Chelsea Press 2
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Post by Chelsea Press 2 on Apr 5, 2012 20:14:19 GMT -5
Got the list of 1 million+ first week openers with large percentage second week drops that Cynthia made last year in the Hits thread during Gaga's BTW second week. 1. 50 Cent (The Massacre) 32.4% 2. Eminem (The Eminem Show) 38.8% 3. Backstreet Boys (Millennium) 45.2% 4. Garth Brooks (Double Live) 49.4% 5. Whitney Houston (The Bodyguard' Soundtrack) 51% 6. Britney Spears (Oops!...I Did It Again) 53.6% 7. Eminem (The Marshal Mathers LP) 54.9% 8. Usher (Confessions) 55.7% 9. Backstreet Boys (Black & Blue) 56.7% 10. Norah Jones (Feels Like Home) 61.3% 11. Limp Bizkit (Chocolate Starfish & the Hot Dog Flavored Water) 62.8% 12. The Beatles (1) 64.2% 13. 'N Sync (No Strings Attached) 66.4% 14. Lil Wayne (Tha Carter III) 69.3% 15. Taylor Swift (Speak Now) 69.5% 16. N Sync (Celebrity) 75.6% 17. Lady Gaga (Born This Way) 85% (EDITED)
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Post by areyoureadytojump on Apr 5, 2012 20:18:27 GMT -5
^That list is missing a Jay Z album that fell 70% in its second week. I don't have the 2nd week in my files.
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Chelsea Press 2
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Post by Chelsea Press 2 on Apr 5, 2012 20:20:08 GMT -5
^That list is missing a Jay Z album that fell 70% in its second week. I don't have the 2nd week in my files. I think Cynthia used Soundscan numbers to make that, but a general estimate version could be made using the old HITS data by finding the correct dates. Perhaps a separate thread dedicated to this type of info could be made.
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Cerbius
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Post by Cerbius on Apr 5, 2012 20:21:26 GMT -5
That's just a list for second week drops for albums that opened with 1 million+. I wouldn't be surprised if Gaga held the "record" until now, though.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2012 20:21:31 GMT -5
That list is for one week 1mil selling albums only
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Apr 5, 2012 20:21:33 GMT -5
Yeah, I think there might have been a discussion around the Gaga drop time. She was at 85% which was pretty hefty. In the end, she did sell a bit more than double her first week total. I'm not sure how that stacks up compared to most albums though. I feel like in recent years, there has been more effort into having high first week sales over anything else as far as the album is concerned so I'd be interested in seeing a list of how total sales compare to first week sales for some major albums. Either way, if MDNA follows that same method, she should make it to 700k or so.
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Chelsea Press 2
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Post by Chelsea Press 2 on Apr 5, 2012 20:26:40 GMT -5
I guess we haven't really tracked large second week drops in great detail. That list is for one week 1mil selling albums only Edited to make that distinction.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2012 20:32:03 GMT -5
Wow horrible drop for Madge I guess that concert promo really dis skew things. At least 500k is guaranteed and she got another #1 album :)
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Post by When I Ruled the World on Apr 5, 2012 20:43:22 GMT -5
I dont think madonna is releasing an album for another 5yrs I'd say 3 years (she's got to make another one for her touring contract.) I bet the lead single to that album will be fire, and make the Top10 for more than one week. I like about 4 tracks on the album ("Love Spent", "Gang Bang", "I'm Addicted", and "Masterpiece"). I think the first 3 of those are really great album tracks (not radio friendly, but some of the best songs aren't radio friendly). I think the album has the potential to grow on me, but only time will tell. "Hard Candy" never did... the only tracks I loved on it were "4 Minutes" and "Voices" (although I liked "Beat Goes On" and "Devil Wouldn't Recognize You"). I do think this album will be an underperformer, and she will have to come up with some radio friendly singles for the next album. She's not the type to only tour on her greatest hits (although she EASILY could), so the new albums she makes for the tours have to have at least one hit song. We need another "Hung Up", "Music" "4 Minutes", or "Die Another Day". Maybe she will go back to Stuart Price for the next album?
