atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Jun 26, 2007 7:43:28 GMT -5
There was a lot of discussion about this at the end of some other thread - I was thinking about it more, and I think the answer is really simple - Alternative Rock stations play cuts FROM CD'S THAT ARE MOSTLY ROCK, NOT POP - a majority of songs on Nickelback and 3 Doors Down CD's (and even Daughtry's CD) are AOR-oriented, even if they have a few ballads - if you listen to a Matchbox 20 CD (from the 2000s), the majority of tracks are not AOR-oriented, but pop oriented, so Alternative Rock listeners don't classify them in that genre - for this same reason, Alternative Rock didn't play Maroon 5's "Harder To Breathe," which could have very well been classified as "Rock"
Ironically, Matchbox 20's very first CD cut was the AOR track "Long Day" in 1997 - "Yourself Or Someone Like You" was probably their only CD classified as "Rock" instead of "Pop"
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KelownaGuy20
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Post by KelownaGuy20 on Jun 26, 2007 8:05:26 GMT -5
I honestly think that "Long Day" was their best song.
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Slinky
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Post by Slinky on Jun 26, 2007 12:45:11 GMT -5
Ditto to that. I still love "Long Day" and there are few other M20 songs I can stand.
Also, I think the band's influences matter. Nickelback was obviously influenced by grunge quite a bit, so they still get played on Alternative. M20 seems more influenced by 70's and 80's pop/rock.
I think "Harder To Breathe" peaked in the 40's on the Alternative chart in early 2003. Then the song sat around on the lower part of Hot AC chart for a while and finally gained notoriety when Pop picked it up. I don't know why Alt. listeners never responded to Maroon 5, but they were at least given a shot.
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Kid Pulse
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Post by Kid Pulse on Jun 26, 2007 12:59:05 GMT -5
I think Maroon 5 is too "soul-influenced" for alternative, but then again didn't "Crazy" by Gnarls Barkley chart on that format last year?
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Pulse
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Post by Pulse on Jun 26, 2007 13:27:19 GMT -5
Yeah, Crazy charted and even went Top 10 and Rehab just charted. Harder To Breathe charted too, but that's their only single that has charted (although my alternative station was playing Makes Me Wonder)
I think it has to do more with the times than anything. Matchbox 20's sound hasn't really changed, and back then, what they were playing was like more normal for alternative. Even Natalie Imbruglia charted with her songs on alternative back then! :o
Although, you do have a few people that slip by now and then. The Fray charted with both of their singles on alternative.
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No Brake$
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Post by No Brake$ on Jun 26, 2007 17:37:33 GMT -5
Pfff, Sarah I believe went Top 5 with both Building A Mystery and Sweet Surrender. Hell, I think Adia even went Top 20 and I know for a fact my station played all three.
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crazyfun1
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Post by crazyfun1 on Jun 26, 2007 19:53:38 GMT -5
It's kind of weird..Alt station won't play MB20, but they play Coldplay? How is Coldplay classified as Alt? A lot of their stuff is lighter and softer then MB20's.
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Kid Pulse
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Post by Kid Pulse on Jun 26, 2007 21:33:03 GMT -5
I agree with that Coldplay thing. "Disease" is so much heavier than "Clocks", don'tcha guys think?
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Jun 26, 2007 21:59:48 GMT -5
Yeah, but "Clocks" was ground-breaking, and didn't sound like anything that ever came before it - "Disease" was almost a carbon-coby of "Smooth" - I think they even both had the line "then just forget about it" in every chorus
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Kid Pulse
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Post by Kid Pulse on Jun 26, 2007 22:37:01 GMT -5
Don't mean to go off-topic but then why didn't rock play "Disease"? They let Nickelback get a lot of success, and they aren't unike, so why not Matchbox Twenty?
(I know about the AOR thing, but "Disease" was pretty heavy)
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musicfanpete
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Post by musicfanpete on Jun 26, 2007 22:57:11 GMT -5
The reason Matchbox 20 doesn't get airplay on most alternative stations may be the same reason why some alternative stations (not all, but some) probably won't even play say the Red Hot Chili Peppers (as an example). Even though they have not "mellowed" to the same point Rob Thomas has, they are just too popular to be considered "alternative" by some of those type of stations.
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Post by mrclimbfall20 on Jun 27, 2007 15:18:31 GMT -5
The reason Matchbox 20 doesn't get airplay on most alternative stations may be the same reason why some alternative stations (not all, but some) probably won't even play say the Red Hot Chili Peppers (as an example). Even though they have not "mellowed" to the same point Rob Thomas has, they are just too popular to be considered "alternative" by some of those type of stations. That's not the case in San Diego. Both alternative stations and the active rock station are obsessed with them, whereas they get little air-time on the Hot AC station.
