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Post by The Music Man on Jun 3, 2005 20:38:35 GMT -5
Yep, the Jack format has spread to two new cities, one of which is in the biggest market of all. WCBS/NYC flipped from Oldies to 101.1 JackFM this afternoon, kicking off with the Beastie Boys, "Fight For Your Right". Quite an interesting jolt from Oldies. Also, WJMK/Chicago made the move to Jack.
One question about the NYC move, though. 'CBS is an Infinity station. WNEW is a total disaster, and is has a format that has little mainstream appeal, and the ratings show it. So why didn't they flip it? I can see why they might have wanted to kill off the Oldies format first, given its demographics versus Mix's, but still...
Also, WMAX/Chattanooga flipped from 80's to 97.3 MaxFM, pretty much the same format as all of the other Jack stations.
We now return to our regularly scheduled dormancy...
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Houster
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Post by Houster on Jun 4, 2005 10:35:58 GMT -5
Today's NY Post says that Infinity "insiders" said that they didn't change 102.7 to Jack because they thought it would drain too many listeners from 101.1.
Its the end of an era -- very little 60's music (or for that matter, Elvis) is now being played in New York, and great deejays like "The Morning Mayor" Harry Harrison, Cousin Brucie Morrow, Bill Brown, and Bobby Jay are now gone. As is morning man Micky Dolenz, who was pretty good. All those great deejays gone in one fell swoop.
I will definitely miss the Fab Four at Four.
It wasn't that long ago that everyone in New York knew that "In The Still Of The Night" by the Five Satins was the No. 1 song every year on CBS-FM.
What I do not understand for the life of me is with the senior population growing faster than any other group, why radio advertisers think a format that serves them is not profitable enough (and I am not a senior). Or do they think they will all go to AM talk radio and Lite-FM?
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Marv
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Post by Marv on Jun 5, 2005 23:46:19 GMT -5
I'm sure the folks in Chicago are equally disgusted about losing WJMK morning legend John 'Records' Landecker as well as all of those superstars/legends @ WCBS-FM who were shown the door so abruptly.
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jimmy74747
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Post by jimmy74747 on Jun 6, 2005 8:03:07 GMT -5
WNEW is the biggest mess in radio. Who listens to that?
I'm glad to see a Jack in New York. PLJ has expanded its playlist a bit, becoming a Jack-lite lately, but having that plus Jack defintely helps NY radio.
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oscillations.
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Post by oscillations. on Jun 14, 2005 0:49:04 GMT -5
This is actually tragic and extremely upsetting and controversial among the older crowds. Can't believe this thread isn't longer.
JACK is actually a crap idea...I hate it.
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oscillations.
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Post by oscillations. on Jun 14, 2005 0:51:24 GMT -5
Today's NY Post says that Infinity "insiders" said that they didn't change 102.7 to Jack because they thought it would drain too many listeners from 101.1. Why would the WCBS crowd listen to Jack FM on WNEW? WCBS wouldn't be touched and WNEW could actually do better. They definitely should have done that instead. |
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Slinky
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Post by Slinky on Jun 14, 2005 8:26:43 GMT -5
This is actually tragic and extremely upsetting and controversial among the older crowds. Can't believe this thread isn't longer. JACK is actually a crap idea...I hate it. Why is it a crap idea? I think it's great that stations are expanding their playlists. 1200 songs from the past 30 years, lots of variety, no repeats. How can you go wrong? Jack is the new Oldies format. People may be upset now, but Infinity was looking to the future. CBS-FM was done. They tried to evolve the station into 70's-80's music and it failed. Meanwhile, its audience is aging out of prime demographics. Unless advertisers seriously change what they are looking for, the Oldies format is going to die off in a few years. Mix and K-Rock are in trouble too, but CBS-FM was definitely going to have to change sooner or later. |
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oscillations.
