Katy Perry - "Roar"

[Deleted]

Aug 10, 2013 11:58:50 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

lol, it's already beginning

Daaaaaaamn.

[Deleted]

Aug 10, 2013 13:18:18 GMT -5 @ihavemcpheever said:

Aug 10, 2013 12:03:46 GMT -5 crystalphnx said:

regarding all the "safe" comments - is there an implication that this approach is uncommon or somehow unique to Katy? were people really expecting this to be bluegrass or heavy metal? I can't think of many major pop stars over the past couple decades who have truly drastically changed their sound from one album to the next, especially at the peak of their popularity. "Russian Roulette" jumps to mind, since it didn't sound like anything on GGGB nor did it seem at all suited for Pop radio in 2009. Madonna also jumps to mind, but you could argue that she didn't start to really mix things up until Album #4. 

The video countdown things they've been posting have been about destroying the "old Katy" image, there was some talk (I think from an interview) about it being a bit darker, so some people were definitely expecting something different.

It was already confirmed to be not dark a week ago

Dr. Luke Doctor Luke thedoctorluke
it's not dark but it does sound different !!! still positive, uplifting.. catchy !!!

Though apparently it was supposed to sound "different".

[rosemoor]

Dr. Luke produced it? no wonder. :(

[Sir Benji]

1. This song came out a few months ago it was called "Brave" and the original is better than this watered down copy. Damn I mean how unoriginal can you be?
2. My ears are not ready for the live performances of this
3. It's okay I guess *shrugs*

[jjose712]

This will be very succesful, but it's like a poorer version (with far worst lyrics) of Brave (i don't know why this song is not smashing, it's instant catchy and very feel good song).

I only hope Sara get some exposure of this controversy and Brave get the success it deserves. Katy will be fine.
She is a classical pop singer, she is not Madonna, she is not Gaga, and she is not Rihanna, so i wasn't expecting changes or a new direction. Well, the only time she tried something different it was with Thinking of you, wich is a good song with a great video and it flopped (well, at least flopped for Katy standards), so i don't expect a Russian Roulette (a song that could have been a hit if they didn't pulled the plug that soon, in fact in Spain is Rihanna's biggest success with Umbrella and We found love) anytime soon

[Gold Soundz]

It's so clean and simple. I love the vocal, too, which was my main concern with Katy on a song like this. She sounds great.

[SuperTrouper]

Well. It's certainly not worse than the "California Gurls"-"TiK ToK" case.

[Love Plastic Love]

Uhm, I am so confused because this sounds like a cover of Brave essentially with a touch of Teenage Dream vocals and production. Does it sample Brave and Sara will get credit for it?

[sbme]

It's a great song, but I would have liked it more if it wasn't a carbon copy of Brave. It's a shame that this will probably be HUGE and Brave will be overshadowed by this monster. That being said, I still love both songs!

Reminds me of the controversy between Halo and Already Gone.

[Gold Soundz]

Aug 10, 2013 13:24:58 GMT -5 @ihavemcpheever said:

Aug 10, 2013 11:58:50 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

lol, it's already beginning

Daaaaaaamn.

Definitely more than a coincidence if Dr. Luke produced both, but those chords are so common. It's a variation on that Annie song, "Hard Knock Life." There will be no lawsuit. 

[Sir Benji]

California Gurls was/is better than Tik Tok though. This is nowhere near as good as "Brave" is.

[Mic Technique]

Heaven help me, I don't hate this.

[Legenderry]

Aug 10, 2013 13:13:38 GMT -5 allow that said:

Aug 10, 2013 12:52:18 GMT -5 Legenderry said:

I think it's really, and I mean really irrelevant that bringing in a new producer is what should be the target for every pop girl's new releases these days.

It's not about a "new producer" so much as progress and evolution. If that requires a new producer, so be it, but there's other ways as well.

In the case of "Roar" there's no doubt that it procures the ingredients required to push for a #1 hit, which perhaps is the only goal, but it's basically slopping the Teenage Dream writing formula and replacing a dancepop instrumental from 2011 over a fun.-drum instrumental du jour. Live fast, die young. Fast hit, watch it sound dated in three years time.

I think it's just a little petty, and honestly seems like it's worth nothing more than bragging rights for fanbases on music forums.

Why so quick to dismiss other opinions as being biased by "fanbase" while your username and avatar are so decked out? Do you see anyone in my avatar?

