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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2014 20:43:35 GMT -5
I've seen it mentioned that she's a co-writer/-producer of her material when she's written about. Maybe her pointing it out so much could be part of the insecurities that she has? insecurity leads people to do lots of things usually its obvious to spot but anyway in this particular case i think its more making sure people give her the credit she deserves considering her favorite part of what she does is songwriting. Mariah has been insecure about some things but never her career or talents she brings, she makes that known.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Feb 22, 2014 23:49:05 GMT -5
Ariana Grande credits Beyonce and Madonna for her growth as an artist.
Asked about the Carey comparisons, Grande explains, βI mean, itβs a huge compliment, But when you hear my entire album, youβll see that Mariahβs sound is much different than mine.β
www.gossipcop.com/ariana-grande-v-magazine-vegan-beyonce-mariah-carey-madonna/
I mean, I find this hilarious. Especially, considering that Beyonce herself said she learned to do vocal runs by listening to Mariah Carey. lol So she's ultimately being influence by Mariah one way or another Less than a year ago Grande was touting Mariah as her main influence and what not. I am sure this comes down to 1) Being annoyed at being compared to Mariah all of the time and 2) Trying to show she likes a variety of music. It could also be because Mariah hasn't reached out to Grande, but why should Mariah? So many young singers who touted Mariah as an influence have come and gone. Is Mariah expected to reach out to every one of them? To praise every one of them? I think people expect too much on that end. It's entirely possible Mariah hasn't heard Ariana's music. I don't think Mariah even listens to much current music outside of hip-hop.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Feb 23, 2014 0:00:58 GMT -5
I've seen it mentioned that she's a co-writer/-producer of her material when she's written about. Maybe her pointing it out so much could be part of the insecurities that she has? It is partly insecurity, but it's based in some reality. I still see articles and other things refer to her co-writers and co-producers as being the people behind the songs, while Mariah doesn't get credited; Mariah is very often left out as being a creative force in her music. Here are some examples: "The heartfelt ballad, produced by Rodney Jerkins..." (not "produced by Rodney Jerkins and Mariah") "I was a big fan of his song, [the Mariah Carey-sung] "We Belong Together". (Jermaine gets credit for "WBT" being his song)
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silab
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Post by silab on Feb 23, 2014 0:08:53 GMT -5
A lot of fans are really delusional. Whoever releases their album that week, Mariah has a slim chance of going number 1. Reality is, outside of Mariah fans, there is a very slim interest in her, and mostly negative if ever she is being talked about. At this point, I don't think You're Mine will reach 100k.
Her album will be lucky to scan gold. And let's not even talk about internationally, she might reach number 1 in the Philippines but come back to me and tell me how much she sold in numbers then you will know it is a tiny achievement
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Post by Positive Tension on Feb 23, 2014 1:43:21 GMT -5
I don't think that even us fans have high hopes for this album's sales. Unless there's a hot single released with lots of great promo, it'll likely be Mariah's lowest selling studio album to date. It's a good thing the album will be out in May, as there's still time for another single and some performances to build interest.
Edit: It was lovely to hear her talk about the album some more in the clip on the last page- it reminded me just how little she's spoken of the music until recently.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Feb 23, 2014 8:42:05 GMT -5
That does happen sometimes, when people who are primarily producers, rather than artists, get more "attention" for the efforts, even if the recording act is a big part of the process. Especially for females whose name isn't the only one appearing on the writing/producing credits.
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Post by sundaymorningguy on Feb 23, 2014 10:41:26 GMT -5
I think Mariah's focus has changed and it makes it harder for people to notice those aspects of her music since she makes the public focus on everything but her music especially in the post-Butterfly eras. That is part of the reason TEOM era was so successful because she brought the attention back to her music, and she didn't play up the ridiculous aspects of herself. She has to realize when she is wearing a dress where her tits are threatening to fall out well nobody is going to hear the part where she is talking about her being a songwriter because they are waiting for those boobs to fall out. She has to realize when she posts photos of her trying to seduce her husband on instagram or facebook nobody is going to be like that is Mariah she co-wrote and co-produced almost all her songs. They are going to be like what the fcuk is she doing. People like her when she is focusing on her music, and it is easier to take her seriously when she is making it about the music. Her focus shifted to other things after the Butterfly era, and I would say that did a bit of damage to her career and credibility with the public.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 11:14:09 GMT -5
I really hope people realize that GOLD records 25 years into a career is not something to frown on and instead is a amazing in todays climate. I know most are aware but reading some posts make it seem like its a flop to get a gold record. Considering the hottest and young artists are clenching their ass just to get to platinum with multiple hit singles. If this album sells gold like Memoirs with just a medium sized hit single all i can say is HELL YES! the legendary and undisputed Queen since 1990 still lives honey.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 11:21:15 GMT -5
Not to mention, hardly any R&B albums sell 100k in their first week anymore and very few go Gold. That's the reality for 90% of today's top R&B acts. Mariah's been around for 25 years. If she pulled off 100k in her first week and got a Gold album (neither of which I think will happen), it would put her ahead of most of today's top R&B acts. When you've been at the head of the pack for 90% of your career, people expect it to continue forever. That's a testament to her incredible success and longevity.
