Ty
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Post by Ty on Jun 11, 2022 11:07:36 GMT -5
Thanks for flagging that for me. I actually didn't know what that means. But also since she's referring to herself, I guess it makes the usage somewhat acceptable?
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jun 11, 2022 11:19:48 GMT -5
Thanks for flagging that for me. I actually didn't know what that means. But also since she's referring to herself, I guess it makes the usage somewhat acceptable? It's a word people that where I live still use a lot so it's also probably why it went over my head too (for the record, I don't use it). It's a slur used against disabled people, and essentially is a very bad way for people to use a word similar to "idiot". Wikipedia says in the US it has evolved past being a slur but I still wonder if she would be better off using another word that isn't so obviously a slur, especially in the UK and Ireland. Not 100% sure about the end of your post, as I guess you could say that about all slurs. As far as I know, she isn't disabled (or disabled in such a way that the slur would be used against her) so it doesn't feel like her place to reclaim. But again, it went completely over my head and probably would have stayed that way had I not seen TikToks about it so I'm not sure how useful my opinion on it is
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kimberly
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Post by kimberly on Jun 11, 2022 11:41:26 GMT -5
Thanks for flagging that for me. I actually didn't know what that means. But also since she's referring to herself, I guess it makes the usage somewhat acceptable? It's a word people that where I live still use a lot so it's also probably why it went over my head too (for the record, I don't use it). It's a slur used against disabled people, and essentially is a very bad way for people to use a word similar to "idiot". Wikipedia says in the US it has evolved past being a slur but I still wonder if she would be better off using another word that isn't so obviously a slur, especially in the UK and Ireland. Not 100% sure about the end of your post, as I guess you could say that about all slurs. As far as I know, she isn't disabled (or disabled in such a way that the slur would be used against her) so it doesn't feel like her place to reclaim. But again, it went completely over my head and probably would have stayed that way had I not seen TikToks about it so I'm not sure how useful my opinion on it is this is interesting, thanks for pointing it out. I think in this form, as a verb, the word is used to mean "to lose control, go off, throw a fit" and is pretty commonly used in the US, especially as part of African American Vernacular English and in hiphop/rap slang. that said, if people with disabilities believe it's still offensive, it might be time to retire this word. I imagine even the definition I gave has an ableist history.
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jun 11, 2022 11:48:02 GMT -5
It's a word people that where I live still use a lot so it's also probably why it went over my head too (for the record, I don't use it). It's a slur used against disabled people, and essentially is a very bad way for people to use a word similar to "idiot". Wikipedia says in the US it has evolved past being a slur but I still wonder if she would be better off using another word that isn't so obviously a slur, especially in the UK and Ireland. Not 100% sure about the end of your post, as I guess you could say that about all slurs. As far as I know, she isn't disabled (or disabled in such a way that the slur would be used against her) so it doesn't feel like her place to reclaim. But again, it went completely over my head and probably would have stayed that way had I not seen TikToks about it so I'm not sure how useful my opinion on it is this is interesting, thanks for pointing it out. I think in this form, as a verb, the word is used to mean "to lose control, go off, throw a fit" and is pretty commonly used in the US, especially as part of African American Vernacular English and in hiphop/rap slang. that said, if people with disabilities believe it's still offensive, it might be time to retire this word. I imagine even the definition I gave has an ableist history. I agree, I don't think Lizzo meant any ill intent. However, and this is probably a bad example, I guess it's kind of like saying you have a gay best friend. Gay isn't a slur but using it in that context carries stereotypes and often outdated ideas of what it means to be gay. Or even like Katy's Ur So Gay. I'm sure she, and people who say gay best friend, probably don't mean to be homophobic, and while intent is still very important, when it's pointed out that actually that isn't a very good thing to say, I think people should be listened to* *I absolutely do not mean you or anyone is saying otherwise, just adding to my previous thoughts
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2022 11:50:26 GMT -5
What’s the slur we speak of? I read the lyrics online but I didn’t see anything.
