Eqbk
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Post by Eqbk on Dec 21, 2019 12:00:18 GMT -5
Yikes at some of the hot takes in this thread. Do people have the capacity to change? Of course, but that change has to be openly demonstrated through actions. If she really changed as a person, others wouldn't have to give her the benefit of the doubt, go through all these mental gymnastics, or even go as far as to expose themselves as supposedly reformed bigots in order to defend her.
It's especially true in a case like this. It's not just about her hateful words, it's about the intensity and frequency of which she said them. This isn't just a case of a teenager trying to be edgy and saying a few stupid remarks. There is a mound of evidence of extremely racist, sexist, and xenophobic behavior. She basically hit almost all the squares in bigot bingo. She's the type of virulently hateful, almost cartoonish level of bigot, that other bigots point to and say, "see this is a real example of racism/sexism/xenophobia, I'm not a racist/sexist/xenophobe."
The level of hate and bigotry she demonstrated in those posts is not something you can simply brush off and simply grow out of. It is something a person has to actively try to fight to rid themselves of. None of her actions so far (including her bs apology) have demonstrated that she has. Again, if she truly changed, people wouldn't feel the need to go through all these mental gymnastics to defend her but there's no clear cut evidence of her change so people have to grasp at whatever they can.
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Ivy Leegue™
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Post by Ivy Leegue™ on Dec 21, 2019 14:44:32 GMT -5
I am almost at my wit's end with this fake outrage I have been seeing. Don't make me ask for receipts from every conversation you have had with your friends or s**t you have posted, knowingly or unknowingly. Furthermore, I don't want to see ANYONE here insisting on branding Camila a "racist" while bopping along to Ariana Blackface Grande, Miley "I used Black Culture when it suited me but the MILLISECOND it didn't, I was quick to s**t openly on a whole Black artform" Cyrus, or geeking out over f**king Disney Plus, with its RICH history of horrifically racist and stereotypical cartoons. There are few things I despise more in this world than hypocrisy. Also, it is convenient that I have yet to see any posts about the actual positive stuff that Camila has done for minorities since she has become famous. ENOUGH. WITH. THE. bulls**t. Are you Black? I am. Any further questions? |
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kierz7
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Post by kierz7 on Dec 21, 2019 14:48:08 GMT -5
I am. Any further questions? You are? LMFAO. 😂🤣😂 Whew, Chile. You can’t make this sh*t up. |
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nardy08
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Post by nardy08 on Dec 21, 2019 15:00:34 GMT -5
Look, I can't pretend to view this from the eyes of the black community. As others stated, my opinion really is moot here since the words / attack wasn't targeted at me. However, as a gay man, I have had to think about artists / celebrities who have had stuff "resurface" and/or who have made blatant homophobic comments. In those instances, some I feel have given genuine apologies / taken actions (Eminem, 50 Cent, Tracy Morgan, Iggy Azalea) and then there are some who I think gave a "save face" apology and really haven't changed / I haven't changed my views on them due to little to no action I consider worthwhile (Chris Brown, Kevin Hart, Isaiah Washington, Beenie Man, Common, Azealia Banks). There are tons of examples here. My point is this, I try to look at how somebody grows from that incident and then decide if I want to give them another chance. Camila frankly needs to do more than just the "save face" apology. IDC when this was posted or how old she was. 14 year olds still know the power of the internet. I hope she has grown, I hope she continues to grow, and frankly, only she can show the world through her actions if she's sincere or not. Time will tell. Whew. Ya’ll are always mentioning the fact that you’re “Gay” as if that has anything to do with the blatant ass racism displayed by another individual. • The fight is NOT the same. • The plight of Black people is NOT the same to that of Gay people. • The struggles that Black people face is NOT the same and not to be compared with the struggles faced by Gay Men, especially “non-Black” Gay men. I'm sorry, you've spoken a lot of truths but i've gotta stop you on this one. Gay people have it bad, homophobia is bad and the struggles and fight can work parallel to one another without being the same. I'm assuming you are Gay yourself. |
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Ivy Leegue™
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Post by Ivy Leegue™ on Dec 21, 2019 15:02:02 GMT -5
I am. Any further questions? You are? LMFAO. 😂🤣😂 Whew, Chile. You can’t make this sh*t up. Not sure what you find so funny, but you know literally NOTHING about me. So, I suggest you be very careful and steer clear of personal attacks. You are a nobody to me and will remain as such. Bye now! |