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JamaicaFunkΒ²
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Post by JamaicaFunkΒ² on Feb 23, 2014 11:32:25 GMT -5
I just want a smooth, sophisticated, semi-popular era this time around to set her up for the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame. She will be eligible next year.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 11:34:31 GMT -5
I just want a smooth, sophisticated, semi-popular era this time around to set her up for the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame. She will be eligible next year. Considering she's never been loved by critics, constantly has her songwriting and production credits ignored or downplayed, and has only had her influence on music recognized beginning in the past couple of years, I doubt she'll be in consideration next year.
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vipanonymous
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Post by vipanonymous on Feb 23, 2014 12:15:54 GMT -5
I have a good feeling about "Thirsty" can't wait to hear it.
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Feb 23, 2014 13:07:19 GMT -5
A lot of fans are really delusional. Whoever releases their album that week, Mariah has a slim chance of going number 1. Reality is, outside of Mariah fans, there is a very slim interest in her, and mostly negative if ever she is being talked about. At this point, I don't think You're Mine will reach 100k. Her album will be lucky to scan gold. And let's not even talk about internationally, she might reach number 1 in the Philippines but come back to me and tell me how much she sold in numbers then you will know it is a tiny achievement HATER ALERTYour post is so random....Who is saying that her album is going to #1? I can tell you and the person who liked your post are "haters" and "trolls" with posts like that above. The only delusional thing is you and that other asscheek thinking we can't see through the continuous Mariah bashing you both do here every chance you get.
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fitandtanned
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Post by fitandtanned on Feb 23, 2014 13:11:30 GMT -5
How would the lambs feel is she came back with something poppy and dancey like the new kylie single? heard that on the radio today and it sounded so full of fun and just energy. On the other hand youre mine , while i like it, is just the same thing we have heard from Mariah over and over since 2005 basically. however i am happy that its at least made the hot 100 as it shows that there is at least a little public interest in her at the minute, when you remember how similar ballads like HATE U and I Stay in love made no impact at all.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 13:16:52 GMT -5
How would the lambs feel is she came back with something poppy and dancey like the new kylie single? heard that on the radio today and it sounded so full of fun and just energy. On the other hand youre mine , while i like it, is just the same thing we have heard from Mariah over and over since 2005 basically. however i am happy that its at least made the hot 100 as it shows that there is at least a little public interest in her at the minute, when you remember how similar ballads like HATE U and I Stay in love made no impact at all. I'm the wrong lamb to ask since in general im not down with more poppy and dancey from anyone unless its amazing however I must admit I made a face because its the last thing i wanna hear coming from Mariah. I do want a fresh, upbeat, fun song from her but it has to be FIRST and FOREMOST rooted in urban and for urban clubs. Its just how i dance.
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fitandtanned
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Post by fitandtanned on Feb 23, 2014 14:06:03 GMT -5
How would the lambs feel is she came back with something poppy and dancey like the new kylie single? heard that on the radio today and it sounded so full of fun and just energy. On the other hand youre mine , while i like it, is just the same thing we have heard from Mariah over and over since 2005 basically. however i am happy that its at least made the hot 100 as it shows that there is at least a little public interest in her at the minute, when you remember how similar ballads like HATE U and I Stay in love made no impact at all. I'm the wrong lamb to ask since in general im not down with more poppy and dancey from anyone unless its amazing however I must admit I made a face because its the last thing i wanna hear coming from Mariah. I do want a fresh, upbeat, fun song from her but it has to be FIRST and FOREMOST rooted in urban and for urban clubs. Its just how i dance. So youre not bothered about mainstream success per se, just urban market ? Seems like would be a good way to go. Would youre mine be considered RnB or what genre does it fall into ? Listening to the Tamar braxton album and it sounds pretty good, Youre Mine just seens dull or boring in comparison. I still like it, its just needs something !
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 14:12:23 GMT -5
^ No, I'm not bothered by mainstream success and neither should anyone else, what is this now her 14 album? She already sold what 200+ records? 18 no. #1's, she will be 50 by the time i turn 18 years old. What mainstream success is she chasing and if she is she shouldn't be slumming it.
