spencer
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Post by spencer on Sept 21, 2013 15:18:41 GMT -5
Censor:
I appreciate your posts , I really do. And I respect your point of view. I guess I just at this point, don't see it exactly the way you do. IT doesn't mean my view is the right one. It just happens to be the one that fits me most right now. But posts like yours have me thinking.
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Post by 43dudleyvillas on Sept 21, 2013 21:24:04 GMT -5
If you can name someone who should have been nominated for Female Vocalist because they could have easily won, please do. How about Ashley Monroe? She has one of 2013's best-reviewed albums in any genre in Like a Rose, an album that debuted in the top-10 of the Billboard Country Albums chart, and collaborated with Train on a single ("Bruises") that, according to Roughstock, has sold 359K and also somehow peaked at #23 on the mongrel chart (for whatever little that is worth). No, she hasn't had a solo single chart. But neither did The Civil Wars, who were nominated for CMA Vocal Duo of the Year. Ashley also represents one-third of the Pistol Annies, whose sophomore album Annie Up (another of country's better-reviewed albums of 2013) debuted at #2 on the Billboard Country Albums chart with 84K copies sold, and has sold over 200K copies to date. Kelly Clarkson's invitations to perform at televised country events largely come down to her ability to deliver as a live performer (independent of genre), her name recognition, and the belief in her ability to attract some pop fans to country broadcasts. From a television producer's standpoint, her inclusion makes sense, and I also completely agree with you that Kelly has a legitimate history within the country industry and format. However, I do not think her accomplishments within the CMA eligibility period were enough to warrant a Female Vocalist nomination over someone like Ashley Monroe. So for me, Kelly's inclusion among the CMA Female Vocalist nominees after some middling results with her solo country singles speaks loudly to the country genre's failure to support a new generation of "home-grown" female talent. Last year, Kellie Pickler released a traditional country album that several media publications would declare to be one of the year's best in the genre, and country radio failed to get on board, leading to the end of her time with Sony Nashville. It would have been nice to see CMA voters acknowledge Kellie's accomplishment with a Female Vocalist nomination in 2012 since there wasn't a viable fifth candidate for the spot, anyway. Nominating Kellie last year, and Ashley this year, would give us a traditional country singer in the category, and result in a range of Female Vocalist nominees that truly ran the gamut from traditional (Ashley/Kellie) to contemporary (Carrie, Miranda and last year, Martina) to alternative/contemporary (Kacey, this year) to pop (Taylor). As it is, Kelly simply represents another pop nominee, and takes up a spot that could have been used to acknowledge the strength of traditional country releases by females in 2013. Moreover, Kelly didn't need that Female Vocalist nomination, nor is she particularly legitimized by it. She was virtually guaranteed a nomination for Vocal Event, anyway (a nomination that I don't think many would dispute), which would have covered any pretext necessary to warrant a CMA Awards performance. Meanwhile, multiple media outlets (including Billboard, Entertainment Weekly, and USA Today) have gently and respectfully questioned her Female Vocalist nomination (without questioning her talent, and I want to emphasize that I'm not questioning Kelly's talent, either). Ashley Monroe, on the other hand, might have benefited more from the recognition, though the odds of her being invited to perform on the broadcast were quite low.
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Focus
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"peace out my babies" ~ Kelly Hoodson tm yoKC ~ "hackers..You've been CLARKSONED"!
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Post by Focus on Sept 22, 2013 12:15:03 GMT -5
I love it! Courtesy GoodListener at the KCE...
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someguy
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Post by someguy on Sept 22, 2013 12:30:37 GMT -5
I think that Kelly deserves her nomination. I definitely see the case that could be made for Ashley Monroe, as well as Jana Kramer, Sheryl Crow and, to some extent, LeAnn Rimes. But I think that an equally strong (if not stronger) case could be made for Kelly. I think her nomination really speaks to the state that the country music industry is in with regards to their acceptance and support of female artists, more than anything else.
