#LisaRinna
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Post by #LisaRinna on Jan 29, 2018 16:30:46 GMT -5
A big piece to the puzzle of why last night’s show turned out to be what it was: Live Nation vs. AEG. Live Nation instigates and holds these very highly-contested battles against AEG, so much so as they began that monopolization of artists having to tour exclusively with them if they wanted to play The Forum or MSG during their runs (with AEG turning around and doing the same thing against ‘em with Staples or The O2). The Recording Academy had to jump through HOOPS to get this show back in NYC for this year, and one of the only ways AEG would agree to the 60th being held away from LA was if the Academy would simultaneously sign a contract to come back to the Staples Center for another 4 years afterwards. With that push to NY, ultimately, came the power for Live Nation to monopolize the broadcast. That included pushing Live Nation touring artists to the front, and wedging AEG artists to the back. These people include *gasp* Lorde, Ed, Katy, and Taylor (as well as Bieber). This could very well explain why there was no offer for Lorde or Ed to perform, and there could be more to why Taylor said no. Most of the performers/big nominees last night are Live Nation touring artists: Bruno, Kendrick, Pink, Jay-Z, Gaga, Dave Chappelle, U2, DJ Khaled, SZA, Sting, etc. In other words, if everything felt contrived and forced last night, that’s because it very much was. Oh wow. Thanks for shedding light on all of this!
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Post by Fat Ass Kelly Price on Jan 29, 2018 16:31:23 GMT -5
People now complain that female are under represented this year, despite having great representation in recent years. People are also breaking out the article which describes 90% of recent Grammy nominees being male, with that article completely disregarding the fact that it's talking about ALL Grammy nominees (producers, writers, visual artists, performing artists, recording studio personnel) and not just the singers/rappers and these careers are dominated by males and therefore naturally the proportion of males to female in overall Grammy nominations would be highly lopsided. No matter what they do, they're doing to receive backlash. Disjointed rant done. You missed the point on that discussion. The point is that it’s a critique on the industry as a whole. The point really soared over your head. That’s the issue. The industry is heavily male dominated from all angles. And there’s no logical reason for it other than gatekeeping.
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deepston
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Post by deepston on Jan 29, 2018 16:46:54 GMT -5
What I think about this year's Grammys is that creativity, talent and thoughtfulness in general were devalued in the face of flash and popular. One of the most acclaimed pop albums from recent times was almost completely snubbed from nominations and lost the one nomination it got. One of the best Hip-Hop albums ever crafted lost AOTY. Innovative artists such as Lorde and Kendrick were almost completely shunned while an artist with an album that is very subpar compared to Melodrama and Damn. was awarded not 1 but 3 big awards. Overall this was a very sad award show and creativity was almost completely defeated. Let's not even start with Ed Sheeran getting the Pop categories over Kesha. Anyway, just another year to prove us we're better off with our TVs turned off on this day.
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jan 29, 2018 16:50:44 GMT -5
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jan 29, 2018 17:04:43 GMT -5
Bruno nominated for song and record of the year with 2 different songs.Should have just been 1 song. Why?
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leonagwen
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Post by leonagwen on Jan 29, 2018 17:06:34 GMT -5
Bruno nominated for song and record of the year with 2 different songs.Should have just been 1 song. Why? Has it ever happened before?
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jan 29, 2018 17:07:51 GMT -5
On a happier note, I need to give a shout-out to Rihanna. As these award shows continue to become less interesting, she consistently shows up, entertains, sounds great, looks great, and doesn't take herself too seriously. She's gradually evolved her sound while still staying true to her roots. She's been around for over a decade, but I'm not sick of her. I don't necessarily stan for her, but I'm always glad to see her. Same. I'm increasingly impressed with Rihanna as she nears 15 years in primetime.
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Zach
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And at once I knew I was not magnificent...
