Gary
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Post by Gary on Apr 24, 2015 9:28:55 GMT -5
Billboard hits or lack of them are not a criteria. The point is more about having songs with an impact. Those of course didn't have to be hits, but often they were. The songwriters hall award would indicate her music career impacted something anyway. Anyway, she is not in the Rock Hall, so why? The credentials are there. The songwriting has been acknowledged. I think she is not in for two reasons. Granted there are counter examples that I will get as soon as I post this next comment. (LOL - not true artist X is in blah blah blah) Although you can get in by being a female pop songwriter, the genre not being rock and the gender not being male I think tend to be negatives in the selection process.
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cking33
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Post by cking33 on Apr 24, 2015 15:49:40 GMT -5
Carly Simon is in the Songwriters Hall of Fame. Billboard hits or lack of them are not a criteria. Count me in with those who think Carly Simon should be the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. Three of the pillars of the 70s singer-songwriter movement were Carly Simon, Joni Mitchell and Carole King. (I'd also throw Laura Nyro in there, though she wasn't as successful commercially as the other three). Carly deserves to be in while Carole deserves to get in as an artist (she's already in as a songwriter).
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swim
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Post by swim on Apr 25, 2015 8:54:31 GMT -5
I attended this year's ceremony. I know there's a lot of debate here about certain pop stars getting in, and from a live ceremony perspective some of the names that get brought up here would be awkward, a vibe killer, and just wouldn't fit in. I don't think you have to be "rock" to get in but if you aren't, a certain amount of time needs to pass by before you get inducted. For example, people went crazy for Bill Withers. Miley, a presenter/performer this year, got more of a mixed reception. I can't imagine the same audience going crazy over Lou Reed (which they did), and, for example, Mariah Carey in the same night. Obviously the point I'm bringing up here is just from one perspective of what makes a successful ceremony, and shouldn't be the be all end all of what type of music gets in. I enjoyed the ceremony to no end because overall it's the type of music I go for. It's just hard to imagine some of these "diva" type singers getting in anytime soon whatsoever when there are several decades of deserving rock bands waiting to get in. Of course, there are some obvious exceptions such as Michael Jackson and Madonna but that's what they are--exceptions.
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Post by areyoureadytojump on Apr 28, 2015 12:11:14 GMT -5
Here are the 2016 eligibles: www.futurerocklegends.com/year.php?eligible_year=2015311 A Tribe Called Quest Alias Alice In Chains Béla Fleck and the Flecktones Bell Biv DeVoe The Black Crowes Blues Traveler Blur The Breeders C+C Music Factory Cannibal Corpse Celine Dion The Charlatans UK Damn Yankees Dannii Minogue Dar Williams David Baerwald Deee-Lite Dread Zeppelin En Vogue Eric's Trip fIREHOSE FireHouse The Gits Hole Ice Cube Israel Kamakawiwo'ole Jellyfish Jesus Lizard Keith Urban Kid Rock Lighter Shade of Brown Mariah Carey Mark Lanegan Mazzy Star Mighty Mighty Bosstones Moby Mortification Nelson Notwist Ocean Colour Scene Orbital Paradise Lost Primus The Rembrandts Ride Saint Etienne Saviour Machine The Screaming Jets Silver Jews Slaughter Slowdive Smashing Pumpkins Snap! Spiritualized Tairrie B Teenage Fanclub Tevin Campbell Therapy? The Toadies Uncle Tupelo Urban Dance Squad Vanilla Ice Ween Wilson Phillips
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Apr 28, 2015 12:48:41 GMT -5
Wilson Phillips FTW!! They recorded "Hold On" and that's all that matters!
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Apr 28, 2015 13:15:38 GMT -5
I don't get the purpose of having artists from all genres "eligible" but yet they can't get in for so and so reasons...
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MikeCheck12
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Post by MikeCheck12 on Apr 28, 2015 15:26:21 GMT -5
I don't get the purpose of having artists from all genres "eligible" but yet they can't get in for so and so reasons... All artists become eligible after that 25 year cut-off, but yea.....only a handful will even make the short list for nomination discussion. There is such a backlog of already eligible artists that continue to be snubbed. The politics aspect absolutely sucks....
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Post by areyoureadytojump on Apr 28, 2015 17:17:06 GMT -5
I don't get the purpose of having artists from all genres "eligible" but yet they can't get in for so and so reasons... The website I got the list from is not associated with the R&R HOF. It's a fan website so don't think it's an official list. It's not. Just a guide...
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Green Baron
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Post by Green Baron on Apr 28, 2015 17:17:58 GMT -5
Alice in Chains, Blur and Smashing Pumpkins are a few of the obvious choices.