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SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Apr 5, 2012 20:50:58 GMT -5
I do think this album will be an underperformer, and she will have to come up with some radio friendly singles for the next album. totally disagree with you, 100%. her radio-friendly songs on MDNA are the worst of the bunch, although still great imo. Just not the standouts at all. I could care less about radio at this point. I'll take a song like Gang Bang or Love Spent over a song like Turn Up the Radio anyday.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Apr 5, 2012 20:51:27 GMT -5
Can't say the projection for Madge's album is totally shocking. Would be nice if it ends up near the higher end of the projection, so it passes 400K- and hopefully it hangs inside the top 10 for a second week.,
Lionel Richie's album will hold up well, as expected- he was out working the TV promo circuit again this week. The AMAs would impact most of this week, and then he also was on Ellen (Monday), Jimmy Kimmel (Wednesday)and The Talk (today).
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Post by closeyoureyes on Apr 5, 2012 21:09:03 GMT -5
Wow, you people sure are smug. You mean like you were last week? ;) I don't really have to explain why I was quick to defend Madonna last week. I'm a fan and certain people give her a hard time on here, and the constant passive aggressive digs at her irk me. I can't help it if I'd rather say something than shake it off. You guys are now celebrating her 2nd week drop as if it justifies something, I'm not sure what. That Madonna had no chance of selling well after everything stacked against her? Wow, would you like a cookie? I certainly wouldn't have done the same to people on here when Mariah Carey bombed miserably a few years ago with that album she put out, or when Janet Jackson bombed 3x in a row with her albums (throwing out some examples, you know). And let's not pretend like you all have no idea what I am talking about. ANYWAY Meanwhile if you wanna blame anyone for this, blame Interscope. The older Madonna, gets it seems the less she cares about the business details - I'm sure Interscope and Guy Oseary told her about the bundle and she was like "yeah whatever go ahead." 20 years ago she probably would have said no. But of course everyone in here will try to say that she was desperate to sell records...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2012 21:12:58 GMT -5
Kelly Clarkson (19/RCA) 27-30k Get that massive increase Kelly! :'(
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Post by When I Ruled the World on Apr 5, 2012 21:19:43 GMT -5
I do think this album will be an underperformer, and she will have to come up with some radio friendly singles for the next album. totally disagree with you, 100%. her radio-friendly songs on MDNA are the worst of the bunch, although still great imo. Just not the standouts at all. I could care less about radio at this point. I'll take a song like Gang Bang or Love Spent over a song like Turn Up the Radio anyday. She doesn't have any radio-friendly songs on MDNA. That was my point. What are the radio-friendly songs on MDNA? I agree with you that the best songs are "Gang Bang" and "Love Spent" - WHICH I SAID IN MY POST, AND YOU LEFT OUT This album has no radio friendly songs. I said she needs some for the next album. So how is it that you disagree with me 100%? I'd like to see you quote my original post and tell me how you disagree with it 100%. Oh, right... you can't. Because you edit like Fox News.
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seaguy27
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Post by seaguy27 on Apr 5, 2012 21:21:24 GMT -5
The Madonna numbers are about 1 thing and 1 thing only and that is promotion. It is unheard of in this day and age to not promote. The first week is all about the fan base buying your record and that happened because this album does excite a lot of her base. That is why you do promotion or lucky enough to have a hit radio single because that sustains an album past the launch week.
So Madonna's twitter promotion does not work because it doesn't sell the album beyond the fan base.