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Jun 27, 2007 15:59:32 GMT -5
Don't mean to go off-topic but then why didn't rock play "Disease"? They let Nickelback get a lot of success, and they aren't unike, so why not Matchbox Twenty? (I know about the AOR thing, but "Disease" was pretty heavy) "Disease" led off a CD by Matchbox 20 that was mostly pop-based, while Nickelback CD's, as a whole, are still hard rock-based - it's hard to tell by the singles they release, but if you listen to the rest of Nickelback CD's that aren't singles, they are AOR-oriented - also, "Disease" wasn't a highly requested track at any radio stations - more of a passive hit for people who already listened to Matchbox 20 - "Photograph" was requested like crazy, as was "Savin' Me" (on Top 40, Hot AC, and Alternative stations that play Nickelback)
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Jun 27, 2007 16:01:26 GMT -5
The reason Matchbox 20 doesn't get airplay on most alternative stations may be the same reason why some alternative stations (not all, but some) probably won't even play say the Red Hot Chili Peppers (as an example). Even though they have not "mellowed" to the same point Rob Thomas has, they are just too popular to be considered "alternative" by some of those type of stations. The Red Hot Chili Peppers still hit #1, or Top 5, on the Alternative chart with nearly every single they release - the station near you must not play them for some reason
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Rumors
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Post by Rumors on Jun 29, 2007 17:09:09 GMT -5
Well, this is kind of on topic. Official MB20 text message today. matchbox twenty to release their first new material in 5 years! EXILE ON MAINSTREAM features 6 new songs and 10 greatest hits will be in stores 10/2!
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crazyfun1
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Post by crazyfun1 on Jun 29, 2007 17:15:06 GMT -5
Is that a joke or for real? Because when I met them in 2002..in an interview, I remember Rob mentiong EXILE ON MAINSTREAM as joke title...or THE OTHER WHITE ALBUM(The Beatles)...lol. Wow..if that's true..then damn the man!
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Chase
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Post by Chase on Jun 29, 2007 18:02:24 GMT -5
6 new songs and 10 greatest hits? Geez, just release a GH and then a new album next year.
Hopefully one of the new songs goes for adds at Alternative ;)
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Rumors
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Post by Rumors on Jun 29, 2007 20:28:43 GMT -5
Well, the album title seems pretty official. Here's an article that was posted on www.billboard.com today. I actually think that title is pretty great (and accurate). Hence the topic on this thread. We should be hearing the single in 2 months or so. matchbox twenty Breaks From 'Exile' With New Tunes Rob Thomas June 29, 2007, 4:05 PM ET Jonathan Cohen, N.Y. After a long hiatus to allow frontman Rob Thomas to release his first solo album, "Something To Be," the members of matchbox twenty have completed a month's worth of sessions in Los Angeles to record new songs for an upcoming retrospective. Thomas tells Billboard.com that "Exile on Mainstream," due Oct. 2 via Atlantic, could include as many as six new cuts produced by Steve Lillywhite, plus 11 prior hits. Among the new tunes are the upbeat first single "How Far We've Come," "I'll Believe You When..." ("It's like our Pretenders song," he says of the latter), the '50s-leaning "Can't Let You Go" and "These Hard Times." "This is different than any record we've made, and different than my solo record," says Thomas, who had never collaborated on the songwriting with his bandmates. "We got together for a week at my house and we all had song ideas, but they didn't sound like what we wanted to play together. Between that vibe and working with Steve, it's a much more raw, energetic, live-sounding record than we've done in the past." In another twist, Paul Doucette, who had previously been the band's drummer, is now playing rhythm guitar as a replacement for Adam Gaynor, who left matchbox in 2005. "Over the last two or three years, he started playing more guitar and keyboard," Thomas says. "One day, he just said, listen, I'd rather not play drums anymore. He's actually a better guitar player than our old guitar player was." Thomas, who just launched a new record label with Epic and released a documentary about the experience of recording solo, says matchbox twenty will return to the road beginning in January. "We'll do some one-offs before then, like TV shows," he reports. "We're also playing an Andre Agassi charity event in Las Vegas." Next summer, Thomas will begin work on his second solo disc, and says he hopes matchbox will be back in the studio in 2009 to record a new album.
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Kid Pulse
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Post by Kid Pulse on Jun 29, 2007 23:37:29 GMT -5
Wow, good news for my favorite band!!
I really wish they would just go ahead and start making the full-length material THIS summer, instead of Rob going solo AGAIN. Hopefully those plans change somehow.
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Post by Walking Contradiction on Jun 29, 2007 23:52:58 GMT -5
A lot of Alternative stations have turned their backs on AOR bands like Nickelback and 3 Doors Down. As they should, IMHO, because while those bands may be good at what they do, they're as mainstream and generic as they come. I'd rather hear MB20 than those bands, but that's just me.
