sayhey
Charting
Joined: February 2023
Posts: 84
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Post by sayhey on Apr 4, 2023 18:07:53 GMT -5
Right!! I was trying to remember which late 70s disco song kept returning to #1 but could only think of The Emotions' Best of My Love! Chic's Le Freak, aside from being an all-time-classic disco masterpiece, had one of the most impressive chart runs ever, considering its release era. It is actually ranked as the #24 biggest song ever on Billboard's All-Time chart. And you actually reminded me of a very funny chart fact. All three #1 singles off of Bee Gee's smash 1979 album Spirits Having Flown interrupted other songs' chart runs. As you said, Too Much Heaven interrupted Le Freak for 2 weeks. Then Tragedy interrupted I Will Survive for 2 weeks again. Finally, Love You Inside Out interrupted Donna's Hot Stuff for a week. I always found that fascinating. It's probably the only album to produce three #1 singles with such chart runs! The closest would be T.I.'s 2008 album Paper trail, which spawned the aforementioned Whatever You Like and Live Your Life. Very interesting fact indeed! And unfortunately, I think it's been well-documented that the answer to this is that there were some shady dealings going on between the Bee Gee's management and Billboard's chart editor at the time. Yeah, agreed, I always found this a bit suspicious! But checking their stats I've found the following: Both Too Much Heaven and Tragedy hit #1 on Radio & Records for two weeks each, while Love You Inside Out hit #3 for three weeks straight. It seems like Too Much Heaven and Tragedy were both bona fide #1 radio smashes and thus legitimate number ones on the Hot 100. Interestingly, the timeless classic I Will Survive never hit #1 on Radio & Records (Le Freak did, for two weeks). As for Love You Inside Out, it seems that it also was a big airplay hit with its three weeks at #3. Strong sales could account for it topping the Hot 100 for a week. One could argue that sales and fan anticipation played a role in those Bee Gees songs interrupting three different #1 chart runs. After all, they were coming off Saturday Night Fever and were clearly among the biggest names in the industry. Their 7'' singles were bound to sell exceptionally well and fast, which could explain why they skyrocketed to #1 only to give way to the preceding chart leaders to return to the top. Also, for similar reasons, their singles were likely to explode on radio due to audience demand, then fall off comparatively faster than songs of lesser established acts whose songs would "burn" slower. But then again, it's still a suspicious chart coincidence, so you never know haha!! |
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firefox
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Post by firefox on Apr 4, 2023 18:22:47 GMT -5
Give her a break already
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slw84
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I only tolerate legends
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Post by slw84 on Apr 4, 2023 19:45:45 GMT -5
The top 10 is so dry but congrats on a new #1 I guess.
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85la
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Post by 85la on Apr 4, 2023 20:49:52 GMT -5
Very interesting fact indeed! And unfortunately, I think it's been well-documented that the answer to this is that there were some shady dealings going on between the Bee Gee's management and Billboard's chart editor at the time. Yeah, agreed, I always found this a bit suspicious! But checking their stats I've found the following: Both Too Much Heaven and Tragedy hit #1 on Radio & Records for two weeks each, while Love You Inside Out hit #3 for three weeks straight. It seems like Too Much Heaven and Tragedy were both bona fide #1 radio smashes and thus legitimate number ones on the Hot 100. Interestingly, the timeless classic I Will Survive never hit #1 on Radio & Records (Le Freak did, for two weeks). As for Love You Inside Out, it seems that it also was a big airplay hit with its three weeks at #3. Strong sales could account for it topping the Hot 100 for a week. One could argue that sales and fan anticipation played a role in those Bee Gees songs interrupting three different #1 chart runs. After all, they were coming off Saturday Night Fever and were clearly among the biggest names in the industry. Their 7'' singles were bound to sell exceptionally well and fast, which could explain why they skyrocketed to #1 only to give way to the preceding chart leaders to return to the top. Also, for similar reasons, their singles were likely to explode on radio due to audience demand, then fall off comparatively faster than songs of lesser established acts whose songs would "burn" slower. But then again, it's