Billboard Hot 100 : 12/05/2015

[Leaf]

Question: When is a song that never charted, or charted for less than 5 weeks for example, considered recurrent and not allowed to enter below the top 50 (or without enough increasing metrics)?

[rimetm]

Nov 23, 2015 16:16:45 GMT -5 Leaf said:

Question: When is a song that never charted, or charted for less than 5 weeks for example, considered recurrent and not allowed to enter below the top 50 (or without enough increasing metrics)?

I believe it's once it reaches 2 years old. However, songs can buck the trend (i.e. Come With Me Now, La La La) if they never received promotion in the U.S. until the point that it's poised to enter.

[Deleted]

yeah it really depends on promotion and circumstance. the Hot 100 was/is created/intended to be an industry tool, first and foremost... which is why the old recurrent rule was put in place when it was... and now this new one. it's not supposed to be a passive, whatever charts, charts type of thing. streaming has clearly made it possible for some passive songs to overstay their welcome, imo.  It's supposed to represent and track new, current, and actively promoted songs... and that's a fact... exceptions are made and time changes certain rules and things accordingly, which is good enough for me.

[badrobot]

I realize I can just go to Billboard, but I miss the articles being posted here -- or am I blind and I missed it?

[YourFaveIsAFlop]

Nov 23, 2015 16:33:01 GMT -5 @broccoli said:

yeah it really depends on promotion and circumstance. the Hot 100 was/is created/intended to be an industry tool, first and foremost... which is why the old recurrent rule was put in place when it was... and now this new one. it's not supposed to be a passive, whatever charts, charts type of thing. streaming has clearly made it possible for some passive songs to overstay their welcome, imo.  It's supposed to represent and track new, current, and actively promoted songs... and that's a fact... exceptions are made and time changes certain rules and things accordingly, which is good enough for me.

It's not an active vs. passive streaming thing.

It's the fact that the demo that uses streaming the most listens to the same songs for months at a time.

[Deleted]

well, don't get it twisted. i didn't say it was active/passive streaming listening habits, necessarily. i said streaming has made it possible for more passive songs (not actively being promoted, old, lingering) to overstay their welcome and take up room that new and actively promoted songs are being denied spots on the chart because of it.  I said it's not supposed to be a passive chart, it's an active chart... in ALL metrics.  Just like radio recurrents, etc.  Sales is obviously an exception because it's never a passive metric.

this being said... i'm not convinced it's not an active/passive streaming issue, now that you bring that up again.  people definitely get stuck on  the same songs for months at a time... that's nothing new at all.  that's normal.  but we're talking a year or more here.  

[Spidey]

Nov 23, 2015 16:36:26 GMT -5 badrobot said:

I realize I can just go to Billboard, but I miss the articles being posted here -- or am I blind and I missed it?

Adele Tops Hot 100 for Fourth Week; Justin Bieber, Alessia Cara Hit Top 10

'Hello' leads again, with record-breaking sales for parent album '25' expected. Plus, Bieber scores a third top five from 'Purpose' and Cara's 'Here' also hits the top 10.

Adele's "Hello" tops the Billboard Hot 100 (dated Dec. 5) for a fourth week, helping set the stage for what could be record-breaking sales for parent album 25.

Meanwhile, Justin Bieber scores a third Hot 100 top 10 from his new Billboard 200 No. 1 Purpose with the set's "Love Yourself," arriving as one of three songs from the album in this week's top 10. He also joins haughty company with three concurrent Hot 100 top five hits and makes further history (read on).

Plus, Alessia Cara's debut hit "Here" also reaches the Hot 100's top 10 and Missy Elliott zooms into the top 25 with her comeback single, "WTF."

As always every Monday, let's run down the Hot 100's top 10 and beyond. Highlights of the airplay/sales/streaming-based Hot 100 post on Billboard.com each Monday, with all charts updated each Tuesday.

"Hello," the first single from Adele's third studio album, 25, released Friday (Nov. 20) on XL/Columbia Records, spends a fourth week atop Digital Songs and Streaming Songs and a second week at No. 1 on Radio Songs.

It holds at No. 1 on Digital Songs with 327,000 downloads sold (down 32 percent) in the week ending Nov. 19, according to Nielsen Music. Following its record debut week (1.11 million sold) and three subsequent frames, "Hello" has sold 2,555,000 downloads in its first four weeks.