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Post by closeyoureyes on Apr 5, 2012 21:25:36 GMT -5
totally disagree with you, 100%. her radio-friendly songs on MDNA are the worst of the bunch, although still great imo. Just not the standouts at all. I could care less about radio at this point. I'll take a song like Gang Bang or Love Spent over a song like Turn Up the Radio anyday. She doesn't have any radio-friendly songs on MDNA. That was my point. What are the radio-friendly songs on MDNA? I agree with you that the best songs are "Gang Bang" and "Love Spent" - WHICH I SAID IN MY POST, AND YOU LEFT OUT This album has no radio friendly songs. I said she needs some for the next album. So how is it that you disagree with me 100%? I'd like to see you quote my original post and tell me how you disagree with it 100%. Oh, right... you can't. Because you edit like Fox News. WTF
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Post by When I Ruled the World on Apr 5, 2012 21:32:13 GMT -5
She doesn't have any radio-friendly songs on MDNA. That was my point. What are the radio-friendly songs on MDNA? I agree with you that the best songs are "Gang Bang" and "Love Spent" - WHICH I SAID IN MY POST, AND YOU LEFT OUT This album has no radio friendly songs. I said she needs some for the next album. So how is it that you disagree with me 100%? I'd like to see you quote my original post and tell me how you disagree with it 100%. Oh, right... you can't. Because you edit like Fox News. WTF Read original post (the full post). Read Spree's reply. He made it look like I said MDNA had radio friendly tracks (GMAYL, GGW, and TUTR) that are better than the album as a whole. Those are not radio friendly tracks, lol. They suck. I never said MDNA had radio friendly tracks (just great album tracks). I said her past 4 albums had radio friendly tracks (along with fantastic album tracks).
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SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Apr 5, 2012 21:37:22 GMT -5
GMAYL, GGW, and TUTR are radio-friendly. But they are near the bottom of the list, although the list is pretty high up to begin with. Do you want an entire album like those 3?
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Post by closeyoureyes on Apr 5, 2012 21:38:09 GMT -5
Read original post (the full post). Read Spree's reply. He made it look like I said MDNA had radio friendly tracks (GMAYL, GGW, and TUTR) that are better than the album as a whole. Those are not radio friendly tracks, lol. They suck. I never said MDNA had radio friendly tracks (just great album tracks). I said her past 4 albums had radio friendly tracks (along with fantastic album tracks). No I know, I just thought it sounded a little aggressive for such an innocuous post that Spree made. lol
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Post by When I Ruled the World on Apr 5, 2012 21:39:08 GMT -5
GMAYL, GGW, and TUTR are radio-friendly. But they are near the bottom of the list, although the list is pretty high up to begin with. Do you want an entire album like those 3? No, I dislike all those songs. None are radio friendly like "Music", "Die Another Day", "Hung Up" or "4 Minutes".
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Post by When I Ruled the World on Apr 5, 2012 21:47:08 GMT -5
Read original post (the full post). Read Spree's reply. He made it look like I said MDNA had radio friendly tracks (GMAYL, GGW, and TUTR) that are better than the album as a whole. Those are not radio friendly tracks, lol. They suck. I never said MDNA had radio friendly tracks (just great album tracks). I said her past 4 albums had radio friendly tracks (along with fantastic album tracks). No I know, I just thought it sounded a little aggressive for such an innocuous post that Spree made. lol after reading my post to Spree, I agree with you that it was too aggressive. Sorry Spree, and thanks to closeyoureyes for bringing it to my attention. *hugs* and sorry... I am a huge Madonna fan who is a bit frustrated. I'll enjoy "Love Spent", "Gang Bang", "I'm Addicted", and I'll quit trying to bitch.
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SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Apr 5, 2012 21:47:12 GMT -5
i'll never understand the high regard towards 4 Minutes. I think those 3 are way better, and personally much more enjoyable, regardless of radio-friendliness, than 4 Minutes.