still a suspicious chart coincidence, so you never know haha!! Right, surely there must have been huge demand for the Bee Gees right after Saturday Night Fever, and those songs were all probably bona fide smashes at least to some extent (all probably would've hit the top 5 anyway), I just do remember it being brought up that that was an issue with the Bee Gees' management and Billboard at at least one time (possible it was with other songs). As you say, Love You Inside Out wasn't as clear a bona fide smash, and if you look at its run on the Hot 100, it was #3 the week before it jumped to #1 for one week, and then dropped to #5 the week immediately after, and then out of the top ten entirely the week after, so the case might be strongest for that possibly being a doctored #1. |
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mms82
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Post by mms82 on Apr 4, 2023 22:08:51 GMT -5
This feels like something that's either on Billboard to clear up, or for chart watchers to adjust their view of what the chart is. Yeah, that's I think the sentiment on this board is that it is Billboard's problem. We don't dislike ARMY (lots of BTS music is great and it is impressive the size and determination of the fanbase), we dislike that Billboard allows itself to be manipulated and inaccurate. |
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mms82
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Post by mms82 on Apr 5, 2023 13:43:39 GMT -5
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Post by kcdawg13 on Apr 5, 2023 14:45:20 GMT -5
Pre-Soundscan Hot 100 was a lawless wasteland, especially the 1980's. In the late 70's song's actually spent a considerable amount of time at #1 and even the Top 10, but the 80's is the era where song's would vault to #1 or the Top 10 and spend like 6 weeks at the most there before dropping out. After Soundscan was implemented in 1991, hits actually spent some decent time hanging around, that's when all the Top 10 and #1 records were broken. I believe many #1's were fraudulent in those days, since basically it all depended on trust that a retail provider would give the correct numbers for a song.
It's not like the 70's are any better, the Bee Gees accusation is interesting because there's that famous story that allegedly in 1978 Andy Gibb's manager basically bribed Billboard into keeping "Shadow Dancing" atop the chart despite Gerry Rafferty's "Baker Street" actually being the #1 song in the country. This is all hearsay obviously but it's just another footnote in how crazy the charts were before Soundscan was implemented. And I'm sure Gerry Rafferty isn't too sad since his song is actually remembered and nobody cares about that Andy Gibb song anymore lol
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divasummer
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Post by divasummer on Apr 5, 2023 16:58:39 GMT -5
Thank you so much for posting this. If it’s not a hassle could you post it at some point each week?? I possibly would but no clue how to cut and paste etc. I’m lucky my old butt can “share” stuff on Facebook…. Lol |
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Post by Baby Yoda Hot100Fan on Apr 5, 2023 17:18:51 GMT -5
Except that's the prior week's revenue chart. That chart usually get refreshed on Thursdays, one week after the end of the tracking week. |
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sayhey
Charting
Joined: February 2023
Posts: 84
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Post by sayhey on Apr 5, 2023 18:39:11 GMT -5
Yeah, agreed, I always found this a bit suspicious! But checking their stats I've found the following: Both Too Much Heaven and Tragedy hit #1 on Radio & Records for two weeks each, while Love You Inside Out hit #3 for three weeks straight. It seems like Too Much Heaven and Tragedy were both bona fide #1 radio smashes and thus legitimate number ones on the Hot 100. Interestingly, the timeless classic I Will Survive never hit #1 on Radio & Records (Le Freak did, for two weeks). As for Love You Inside Out, it seems that it also was a big airplay hit with its three weeks at #3. Strong sales could account for it topping the Hot 100 for a week. One could argue that sales and fan anticipation played a role in those Bee Gees songs interrupting three different #1 chart runs. After all, they were coming off Saturday Night Fever and were clearly among the biggest names in the industry. Their 7'' singles were bound to sell exceptionally well and fast, which could explain why they skyrocketed to #1 only to give way to the preceding chart leaders to return to the top. Also, for similar reasons, their singles were likely to explode on radio due to audience demand, then fall off comparatively faster than songs of lesser established