On the other hand, I don't think there's a single Alternative station in the country that doesn't play RHCP.
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Jun 30, 2007 7:18:51 GMT -5
A lot of Alternative stations have turned their backs on AOR bands like Nickelback and 3 Doors Down. Seems like Alternative stations WITHOUT A STRONG HOT AC IN THE MARKET still play Nickelback and 3 Doors Down (WEND/Charlotte, WNNX/Atlanta are two I know of) - if the local Hot AC station (and/or Top 40 station) is playing these bands heavily, then Alternative can leave them out I still think Matchbox 20 would need a completely unique-sounding, but harder-edged hit to be considered by these Alternative stations that do play Nickelback and 3 Doors Down
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NORTHCOAST
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Post by NORTHCOAST on Jul 1, 2007 17:37:44 GMT -5
I just think MB20 is too ubiquitous to be termed "alternative". They are such a successful band, churning out hit after hit after hit. The epitome of mainstream, hence the "Exile on Mainstream" title for their next album. I think "alternative" stations should stick with "alternative" bands and leave the MB20, 3DD and Nickelbacks of the world to Hot AC and AC.
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Post by tico on Jul 1, 2007 19:09:16 GMT -5
The active rock station here, WRXW, still plays 3 Doors Down and Nickelback. They even surprised the heck outta me when they first started playing Daughtry.
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Jul 1, 2007 22:13:12 GMT -5
I think "alternative" stations should stick with "alternative" bands and leave the MB20, 3DD and Nickelbacks of the world to Hot AC and AC. Unless there's no Hot AC in the market - that's what's happening in many cities in the Southeast
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Rumors
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Post by Rumors on Jul 2, 2007 17:56:57 GMT -5
I just think MB20 is too ubiquitous to be termed "alternative". They are such a successful band, churning out hit after hit after hit. The epitome of mainstream, hence the "Exile on Mainstream" title for their next album. I think "alternative" stations should stick with "alternative" bands and leave the MB20, 3DD and Nickelbacks of the world to Hot AC and AC. I would agree with that statement IF alternative strickly played truly alternative bands. However, I think MB20 is as alternative as many of the bands getting played on alternative radio. For an example, what's really alternative about Evanescence or FOB?
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crazyfun1
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Post by crazyfun1 on Jul 2, 2007 18:36:42 GMT -5
You know, when it comes down to it, was is the defn of an 'alternative' band? What makes one artist 'alternative' over another?
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Jul 3, 2007 19:32:02 GMT -5
You know, when it comes down to it, was is the defn of an 'alternative' band? What makes one artist 'alternative' over another? Here's my guess - an alternative artist (usually, with the exception of the Southeast Alternative stations w/ no Hot AC in the market) isn't played excessively by Hot AC or AC, and/or song comes from a CD which has mostly AOR-oriented tracks (like Evanescence as compared to Matchbox 20)
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shocker
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Post by shocker on Jul 4, 2007 6:31:30 GMT -5
You know, when it comes down to it, was is the defn of an 'alternative' band? What makes one artist 'alternative' over another? Alternative means separated from the mainstream, or indepenedent. Think of it as the anti-boy band, the anti-Britney Spears, or the anti-American Idol. In other words - an "alternative" to the manufactured pop sound. It can be light (Sarah McLachlan), hard (Nirvana), or in the middle (Red Hot Chili Peppers). It doesn't have one specific sound, or beats-per-minute. When alternative artists become more accepted by mainstream audiences, they can't really be considered "alternative" any longer; and that's why alternative stations will no longer play their songs very much when that happens. Sheryl Crow was an alternative singer before pop stations embraced her. To prove my point - In the early days, R.E.M. and the Police were classified as alternative. How many alternative stations still spin their songs on a regular rotation?
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Jul 4, 2007 9:56:05 GMT -5
You know, when it comes down to it, was is the defn of an 'alternative' band? What makes one artist 'alternative' over another? To prove my point - In the early days, R.E.M. and the Police were classified as alternative. How many alternative stations still spin their songs on a regular rotation? Actually, a lot of Alternative stations DO play "classic songs" by R. E. M. and the Police, especially (sorry to keep repeating this) if there is no major Hot AC in the market
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Chase
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Post by Chase on Jul 4, 2007 13:21:19 GMT -5
To prove my point - In the early days, R.E.M. and the Police were classified as alternative. How many alternative stations still spin their songs on a regular rotation? Actually, a lot of Alternative stations DO play "classic songs" by R. E. M. and the Police, especially (sorry to keep repeating this) if there is no major Hot AC in the market Several alternative stations (KROQ in LA and Radio 104.5 in Philadelphia come to mind) also spin Bob Marley, which always confuses me.
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