I don't think any of the pop girls have naturally evolved a lot in the past years. Gaga, Rihanna, P!nk, Kelly Clarkson, etc etc... haven't evolved. They're mostly still doing the same thing, so it's kind of skewed how Katy Perry is always on the receiving end of the criticism for not evolving IMO, especially while this song does sound different from her previous work.

I was just giving an example re: bragging rights for fanbases. But that wasn't the point anyway, the point was that I think it's irrelevant how pop girls should bring in new sounds/producers in order for their new music to be remarkable. Artists can evolve while still working with the same people, I think Katy Perry is a good example of that. I wasn't saying you were biased, that has nothing to do with that particular opinion of yours, I just think it's stupid that people act like sticking with the same writers and producers means your music is not evolving and is automatically less remarkable than working with someone new like Britney is with Naughty Boy. If that collab ends being really succesful, you'll hear thousands of Britney fans saying she brought him into mainstream = bragging rights. Same goes for Rihanna and Calvin Harris/EDM, except this one is invalid.

[Love Plastic Love]

Aug 10, 2013 13:36:39 GMT -5 Gold Soundz said:

Aug 10, 2013 13:24:58 GMT -5 @ihavemcpheever said:

Daaaaaaamn.

Definitely more than a coincidence if Dr. Luke produced both, but those chords are so common. It's a variation on that Annie song, "Hard Knock Life." There will be no lawsuit. 

This is like...a direct lift though of the exact music. It really sounds like a sample to me so maybe we are all freaking out when really Dr. Luke and Katy will give credit to the original track that was sampled. I mean, we don't KNOW that Sara and this song aren't credited.

[Deleted]

The structure and theme are pretty much "Brave"; but the production is more in line with "So Good".

[SuperTrouper]

"Brave" is produced by Mark Endert and written by Sara and Jack Antonoff - who, funnily enough, is the guitarist of fun. and a co-writer on "We Are Young".

The credits of "Roar" is not out yet I think, although Billboard said it's "reportedly" co-written by Katy, Dr. Luke, Max Martin and Bonnie McKee.

[Gold Soundz]

This is how Pop music operates. There are only so many chord changes. There's a slight chord change on the verse and a bigger one on the chorus. Dr. Luke finds chords he likes and uses them over and over, like many other successful Pop producers have done. The melody is so common. The choruses have slightly different chord progressions, too, but you could sing One Republic's "Secrets" over both of them. I'm not trying to defend him. He should've waited a while. It's not plagiarism, though, and it's not nearly as bad as CG/TT or Tedder's Halo/Already Gone. I used to call "rip-off" on every song I heard that sounded really similar, but then I stumbled on this:

www.hooktheory.com/trends

[Brazilian Guy]

This will be a huge hit though. It's even more adult contemporary friendly than Teenage Dream and that album already slayed Hot AC like there was no tomorrow. Poor Pink, her reign will probably be snatched.

[jjose712]

Aug 10, 2013 13:38:30 GMT -5 Legenderry said:

Aug 10, 2013 13:13:38 GMT -5 allow that said:

It's not about a "new producer" so much as progress and evolution. If that requires a new producer, so be it, but there's other ways as well.

In the case of "Roar" there's no doubt that it procures the ingredients required to push for a #1 hit, which perhaps is the only goal, but it's basically slopping the Teenage Dream writing formula and replacing a dancepop instrumental from 2011 over a fun.-drum instrumental du jour. Live fast, die young. Fast hit, watch it sound dated in three years time.

Why so quick to dismiss other opinions as being biased by "fanbase" while your username and avatar are so decked out? Do you see anyone in my avatar?

I don't think any of the pop girls have naturally evolved a lot in the past years. Gaga, Rihanna, P!nk, Kelly Clarkson, etc etc... haven't evolved. They're mostly still doing the same thing, so it's kind of skewed how Katy Perry is always on the receiving end of the criticism for not evolving IMO, especially while this song does sound different from her previous work.

I was just giving an example re: bragging rights for fanbases. But that wasn't the point anyway, the point was that I think it's irrelevant how pop girls should bring in new sounds/producers in order for their new music to be remarkable. Artists can evolve while still working with the same people, I think Katy Perry is a good example of that. I wasn't saying you were biased, that has nothing to do with that particular opinion of yours, I just think it's stupid that people act like sticking with the same writers and producers means your music is not evolving and is automatically less remarkable than working with someone new like Britney is with Naughty Boy. If that collab ends being really succesful, you'll hear thousands of Britney fans saying she brought him into mainstream = bragging rights. Same goes for Rihanna and Calvin Harris/EDM, except this one is invalid.