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jun 11, 2022 11:54:22 GMT -5
What’s the slur we speak of? I read the lyrics online but I didn’t see anything. I attatched it in my post at the end of Page 1 but here is the Wikipedia page for the full word (she used it as a verb). Also, I don't like this song so I hope people don't think I'm only bringing it up to further 'hate' on the song or trying to cancel her, it's not my intention at all
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Post by cause_for_celebration on Jun 11, 2022 12:30:24 GMT -5
Spazz is a curse word now? Lol
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Nick
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Post by Nick on Jun 11, 2022 13:24:32 GMT -5
Reaching.
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Ty
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Post by Ty on Jun 11, 2022 14:00:04 GMT -5
I don't want to say it's reaching. Outside of the US, it seems like it is indeed mostly used as a cuss word targeting people with disabilities. Most of the ones who have voiced their concerns online, from what I see, understand she wasn't intentionally using it as a slur and they are ready to move on from it if she issues an apology and a "clean" version of "Grrrls".
Basically, if her team handles it well and in time, it's not gonna be a big deal for her album rollout.
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jun 11, 2022 14:29:12 GMT -5
I agree, I wouldn’t consider it reaching at all just because it isn’t consider a slur en masse in the US. Like how here saying God Damn means nothing but for Rumours she had to release a censored version as a lot of people in the US consider that cursing or whatever. As I said, I live in Ireland and here and in the UK, it and the -stic version of it are very much used as slurs. I don’t necessarily think she needs to edit the song, just acknowledge it and use this as an opportunity to educate, but I’m also not disabled so my opinion means little.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2022 15:14:27 GMT -5
I feel like spazz is a bit of a reach and this is coming from someone with disabilities, but that’s just me. That being said, however, I would take it as an insult if I were having an attack of some sort and someone said, “stop spazzing out.” But in general, I see it more playful than hateful.
That aside, I don’t think this is the second single since they’re not introducing it as such.
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Wave.
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Post by Wave. on Jun 11, 2022 18:12:05 GMT -5
Nah its just a promo single.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2022 19:32:09 GMT -5
Nah its just a promo single. Thank, Jesus.
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SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Jun 12, 2022 0:05:36 GMT -5
total reach. I don't buy it. Spaz just means crazy or lunatic.
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jun 12, 2022 6:11:06 GMT -5
total reach. I don't buy it. Spaz just means crazy or lunatic. Your last sentence is literally the point, though? Just because you didn’t know it was a serious slur in other English speaking countries doesn’t make it a reach. From the Wikipedia article I have linked:
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Nick
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Post by Nick on Jun 12, 2022 6:18:03 GMT -5
Dylan just can't let it go, huh? lol. Can we move on now?
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jun 12, 2022 6:46:16 GMT -5
Dylan just can't let it go, huh? lol. Can we move on now? I’m just replying to people in the conversation I started, which I consider better than ignoring people who have a differing opinion to me. If you don’t like what I’m saying and don’t want to read it, you can just mute me 🤷🏻♂️ But I will drop it here as I think all the points that need to be made have been made.
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Nick
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Post by Nick on Jun 12, 2022 7:11:55 GMT -5
It’s all good. So, do you like the song now? You must because you keep coming back to this thread 😉
It’s a fun song not meant to offend anyone. Lizzo doesn’t seem to have a hateful bone in her body.
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jun 12, 2022 7:18:56 GMT -5
It’s all good. So, do you like the song now? You must because you keep coming back to this thread 😉 It’s a fun song not meant to offend anyone. Lizzo doesn’t seem to have a hateful bone in her body. No, I still can’t stand the song, but I do really like Lizzo and I’m looking forward to the album. As for the hateful bone part, I completely agree, I don’t think she knew the word had an alternative meaning for people and I think if she had, she wouldn’t have used it. However, not addressing it would, in my eyes, be unfair and a mistake given the comments of her TikTok of the song is full of people questioning her use of it. Anyway, I’ve said all I have had to say and you’re right, I don’t like this song, so I’m out of here ✌🏻
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2022 7:44:30 GMT -5
Sure, It might have a negative context, but she was using it for herself.
