts closely would think, and why she’s probably releasing remixes and discounts — to make it chart higher. Because she wants a high peak? Isn't it obvious?
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Dec 16, 2020 12:29:29 GMT -5
If you’re not interested in having discussions, why bother posting on here? If you’re content having a limited viewpoint in regards to charts where Hot 100 is the only factor in a successful era, so be it, but people may respond. I wasn’t trying to be rude. Too bad the same can’t be said for you. I never said that’s what I believe personally, I know there’s many more aspects to hits. Trust me, I’ve been on this board for years, mediabase, and followed artist charts, sales, and otherwise. I’m just saying the reason she’s doing remixes and discounts, is to have higher chart placements to make it look more successful and that’s how a lot of people that don’t follow charts closely think. “Oh, it was a number one album or song.” Or “ooo, it only peaked at 64 - must be a flop.” She doesn’t need more success but she sure as hell is going to try her hardest to make them as successful and have as many chart peaking highs as possible. If she thought like us — more to success than charts — she wouldn’t be so focused on it. And I don’t disagree. I think that’s the sole purpose of remixes - to reach an expanded audience (to put it in a “respectable” way) or to achieve a higher chart position (to make it sound “cheap”). The timing certainly points to placing a priority on the charts, so I definitely agree that’s why the remixes were made and why they’re coming out now. I think there was probably a bit of burn with having two consecutive number twos from Lover, which may have impacted the perception of the era itself - particularly as both songs didn’t have a ton of longevity or pop radio support (though both briefly went too 10). I think the case is different with both of these albums because the expectation is different. Not being pop albums, even though they’re by a huge superstar, plays into the perception that they can still be successes without the need for a high-performing single. On paper, cardigan was a number one hit, but I’d be willing to bet there’s more familiarity with the album than with the single as compared to the singles from 1989 for example. I do think there’s a risk with putting a lot of promo into a single because if it doesn’t get the desired result, it looks worse. I think that’s why ME! was such a stinger. The expectation was there and it didn’t meet expectations. If Willow doesn’t hit number one, it might look worse for the era than if it missed without all the remixes and extra promo. But if the album has a similar trajectory to folklore, it might be less of a hit to the perception of the era’s performance itself that it might not matter as much as ME!’s hit on the Lover era did.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 12:32:56 GMT -5
Thank you, Rose. I appreciate your well informative response. And I agree completely.
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Post by Mayman on Dec 16, 2020 12:43:30 GMT -5
I do believe a song can be "pulled" from radio in a promotional sense where a label removes it from their newsletters sent to stations, and other radio industry hubs like All Access. I think it’s a semantics thing and saying it like that makes it sound not like what it actually is. Labels can stop promoting a song, that doesn’t mean they’re pulling the song. “Pulling” implies an action is being performed and I doubt labels would ask stations to stop playing their songs - unless you’re Clive Davis and Kelly Clarkson has just written an album. Otherwise, people may have been shocked when “Circles” was “pulled” from radio last winter only for it to go on and break longevity records into the summer. Yeah this is more of what I meant.
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Post by Henry Suárez on Dec 16, 2020 13:08:02 GMT -5
I wonder which version will KIIS play? have not heard this song on the radio.
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kimberly
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Post by kimberly on Dec 16, 2020 13:46:39 GMT -5
I do believe a song can be "pulled" from radio in a promotional sense where a label removes it from their newsletters sent to stations, and other radio industry hubs like All Access. I think it’s a semantics thing and saying it like that makes it sound not like what it actually is. Labels can stop promoting a song, that doesn’t mean they’re pulling the song. “Pulling” implies an action is being performed and I doubt labels would ask stations to stop playing their songs - unless you’re Clive Davis and Kelly Clarkson has just written an album. Otherwise, people may have been shocked when “Circles” was “pulled” from radio last winter only for it to go on and break longevity records into the summer. this. when I think of being "pulled" from radio, I think of "Die Young" by Kesha. songs that have already peaked and began their natural descent don't count. especially in cases where another single is beginning to be promoted. like if Republic stopped including "positions" in their communications to make room for "34+35" we're not going to say they're "pulling" the song from radio, right?
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SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Dec 16, 2020 14:00:31 GMT -5
she's just padding her stats. She knows these songs aren't suited for Pop radio, so in order to have high chart placements, all these other tactics are necessary. It's all a game, and she's playing the game. I wish more artists would make such an effort.
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born
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Post by born on Dec 16, 2020 17:44:28 GMT -5
Their effort... I'm cackling
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 16, 2020 17:48:43 GMT -5
Ya'll shut up and enjoy the song lol, doing the most
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kimberly
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Post by kimberly on Dec 16, 2020 18:14:31 GMT -5
the songwriting demo is pretty cool! a dollar well spent
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