The way I look at it is now she is that period of her legacy of just maintaining that legend not adding or subtracting from it. Urban is less fickle and more loyal to certain artists that mainstream pop ever is. She should cater to Urban AC market for all her songs and if she releases uptempo then its geared for Urban. I think once Mariah starts to write and cater to a older crowd than trying to fit in then her music and quality will get better and be more mature.
As for genre yes, You're Mine is r&b but blended with pop and it will not be successful on Urban because its not what urban plays, its basically another release of hers that is intended for everyone but doesnt fit any one genre, none of them will play it so why not just gear for one market.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 14:15:28 GMT -5
Mariah's biggest reality check is going to be realizing she's better off catering to Urban AC (an "old people" format) than essentially catering to no one except hardcore fans. Took Toni a decade to come to that realization and accept it, but it's paid off.
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Mean A$$
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Post by Mean A$$ on Feb 23, 2014 15:25:50 GMT -5
Mariah's biggest reality check is going to be realizing she's better off catering to Urban AC (an "old people" format) than essentially catering to no one except hardcore fans. Took Toni a decade to come to that realization and accept it, but it's paid off. This makes sense because a lot of her fans are "old people"β¦ they grew up with her. Its unrealistic to think she's going to pick up a lot of new fans (teens) nowadays because times change. You mention Mariah Carey to most 14-15 year olds and there like "who"? She's not going to appeal to them anymore and thats why radio has shut her out just as they have with Madonna, Toni Braxton, etc. It doesn't mean her career is over by far, its just means she needs to channel other avenues. Madonna is a touring phenomenon, Toni turned into a reality star and well Mariahβ¦ its left to see what she's going to do. And she may not end up doing anything.. she doesn't need to at this point.. she's secured icon status and has enough money to live very comfortably for the rest of her life and leave some for dem babiezβ¦
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vipanonymous
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Post by vipanonymous on Feb 23, 2014 15:28:04 GMT -5
^ No, I'm not bothered by mainstream success and neither should anyone else, what is this now her 14 album? She already sold what 200+ records? 18 no. #1's, she will be 50 by the time i turn 18 years old. What mainstream success is she chasing and if she is she shouldn't be slumming it. Oh really?!? I thought you were older. Lol
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 15:32:46 GMT -5
It was just a play play on her eternally 12 quote. I'm grown, honey!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 16:12:43 GMT -5
If Mariah could reign back her diva image, get her body back to AI shape and come off as funny and chill rather than grandiose I think she could win back some of her lost fan base with the right material. Back in the E=Mc2 and Memoirs eras, she was kind of kooky but still came off as relatable and contemporary. Since she had kids and has gotten her deserved legend acclaim, she's come off more and more distanced from the GP and I think that's hurting her image this time around. I think she looks good enough and still retains enough moderate relevance to have a successful Urban era, good material allowing, but she should hang up the legend hat and try and come off as more down to earth and fun to win back some of the audience that she had at the start of the Memoirs era.
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fitandtanned
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Post by fitandtanned on Feb 23, 2014 16:18:37 GMT -5
Agreed, she needs to stick to one format and possibly have an odd crossover hit such as Beautiful. Anyone who considered Beautiful a flop for Mariah considering her recent chart performances were just being over critical and has too high expectations of her at this point in her career. Anytime she ever goes Top 15 now it should be considered a huge success in my opinion.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Feb 23, 2014 16:27:16 GMT -5
That does happen sometimes, when people who are primarily producers, rather than artists, get more "attention" for the efforts, even if the recording act is a big part of the process. Especially for females whose name isn't the only one appearing on the writing/producing credits. If you agree it happens with females, then why are you saying her feeling a need to point out her involvement has to do with insecurity?
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Feb 23, 2014 16:47:45 GMT -5
It was speculation, I didn't say it was for sure. :) I haven't noticed others pointing it out as much as she does, hence the speculation.
She's also regularly brought up chart achievements/stats.