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onebuffalo
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Post by onebuffalo on Sept 22, 2013 13:58:19 GMT -5
I am glad to see the Censor-spencer (or is it spencer-Censor?) debate over. Sure, it was a head scratcher last year when Kelly Clarkson got her first nomination for Female Vocalist. Even Country Weekly was asking if there was another country female available for the nomination. Sadly, I do agree with the 'filler' part of the nomination. I really do feel like Clarkson is rounding out the category. Would I love to see five females with major successes in the category? You betcha! However, with the state of country radio being what it is, getting ANY five females into that category is a miracle unto itself (and please, do not put the likes of Katy Perry, Miley Cyrus, Rihanna, Kesha, and Lady Gaga there). However, I would love to see Clarkson have major country success all to HERSELF. Sure, her duets with Reba McEntire (soon to be mother-in-law) and Jason Aldean were good, but I would love to see Clarkson concentrate on the Country format a bit better. It would be great for the genre.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 22, 2013 16:01:11 GMT -5
I am glad to see the Censor-spencer (or is it spencer-Censor?) debate over. I thought it was a good debate with good points made. I like to see good discussion like that. I'm not surprised that Kelly got nominated but I hope a full country album comes to fruition, as she did say in a recent interview that they'd changed course and were indeed going to release a country album (whereas in the past she'd always said that her albums would continue to be a mix of genres). I definitely think Dudley brought up some great points about Ashley Monroe, though, and I do wish the industry would make more nods toward the traditional side of the genre. I'm hoping that Jana Kramer can have some more radio success in 2014 and get some more attention at the award shows as well. As for "Tie It Up", I'm not sure how much further it can get up the chart. It's just kind of simmering there in the 33-35 range. I can see it sneaking into the top 30 and peaking close to where "Don't Rush" did (#27), but I don't see it doing much more than that. I'm definitely interested in more material from her, though, so that's why I hope we get more news about a country album. I'm probably in the minority here in that DR was only just 'ok' for me, and I don't really care for TIU, but I generally do like Clarkson so I'm hoping she'll have some other songs that I like better.
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spencer
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Post by spencer on Oct 2, 2013 12:53:43 GMT -5
Has TIU's run on the charts ended? It dropped down to 37 on today's chart, but it's been losing spins on a fairly regular basis this week. I can see however, that the charts can be pretty up and down from day to day. Is there a limit to how many spin loses a song can experience before it is considered done?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 2, 2013 16:16:44 GMT -5
Has TIU's run on the charts ended? It dropped down to 37 on today's chart, but it's been losing spins on a fairly regular basis this week. I can see however, that the charts can be pretty up and down from day to day. Is there a limit to how many spin loses a song can experience before it is considered done? On Mediabase a song is sent to recurrent status after 3 bullet-less weeks. The September 29th chart marked Kelly's first week without a bullet, so the song can't go recurrent until Sunday the 13th, but it's done. It's been losing audience almost every day for the last 7-10 days now and has dropped a total of almost 2 mil in that span--it peaked with 8.034 million back on the September 19th update, and it's currently down at 6.096 million, with a bullet of -135. Here's a rundown of the last week and then some: 09/19: +45k (up to 8.034 million, her highest audience) 09/20: -32k 09/21: +25k 09/22: -63k 09/23: -192k 09/24: -319k 09/25: +24k 09/26: -273k 09/27: -26k 09/28: -297k 09/29: -144k 09/30: -202k 10/01: -112k 10/02: -327k TIU didn't start losing a lot of spins until around the 26th/27th, so that might suggest that the bigger market stations started cutting its airplay (which would explain the bigger audience drops despite only small losses of spins). But now I think Columbia Nashville has pulled the plug, likely realizing that this song wasn't going to crack the top 30. TIU hasn't been testing well with listeners at all. The Billboard recurrent rule is a little different, as songs 21 weeks and older can go recurrent after just one drop week, but otherwise it's the same as the Mediabase rule. TIU was without a bullet on Monday's chart, so it'll still get another appearance, but then it will get pulled.