For example, I could call myself a f*g because I am one. And it’s my choice if I choose to call myself that, just like she chose to call herself a spazz.
This is a moment where we can educate on the severity of the word, but in no way should she be canceled for it.
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Au$tin
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Post by Au$tin on Jun 12, 2022 9:27:35 GMT -5
For example, I could call myself a f*g because I am one. And it’s my choice if I choose to call myself that, just like she chose to call herself a spazz. That logic doesn't work. You are gay, you can call yourself that. Lizzo is not disabled. I can't call myself the f-word, I'm straight. I can't call myself the n-word, I'm white. But to be 100% clear, "spazz" and "spastic" are not used as slurs here in the US, which is where Lizzo is from. I, and most likely Lizzo too, had no idea it was used that way in other countries. And it's extremely obvious that its use in the context of this song isn't meant to be negative or a slur. So anyone who is legitimately angry at her is reaching and overreacting. But those that are calmly informing her and others about its usage elsewhere and asking for an edit for their territories are being sensible. Much like how in some countries I can't do this 👌 because it's offensive. Or how in some cultures the middle finger isn't offensive.
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Lordef†ones
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Post by Lordef†ones on Jun 12, 2022 12:13:30 GMT -5
Are you guys really spazzing over the word spazz
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atg
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Post by atg on Jun 12, 2022 12:22:49 GMT -5
There’s a universe somewhere in which ADT continued to flop and this song ended up being the big smash hit. I’m glad this universe isn’t one of them.
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Au$tin
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Post by Au$tin on Jun 12, 2022 13:32:57 GMT -5
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Ty
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Post by Ty on Jun 12, 2022 13:56:28 GMT -5
Pride month and upcoming Juneteenth are keeping haters pressed over here...
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Post by Hurricane Lee on Jun 12, 2022 14:09:57 GMT -5
OMG. Be like your girl Lizzo and smile and twerk your way through the drama!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 12, 2022 18:57:09 GMT -5
For example, I could call myself a f*g because I am one. And it’s my choice if I choose to call myself that, just like she chose to call herself a spazz. That logic doesn't work. You are gay, you can call yourself that. Lizzo is not disabled. I can't call myself the f-word, I'm straight. I can't call myself the n-word, I'm white. But to be 100% clear, "spazz" and "spastic" are not used as slurs here in the US, which is where Lizzo is from. I, and most likely Lizzo too, had no idea it was used that way in other countries. And it's extremely obvious that its use in the context of this song isn't meant to be negative or a slur. So anyone who is legitimately angry at her is reaching and overreacting. But those that are calmly informing her and others about its usage elsewhere and asking for an edit for their territories are being sensible. Much like how in some countries I can't do this 👌 because it's offensive. Or how in some cultures the middle finger isn't offensive. I never said she was disabled, but if she calls herself a spaz and IS disabled then we can’t say s**t. And, how do you know LIZZO isn’t disabled, btw? She can have mental disorders we know nothing about. ;)
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𝕡𝕙𝕖𝕖𝕓𝕤
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Post by 𝕡𝕙𝕖𝕖𝕓𝕤 on Jun 13, 2022 14:51:08 GMT -5
Here is commentary from Imani Barbarin, a disabled black woman and disability activist.
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kimberly
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Post by kimberly on Jun 13, 2022 17:51:17 GMT -5
a queen. I have so much love and respect for her and she’s somehow managed to earn more
updated version, replacing the line with "hold me back":
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jun 13, 2022 18:00:45 GMT -5
She did the right thing, and I think this lyric flows nicer
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