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Post by Adonis the DemiGod! on Jun 15, 2006 14:00:28 GMT -5
Its so thick you can cut it with a knife....Mariah has really opened the flood gates for female artists.
Beyonce, Ciara, Nelly Furtado, Janet, X-tina, Shakira etc... Wow! Let's talk about these people...
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Big Brother
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Post by Big Brother on Jun 15, 2006 14:02:31 GMT -5
I agree! Mariah rocked last year. I hope Janet fucking BRINGS IT!
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 15, 2006 21:58:41 GMT -5
How has Mariah been opening flood gates for female artists? I've randomly just read topics in this forum and you've said that three times.
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Post by That Skipping Rope. on Jun 15, 2006 23:14:36 GMT -5
The for LILY ALLEN!
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banet2001
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Post by banet2001 on Jun 16, 2006 14:25:32 GMT -5
Mariah opened the floodgates for Christina, Shakira, Beyonce and Janet Jackson? I guess you can toss in Britney's next album as well (whenever it gets released) All of them would have had huge years whether or not Mariah had a huge year.
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MusicJunkie
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Post by MusicJunkie on Jun 17, 2006 8:57:27 GMT -5
I agree. All these females had a lot of success before Mariah even released TEOM. Mariah DID NOT open any flood gates for anyone.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 18, 2006 7:56:37 GMT -5
She opened them for herself. Instead of making BAD albums that flopped, she made a half decent one and released all the right singles.
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danny
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Post by danny on Jun 18, 2006 9:00:08 GMT -5
Mariah's TEOM is indeed a VERY solid album! One of my favourite albums of hers! And one of my favourite albums this decade! I LOVE every song, except TTF and Joyride, which I still enjoy though!
And although Mariah's former two albums did flop, that doesn't mean they were bad now does it. In their own ways, I think Glitter and CB were in fact Good albums. I mean, Mpol, does the fact Pink's IND flopped mean it is a bad album? Hell no! It is awesome ;) And also, even MC's flop albums still managed to sell millions of copies worldwide.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 18, 2006 9:38:23 GMT -5
The thing is, when Mariah does make good-great music it sells by the truck loads. Hence the success of Mimi. In the 90's she had the media in the palm of her hand. And she released great music. That equates to millions of albums sold. HOWEVER. With Glitter, came the lacluster album, the bad movie, the infamous breakdown and the public war of words with her ex-husband/manager. People were expecting alot from Glitter. It didn't deliver (although I LOVED Nvere Too Far!.) I haven't heard it, so I am personally not judging it. But reading various reviews and word of mouth told me that Glitter and Charm Bracelet were anything close to even half of what she can deliver. Couple that with her voice starting to strain through a decade of non stop singing, the media turning against you and you start to have little success. They have turned against you. When Charmbracelet came out, she needed to have produced some of her best music to regain that respect, but she again fell short. It was different with TEOM as she took her time, wrote music SHE wanted to write and you could hear MIMI was back in full swing again. Time was also a huge factor. It helped her to distance herself from her ex, the breakdown and her voice was sarting to resemble it's former power. (Has anyone heard Make It Through The Rain? Either her voice was then at its worst OR she just plainly oculdn't give a fuck singing it as it wasn't WHAT SHE wanted to sing, hence the title of her new album!) Word was getting out in the music industry that Mimi was heading back to her best. It created the perfect hype and when the album came out, along with it's well chosen singles, it sold like crazy again.
Do you see what I'm saying? No? Ok... let me now use Pink as an example.
Try This and I'm Not Dead have CRITICALLY been recieved better by critics than Mizundastood. I'm Not Dead is also proving to be a huge hit with the fans and those few who so far HAVE purchased it. They love it. And why not, it's a top quality record. BUT you see the differnce is Pink has a bad promo team behind her and releases all the wrong singles in the US (WW they are lapping up SG and WK, hell SG is her second biggest hit after GTPS.) But in the US, she rushed TT release, and once it was flopping, didnt promote it. With IND she's taken her time and still has done very little to help it sell now that it's falling off of the charts. Pink also doesn't have a loyal fanbase. It's not alot of people anyways. Not compared to Mimi. Mariah on the other hand lets her label decide what's going to be a hit, and guess what, it becomes ONE! She then uses these smashes to allow the album to sell and by doing her Oprah like appreances, the rest is all history, it's all in the sales.