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Rumors
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Post by Rumors on Oct 2, 2013 16:42:24 GMT -5
Collaborating with artists outside one's genre due to friendship and/or interest in the genre and then releasing a couple of songs to that genre which do not generate significant interest from radio don' t to my mind justify, country festival and award shows performances, and certainly not a nomination in the FVOTY category. Notice that I say FVOTY and not collaboration category. Was/is there no other female country artist whose single releases performed at /or similar level as KC 's country releases.? Hanging out with one's country friends, at significant country award shows and concerts, and collaborating with artists on single releases, does not, to my mind, merit, solo spots at country festival or country award shows.....at least not yet.. You do the work first, then the success, then the nomination. It just seems that KC's camp is a little impatient. Even KC tweeted after hearing about her first FVOTY nomination, something to the effect that, '...she would earn it'. I agree with this 100%. I do like Kelly the pop artist. I think her country stuff has been very average. Her duet with Reba was on a very good pop song that was already familiar with many country listeners and I didn't like her duet with Jason. Good singing from both stars but the song itself was awful. I think the inclusion of Kelly just shows how very few female stars counrty has right now...Taylor (and she's really pop to me), Miranda, and Carrie. That's really about it. So here you have Kelly who hails from Texas and hangs out with country stars. So hey, let's make her a country star without even releasing a country album. Silly if you ask me. Added - I just finished reading the rest of the post. I guess my post was late and everyone else basically said the same thing I just did. LOL!
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spencer
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Post by spencer on Oct 2, 2013 17:46:17 GMT -5
Has TIU's run on the charts ended? It dropped down to 37 on today's chart, but it's been losing spins on a fairly regular basis this week. I can see however, that the charts can be pretty up and down from day to day. Is there a limit to how many spin loses a song can experience before it is considered done? On Mediabase a song is sent to recurrent status after 3 bullet-less weeks. The September 29th chart marked Kelly's first week without a bullet, so the song can't go recurrent until Sunday the 13th, but it's done. It's been losing audience almost every day for the last 7-10 days now and has dropped a total of almost 2 mil in that span--it peaked with 8.034 million back on the September 19th update, and it's currently down at 6.096 million, with a bullet of -135. Here's a rundown of the last week and then some: 09/19: +45k (up to 8.034 million, her highest audience) 09/20: -32k 09/21: +25k 09/22: -63k 09/23: -192k 09/24: -319k 09/25: +24k 09/26: -273k 09/27: -26k 09/28: -297k 09/29: -144k 09/30: -202k 10/01: -112k 10/02: -327k TIU didn't start losing a lot of spins until around the 26th/27th, so that might suggest that the bigger market stations started cutting its airplay (which would explain the bigger audience drops despite only small losses of spins). But now I think Columbia Nashville has pulled the plug, likely realizing that this song wasn't going to crack the top 30. TIU hasn't been testing well with listeners at all. The Billboard recurrent rule is a little different, as songs 21 weeks and older can go recurrent after just one drop week, but otherwise it's the same as the Mediabase rule. TIU was without a bullet on Monday's chart, so it'll still get another appearance, but then it will get pulled. Thank you jhomes87 for the very informative post.
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onebuffalo
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Post by onebuffalo on Oct 6, 2013 14:02:25 GMT -5
Kelly Clarkson: "I love singing this single on tour every night cause I'm about to TIE IT UP!" It's the 1st single of her country album!
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bigb0882
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Post by bigb0882 on Oct 8, 2013 18:07:00 GMT -5
It doesn't really feel like a lead single for a country album. Even if the album is dropped early 2014 this song will have been long forgotten by then. Might as well add this onto the album as a bonus track rather than try and use it for promotion purposes because that seems a waste of time (especially by the time the album does come out).
This is all assuming there will be a country album.
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Post by clarksonnumber1 on Oct 10, 2013 14:39:16 GMT -5
I thought Tie It Up fits in better with today's Country music than Don't Rush or Mr. Know It All did. I'm surprised to see how poorly it did. I still have hope for Don't Rush winning a Grammy award, but it's safe to say Tie It Up won't be nominated.
Her singles lately have done worse than the previous one. On the positive side she should have a few months break from Country radio. Hopefully it will help.
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