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Post by oscillations. on Jun 14, 2005 16:34:23 GMT -5
This is actually tragic and extremely upsetting and controversial among the older crowds. Can't believe this thread isn't longer. JACK is actually a crap idea...I hate it. Why is it a crap idea? I think it's great that stations are expanding their playlists. 1200 songs from the past 30 years, lots of variety, no repeats. How can you go wrong? Jack is the new Oldies format. People may be upset now, but Infinity was looking to the future. CBS-FM was done. They tried to evolve the station into 70's-80's music and it failed. Meanwhile, its audience is aging out of prime demographics. Unless advertisers seriously change what they are looking for, the Oldies format is going to die off in a few years. Mix and K-Rock are in trouble too, but CBS-FM was definitely going to have to change sooner or later. That's bullshit. CBS was #8 overall, which is really good. Even Howard Stern was commenting on how successful and profitable the station was. Why is Jack crap? Because there is no rhyme or reason to it, and while that may have some limited appeal (the whole Ipod Shuffle notion), whose "Ipod" is it supposed to be? I listened to it for awhile, and it's no great shake. I guarantee you that station's ratings will PLUMMET and meanwhile, a popular station is history and an entire veteran staff now is jobless (until they get thrown onto AM or satellite). Great job, Infinity. *flips the bird*  |
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Post by tico on Jun 14, 2005 23:00:36 GMT -5
Why is it a crap idea? I think it's great that stations are expanding their playlists. 1200 songs from the past 30 years, lots of variety, no repeats. How can you go wrong? Jack is the new Oldies format. People may be upset now, but Infinity was looking to the future. CBS-FM was done. They tried to evolve the station into 70's-80's music and it failed. Meanwhile, its audience is aging out of prime demographics. Unless advertisers seriously change what they are looking for, the Oldies format is going to die off in a few years. Mix and K-Rock are in trouble too, but CBS-FM was definitely going to have to change sooner or later. That's bulls**t. CBS was #8 overall, which is really good. Even Howard Stern was commenting on how successful and profitable the station was. Why is Jack crap? Because there is no rhyme or reason to it, and while that may have some limited appeal (the whole Ipod Shuffle notion), whose "Ipod" is it supposed to be? I listened to it for awhile, and it's no great shake. I guarantee you that station's ratings will PLUMMET and meanwhile, a popular station is history and an entire veteran staff now is jobless (until they get thrown onto AM or satellite). Great job, Infinity. *flips the bird* On the surface, CBS-FM probably should not have been the sacrificial lamb, but like Slinky said, the oldies format is dying off and eventually, the format would've been a harder sell because of its aging demographic. Doesn't seem fair, but that's just the nature of the beast. Jack's ratings *could* fall, but it also could rise or stay the same. |
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jimmy74747
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Post by jimmy74747 on Jun 15, 2005 8:53:41 GMT -5
I think the Jack format is perfect for 25-40 year olds who will turn into the Oldies crowd in a another ten years.
People in this age bracket are not listening to Top 40 radio because of its overplay of rap. They also do not like most new rock/alternative music is its more about being loud than song structure. Artists that do appeal to older crowds played on those format (3 Doors Down, Rob Thomas, Gwen Stefani) are played on Jack stations, along with the hits they grew up with from the 70's through today.
In an era when playlists are being shortened, Jack stations are going against the trend. I think they will do very well ratings wise.
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Post by tico on Jun 15, 2005 11:13:52 GMT -5
I found this on All Access.com:
Six of eight Adult Hits stations (JACK-FM(tm), "BOB", etc.) ranked either first or second in Cume for 25-54 Persons, according to a new analysis conducted by ARBITRON and EDISON MEDIA RESEARCH entitled "ADULT HITS: AN EARLY LOOK AT THE NUMBERS DRIVING RADIO'S NEWEST FORMAT." The study examined the following eight stations: KJKK/DALLAS, KJAC/DENVER, KCJK/KANSAS CITY, WPYA/NORFOLK, KBPA/AUSTIN, KQOB/OKLAHOMA CITY, and WWJK/JACKSON, MS.
Highlights from the analysis include:
Strong concentration of listening among persons 35-44 with more strength on the younger end of this age span.
Balanced audience composition among men and women that is not often found on stations with Pop-or Rock-based formats.