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Post by Zach on Jan 29, 2018 17:08:32 GMT -5
People now complain that female are under represented this year, despite having great representation in recent years. People are also breaking out the article which describes 90% of recent Grammy nominees being male, with that article completely disregarding the fact that it's talking about ALL Grammy nominees (producers, writers, visual artists, performing artists, recording studio personnel) and not just the singers/rappers and these careers are dominated by males and therefore naturally the proportion of males to female in overall Grammy nominations would be highly lopsided. No matter what they do, they're doing to receive backlash. Disjointed rant done. You missed the point on that discussion. The point is that it’s a critique on the industry as a whole. The point really soared over your head. That’s the issue. The industry is heavily male dominated from all angles. And there’s no logical reason for it other than gatekeeping. If you were thinking that was a direct response to any discussion within this thread, it wasn't. It was a response to a general trend I've seen of people specifically blasting the Grammys itself for the male-to-female ratio of its nominees, and their referencing of that report to try to back up their criticism. In my opinion the ratio of the sexes in the industry as a whole reaches far beyond the Grammy Awards and it isn't fair to hit out against the Grammys for the under-representation of women in their nominations when there are so much fewer woman who are even there to be nominated. I completely agree with you about the industry as a whole. As someone with a close second hand experience of the industry in both the US and Jamaica I have learned of how much of a guy's club the music industry is and how difficult it is for women to advance up the ranks. Some people will try to argue that it's just a situation of women not being interested and try to compare it to the lack of females within automotive mechanics or trucking but I don't think that comparison holds water. BUT EVEN THEN the question could be asked as to why there is such a disinterest of women in the profession because there is no certainly no biological reason for it, so...
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jan 29, 2018 17:12:44 GMT -5
Has it ever happened before? Why would that matter in regards to your point that only one song should be nominated in both categories? To answer your question, in 2002 U2 were nominated in both categories with 2 different songs. They won Record of the Year (Walk On) but lost Song (Stuck In A Moment). (They also won both the year before but both were for Beautiful Day).
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Deleted
Joined: January 1970
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2018 17:14:17 GMT -5
Still upset my queen SZA got no wins I mean look at her, she's a fucking talented beautiful queen, she brought her mom and grandmother too
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 29, 2018 17:14:23 GMT -5
You missed the point on that discussion. The point is that it’s a critique on the industry as a whole. The point really soared over your head. That’s the issue. The industry is heavily male dominated from all angles. And there’s no logical reason for it other than gatekeeping. If you were thinking that was a direct response to any discussion within this thread, it wasn't. It was a response to a general trend I've seen of people specifically blasting the Grammys itself for the male-to-female ratio of its nominees, and their referencing of that report to try to back up their criticism. In my opinion the ratio of the sexes in the industry as a whole reaches far beyond the Grammy Awards and it isn't fair to hit out against the Grammys for the under-representation of women in their nominations when there are so much fewer woman who are even there to be nominated. I completely agree with you about the industry as a whole. As someone with a close second hand experience of the industry in both the US and Jamaica I have learned of how much of a guy's club the music industry is and how difficult it is for women to advance up the ranks. I agree that the issue exists outside of the Grammys and is larger than the Grammys; it's the same with the film industry and the Oscars. Having said that, the Oscars still took steps to improve its voting body, and I think the Grammys could/should do the same. The Oscars, Grammys, etc do influence the industry at least a bit, so diversity within those awards can lead to some diversity within the industry, even if the awards shows are a symptom more than the problem.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jan 29, 2018 17:15:43 GMT -5
I'd be curious to know the demographic breakdown of the voters.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 29, 2018 17:18:49 GMT -5
Has it ever happened before? Why would that matter in regards to your point that only one song should be nominated in both categories? To answer your question, in 2002 U2 were nominated in both categories with 2 different songs. They won Record of the Year (Walk On) but lost Song (Stuck In A Moment). (They also won both the year before but both were for Beautiful Day). Another example is Beyonce when she was in Record for "Halo" (a loss) and in Song for "Single Ladies" (a win). In terms of wins for different songs, Carole King won Record for "It's Too Late" and Song for "You've Got a Friend" (which in a sense was also for James Taylor's version).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2018 17:27:09 GMT -5
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¤ Matthea ¤
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Post by ¤ Matthea ¤ on Jan 29, 2018 18:17:46 GMT -5
When I checked the winner's list this morning, I started laughing so hard.