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kierz7
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Post by kierz7 on Dec 21, 2019 15:07:28 GMT -5
You are? LMFAO. 😂🤣😂 Whew, Chile. You can’t make this sh*t up. Not sure what you find so funny, but you know literally NOTHING about me. So, I suggest you be very careful and steer clear of personal attacks. You are a nobody to me and will remain as such. Bye now! You know exactly what it is that I find funny, hence why you’ve presumed that it was a “personal attack”. I’m going to leave that though, Sweetheart. 😉 Everyone on this forum is a “nobody” to each-other so I’m not sure what you thought it is you were doing there. |
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kierz7
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Post by kierz7 on Dec 21, 2019 15:10:58 GMT -5
Whew. Ya’ll are always mentioning the fact that you’re “Gay” as if that has anything to do with the blatant ass racism displayed by another individual. • The fight is NOT the same. • The plight of Black people is NOT the same to that of Gay people. • The struggles that Black people face is NOT the same and not to be compared with the struggles faced by Gay Men, especially “non-Black” Gay men. I'm sorry, you've spoken a lot of truths but i've gotta stop you on this one. Gay people have it bad, homophobia is bad and the struggles and fight can work parallel to one another without being the same. I'm assuming you are Gay yourself. You’re right in a sense. They can. However, I just got irritated by the fact that in another conversation about “race” and “racism towards Black people”, someone else is yet again trying to make complete comparisons to that of the plight of Gay people and the prejudices they face. In this context, it’s not needed, if even for the sake of their own understanding, because we’re not speaking on LGBT issues. I am Gay, but I’m a Black Man first and foremost and that’s how I’ll always be viewed. My sexuality is literally secondary. |
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popwizard
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Post by popwizard on Dec 21, 2019 16:29:18 GMT -5
These weren’t new, they were discovered around the time she popped up on x factor and first started getting fans. It’s just nobody cared then. I think she apologized when they originally surfaced too. I think some of these were posted when she was younger than 14/15. At one point she posted about seeing her old posts and realizing they were sketchy but leaving it up anyway because it was “nostalgic” for her to remember the fun times when she was younger... or something like that. I know a llot of middle school kids think stuff like that is funny. And she’s very well might have grown since then. But still, it’s just... I don’t know if I’ll ever really trust her.. She’s never seemed very sincerely regretful to me. Like she gets it on a surface level and knows what to say but... eh. Won’t make a bit of difference to her career IMO. It will blow over soon enough. But it will live on in Stan wars FOREVER. What she apologized for were her repeated use of the n-word on her Twitter account. That’s separate from what was uncovered on her Tumblr most recently for the first time. I think it’s interesting that people just want this to blow over. Is the concern more for the career success of a mediocre pop-star, rather than the young and impressionable fans that look up to her, especially her black fans (which she does have) that now have to reconcile the fact that their idol has belittled them in the past because of their race? |
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Ivy Leegue™
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Post by Ivy Leegue™ on Dec 21, 2019 16:48:09 GMT -5
Is it possible for Cry For Me to be a single since it was already a promo track? I forget how these things work but I think it would work.
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Ty
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Post by Ty on Dec 21, 2019 16:59:06 GMT -5
Is it possible for Cry For Me to be a single since it was already a promo track? I forget how these things work but I think it would work. It might, though out of the promo tracks it seems to be the least favored one based off streaming and iTunes numbers. Unless it's used in some hit advertisement/movie, or it magically blow up on TikTok, which is possible, or this is Camila's personal favorite and her team affords another "Consequences" type of situation, its chance to become a legit single is slim. |
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Lumi
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Post by Lumi on Dec 21, 2019 19:06:23 GMT -5
Even if its made a single, it definitely won't smash. I think there's a few good single choices left on the album like "Should've Said It" and "This Love" (aside from "My Oh My"), but I feel like they should end the era after "My Oh My" and the tour and she should take a few years off.