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MikeCheck12
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Post by MikeCheck12 on May 3, 2015 12:40:18 GMT -5
Alice in Chains, Blur and Smashing Pumpkins are a few of the obvious choices. A Tribe Called Quest will definitely get some support - but there are several rap acts ahead of them that will likely get more support.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on May 14, 2015 12:43:00 GMT -5
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Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on May 14, 2015 12:50:14 GMT -5
Exactly. And that's ONE single song. And there's still her entire 90's catalogue(I want to be modest) alone. There are so many videos on Youtube of Beyoncé, Rihanna, Kelly, Xtina, Britney, Leona, just to name a few, of how that song made them want to sing and be singers; how they "studied" her and tried to mimic every run, riff, note. I'm ok with the Hall not getting her in...but the accolades, influence and impact is all there whether they think so or not.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on May 14, 2015 15:59:50 GMT -5
Mariah's chances down the road probably depend on what happens with Whitney Houston. (As the Hall has inductees who didn't play a vital role in writing their material, Mariah doing so won't give her a "leg up" over Whitney).
Of this year's new eligibles, Blue is by far the most acclaimed, but I'd be surprised if it received a nomination right out of the gate.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on May 14, 2015 16:34:16 GMT -5
We know about Mariah's chances HG, no need to keep reminding us. My post was about pointing out the influence just one of Mariah's songs has had on music.
I assume by "Blue" you mean, "Blur," but is 'acclaim' enough to merit inclusion?
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WolfSpear
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Post by WolfSpear on May 14, 2015 17:36:55 GMT -5
That's the saddest list of new eligibles I've ever seen.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on May 14, 2015 19:47:49 GMT -5
Oops- yes, I meant Blur. :) And, that's why I noted that I'd be surprised- its level of acclaim probably isn't enough to get it on the ballot the first time out.
It wasn't that I was reminding, per se- just keeping it in perspective, as far as discussion of potential 2015 nominees.
I wonder if Ben E. King will be nominated- he had a few nominations prior, but not in some time.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on May 14, 2015 20:36:02 GMT -5
But there is no need to keep putting it in perspective; is anyone even predicting that she is getting in? I don't think anyone here has a perspective that needs to be reigned it.
What notable recording has Ben E King had apart from "Stand By Me?"
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on May 14, 2015 20:50:08 GMT -5
^The original versions of "Spanish Harlem," "Don't Play That Song (You Lied)" and "I (Who Have Nothing)," to name a few.
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H.
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Post by H. on May 14, 2015 20:50:25 GMT -5
That's the saddest list of new eligibles I've ever seen. Agreed. I only really think Smashing Pumpkins belong.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on May 14, 2015 20:56:29 GMT -5
I'm not saying all of these deserve HOF induction, but all of these have made music I like a lot:
A Tribe Called Quest Alice In Chains Béla Fleck and the Flecktones Bell Biv DeVoe (ok, just "Poison" lol) The Black Crowes Blues Traveler Blur En Vogue Hole Ice Cube Keith Urban Mariah Carey Mazzy Star Moby Smashing Pumpkins
In terms of having enough quality and influence to deserve induction, I'd only argue for Mariah Carey and Smashing Pumpkins. Blur is a possibility, but their influence in mainly in the UK. Does the HOF include that? Alice in Chains is another one that wouldn't be a bad inclusion at some point, but I don't think they should be a sure shot. Hole made one really great album and other solid one, which is more than some acts that are in.
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WolfSpear
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Post by WolfSpear on May 14, 2015 21:52:30 GMT -5
Truth be told, only Smashing Pumpkins belong in there.
Not sure how the Hall will treat Blur, but I'm assuming that they'll ignore overall impact. There's a better chance of seeing the Smiths in the Hall... and rightfully so.
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Post by areyoureadytojump on May 15, 2015 8:33:49 GMT -5
All of us are too young to know the influence of Ben E. King...
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on May 15, 2015 9:03:55 GMT -5
B.B. King (RIP) was inducted in 1987 - or did you mean Ben E. King?
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WolfSpear
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Post by WolfSpear on May 15, 2015 14:19:11 GMT -5
RIP B.B. King.
True legend in the blues field that will be greatly missed.
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Gary
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Post by Gary on May 15, 2015 14:32:26 GMT -5
Ben E King too
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on May 15, 2015 15:29:45 GMT -5
^The original versions of "Spanish Harlem," "Don't Play That Song (You Lied)" and "I (Who Have Nothing)," to name a few. But other people are identified with those songs, not him. He didn't write them either, so you can't really use that to justify anything.
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Gary
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Post by Gary on May 15, 2015 15:42:52 GMT -5
No one knows exactly what they use to pick
He has been nominated before and with his death will likely get nominated again.
As we enter the 1990's for eligibility, I see fewer and fewer "new" artists getting in because there are fewer and fewer actual rock acts that emereged in the 90s
I see them going back in time and filling in some of the gaps that they may have missed. Ben E King is one.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on May 16, 2015 8:10:00 GMT -5
King's version of "Spanish Harlem" is pretty revered. And, obviously, for him to be nominated previously, some must find him worthy.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on May 16, 2015 8:54:35 GMT -5
I didn't say someone didn't find him worthy, I am again just pointing out inconsistencies. The Ronettes are basically in for 1 song. I think Hall of Fame status should require more than that, but obviously some disagree.
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Gary
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Post by Gary on May 16, 2015 13:11:34 GMT -5
One thing we do know about the criteria is that it is most certainly not about how many hits you had. This is not the Billboard Hot 100 Hall of Fame, otherwise artists like Mariah, Whitney and others would be a shoo-in.
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