acts whose songs would "burn" slower. But then again, it's still a suspicious chart coincidence, so you never know haha!! Right, surely there must have been huge demand for the Bee Gees right after Saturday Night Fever, and those songs were all probably bona fide smashes at least to some extent (all probably would've hit the top 5 anyway), I just do remember it being brought up that that was an issue with the Bee Gees' management and Billboard at at least one time (possible it was with other songs). As you say, Love You Inside Out wasn't as clear a bona fide smash, and if you look at its run on the Hot 100, it was #3 the week before it jumped to #1 for one week, and then dropped to #5 the week immediately after, and then out of the top ten entirely the week after, so the case might be strongest for that possibly being a doctored #1. Yeah, I would definitely not be surprised if the Bee Gees and other prominent artists of the pre-Soundscan era had an "understanding" with Billboard regarding their highly promoted single releases. I mean, I don't know if they had their #1s "secured" but I would assume that if their chart activity was strong enough, they would be "given" the #1 even if the actual chart leader was a bit unclear. At the end of the day, radio charts were based on playlists submitted by stations to Billboard, which were prone to being influenced by the bribing of the major record companies (a major issue until the Soundscan era). The very same issue would occur in retail, where retailers would submit lists of their top sellers which were similarly influenced by record label bribery. Since Billboard clearly knew that their stats were far from being totally accurate, I'm sure they would not hesitate to arbitrarily "choose" the #1 for certain weeks where the whole top 5 had similar chart activity. I've actually always wondered what went down behind the scenes back then, I can imagine a lot of drama haha! As for Love You Inside Out, I checked its exact chart run out of curiosity, and here's its 10 week stay in the top 20, including a 5 week run in the top 10: #17 - #11 - #6 - #4 - #3 - #1 - #5 - #11 - #11 - #12 It lasted 19 weeks on the Hot 100 overall, a relatively longevous hit for late 70s standards (the massive Le Freak did 25 weeks). Too Much Heaven did 21 weeks, while Tragedy did 20 weeks. I'd say 5 weeks in the top 10 and 10 weeks in the top 20 was also pretty standard at the time for a hit single. Plus many songs would drop pretty fast after hitting the top spot back then in their defense. It was kind of the norm actually. Though there were several exceptions. For instance, the otherwise very longevous I Will Survive drastically dropped #1 - #2 - #5 - #13 once it started losing steam. I think these sudden drops had more to do with the labels withdrawing support for a previous major hit that was on the decline so as to shift their focus to their next potential hit(s). The labels would probably communicate that to stations and retailers, who would then remove the aging hits from their playlists resulting in the dramatic pre-Soundscan drops. A similar post-Soundscan phenomenon would be the deletion of physical singles to prevent the cannibalization of album sales and to boost the next single, also resulting in the sudden drops of many blockbuster singles of the 90s after their peak at radio and/or retail. But I do agree that out of the three Spirits Having Flown #1s, the most suspicious is definitely Love You Inside Out (even though it's my favorite of the three haha). Especially considering all three interrupted other #1s haha! It could be a legitimate #1 given how charts worked back then and considering the Bee Gee's tremendous popularity at that time, but you really never know haha! Actually, all this talk about Love You Inside Out reminded me of Feist's SUPERB cover of the song. What a classic!! |
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shayonce
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Post by shayonce on Apr 6, 2023 0:52:16 GMT -5
anyone know cd single sales of jimin?
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sayhey
Charting
Joined: February 2023
Posts: 84
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Post by sayhey on Apr 6, 2023 4:39:41 GMT -5
