wilson7
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Post by wilson7 on Jan 6, 2021 23:20:30 GMT -5
Somebody commented that there's discrimination , that the reason artists like Brandy aren't successfuls with their R&B music because they're black. The only exeptions being Beyonce and Rihanna. Why do you think that.
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degen
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Post by degen on Jan 7, 2021 16:24:46 GMT -5
Is this true though? Because in the U.S. black artists can and have dominated the charts pretty easily.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 7, 2021 19:58:43 GMT -5
The reason that Brandy isn't successful anymore is that her first hit was in the Mid 90s, rarely is any artist big for over 25 years.
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allow that
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Post by allow that on Jan 8, 2021 11:35:04 GMT -5
Is this true though? Because in the U.S. black artists can and have dominated the charts pretty easily. There's definitely truth in this. Brandy is a bad example because she's 20+ years past her peak, but where are the black female vocalists on Pop radio? We have Ariana going straight to #1 over and over with black inspired music so we can't say it's because Pop audiences are resistant to the genre. Pop radio continues to hold a bias.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 12:02:21 GMT -5
I think we need to look to what type of music the labels are really investing in and the type of R&B that they're pushing before we can understand why pop radio isn't playing R&B by Black artists. I can see why listeners of pop radio would respond well to a song like "positions" (an R&B song, recorded by a pop act who has recorded music influenced by a variety of genres, with an instant pop hook) but may not be especially interested in recent singles by Jhené Aiko, SZA, Ella Mai, and H.E.R. for example which have done well at Urban/Urban AC but don't have those instant pop hooks. The labels aren't even really making an effort to push their R&B acts to pop radio. So I think the "lack of R&B by Black artists" issue starts long before the radio programming/playlists stage.
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.indulgecountry
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Post by .indulgecountry on Jan 8, 2021 12:20:50 GMT -5
RnB currently has a limited reach within its own Urban format as far as radio goes (so without even diving into a lack of representation on pop). Some of the new girls have been doing alright, but generally speaking the radio format is overrun with male artists and rap/hip-hop tracks get priority over RnB music most of the time.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 12:36:32 GMT -5
RnB currently has a limited reach within its own Urban format as far as radio goes (so without even diving into a lack of representation on pop). Some of the new girls have been doing alright, but generally speaking the radio format is overrun with male artists and rap/hip-hop tracks get priority over RnB music most of the time. ...and when you look at how Rap albums do compared to R&B albums these days, you can see why labels may not invest as much in R&B acts. It's more difficult to make a profit with R&B acts.
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jdanton2
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Post by jdanton2 on Jan 8, 2021 19:47:40 GMT -5
Chris Brown's Go Crazy is doing well at Pop though would be more straight r&b without the Young Thug auto tune.
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Choco
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Post by Choco on Jan 8, 2021 20:54:59 GMT -5
Much like Rock, it's a genre that has seen better days. I don't necessarily think it's sexism or racism. It's just not a genre that is moving units that much, so labels focus on acts that can crossover to other genres more (Rihanna for example).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2021 23:28:00 GMT -5
Much like Rock, it's a genre that has seen better days. I don't necessarily think it's sexism or racism. It's just not a genre that is moving units that much, so labels focus on acts that can crossover to other genres more (Rihanna for example). I think R&B's in a better state right now than Rock is (Rock hasn't been relevant in over a decade, unless you count the Indie Boom in 2012-13 as Rock).
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shayonce
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Post by shayonce on Jan 9, 2021 1:35:35 GMT -5
yeah. also pop music by black artist usually struggle more as they are seen as Black Music,RNB, "urban".
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jthentic
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Post by jthentic on Jan 9, 2021 1:43:19 GMT -5
The same way urban radio won't play white artists. All white rappers say logic(bi-r), g eazy, NF, Yelawolf, mac miller, mgk, posty, beastie boys, russ.. have little or no support from hip hop/rap based radio stations. That's the reason you see them doing crossovers to get airplays in other formats. All these artists I've stated had their hits by making pop / crossovers (1800-,him & i, me, myself, bad things, let you down etc). Hell even Eminem gets little to 0 airplay. Might be one of the reasons you don't see many white rappers elevating above their station in rap.
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Choco
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Post by Choco on Jan 9, 2021 12:35:10 GMT -5
Much like Rock, it's a genre that has seen better days. I don't necessarily think it's sexism or racism. It's just not a genre that is moving units that much, so labels focus on acts that can crossover to other genres more (Rihanna for example). I think R&B's in a better state right now than Rock is (Rock hasn't been relevant in over a decade, unless you count the Indie Boom in 2012-13 as Rock). True. SZA is topping streaming charts at the moment, for example. And save for the random rock cover on iTunes they don't even chart at all these days.
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tekkenguy
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Post by tekkenguy on Feb 4, 2021 0:26:31 GMT -5
Much like Rock, it's a genre that has seen better days. I don't necessarily think it's sexism or racism. It's just not a genre that is moving units that much, so labels focus on acts that can crossover to other genres more (Rihanna for example). Not true. R&B crossover hits are fairly common, we haven’t had a rock crossover hit in over a decade.