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kierz7
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Post by kierz7 on Dec 21, 2019 20:22:52 GMT -5
These weren’t new, they were discovered around the time she popped up on x factor and first started getting fans. It’s just nobody cared then. I think she apologized when they originally surfaced too. I think some of these were posted when she was younger than 14/15. At one point she posted about seeing her old posts and realizing they were sketchy but leaving it up anyway because it was “nostalgic” for her to remember the fun times when she was younger... or something like that. I know a llot of middle school kids think stuff like that is funny. And she’s very well might have grown since then. But still, it’s just... I don’t know if I’ll ever really trust her.. She’s never seemed very sincerely regretful to me. Like she gets it on a surface level and knows what to say but... eh. Won’t make a bit of difference to her career IMO. It will blow over soon enough. But it will live on in Stan wars FOREVER. What she apologized for were her repeated use of the n-word on her Twitter account. That’s separate from what was uncovered on her Tumblr most recently for the first time. I think it’s interesting that people just want this to blow over. Is the concern more for the career success of a mediocre pop-star, rather than the young and impressionable fans that look up to her, especially her black fans (which she does have) that now have to reconcile the fact that their idol has belittled them in the past because of their race? Exactly! Don’t be too hard on them though. One of her ALLEGED “Black” fans above thinks this is all B.S and the backlash isn’t needed, because she was a ‘young teenager’, and should easily be forgiven just as much and just as quick. There’s always one, or should I say a few. What was uncovered on her Twitter was/is deplorable but let us forget about it as it was almost a decade ago and she’s surely changed since then! 🤷🏿♀️ |
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Lumi
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Post by Lumi on Dec 21, 2019 20:53:42 GMT -5
What she apologized for were her repeated use of the n-word on her Twitter account. That’s separate from what was uncovered on her Tumblr most recently for the first time. I think it’s interesting that people just want this to blow over. Is the concern more for the career success of a mediocre pop-star, rather than the young and impressionable fans that look up to her, especially her black fans (which she does have) that now have to reconcile the fact that their idol has belittled them in the past because of their race? Exactly! Don’t be too hard on them though. One of her ALLEGED “Black” fans above thinks this is all B.S and the backlash isn’t needed, because she was a ‘young teenager’, and should easily be forgiven just as much and just as quick. There’s always one, or should I say a few. What was uncovered on her Twitter was/is deplorable but let us forget about it as it was almost a decade ago and she’s surely changed since then! 🤷🏿♀️ I know you didn't just put quotations around the word black as if they're lying... I- |
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Ivy Leegue™
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Post by Ivy Leegue™ on Dec 21, 2019 22:18:29 GMT -5
I know you didn't just put quotations around the word black as if they're lying... I- Sure the f**k did! I already asked to avoid personal attacks and...here we are, actually challenging someone's Blackness, which is HIGHLY offensive, disrespectful, and disgusting. |
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tinawina
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Post by tinawina on Dec 21, 2019 23:07:14 GMT -5
These weren’t new, they were discovered around the time she popped up on x factor and first started getting fans. It’s just nobody cared then. I think she apologized when they originally surfaced too. I think some of these were posted when she was younger than 14/15. At one point she posted about seeing her old posts and realizing they were sketchy but leaving it up anyway because it was “nostalgic” for her to remember the fun times when she was younger... or something like that. I know a llot of middle school kids think stuff like that is funny. And she’s very well might have grown since then. But still, it’s just... I don’t know if I’ll ever really trust her.. She’s never seemed very sincerely regretful to me. Like she gets it on a surface level and knows what to say but... eh. Won’t make a bit of difference to her career IMO. It will blow over soon enough. But it will live on in Stan wars FOREVER. What she apologized for were her repeated use of the n-word on her Twitter account. That’s separate from what was uncovered on her Tumblr most recently for the first time. I think it’s interesting that people just want this to blow over. Is the concern more for the career success of a mediocre pop-star, rather than the young and impressionable fans that look up to her, especially her black fans (which she does have) that now have to reconcile the fact that their idol has belittled them in the past because of their race? I could have sworn I had heard of