Still don't get what I'm saying? Ok, with Mimi, it's obvious, she had alot of bad shit happen all at the one time, and the media turned on her. She released albums that were far from her best, and they consequencly flopped. Pink on the other hand seems to be out doing herself making each album get better and better (remember this is from a critics view, as each of us have our own!) and yet the singles/album continue to flop in the US. Why? Well again, bad single choices, and lack of any appearences. I'm guessing those who aren't fans or don't go onto these forums don't know Pink has a new album out, 'but didn't she do that Stupid Women, Girls song thingo?'
Quite simply all Mariah needs to do was make good music. Her old fan base (along with the new one this album has scored her) will LAP IT UP!
Pink needs to play all the right moves, by making a great album, release the right singles and promote this album something shocking in the US for it to make any impact. The quality of music isn't so vital to Pink's success, not now when most people don't even know she has a new album out.
Mariah's already done all the hard work. Release the right singles, make a few appearences on Idol, Orpah and the VMA and she'll be set for another 5-6x Platinum record in the US, with another 5-6mill WW to boot.
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MusicJunkie
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Post by MusicJunkie on Jun 18, 2006 13:03:55 GMT -5
Mariah on the other hand lets her label decide what's going to be a hit, and guess what, it becomes ONE! I think you're wrong. Her label wanted Say Somethin as the 3rd single. Mariah was the one who wanted Shake It Off and they went with it, SIO becoming a huge hit. Then Mariah wanted Fly Like A Bird while her label was still so determined to release SS and they went with it as the mainstream single. SS flopped hard while FLAB ended up having higher audience for weeks with SS having Pop and Rhythmic support, which is sad. So Mariah succeeded doing things her way while Pink isn't. Pink wanted both Stupid Girls and Who Knew as singles. The rest of the world is obviously embracing Pink and so are fans here. Every one of Pink's videos from the Try This era and the I'm Not Dead era so far has made TRL for weeks which shows that she definitely still has fans out there that like her music. Pink has fans support, people want to see her videos, and she always receives critical acclaim for her albums. Pink's only problem is US radio. Her label needs to realize that and they need to do a radio tour or something to show radio stations she has music out there now. But radio prefers playing random new urban female singers with mediocre vocals and boring songs that won't ever be remembered one year from now.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 18, 2006 20:09:08 GMT -5
'If sone one said a year from now, the song would be gone, I'd stand up and punch the-em out, 'cos they're all wr-ong!'
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Lowe
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Post by Lowe on Jun 18, 2006 22:00:26 GMT -5
Her label wanted Say Somethin to be the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd single. Mariah fought them off until the label won the 5th single. I know the felt stupid after it flopped with that expensive video..lol.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 18, 2006 22:38:17 GMT -5
Yeah why the hell did they want it to be a single at all. Sorry about my mis calculation. mariah obviously does haeva say. She should teach Pink her expertise in this area. But why the hell did they want SS as a single when it doesn't even come close to being half as good as the other four.
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Post by babyboylrtm on Jun 19, 2006 5:45:57 GMT -5
'If sone one said a year from now, the song would be gone, I'd stand up and punch the-em out, 'cos they're all wr-ong!' Riiiiiiiiiight. Pink is BEYOND dead. It's rather sad cuz its all her fault.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 19, 2006 9:05:08 GMT -5
Out side of the US she's doing as well as ever. Is that her fault as well. If the woman in your member pic doesn't stop doing to crazy shit she's been doing, she will literally BE dead. Poor thing. But again, like you said with Pink, she'll have no one to blame but herself.