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Post by sundaymorningguy on Feb 23, 2014 18:19:46 GMT -5
I think the problem for me is I know the record industry has changed, but I feel like Mariah hasn't tried to get any of her eras aside from TEOM off to the right start. I feel so much wasted potential post-Butterfly. It pisses me off because I know she is better than that, and I feel like sometimes she has tried to get things off to the right start and it has worked, and sometimes she has fcuked it up so much that it is obvious it is her fault. Her post career I feel lies on her shoulders. I think she has had support from her label up til this point, and she hasn't made it work for her. She needs to do a reassessment of her career. I am tired of half a**sed work from her. Everything needs to be on point for it to work. Her videos are a joke, and I mean a damn joke. Her remixes have really gone down hill minus the WBT urban remix. Half a*s don't cut it anymore. This industry you have to be on point period. You can't afford a stutter anywhere, and she does consistently seem to mess it up.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 18:22:40 GMT -5
I think the problem for me is I know the record industry has changed, but I feel like Mariah hasn't tried to get any of her eras aside from TEOM off to the right start. I feel so much wasted potential post-Butterfly. It pisses me off because I know she is better than that, and I feel like sometimes she has tried to get things off to the right start and it has worked, and sometimes she has fcuked it up so much that it is obvious it is her fault. Her post career I feel lies on her shoulders. I think she has had support from her label up til this point, and she hasn't made it work for her. She needs to do a reassessment of her career. I am tired of half a**sed work from her. Everything needs to be on point for it to work. Her videos are a joke, and I mean a damn joke. Her remixes have really gone down hill minus the WBT urban remix. Half a*s don't cut it anymore. This industry you have to be on point period. You can't afford a stutter anywhere, and she does consistently seem to mess it up. If it were up to her, the awful second single choices from her previous two albums never would have happened.
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Post by sundaymorningguy on Feb 23, 2014 18:28:31 GMT -5
I think the problem for me is I know the record industry has changed, but I feel like Mariah hasn't tried to get any of her eras aside from TEOM off to the right start. I feel so much wasted potential post-Butterfly. It pisses me off because I know she is better than that, and I feel like sometimes she has tried to get things off to the right start and it has worked, and sometimes she has fcuked it up so much that it is obvious it is her fault. Her post career I feel lies on her shoulders. I think she has had support from her label up til this point, and she hasn't made it work for her. She needs to do a reassessment of her career. I am tired of half a**sed work from her. Everything needs to be on point for it to work. Her videos are a joke, and I mean a damn joke. Her remixes have really gone down hill minus the WBT urban remix. Half a*s don't cut it anymore. This industry you have to be on point period. You can't afford a stutter anywhere, and she does consistently seem to mess it up. If it were up to her, the awful second single choices from her previous two albums never would have happened. That is hindsight though, I wonder how honest she is being there. I mean if she was that against it then I don't think we would have gotten videos. I think if she was that aware, after it messed up with E=MC^2 she would have been her own boss. I think what doesn't jive well with that explanation is that given that her second singles have killed her momentum, and if she knows how important it is, she knows better than to come with a You're Mine.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 18:36:00 GMT -5
If it were up to her, the awful second single choices from her previous two albums never would have happened. That is hindsight though, I wonder how honest she is being there. I mean if she was that against it then I don't think we would have gotten videos. I think if she was that aware, after it messed up with E=MC^2 she would have been her own boss. She was always pushing for "Migrate". LA Reid changed it after she performed it on SNL and it didn't get the reaction they wanted. It also wouldn't be the first time Mariah shot a video for a song she wasn't crazy about. If she's on a major label, she still has label execs to please. If she wants to put up a stink and refuse to do things, that creates friction that she doesn't need if she wants them to make her a priority.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Feb 23, 2014 21:16:42 GMT -5
I think the problem for me is I know the record industry has changed, but I feel like Mariah hasn't tried to get any of her eras aside from TEOM off to the right start. I feel so much wasted potential post-Butterfly. It pisses me off because I know she is better than that, and I feel like sometimes she has tried to get things off to the right start and it has worked, and sometimes she has fcuked it up so much that it is obvious it is her fault. Her post career I feel lies on her shoulders. I think she has had support from her label up til this point, and she hasn't made it work for her. She needs to do a reassessment of her career. I am tired of half a**sed work from her. Everything needs to be on point for it to work. Her videos are a joke, and I mean a damn joke. Her remixes have really gone down hill minus the WBT urban remix. Half a*s don't cut it anymore. This industry you have to be on point period. You can't afford a stutter anywhere, and she does consistently seem to mess it up. E=MC2 was set up fantastically. "Touch My Body" was a #1 hit, and Mariah had been on MTV, SNL, etc. When the album dropped she did those fantastic MTV spots (the clips of songs with live instruments, as well as those commercials with Snoop as the voice of her dog). She also did Oprah's show and was a mentor on American Idol and performed. The album then had her biggest opening sales week ever. So, the set-up was there. Her quickie marriage combined with the failure of "Bye Bye" killed the album. If it were up to her, the awful second single choices from her previous two albums never would have happened. That is hindsight though, I wonder how honest she is being there. I mean if she was that against it then I don't think we would have gotten videos. I think if she was that aware, after it messed up with E=MC^2 she would have been her own boss. Agreed. I could be wrong, but I just don't buy that she didn't approve of the 2nd singles at all. Mariah has too much control of her career at this point for that to be true. Hell, she released "Triumphant" and "The Art of Letting Go" despite the label not wanting them released; that shows her control, for one, but also her poor idea of what works in the current market.
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