"Hello" holds atop Streaming Songs with 34.7 million U.S. streams, down 23 percent. The song is just the second to link four consecutive weeks of at least 30 million domestic streams; Baauer's "Harlem Shake" first did so for four frames in 2013 (heavily driven by user-generated videos featuring the song's official audio).

The ballad remains the most-heard song on U.S. radio, leading Radio Songs with a 13 percent increase to 160 million all-format audience impressions (and earning top Airplay Gainer honors on the Hot 100 for a third week). As reported last week, when the track bounded 6-1 on Radio Songs in its fourth week, it became the fastest-rising No. 1 on the list in 22 years.

Helping fuel the radio rule of "Hello" this week: two more coronations on Billboard format airplay charts. As previously reported, it jumps 4-1 on the Pop Songs radio airplay chart and 3-1 on Adult Pop Songs, making a record-setting rise to No. 1 in its fifth week on the latter ranking.

All the action for "Hello" is helping power what appears to be a record-breaking sales week for 25, which is headed toward what is shaping up as the biggest one-week total since Nielsen Music began tracking sales in 1991.

Beneath "Hello" on the Hot 100, Bieber's "Sorry" returns to its No. 2 peak (3-2) after launching at No. 2 three weeks ago. The song charges 3-2 on Streaming Songs (26.5 million, up 23 percent, becoming the Hot 100's top Streaming Gainer) and 16-12 on Radio Songs (68 million, up 32 percent), while dropping 2-5 on Digital Songs (82,000, down 46 percent). It also takes over atop the subscription services-based On-Demand Songs chart with 12.9 million on-demand streams, up 35 percent.

"Sorry" is the second single from Bieber's album Purpose, which launches atop the Billboard 200. Lead single "What Do You Mean?" rebounds 6-5 on the Hot 100 after debuting as his first No. 1 on the Sept. 19 chart. Meanwhile, the set's "Love Yourself" blasts onto the Hot 100 at No. 4, starting at No. 2 on Digital Songs (141,000) and No. 5 on Streaming Songs (17.4 million). His new entry is his ninth Hot 100 top 10.

At Nos. 2, 4, and 5, Bieber joins elite company: only two other acts have charted at least three songs in the top five at once: the Beatles, for eight weeks in 1964 (including the entire top five on April 4, 1964), and 50 Cent, for two weeks in 2005. Bieber and the Beatles are the only acts to earn the honor as a lead artist on all three songs.

Bieber makes additional history with a record 17 songs on the Hot 100 simultaneously, passing the mark of 14, previously notched by the Beatles and Drake.

Note that following Bieber's appearance and performance on the American Music Awards last night (Nov. 22), spikes for any artists on the AMAs will be reflected on next week's charts, as this week's charts reflect sales and streams in the week ending Nov. 19.

Of course, there's more than just Adele and Bieber on the Hot 100. Drake's "Hotline Bling" drops to No. 3 from its No. 2 peak. It keeps at No. 2 on Radio Songs (142 million, even from last week); dips 2-3 on Streaming Songs (20.2 million, down 17 percent); and is stationary at No. 4 on Digital Songs (82,000, down 21 percent). It logs a fourth week at No. 1 on Billboard's Hot R&B/Hip-Hop Songs chart and rules Hot Rap Songs for a ninth week.

The Weeknd's former six-week Hot 100 No. 1 "The Hills" descends 4-6; Shawn Mendes' "Stitches" falls 5-7, after peaking at No. 4; Fetty Wap's No. 4-peaking "679," featuring Remy Boyz, slips 7-8; and Swift's "Wildest Dreams" drops 8-9, after reaching No. 5.

Meanwhile, Cara hits the Hot 100's top 10 on her first try with "Here" (11-10). The proud anti-partying anthem bullets at No. 8 on Radio Songs (92 million, up 8 percent); bounds 17-11 on Digital Songs (50,000, up 6 percent); and lifts 18-16 on Streaming Songs (7.8 million, up 7 percent). Concurrently, Cara's debut full-length Know-It-All enters the Billboard 200 at No. 9.