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back2blk
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Post by back2blk on Feb 4, 2021 11:58:29 GMT -5
I think we need to look to what type of music the labels are really investing in and the type of R&B that they're pushing before we can understand why pop radio isn't playing R&B by Black artists. I can see why listeners of pop radio would respond well to a song like "positions" (an R&B song, recorded by a pop act who has recorded music influenced by a variety of genres, with an instant pop hook) but may not be especially interested in recent singles by Jhené Aiko, SZA, Ella Mai, and H.E.R. for example which have done well at Urban/Urban AC but don't have those instant pop hooks. The labels aren't even really making an effort to push their R&B acts to pop radio. So I think the "lack of R&B by Black artists" issue starts long before the radio programming/playlists stage. To add to this, an element of this conversation is that a song like "positions" is more suited to pop listeners not only because it's catering its sound to pop with hooks, but the artist providing that sound is white passing. Would any of the black artists you listed see the same success Ariana is receiving if "positions" was their song? Justin Bieber is a prime example of this too as he is claiming his recent output to pop to be "R&B", and they're eating it up.
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Post by Private Dancer on Feb 4, 2021 12:07:01 GMT -5
I think we need to look to what type of music the labels are really investing in and the type of R&B that they're pushing before we can understand why pop radio isn't playing R&B by Black artists. I can see why listeners of pop radio would respond well to a song like "positions" (an R&B song, recorded by a pop act who has recorded music influenced by a variety of genres, with an instant pop hook) but may not be especially interested in recent singles by Jhené Aiko, SZA, Ella Mai, and H.E.R. for example which have done well at Urban/Urban AC but don't have those instant pop hooks. The labels aren't even really making an effort to push their R&B acts to pop radio. So I think the "lack of R&B by Black artists" issue starts long before the radio programming/playlists stage. To add to this, an element of this conversation is that a song like "positions" is more suited to pop listeners not only because it's catering its sound to pop with hooks, but the artist providing that sound is white passing. Would any of the black artists you listed see the same success Ariana is receiving if "positions" was their song? Justin Bieber is a prime example of this too as he is claiming his recent output to pop to be "R&B", and they're eating it up. I wanted to say this but didn't know how. Basically white artists get good airplay on Top 40 stations with R&B songs but black artists...they don't really play them ofc there is exceptions
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 4, 2021 12:35:20 GMT -5
I think we need to look to what type of music the labels are really investing in and the type of R&B that they're pushing before we can understand why pop radio isn't playing R&B by Black artists. I can see why listeners of pop radio would respond well to a song like "positions" (an R&B song, recorded by a pop act who has recorded music influenced by a variety of genres, with an instant pop hook) but may not be especially interested in recent singles by Jhené Aiko, SZA, Ella Mai, and H.E.R. for example which have done well at Urban/Urban AC but don't have those instant pop hooks. The labels aren't even really making an effort to push their R&B acts to pop radio. So I think the "lack of R&B by Black artists" issue starts long before the radio programming/playlists stage. To add to this, an element of this conversation is that a song like "positions" is more suited to pop listeners not only because it's catering its sound to pop with hooks, but the artist providing that sound is white passing. Would any of the black artists you listed see the same success Ariana is receiving if "positions" was their song? Justin Bieber is a prime example of this too as he is claiming his recent output to pop to be "R&B", and they're eating it up. I think we also need to consider, at least for artists who don't have a lot of creative control over their material, that when labels are soliciting tracks from major songwriters and producers.. acts without recent mainstream success are also less likely to get those writers' and producers' best work than acts with recent success because they don't want to give those tracks to acts who are going to have more of an uphill climb with them. It happens to older acts too. If Ariana Grande and Céline Dion both approach the same songwriting/production team, they're less likely to give Céline the songs that sound like smash hits because they know the hype alone will likely make it a bigger hit for Ariana. There are many factors at play.
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back2blk
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Post by back2blk on Feb 4, 2021 12:41:09 GMT -5
To add to this, an element of this conversation is that a song like "positions" is more suited to pop listeners not only because it's catering its sound to pop with hooks, but the artist providing that sound is white passing. Would any of the black artists you listed see the same success Ariana is receiving if "positions" was their song? Justin Bieber is a prime example of this too as he is claiming his recent output to pop to be "R&B", and they're eating it up. I think we also need to consider, at least for artists who don't have a lot of creative control over their material, that when labels are soliciting tracks from major songwriters and producers.. acts without recent mainstream success are also less likely to get those writers' and producers' best work than acts with recent success because they don't want to give those tracks to acts who are going to have more of an uphill climb with them. It happens to older acts too. If Ariana Grande and Céline Dion both approach the same songwriting/production team, they're less likely to give Céline the songs that sound like smash hits because they know the hype alone will likely make it a bigger hit for Ariana. There are many factors at play. Absolutely. Not to mention the creative integrity R&B artists compromise on if they want to cater that strongly to pop's standard of sound. You'll get Nicki Minaj serving us Super Bass, you'll get Beyonce giving us whatever I Am Sasha Fierce was lol, or whatever the f**k Ciara and Tinashe are trying to be.
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