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MusicJunkie
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Post by MusicJunkie on Jun 19, 2006 18:06:56 GMT -5
I don't blame Pink at all. US radio is the one to blame. She has support everywhere else. Mariah got things done her way and she succeeded. Pink unfortunately isn't because of US radio but it looks like radio is giving Who Knew another chance now.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 19, 2006 22:17:22 GMT -5
music junkie, you rule. Thanks.
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MusicJunkie
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Post by MusicJunkie on Jun 20, 2006 17:38:08 GMT -5
music junkie, you rule. Thanks. As always. lmao j/k.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 20, 2006 23:37:38 GMT -5
No it's true. Us Pink fans need to unite, and help her. Even if it doesn't help muh, we need to do what we can. You aoart of Pinks page? My username is LovinP!nk.
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Dan
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Post by Dan on Jun 21, 2006 14:32:48 GMT -5
I don't blame Pink at all. US radio is the one to blame. She has support everywhere else. Mariah got things done her way and she succeeded. Pink unfortunately isn't because of US radio but it looks like radio is giving Who Knew another chance now. It is Pink's fault. She fought for "Stupid Girls" to be released. The label wanted "U + Ur Hand." She just dug her own grave by doing that.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 21, 2006 17:12:04 GMT -5
Plus it doesn't help that Pink's songs really aren't that great. Granted she has had a few good songs but overall, she's nothing really special and she doesn't even have a niche in music now. She's all over the place in styles, or she's trying to be, and it's just messy.
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MusicJunkie
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Post by MusicJunkie on Jun 21, 2006 17:58:52 GMT -5
I 100% disagree max. Pink's niche is definitely pop/rock. Some are pure pop, while others lean more to rock. Also, Pink does not try to be a certain style. She's as real as can be and obviously her first album's style was forced. Pink and R&B don't mix IMO.
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Post by How Do You Do? on Jun 21, 2006 23:34:34 GMT -5
Plus it doesn't help that Pink's songs really aren't that great. Granted she has had a few good songs but overall, she's nothing really special and she doesn't even have a niche in music now. She's all over the place in styles, or she's trying to be, and it's just messy. I feel the same way about the quality of her songs. I don't get the praising of this album like it's the second coming. It's just an average pop/rock album. I do disagree that the problem is that she is all over the place. I actually think that is a positive. I think part of the problem is that the U.S. public just isn't that interested in her.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 22, 2006 2:07:14 GMT -5
I just think her style feels more forced as if she's trying to be some badass but then the next album, she's a girlie girl.
And I'm all for an artist being versitile with style (nelly furtado, for example) but Pink just seems to unorganized. It's like she wants to be rock but then she has a dance song. And while rock and dance can get along well (killers or scissor sisters), Pink isn't exactly doing that. I dunno. It seems to me she's lacking direction and her songs aren't really doing anything for me. Even her best songs (to me) 'Most Girls' and 'Don't Let Me Get Me' weren't amazing. Good but not really GREAT.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 22, 2006 8:58:24 GMT -5
Pink has had drug addictions, been held at gun point, overdosed, and has had family dramas for the larger part of her life. If she ain't a bad ass, then I don't know what is. She's had a hard life. Not liking her music is a matter of opinion. But that isn't what this thread is about. It's about people claiming that Mariah created the hype for artists this year with her success. I only used Pink as an example. Her not being as big as she once was in the US, to me is a cumlination of things, but to me the biggest issue is that the US doesn't like smart, opinionated women. They'd rather you shake your booty, becasue a woman how can speak up are just far too complicated to deal with. And now Pink's touching upon issues like politics and war, people are pulling away. SHakign your but in a pop/hip jop styled song it where it's at now days. Sad but true. Other counties have embraced this album. Why? Because they can tollerate an open, out spoken famous woman. This also happened to Madonna and Aguilera. Yes they sexed it up big time, but they too had things to say. BUT the US public just tunred against them. It's sad. Men on the other hand can do whatever they want, and people love them for it. I feel, yall may not and that's cool, that Pink's lack of success doesn't have alot to do with radio, or single choice. Yes she needs to promote more, but until she shuts up and stops being who she is (which will NEVER HAPPEN!) I can't see the US embracing an out spoken woman like Pink. They loved ger CTMH days as her music was in your face and her image was all R/B on your ass bitches ( ) and they loved Mizundastood, because she was whinging about HER own life. But when she gets all, hard ass, out spoken activist on our asses, the US can't hack it. Sad for them.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 22, 2006 10:13:40 GMT -5