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Post by closeyoureyes on Apr 5, 2012 21:52:26 GMT -5
i'll never understand the high regard towards 4 Minutes. I think those 3 are way better, and personally much more enjoyable, regardless of radio-friendliness, than 4 Minutes. I resent 4 Minutes quite a bit, despite my enjoyment of it. That song was an empty success, it didn't sell the album and it didn't generate interest for the 2nd single which bombed instantly (not that I blame radio for not playing it, Give It 2 Me sucked, but after a #3 song, you'd think they'd at least gave it a shot at top 40 lol)
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spooky21
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Post by spooky21 on Apr 5, 2012 21:52:55 GMT -5
You mean like you were last week? ;) I don't really have to explain why I was quick to defend Madonna last week. I'm a fan and certain people give her a hard time on here, and the constant passive aggressive digs at her irk me. I can't help it if I'd rather say something than shake it off. You guys are now celebrating her 2nd week drop as if it justifies something, I'm not sure what. That Madonna had no chance of selling well after everything stacked against her? Wow, would you like a cookie? I certainly wouldn't have done the same to people on here when Mariah Carey bombed miserably a few years ago with that album she put out, or when Janet Jackson bombed 3x in a row with her albums (throwing out some examples, you know). And let's not pretend like you all have no idea what I am talking about. ANYWAY Meanwhile if you wanna blame anyone for this, blame Interscope. The older Madonna, gets it seems the less she cares about the business details - I'm sure Interscope and Guy Oseary told her about the bundle and she was like "yeah whatever go ahead." 20 years ago she probably would have said no. But of course everyone in here will try to say that she was desperate to sell records... Looks like your fee fees got hurt. Look here buddy, this is a chart board. Any unusual activity on the charts will get analyzed and discussed regardless of the artist. Madonna is not special in that extent so there is no use sitting here and whining about people posting because they are just hating on her. Read the Gaga thread for an even more polarizing discussion on the first week sales for BTW. The Mariah flopping thread was also quite explosive. The biggest Madonna detractors and super stans like yourself will cancel each other out. The rest of us here live to make chart assumptions, analysis or arguments and pray/hope that the data vindicates us. If people are being celebratory, it is less of hating on Madonna and more of feeling vindicated about last week's arguments that this type of gimmicky concert promo is far too manipulative of the charts.
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chartfreak
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Post by chartfreak on Apr 5, 2012 22:00:49 GMT -5
What does "real sales" mean?
I think many are to quick to say that MDNA is dead. Yes, it's a huge drop, but I know a few casual fans that have not even pickd up the cd yet. Yes, I know, those few won't make a difference next week, but I'm sure there are many like them out there.
GGW can be a sleeper hit...you never know...at least a "hit" for Madonna, which would be more sustained airplay and an entry on the Hot 100. Believe it or not, there are stations that are playing the song.
If they do go with a 3rd single, which I can't imagine they don't, it can help in the long run.
Lastly, who cares if this hits only 700K, look at someone like Rihanna, that has massive airplay and promotion and her albums are not selling that much. (yes, I know the singles are, but still)
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Post by closeyoureyes on Apr 5, 2012 22:07:33 GMT -5
I don't really have to explain why I was quick to defend Madonna last week. I'm a fan and certain people give her a hard time on here, and the constant passive aggressive digs at her irk me. I can't help it if I'd rather say something than shake it off. You guys are now celebrating her 2nd week drop as if it justifies something, I'm not sure what. That Madonna had no chance of selling well after everything stacked against her? Wow, would you like a cookie? I certainly wouldn't have done the same to people on here when Mariah Carey bombed miserably a few years ago with that album she put out, or when Janet Jackson bombed 3x in a row with her albums (throwing out some examples, you know). And let's not pretend like you all have no idea what I am talking about. ANYWAY Meanwhile if you wanna blame anyone for this, blame Interscope. The older Madonna, gets it seems the less she cares about the business details - I'm sure Interscope and Guy Oseary told her about the bundle and she was like "yeah whatever go ahead." 20 years ago she probably would have said no. But of course everyone in here will try to say that she was desperate to sell records... Looks like your fee fees got hurt. Look here buddy, this is a chart board. Any unusual activity on the charts will get analyzed and discussed regardless of the artist. Madonna is not special in that extent so there is no use sitting here and whining about people posting because they are just hating on her. Read the Gaga thread for an even more polarizing discussion on the first week sales for BTW. The Mariah flopping thread was also quite explosive. The biggest Madonna detractors and super stans like yourself will cancel each other out. The rest of us here live to make chart assumptions, analysis or arguments and pray/hope that the data vindicates us. You know, if I am such a crazy STAN as you all love to call each other here, then I am not sure why you even entertain my posts in the first place. If everything I say is so unreasonable then why do you like to throw it in my face when I am wrong about something? If you're all about the STATS and the figures then glow on, ignore my crazy ass, but HERE WE ARE again. I think you enjoy this just as much as the rest of the MORTALS on this board.