Among action just outside the Hot 100's top 10, Selena Gomez's "Same Old Love" lifts to a new high (14-13) and Missy Elliott's "WTF," featuring Pharrell Williams, blasts 91-22. The current Billboard cover artist notches her highest Hot 100 rank since 2007, when Keyshia Cole's "Let It Go," featuring Elliott and Lil Kim, reached No. 7. She achieves her highest rank as a lead in more than 10 years, since "Lose Control," featuring Ciara and Fat Man Scoop, soared to No. 3. Following its first full week of tracking, "WTF" bows at No. 6 on Digital Songs (69,000) and No. 31 on Streaming Songs (6.1 million).

(Also, note that effective this week, a new "recurrent rule" goes into effect on the Hot 100: descending songs are now removed from the chart if ranking below No. 25 after 52 weeks, as well as if ranking below No. 50 after 20 weeks. Previously only the latter measure was applied.)

Again, visit Billboard.com tomorrow (Nov. 24), when all rankings, including the Hot 100 in its entirety, will refresh, as they do each Tuesday.

Source: www.billboard.com/articles/columns/chart-beat/6770427/adele-tops-hot-100-fourth-week-justin-bieber-alessia-cara

[jtd Thee Stallion]

Nov 23, 2015 16:08:00 GMT -5 jred said:

I f**king hate the new recurrent rule. The Hot 100 is fine as it was.
The only good thing about it is the fact it leaves a few more spots open - perhaps "First" can finally debut?

Probably not because.. you know.. Bieber, One Direction, and Adele are taking over the next few weeks.

[Dylan :)]

I think the new recurrent rule is fine. 52+ weeks isn't exactly common, anyway, compared to 20 weeks

[skizzo]

Loving the new recurrent rule, the dead weight is finally gone.

[Deleted]

Nov 23, 2015 17:02:16 GMT -5 Dylan :) said:

I think the new recurrent rule is fine. 52+ weeks isn't exactly common, anyway, compared to 20 weeks

agreed. somehow some of us don't have a problem with a song that's only 21 weeks old fall off despite still having some really active metrics (sales, for example)... but now that they are removing year old songs that aren't in the top 25... it's this terrible rule.  we all have opinions and to each their own, but i just can't get with that mentality.  it's missing the point behind the Hot 100 entirely.

[forg]

Wow Bieber's 3 top 5 hits at the same time!

I'm okay with the new recurrent role although looks like the the record for longest staying won't be broken anytime soon

[badrobot]

Well one thing the new rule probably means -- the "Radioactive" record probably will stand for a very long time.

I think it's a wise move. Keeps the emphasis on "Hot" in "Hot 100" -- and it may help a few songs get more traction with more chart visibility.

[yuh yuh]

I don't know what to think about that new rule.
The good thing is that the chart will become fresher. But bad thing is, when like Uptown Funk was having to collect more points and to compete with the most successful songs of all time, now it will be deleted and it can't compete anymore..

[KeepDeanWeird]

Nov 23, 2015 17:47:44 GMT -5 badrobot said:

Well one thing the new rule probably means -- the "Radioactive" record probably will stand for a very long time.

I think it's a wise move. Keeps the emphasis on "Hot" in "Hot 100" -- and it may help a few songs get more traction with more chart visibility.

Yes Radioactive will be safely have that record. I'm glad they are flushing out old songs - that was my TQ (and others) argument last week - streaming was propping songs that should have disappeared from H100 a lot sooner. What is odd is Top 25 - a metric that has never been significant for H100 or Album charts. (Nobody says 'Top 25 hit.' I would've gone with Top 30, but it will be interesting to see the chart action between 25-50 following the Biebs, Adele and the holidays.

[MTSChart21]

Nov 23, 2015 16:08:00 GMT -5 jred said:

I f**king hate the new recurrent rule. The Hot 100 is fine as it was.
The only good thing about it is the fact it leaves a few more spots open - perhaps "First" can finally debut?

What is the rule though? And is Thinking Out Loud gone?

[Spidey]

I have always had mixed feelings on the recurrent rules. But at the end of the day, the purpose of the Hot 100 is to be an industry tool for record labels. They care more about what releases they are actively promoting, then a song from over a year ago.

[lyhom]

Nov 23, 2015 18:07:36 GMT -5 MTSChart21 said:

Nov 23, 2015 16:08:00 GMT -5 jred said:

I f**king hate the new recurrent rule. The Hot 100 is fine as it was.
The only good thing about it is the fact it leaves a few more spots open - perhaps "First" can finally debut?