Pre-Soundscan Hot 100 was a lawless wasteland, especially the 1980's. In the late 70's song's actually spent a considerable amount of time at #1 and even the Top 10, but the 80's is the era where song's would vault to #1 or the Top 10 and spend like 6 weeks at the most there before dropping out. After Soundscan was implemented in 1991, hits actually spent some decent time hanging around, that's when all the Top 10 and #1 records were broken. I believe many #1's were fraudulent in those days, since basically it all depended on trust that a retail provider would give the correct numbers for a song. It's not like the 70's are any better, the Bee Gees accusation is interesting because there's that famous story that allegedly in 1978 Andy Gibb's manager basically bribed Billboard into keeping "Shadow Dancing" atop the chart despite Gerry Rafferty's "Baker Street" actually being the #1 song in the country. This is all hearsay obviously but it's just another footnote in how crazy the charts were before Soundscan was implemented. And I'm sure Gerry Rafferty isn't too sad since his song is actually remembered and nobody cares about that Andy Gibb song anymore lol Yeah, the 80s were the worst in terms of chart manipulation and volatility. The fact alone that between Madonna's Like a Virgin (6 weeks at #1 in late 1984-early 1985) and Paula Abdul's Rush Rush (5 weeks at #1 in 1991) no song spent more than 4 weeks at #1 is very telling of how corrupt and arbitrary the chart system was at the time. As for Baker Street vs. Shadow Dancing, I've heard that story and always found it hilarious. Whether it's just hearsay or not, I'm sure Billboard was involved in all sorts of corrupt tactics and influenced by bribery in the pre-Soundscan era! |
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sayhey
Charting
Joined: February 2023
Posts: 84
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Post by sayhey on Apr 6, 2023 5:26:22 GMT -5
anyone know cd single sales of jimin? It was reported it sold 254,000 digital and physical copies combined, while its digital-only sales were reported as 38,000. That would mean it sold 216,000 physical copies. |
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rimetm
2x Platinum Member
Just a Good Ol' Chart Shmuck
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Post by rimetm on Apr 6, 2023 8:33:48 GMT -5
anyone know cd single sales of jimin? It was reported it sold 254,000 digital and physical copies combined, while its digital-only sales were reported as 38,000. That would mean it sold 216,000 physical copies. No, I know how you arrived at that number (the Global 200 sales number minus the Global Excluding US sales number), and you've forgotten that D2C sales, both physical and digital, don't count for those charts. 38,000 just represents the amount of digital sales Like Crazy received on mainstream digital storefronts (e.g. Amazon, iTunes). |
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mms82
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Post by mms82 on Apr 6, 2023 11:39:23 GMT -5
Does anybody know El Gordo Trae El Mando by Chino Pacas? I saw it at the bottom of the chart and its amazing... but there are no lyric translations anywhere online and Google Translated ones do terrible (I figure lots of slang). Can somebody that is a spanish speaker either translate the lyrics or share the gist?
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sayhey
Charting
Joined: February 2023
Posts: 84
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Post by sayhey on Apr 6, 2023 13:03:17 GMT -5
It was reported it sold 254,000 digital and physical copies combined, while its digital-only sales were reported as 38,000. That would mean it sold 216,000 physical copies. No, I know how you arrived at that number (the Global 200 sales number minus the Global Excluding US sales number), and you've forgotten that D2C sales, both physical and digital, don't count for those charts. 38,000 just represents the amount of digital sales Like Crazy received on mainstream digital storefronts (e.g. Amazon, iTunes). By D2C do you mean direct-to-consumers sales? Yeah, I know those were recently excluded from consideration by Billboard. I honestly just checked the Wikipedia article on the Digital Song Sales number ones of 2023 and saw the 38K figure for the single without checking the source. Just looked at the Billboard article and saw that the Wikipedia editor indeed subtracted the Excl. US number (48K) from the global one (86K) to arrive to 38K. But since Billboard doesn't take D2C sales into account for any of their charts, the 38K number would indeed represent what counts towards the charts, right? So, subtracting 38K digital sales (from mainstream stores that count towards the Hot 100) from the 254K overall sales figure ("mainstream" digital sales + physical sales) would indeed lead to the physical sales figure of the single, right? I'm sorry if I'm misunderstanding something, I don't follow the Global charts at all and don't really know how they work haha! |
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rimetm
2x Platinum Member
Just a Good Ol' Chart Shmuck
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Post by rimetm on Apr 6, 2023 18:12:26 GMT -5
The Hot 100 and Digital Songs do use D2C sales, while the Global Charts don’t. Whoever posted that number for Wikipedia made a significant error.