Bruno Mars won all the big awards. I mean, the guy is talented, but the quality of his material goes down with every new album he releases. Nothing on 24KMagic stands out to me. That said, if I were a Grammy voter, I would go with Bruno, too. The AOTY nominees this year were a tragic selection. I would have given ROTY and SOTY to 'Despacito', because that was the song of 2017 and the only reasonable alternative to it could be 'Shape Of You', but that one wasn't nominated in the major categories.
I'm happy Ed Sheeran won the two awards he was nominated for. I'm just a casual fan of Ed Sheeran, but his latest album is good enough to keep my attention the whole way through.
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Zach
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Post by Zach on Jan 29, 2018 18:47:57 GMT -5
When I checked the winner's list this morning, I started laughing so hard. Bruno Mars won all the big awards. I mean, the guy is talented, but the quality of his material goes down with every new album he releases. Nothing on 24KMagic stands out to me. That said, if I were a Grammy voter, I would go with Bruno, too. The AOTY nominees this year were a tragic selection. I would have given ROTY and SOTY to 'Despacito', because that was the song of 2017 and the only reasonable alternative to it could be 'Shape Of You', but that one wasn't nominated in the major categories.
I'm happy Ed Sheeran won the two awards he was nominated for. I'm just a casual fan of Ed Sheeran, but his latest album is good enough to keep my attention the whole way through.I'm dying at the fact that I disagree strongly with pretty much the entire bolded section of your comment. Not putting down your opinion or anything, it isn't any less significant than mine, I just find it funny that I can find a post which says so many things and I highly disagree with almost all of them.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2018 19:06:33 GMT -5
The Grammys needs to figure out wtf it wants to actually represent, mainstream tastes or pure acclaim; it's painfully clear that they'll never figure out how to stand for both. A lot of its issues would fix themselves if the showrunners could make heads or tails of what the Grammy brand is all about. The show doesn't catch backlash simply b/c there's always someone who will be mad, but because they have no sense of consistency except for their' dogged persistence in being clueless. When they get called out they 'fix' things that don't need fixing, neglect what does need fixing, and usually end up making an even bigger mess in the process.
Right now it's just confusing and often hurtful when you can be nominated for AOTY but still somehow receive the message that your album wasn't good or successful enough to guarantee a performance slot for it; or when someone can justifiably believe he got locked out of the general race solely b/c he didn't fit the current narrative; or when a hugely acclaimed breakthrough who does fit the current narrative gets gassed up only to lose to the guy I just mentioned simply because he sold more and that's what the voters wanted to recognize, and then hear the president of the academy declare just a few hours later that the women "need to step up and be artists" if they want to be recognized and basically make a mockery of the whole movement.
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leonagwen
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Post by leonagwen on Jan 29, 2018 19:21:13 GMT -5
Why would that matter in regards to your point that only one song should be nominated in both categories? To answer your question, in 2002 U2 were nominated in both categories with 2 different songs. They won Record of the Year (Walk On) but lost Song (Stuck In A Moment). (They also won both the year before but both were for Beautiful Day). Another example is Beyonce when she was in Record for "Halo" (a loss) and in Song for "Single Ladies" (a win). In terms of wins for different songs, Carole King won Record for "It's Too Late" and Song for "You've Got a Friend" (which in a sense was also for James Taylor's version). Carole King deserved it that year as Tapestry was the best album that year.
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Dylan :)
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Post by Dylan :) on Jan 29, 2018 19:23:39 GMT -5
Still can’t get over the fact that they had the whitest band from one of the whitest countries in the world do a performance beneath the Statue of Liberty in honor of Dreamers and the struggle of immigrants and undocumented citizens. Although I completely agree with this, in a separate point/just a general point, it is worth looking up the treatment of Irish people when they emigrated to the US during the famine (I believe Glove Slap already mentioned this)
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Keelzit
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Post by Keelzit on Jan 29, 2018 19:39:15 GMT -5
I personally dislike Bruno's music style aside from a select few bops of his but there's no denying that he's exceptionally talented, especially in the vocal department. That said, I'm absolutely shocked at his total sweep because of how hugely successful most of the other nominees on the Big 3 awards were too. Adele's sweep last year wasn't shocking because she had massive numbers backing her up, something Bruno only matched or even lacked in comparison to Humble, DAMN., Despacito, etc. And he did it with basically an EP (for today's standards) that never even went #1. It definitely wasn't an undeserved win because it was a quality record but still, I thought the wins would be more spread out and expected Kendrick Lamar to take AOTY, maybe even one of the ROTY/SOTY awards and Redbone getting the one not won by Kendrick.