It's not about evolution. Gaga was always more creative than Katy, and Rihanna like to experiment a lot of different styles. Pink and Kelly always fluctuate between pop and soft rock (and lately country in Kelly's case).

I like Katy, her songs are instant catchy, it's pure pop. Of course she was quite controversial from the beginning, and her success makes easier to put her as target than any other of pop divas.

To be honest, i'm not sure if she is able to make a turn around in her career, to put a comparision with writers, Stephen king is able to write very different type of books and being successful, but i'm pretty sure that Dan Brown is unable to do it (i'm not comparing Katy with Dan, her songs are far better than his books). Her last album was a big hit, with tons of number ones, so i think tptb will oppose to major changes in her style. The only way i see a big change in her music is if for some reason, the album or her songs start to flop

[Rocky]

They definitely wanted to reproduce the new-wave hip hop and the Jeff Bhasker-fun.-sound, mix it together and put a "we are young, we are rebel, we are independent and we stand on the grouns" lyrics. Amazing.
The song is such an earworm. It's in your head for the whole day. Just like fun.'s singles or the aforementioned "So Good". Lol the "Brave" comparison is so obvious. At least aomeone is making a bit hit of that tune if Sara won't. I want Zedd for single #2.

[Love Plastic Love]

I have mixed feelings about this song even putting aside the cover/sample issues. On one hand, this does nothing to make me think more of Dr. Luke and I think Katy deserves a bit better. It is basically a direct rip-off much like California Gurlz was and I feel like the biggest pop star out there and the biggest pop producers can do better than ripping off Sara Bareilles with some fun. elements heaped in.
However, it is admittedly very well-done and catchy and I do think it will smash so maybe the joke is on me and this IS what the biggest pop star right now needs to be doing to grab #1s and continue smashing. Like, CG was a Tik Tok rip off, but everyone lapped it up and sent it straight to #1. I can genuinely see this being huge for her and I guess everyone copies (Gaga, Britney, Beyonce, even Madonna has had her fair share) so I should get over it lol.


***I feel like I need a disclaimer-by biggest pop star right now I mean I do think Katy is the biggest current pop star in the US. I realize it gets complicated when you look at overall picture, consider all cds and sales, historical data, tour revenue, worldwide sales and we could probably debate all day who is the biggest pop star or what that even means. I just meant I think, right now, she is the biggest pop star in the US with the most hype.

[sbme]

She did tweet that she loved Brave on May 15:

So maybe she actually did sample it.

[Adonis the DemiGod!]

This is safe. I was hoping for something less safe from Katy Perry. This is too safe. I don't think #1 is in the cards. I'd say #3 if she's lucky. WOW! What a blown opportunity. I'd go back in the studio and forget this ever happened. the record company should send out cease and desist orders to keep this song from ever charting at all.

[Soldado de Juguete]

On first listen, I hated it because of her voice in the chorus, but now I really like this song :)

[Deleted]

So, I've decided that this is an accurate description of the song:

It's "Brave" with better production but has the same lyrical content as "Catch My Breath" with weaker lyrics than both of them, particularly the latter.

Basically, I love it.

[Love Plastic Love]

Aug 10, 2013 13:56:30 GMT -5 sbme said:

She did tweet that she loved Brave on May 15:

So maybe she actually did sample it.

Yeah it is possible since she just tweeted about liking it. We will feel dumb if she did and we are accusing her of ripping it off lol.

[HolidayGuy]

Will radio play this early, or is there a "debut" set for Monday?

[SuperTrouper]

Wouldn't it be weird that she sampled a brand new song from a relatively known artist that just got the video treatment? :/

[Deleted]

Aug 10, 2013 13:50:11 GMT -5 Gold Soundz said:

This is how Pop music operates. There are only so many chord changes. There's a slight chord change on the verse and a bigger one on the chorus. Dr. Luke finds chords he likes and uses them over and over, like many other successful Pop producers have done. The melody is so common. The choruses have slightly different chord progressions, too, but you could sing One Republic's "Secrets" over both of them. I'm not trying to defend him. He should've waited a while. It's not plagiarism, though, and it's not nearly as bad as CG/TT or Tedder's Halo/Already Gone. I used to call "rip-off" on every song I heard that sounded really similar, but then I stumbled on this:

www.hooktheory.com/trends

It's not just the chord progression though, its a lot more...

[Gold Soundz]

Also, the cadence in the verses reminds me of "Ho Hey." I'm not going to enjoy it any less. Great pop songs come from deconstructing other great pop songs and seeing what works and what could be better. Katy's song is the better of the two IMHO (re: Sarah).