a tumblr account before, but maybe it was just old twitter posts. Thanks for the correct info. A lot of her black Stans likely already made their peace with it because this is not her first ride at the racist rodeo. And I mean, Chris Brown had been a misogynist ball of rage for years and still has plenty of fans. It took R Kelly DECADES to finally see a negative impact on his career and there was VIDEO OF HIM MOLESTING TEENS. People tell themselves whatever they have to tell themselves so they don’t have to give up what they love. We see examples of this phenomenon all aound us every day. The biggest one is President. Heh. Plus I do think a lot of people remember doing crappy stuff when younger and can identify with the nightmare of everyone finding out about those things they used to do. I get that. All I know is FOR ME it’s hard to believe someone who did this over and over and over again. If she really had just shared a couple of questionable memes when she was 13 that would be one thing, but who does that kind of stuff for years and years in multiple platforms all the damn time and isn’t just really hateful? Yes she could have changed, but still... hiring some rent a rappers, wearing a black lives matter t shirt and making nice with the black girl in your old group now that you don’t have to work with her anymore is not really impressive considering the depths from which she sunk at one point. But I don’t know the girl so anything’s possible I guess. |
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🇯🇲 dollybaby 🇯🇲
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Post by 🇯🇲 dollybaby 🇯🇲 on Dec 21, 2019 23:26:35 GMT -5
I was gonna post this video, but you beat me to it! I remember reading the US Weekly interview with Normani talking about how Camilla fans had bullied her with racial epithets and threats of lynching...all because she had described Camila as being "quirky" and "cute". What was so offensive about calling Camilla "quirky" and "cute"? It really broke my heart to read what Normani had went through because of that. She's so talented and she's definitely my fave member from the group, by far! "Motivation" still slays! I think she's much better off as a solo artist where she can get her own shine. It was nice that the other group members had spoke up and showed Normani support. |
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Lumi
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Post by Lumi on Dec 22, 2019 0:31:32 GMT -5
Normani has gone through so much undeserved sh*t. I don't understand why Lauren stans and Camila stans etc all send disgusting comments towards her when they were fans of Fifth Harmony? Stan culture is a whole mess.
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Post by thegreatdivine on Dec 22, 2019 7:30:37 GMT -5
I hope this brings an end to her basic career. She's one of the most overrated singers of the past few years whose hype simply doesn't match up to actual talent.
People will eventually move on from this, but I imagine it'll damage her career a lot more than some people think. Her solo career has already been pretty uneventful save for two major hit singles. Romance will flop like it deserves to and the GP will move on from her.
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Post by violentdreams on Dec 22, 2019 8:11:37 GMT -5
I hope this brings an end to her basic career. She's one of the most overrated singers of the past few years whose hype simply doesn't match up to actual talent. People will eventually move on from this, but I imagine it'll damage her career a lot more than some people think. Her solo career has already been pretty uneventful save for two major hit singles. Romance will flop like it deserves to and the GP will move on from her. I'm inclined to agree. I think if this was another pop girl, people would be willing to give her the benefit of the doubt as just an edgy teenager who grew up, but Camila already had a very shady history in regards to racial insensitivity (towards her own group member, no less). Combine that with the fact that she has no real sizable fanbase and a lot of people who already hate her due to the circumstances in which she left 5H, plus a flop sophomore album that even her own fans didn't really enjoy, and that puts her in a pretty terrible position. Because of all of this, I would not be shocked if the Romance era is the last mainstream era she has and she spends the rest of her career getting no hits and consistently selling >50k with her albums. |
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Franck
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Post by Franck on Dec 22, 2019 17:52:42 GMT -5
Her apology is obviously a PR move (why didn't she delete these accounts before ?). The craziest thing is how much she was INVESTED into these racist posts. it's just so weird and pathetic.
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divasummer
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Post by divasummer on Dec 22, 2019 17:54:28 GMT -5
This whole thread is a mess.
Go out into a community and see what's going on and talk it out with different people/races.
Not on the Pulse Board. lol This is barely even real life.
Go out and do something about it and just not whine here.