Well, that may all be true. I won't say it isn't because I don't know and obviously you'd know more than I would, but as a casual follower of her music (because I know she's there so I'm pretty much just reporting what I see from my point of view), it seems that her image just seems forced more than it seems natural. And maybe her style of music isn't suitable for the subject matter that she wants to sing about. I'm not saying she *shouldn't* sing pop/rock songs the style she does sing about but I find if you want your lyrics to be taken seriously, maybe using pop music like how Pink's sounds isn't a great idea.... HOWEVER, I will give her credit in that, if her lyrics actually DO touch on those subjects and go somewhat in depth with them, then doing that over pop music probably could be a good idea in helping to get the ideas out and not just doing the expected.
As for Mariah opening up the floodgates for other female artists? C'mon! Mariah wasn't the first female solo singer to make a song or release an album or whatever. And she may have had a successful album last year but I seriously doubt she created hype for other female singers this year. Unless they're singers that she has directly worked with or have endorsed somehow, claiming that any female singer that does good (or doesn't do good) is all thanks to Mariah should probably get their head out of the clouds and get back to reality.
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Post by babyboylrtm on Jun 22, 2006 10:27:27 GMT -5
If the woman in your member pic doesn't stop doing to crazy s**t she's been doing, she will literally BE dead. Poor thing. But again, like you said with Pink, she'll have no one to blame but herself. You need to stop attacking Nippy whenever I say something negative about Pink. It's getting old and we all know Pink is nothing but a major bomb right now.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 22, 2006 10:37:11 GMT -5
I am sorry about that comment it was alittle too harsh. Whitney Houston is nothing BUT a legand. My prays are with the poor girl. I just don't like it when people hate or dislike an artist JUST because they are bombing. Yes it is frustrating as Pink could have had success this time around, but hey, this album is awesome. I'm glad we agree on that. I too am frustrated but I don't see the need to hate her becuase of wat iso nly plartly her fault.
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Post by How Do You Do? on Jun 22, 2006 11:13:56 GMT -5
That is so offensive. Just because your idol isn't doing well, doesn't mean you need to attack other artists. She is just not popular in the U.S. right now and her music isn't catching on. It happens to all artists at one point.
A minor list of "strong, opinionated women" who are doing well right now: 1. Dixie Chicks - I don't think you get more opinionated then this (and they are succeeding without radio play). 2. Shakira - yes, she shakes her ass, but she also has never shyed away from political statements (see Bush/Hussein puppet show during TOTM, her Reebok peace ad). She also has two political/current issue songs on her current album - Timor and How Do You Do? She played Live 8 (and is planning a Latin Live 8), is an ambassador for UNICEF, and runs a foundation that builds schools for poor Colombian children. 3. Christina Aguilera - strong, opinionated woman with control over her career.
Personally, while Pink's music is not my cup of tea, I'd like her a lot more if she spent more time getting involved with issues (Vote for Change, Live 8, etc.) and less time making statements.
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polly
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Post by polly on Jun 22, 2006 11:18:23 GMT -5
My post w as never ment to offend. but look, you pulled out some great names there. Those are women having some sort of success in the US. But you should know none are comming off of a flop record. Whilst OF1 wasn'y huge, I always assumed it would always be over shadowed by 2, which is certainly is now. But you bring up a nice list there. Pink has had two flops in a row now, whilst those artists you mentioned have not. The DHixies have come off of bad press but nothing more. Aguilera's Stripped went 4x Platinum. An amazing feat .
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