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Post by Baby Yoda Hot100Fan on Apr 6, 2023 21:27:40 GMT -5
No, I know how you arrived at that number (the Global 200 sales number minus the Global Excluding US sales number), and you've forgotten that D2C sales, both physical and digital, don't count for those charts. 38,000 just represents the amount of digital sales Like Crazy received on mainstream digital storefronts (e.g. Amazon, iTunes). By D2C do you mean direct-to-consumers sales? Yeah, I know those were recently excluded from consideration by Billboard. I honestly just checked the Wikipedia article on the Digital Song Sales number ones of 2023 and saw the 38K figure for the single without checking the source. Just looked at the Billboard article and saw that the Wikipedia editor indeed subtracted the Excl. US number (48K) from the global one (86K) to arrive to 38K. But since Billboard doesn't take D2C sales into account for any of their charts, the 38K number would indeed represent what counts towards the charts, right? So, subtracting 38K digital sales (from mainstream stores that count towards the Hot 100) from the 254K overall sales figure ("mainstream" digital sales + physical sales) would indeed lead to the physical sales figure of the single, right? I'm sorry if I'm misunderstanding something, I don't follow the Global charts at all and don't really know how they work haha! The 38k digital sales were non-D2C, while the remaining 216k sales came from D2C. The D2C include for Like Crazy both digital song sales of the different versions of the song and the CD version of the song. The article didn't mention the breakdown for the D2C, but I would think most (my guess is 95% or more) came from the digital versions of the song. Why? The catch is that for a CD sale to count it would need to have been shipped during the tracking week in question. And given that most of Like Crazy's seem to have happened the last day of the tracking day, buying the digital versions of the songs would be the best way to make sure that they would count toward the tracking week for the Hot 100. |
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Post by Baby Yoda Hot100Fan on Apr 6, 2023 21:31:09 GMT -5
Taylor Swift Ties for the 10th-Most Top 10 Hits on the Radio Songs Chart With ‘Lavender Haze’4/5/2023 By Gary Trust The song is her 17th top 10 on the all-format airplay ranking. Taylor Swift enters into a tie for the 10th-most top 10 hits in the history of Billboard’s all-format Radio Songs chart, as “Lavender Haze” lifts from No. 11 to No. 10 on the tally dated April 8. The song, released on Republic Records, becomes Swift’s 17th Radio Songs top 10, gaining by 3% to 46.2 million in audience March 24-30, according to Luminate. “Lavender Haze” is the second Radio Songs top 10 from Swift’s album Midnights, after “Anti-Hero” became her ninth No. 1, ruling for five weeks in December-January. She’s tied for the fourth-most leaders on the list (which began in December 1990). Swift scored her first top 10, “Love Story,” and followed with her first No. 1, “You Belong With Me,” both in 2009. Here’s a recap of the acts with the most Radio Songs top 10s: 30, Rihanna 24, Drake 23, Mariah Carey 21, Justin Bieber 20, Lil Wayne 19, Beyoncé 18, Chris Brown 18, Maroon 5 18, Bruno Mars 17, Ariana Grande 17, Jay-Z 17, Ludacris 17, P!nk 17, T-Pain 17, Taylor Swift 17, Usher “Lavender Haze” concurrently holds at its No. 5 highs on both Adult Pop Airplay and Pop Airplay. It became Swift’s record-tying 27th top 10 on the former ranking and 20th on the latter. On the all-genre, multi-metric Billboard Hot 100, the song debuted at its No. 2 high on the Nov. 5, 2022, chart – as one of 10 tracks from Midnights in the tier that week, as Swift became the first artist ever to infuse the entire top 10 in a single week. In addition to its radio audience, “Lavender Haze” drew 9.6 million streams and sold 1,400 downloads in the latest tracking week.
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85la
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Post by 85la on Apr 6, 2023 23:17:29 GMT -5
Taylor Swift Ties for the 10th-Most Top 10 Hits on the Radio Songs Chart With ‘Lavender Haze’4/5/2023 By Gary Trust The song is her 17th top 10 on the all-format airplay ranking. Taylor Swift enters into a tie for the 10th-most top 10 hits in the history of Billboard’s all-format Radio Songs chart, as “Lavender Haze” lifts from No. 11 to No. 10 on the tally dated April 8. The song, released on Republic Records, becomes Swift’s 17th Radio Songs top 10, gaining by 3% to 46.2 million in audience March 24-30, according to Luminate. “Lavender Haze” is the second Radio Songs top 10 from Swift’s album Midnights, after “Anti-Hero” became her ninth No. 1, ruling for five weeks in December-January. She’s tied for the fourth-most leaders on the list (which began in December 1990). Swift scored her first top 10, “Love Story,” and followed with her first No. 1, “You Belong With Me,” both in 2009. I think they're confusing her Radio Songs #1's either with her Hot 100 #1's or Pop Songs #1's, as I'm only counting 7 of her songs that reached #1 on Radio Songs (You Belong With Me, I Knew You Were Trouble, Shake It Off, Blank Space, Bad Blood, Wildest Dreams, and Anti-Hero), while she has had 9 #1's on both the Hot 100 and Pop Songs. Their ranking is correct though, she is tied for the fourth-most leaders on Radio Songs (Rihanna leading with 13, Mariah with 11, Bruno Mars with 9, and then Usher, Katy Perry, and Maroon 5 also with 7). |
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