Feed the homeless, talk to pregnant teen mothers who need some help. Talk to someone who looks lost on the street, talk to an Arabic person who needs help and no one will talk to them. Do anything but complain on the Pulse Board which is turning into a tired Twitter war. Sorry.
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itsaboutart
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Post by itsaboutart on Dec 22, 2019 20:26:04 GMT -5
This whole thread is a mess. Go out into a community and see what's going on and talk it out with different people/races. Not on the Pulse Board. lol This is barely even real life. Go out and do something about it and just not whine here. Feed the homeless, talk to pregnant teen mothers who need some help. Talk to someone who looks lost on the street, talk to an Arabic person who needs help and no one will talk to them. Do anything but complain on the Pulse Board which is turning into a tired Twitter war. Sorry. Why don’t u go and do all of those things since u want to preach about them. I absolutely will use my civic right and call out racism when I see it. Iggy azalea got destroyed for her slavery reference in her rap, why should Camila get no consequences at all. U don’t get to create a tumblr of hate and issue one basic apology and think it’s all good. |
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leonagwen
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Post by leonagwen on Dec 22, 2019 22:28:38 GMT -5
Not too many female singers can say that they have 2 songs that were as huge as Havana and Senorita.
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Post by thegreatdivine on Dec 22, 2019 23:05:23 GMT -5
Not too many female singers can say that they have 2 songs that were as huge as Havana and Senorita. Not too many female singers can say that they dedicated their entire time as teenagers into posting and sharing harmful, disgusting ideas of black people, either. |
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Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ
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Post by Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ on Dec 22, 2019 23:10:02 GMT -5
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Ivy Leegue™
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Post by Ivy Leegue™ on Dec 22, 2019 23:11:26 GMT -5
Now that I have spun the whole album a bunch of times, I can see why they threw Liar out to the public. It's definitely a bop and I love the production, especially the end. All of the producers put in serious work on this album. Some of the best pop production I have heard all year.
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Post by thegreatdivine on Dec 22, 2019 23:27:49 GMT -5
It'll be interesting watching her and her team try to salvage whatever else is left of this era. |
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crdubb17
Gold Member
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Post by crdubb17 on Dec 23, 2019 0:34:12 GMT -5
This whole thread is a mess. Go out into a community and see what's going on and talk it out with different people/races. Not on the Pulse Board. lol This is barely even real life. Go out and do something about it and just not whine here. Feed the homeless, talk to pregnant teen mothers who need some help. Talk to someone who looks lost on the street, talk to an Arabic person who needs help and no one will talk to them. Do anything but complain on the Pulse Board which is turning into a tired Twitter war. Sorry. Sorry? Lol. Hmmm. Although I don't care for some of the bickering, I'm grateful for the deeper discussion that has come about through this board and through social media. This s**t is real stuff, and it's deeper than Camila. I initially thought this would be something that would wash away (and maybe it will with time), but I don't think this is something that people will ever forget. It's bigger than Camila, and I think it's been educational for a lot of people (me included as a black gay man). Camila (and others who think like her) get an opportunity to hear directly from the people she directed her racism and insensitivity towards. It's interesting because I don't think I've ever witnessed anything like this before. I hope she's able to sift through the vitriol and really learn something of value from this experience. |
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Lumi
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I feel so sad, you should be sad
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Post by Lumi on Dec 23, 2019 1:35:07 GMT -5
"My Oh My" is stil gaining 2mil + streams everyday! Also I agree with Ivy Leegue™ said. The production on this album is INCREDIBLE. I get chills every time listening to "Shameless", "Bad Kind Of Butterflies" and "Used To This" are a few examples. They really did their work |
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Ty
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Post by Ty on Dec 23, 2019 2:13:42 GMT -5
This is a good album in the technical aspects (save vocal production). She has the best songwriting and production team among pop girls. Props to them. But Camila herself never comes across to me as a genuine person like Carly, Dua or Tove, who make you feel like they do care about whatever they talk about. Her whole campaign, which tries to shove her down my throat, isn't helping either. I have the same bias when it comes to Halsey, but I think she has improved a lot recently.
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