What is the rule though? And is Thinking Out Loud gone?

if a song spends 52 weeks or more on the chart, now it will be considered recurrent when it falls below #25 rather than #50.

(and yes, I'd presume that "thinking out loud" will be out)

[Gary]

5 songs in history have spent 68 weeks or longer on the Hot 100

Radioactive, Sail, I'm Yours, How Do I Live and Party Rock Anthem

Under new rules all would have been bumped off to recurrent at 52 weeks EXCEPT Radioactive who would have lasted another 15 weeks.

[erzo01]

How about coming up with a Comprehensive 100 charts which ranks the true top 100 songs of the week, be they current/recurrent/gold? Notice that I dropped the word "Hot".

Also, I wonder how this new recurrent rule will affect all-time rankings now that "newer" songs won't have the benefit of additional weeks. Although come of think of it older songs don't have the benefit of additional weeks because they didn't have streaming factored in during their Hot 100 stint.

Thinking out loud here.

[KeepDeanWeird]

I was looking at random charts through 2015 and, honestly, except for last week's H100, which featured three songs with 52 or more weeks, (two which hit 52 two weeks ago), very few songs would've been purged during the past chart year under the recurrent rule. The closest song one will be TQ when it hits 44 this week, so it's got another two months to hover around for us.

[Au$tin]

There's absolutely nothing wrong with the recurrent rule. The chart is adjusting itself with the changing music climate. Streaming is making songs chart longer than ever, and to help combat that, the recurrent limit cuts back a bit. It's no different than the changing recurrent rules on Mediabase.

I personally don't agree with having recurrent rules in the first place, but if they insist of having them in a chart, then it's best to keep them changing with the changing climate of the music industry. Not doing so leaves the chart outdated.

Also, as many posters have pointed out, it's not exactly common for songs to spend a full year on the chart anyway. Even with songs staying on for really long periods of time now, it's still not that common. It probably only affects 1-2 songs per year.

[Gary]

Longest running songs Hot 100 > 52 weeks


Weeks Title, Artist
87 Radioactive, Imagine Dragons
79 Sail, AWOLNATION
76 I'm Yours, Jason Mraz
69 How Do I Live, LeAnn Rimes  
68 Counting Stars, OneRepublic
68 Party Rock Anthem, LMFAO Featuring Lauren Bennett & GoonRock
65 Foolish Games/You Were Meant For Me, Jewel  
65 Rolling In The Deep, Adele
64 Before He Cheats, Carrie Underwood  
62 Ho Hey, The Lumineers
62 You And Me, Lifehouse  
61 Demons, Imagine Dragons
60 Macarena (Bayside Boys Mix), Los Del Rio  
60 Need You Now, Lady Antebellum
59 All Of Me, John Legend
59 Somebody That I Used To Know, Gotye Featuring Kimbra
58 How To Save A Life, The Fray  
58 Smooth, Santana Featuring Rob Thomas  
58 Thinking Out Loud, Ed Sheeran
57 Dark Horse, Katy Perry Featuring Juicy J
57 Higher, Creed  
57 Lights, Ellie Goulding
57 Use Somebody, Kings Of Leon
56 I Don't Want To Wait, Paula Cole  
56 I Gotta Feeling, The Black Eyed Peas
56 Some Nights, fun.
56 The Way You Love Me, Faith Hill  
55 Amazed, Lonestar  
55 Barely Breathing, Duncan Sheik  
55 Missing, Everything But The Girl  
54 Cruise, Florida Georgia Line Featuring Nelly
54 December 1963 (Oh, What A Night), Four Seasons  
54 Hanging By A Moment, Lifehouse  
54 Hey, Soul Sister, Train
54 Stay With Me, Sam Smith
54 Unwell, matchbox twenty  
53 Breathe, Faith Hill  
53 Drops Of Jupiter (Tell Me), Train  
53 If I Die Young, The Band Perry
53 Kryptonite, 3 Doors Down  
53 Pompeii, Bastille
53 Shut Up And Dance, WALK THE MOON
53 Too Close, Next  
53 Uptown Funk!, Mark Ronson Featuring Bruno Mars
53 Wake Me Up!, Avicii

[jred]

Nov 23, 2015 19:26:17 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

There's absolutely nothing wrong with the recurrent rule. The chart is adjusting itself with the changing music climate. Streaming is making songs chart longer than ever, and to help combat that, the recurrent limit cuts back a bit. It's no different than the changing recurrent rules on Mediabase.