Initial gains in ratings occur whether or not the stations emphasize air personalities.
Strongest audience in midday and afternoon drive.
In-car and at-work listening is above the norm.
For the official Power Point presentation, click here.
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I'm 30, thus outside of the 35-44 group, but I listen to Jack more than any other music station in town. A lot of the songs they play are songs I grew up with or recent songs with familiarity. It's not too "oldies", too "classic rock" or too "AC". Plus, it lacks the awful rap music of the last few years (though they some of the classics from the 80s). Again, I don't find all current rap awful, but most of it is unlistenable. Jack also gives me a choice if I object to something being played on CHR, AC, rock, urban or urban AC.
Some of the younger people here probably wouldn't get the concept behind Jack and I get that. But for me, the format is not crap. Would be nice if they have jocks (which I think eventually will happen).
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EvanJ
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Post by EvanJ on Jun 15, 2005 20:05:43 GMT -5
Even Howard Stern was commenting on how successful and profitable the station was. Howard Stern is on a sister station to WCBS-FM therefore he may not be objective. |
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Houster
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Post by Houster on Jun 15, 2005 21:52:38 GMT -5
This is precisely the problem, that the baby boomer generation and the slightly older group, which makes up the bulk of America and who has the most money and most disposable income, is no longer seen by advertisers as "prime demographics." Maybe they are just too lazy to try to sell products to people over 40.
Advertisers see us as dead, when we are far from that.
New York City is not like the rest of the United States -- that's what "Cousin Brucie" Morrow said about the JACK format after he was fired and before he signed on with Sirius Sattelite Radio. Radio is music plus personalities. Having a giant ipod with some nameless, vanilla, obnoxious announcer is not us. Some of us like having a person who knows us and has a feel for the audience and the music.
There are plenty of people around who miss the old music and the deejays of our youth who were still around and were still willing to give us fun times.
And at least Infinity could have given the old personalities a chance to say goodbye, like the old WNEW-FM in 2000. Micky Dolenz was celebrating his 100th broadcast doing a live broadcast from B.B. King's the morning that he was fired -- and Infinity let him do the broadcast without telling him that it was his last one. What Chutzpah.
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Marv
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Post by Marv on Jun 16, 2005 17:42:17 GMT -5
Today's adults don't have a true station or format to grasp in large numbers.
Once-powerful CHR/Pop powerhouses such as KIIS-FM have blown off most of their adult listeners over the past 15 years by overloading on rap and rhythmic product, with almost universal disastrous results. Although KIIS-FM is again #1 in L A (with a so-so 4.9), it's listeners has FAR less income than the station did when it had HUGE numbers both overall (including a TEN in the fall of 1984) and in the ultra-desirable adults 25-54 demo, throughout most of the eighties, especially after Rick Dees came aboard in 1982.
Oldies stations aren't serving that core adults 25-54 demographic anymore; most of them are playing almost NO music from the seventies or eighties.
An AC station COULD serve 25-54 adults now as well as it ever has, simply by increasing the size of thyeir libraries, and playing much more punchier music.
Country and Smooth Jazz stations will always do well with 25-54 adults, who have TONS of disposable income to spend on the products offered by such high-end advertisers as Lexus & other prestigious products.
Based on that article which is available for free from the Edison Media Research website and which was previously mentioned above, the 'Jack-FM format is merely an atrempt to snag adult listeners who want to hear more than 250 songs on their over-researched and overconsulted radio station; an overreliance on research has made FAR too many stations in FAR too many formats unlistenable due to their high-repetition practices; the fact that most of those 'Jack-FM stations (such as KCBS-FM here in Los Angeles) have over TWELVE HUNDRED songs in their libraries, and rarely playing any song more than FIVE times per WEEK makes it much less boring and much less safe, which is what these conglomerates such as Clear Channel, Cumulus & Infinity have done.
Safe and overresearched radio is also very DULL and predictable radio, and that's what happens when those conglomerates put the insatiable desires of Wall Street ahead of those of their listeners.
The listeners usually lose.
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