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Post by closeyoureyes on Apr 5, 2012 22:14:11 GMT -5
What does "real sales" mean? I think many are to quick to say that MDNA is dead. Yes, it's a huge drop, but I know a few casual fans that have not even pickd up the cd yet. Yes, I know, those few won't make a difference next week, but I'm sure there are many like them out there. GGW can be a sleeper hit...you never know...at least a "hit" for Madonna, which would be more sustained airplay and an entry on the Hot 100. Believe it or not, there are stations that are playing the song. If they do go with a 3rd single, which I can't imagine they don't, it can help in the long run. Lastly, who cares if this hits only 700K, look at someone like Rihanna, that has massive airplay and promotion and her albums are not selling that much. (yes, I know the singles are, but still) A 3rd single to me is worthless without a video, and I fear that's what they're going to do - AGAIN.
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seaguy27
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Post by seaguy27 on Apr 5, 2012 22:14:16 GMT -5
Why is selling 700k these days a bad thing? In case you guys have not noticed album sales just do not do what they use to. 700K now is not what it was 10 years ago. Their has not been an album released yet this year that has scanned 1 million yet and we are in April already. I think anything over 500k is solid these days.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2012 22:16:46 GMT -5
^That list is missing a Jay Z album that fell 70% in its second week. I don't have the 2nd week in my files. I think Cynthia used Soundscan numbers to make that, but a general estimate version could be made using the old HITS data by finding the correct dates. Perhaps a separate thread dedicated to this type of info could be made. Yeah, I used Soundscan numbers. And as pointed out earlier that list is only albums that debuted with 1m+, though Gaga's 85% is probably the biggest drop of note. (What I mean by emphasizing "of note" is, I wouldn't doubt there are at least a few albums that had huger drops but they are likely albums that opened with such a small amount that a large drop would not even be noticed by anyone...if you are going from say, a 20k opening week to a 2k second week, we likely don't care enough to even note your debut week anyway, let alone your drop.) This is likely a question that would be most quickly answered by asking Billboard. Why is selling 700k these days a bad thing? In case you guys have not noticed album sales just do not do what they use to. 700K now is not what it was 10 years ago. Their has not been an album released yet this year that has scanned 1 million yet and we are in April already. I think anything over 500k is solid these days. You know, I think it's suffering from the same thing that BTW did. Generally an album's opening numbers are expected to be a very small percentage of the album's total sales (like, no more than 20%), b/c we expect that the artist will release multiple singles and do various promotion throughout the next several months to keep pushing the album. So when Gaga's total numbers right now are barely twice the amount of her debut week, it seems bad, and is a sign that she didn't live up to the initial (and impossibly large) hype she had going into the era. Should Gaga feel bad b/c her 2 million sales were more frontloaded than Katy, who opened with a "small" amount and much more manageable level of hype/expectation, then had to maintain momentum over 1 1/2 years to reach the same amount? Neither of them should feel bad at all, but people believe Gaga looks worse b/c she "should have" sold more but lost steam. That is how our view of things often gets affected. MDNA is on a smaller scale than BTW in this regard but it's the same thing. To open with over 350k and then struggle for another 8 1/2 months just to sell another 150-200k isn't really a good look to most people. It shows that the promotion and/or hits are lacking and reflects poorly on the album (whether that is fair or not depends on how one feels about the quality of the album). OTOH you may have people who open with 50k and then chug their way to gold, and it seems like a more hard-earned effort b/c they really had to work to keep themselves out there long enough to get to that point.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Apr 5, 2012 22:20:18 GMT -5
Jay-Z's Kingdom Come (2006) dropped 79% in its second week (from 680K to 140K), so that was another biggie.
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