I personally don't agree with having recurrent rules in the first place, but if they insist of having them in a chart, then it's best to keep them changing with the changing climate of the music industry. Not doing so leaves the chart outdated.

Also, as many posters have pointed out, it's not exactly common for songs to spend a full year on the chart anyway. Even with songs staying on for really long periods of time now, it's still not that common. It probably only affects 1-2 songs per year.

You have a good point, but the bolded is a bit of an understatement - it affects three songs that were on the chart just last week.

[lyhom]

for the record, on the canadian charts, justin bieber has had all 18 songs from his album chart, and he currently has four songs in the top 10 ("Sorry", "Love Yourself", "What Do You Mean?", and "I'll Show You")

source

[Au$tin]

Nov 23, 2015 20:18:26 GMT -5 jred said:

Nov 23, 2015 19:26:17 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

There's absolutely nothing wrong with the recurrent rule. The chart is adjusting itself with the changing music climate. Streaming is making songs chart longer than ever, and to help combat that, the recurrent limit cuts back a bit. It's no different than the changing recurrent rules on Mediabase.

I personally don't agree with having recurrent rules in the first place, but if they insist of having them in a chart, then it's best to keep them changing with the changing climate of the music industry. Not doing so leaves the chart outdated.

Also, as many posters have pointed out, it's not exactly common for songs to spend a full year on the chart anyway. Even with songs staying on for really long periods of time now, it's still not that common. It probably only affects 1-2 songs per year.

You have a good point, but the bolded is a bit of an understatement - it affects three songs that were on the chart just last week.

The fact that there were a lot at one point is probably what prompted Billboard to make the change in the first place. It's a chart anomaly to have three year-long sitters at once, not the norm at all. Given any point in the year, you're not going to find them as often as there was this week.

For instance, going back to a random week in August, I can see that no song was over a year old and the three longest sitters were of course the same three that were affected this week. Go back to a random week in June, there is yet again no year-long chart sitter. Go back to a random week in April, it appears that Sam Smith's "Stay with Me" would have been removed the week it was #49 (literally two spots away from being removed on the old recurrent rule anyway, only two weeks before it actually went recurrent). Go back to a random week in January, once again no year-long chart sitter and the oldest is still "Stay with Me" at 41 weeks.

It appears that the majority of the big hits just simply don't make it to 52 weeks anyway.

[rimetm]

So, the following ended their run (relatively) recently:

2013
Cruise
Ho Hey
Lights
Some Nights
Somebody That I Used to Know
Too Close

2014
Counting Stars
Dark Horse
Demons
Pompeii
Radioactive
Sail
Wake Me Up

2015
All of Me
Stay With Me
Shut Up and Dance
Thinking Out Loud
Uptown Funk

11% of all year-longers were in this year, and 40% were in the past 3 years (aka when on-demand and then streaming had their effect). I totally understand the reasoning behind adding the rule.

[MTSChart21]

Nov 23, 2015 18:51:59 GMT -5 lyhom said:

Nov 23, 2015 18:07:36 GMT -5 MTSChart21 said:

What is the rule though? And is Thinking Out Loud gone?

if a song spends 52 weeks or more on the chart, now it will be considered recurrent when it falls below #25 rather than #50.

(and yes, I'd presume that "thinking out loud" will be out)

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! But anyways, not being biased about TOL but, I dont like this idea. It is rare to have a song spend 52 or more weeks on the chart, so a song should be able to have the longevity as long as it is above the top 50.

[forg]

I like the idea of Comprehensive Top 100 with no recurrent rules but I doubt Billboard will bother

[Ravi]

One of the reasons I follow the charts is the thrill of seeing records being broken. By going for this new recurrent rule, Billboard has practically taken one major record out of the equation.

So What's next? A song with 10 weeks on #1 will go recurrent to make place for other new songs?

The older songs hanging around should have told Billboard that streaming is over-weighed compared to other chart components. It should have reduced the weightage of streaming and probably increased the weightage of sales (as it is declining year-after-year). That would have taken care of the "problem" Billboard was facing.