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DJ General
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Post by DJ General on Jan 29, 2018 19:41:43 GMT -5
UPDATED:
In time zone-adjusted ratings, the Grammys delivered a 5.9 rating among adults 18-49 and 19.81 million viewers. That’s down 24 percent in both adults 18-49 and viewers vs. last year’s awards. It’s the lowest 18-49 rating the Grammys have ever recorded and the least-watched ceremony since 2009.
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14887fan
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Post by 14887fan on Jan 29, 2018 19:42:35 GMT -5
Still can’t get over the fact that they had the whitest band from one of the whitest countries in the world do a performance beneath the Statue of Liberty in honor of Dreamers and the struggle of immigrants and undocumented citizens. Although I completely agree with this, in a separate point/just a general point, it is worth looking up the treatment of Irish people when they emigrated to the US during the famine (I believe Glove Slap already mentioned this) Very much aware — took several classes on it. No disrespect meant towards anyone in the Irish community, but I apologize if I offended! Glad you got the gist of what I meant by my post!
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DJ General
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Post by DJ General on Jan 29, 2018 19:44:15 GMT -5
Here are this decades numbers.
Year, Millions, Demo
2011 26.55 10.0 2012 39.91 14.1 2013 28.37 10.1 2014 28.51 9.9 2015 25.3 8.5 2016 24.95 7.7 2017 26.05 7.8 2018 19.81 5.9
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DJ General
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Post by DJ General on Jan 29, 2018 19:47:49 GMT -5
Pink responds to Recording Academy president Neil Portnow's call for women to 'step up' after male-dominated Grammys
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Keelzit
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Post by Keelzit on Jan 29, 2018 19:47:50 GMT -5
Here are this decades numbers. Year, Millions, Demo 2011 26.55 10.0 2012 39.91 14.1 2013 28.37 10.1 2014 28.51 9.9 2015 25.3 8.5 2016 24.95 7.7 2017 26.05 7.8 2018 19.81 5.9 No Adele, No ratings
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DJ General
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Post by DJ General on Jan 29, 2018 19:50:18 GMT -5
Here are this decades numbers. Year, Millions, Demo 2011 26.55 10.0 2012 39.91 14.1 2013 28.37 10.1 2014 28.51 9.9 2015 25.3 8.5 2016 24.95 7.7 2017 26.05 7.8 2018 19.81 5.9 No Adele, No ratings The 2012 bump was due to the death of Whitney Houston, if that is what you are referring to.
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HEADOFTHEPACK
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Post by HEADOFTHEPACK on Jan 29, 2018 19:55:15 GMT -5
Good for Pink. Seriously fuck the guy who said women need to step up, what an insult.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 29, 2018 19:58:06 GMT -5
Pink responds to Recording Academy president Neil Portnow's call for women to 'step up' after male-dominated Grammys And this is why P!nk is a legend bitches
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14887fan
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Post by 14887fan on Jan 29, 2018 20:07:43 GMT -5
Neil Portnow and Ken Ehrlich really need to step down. They showed their age and out-of-touch mindsets with these comments, and the backlash has been enormous.
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Troy
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Post by Troy on Jan 29, 2018 20:30:15 GMT -5
I have nothing bad to say about Bruno or Ed, but nothing positive to say either...Ed is usually a big yawn & Bruno, although talented isn't my cup of tea
They both have some good songs but nothing from the past year particularly stands out ... The Onion hit the nail on the head w/ the description "least threatening"
but remember that Purple Rain lost to Can't Slow Down in 1985, so the Grammys have played it safe for a long time now
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