Hot 100: 04/25/2015 - See You Again Uptown Funk!

[crystalphnx]

Apr 15, 2015 20:49:45 GMT -5 leonagwen said:

The #27 song on mediabase is the #1 song on the hot 100.I just think that airplay should have more weight in the chart formula.

Fair enough, though that's a complaint I don't see too often.

I like the idea of the components over which consumers have the most direct control (sales + streaming) having the most weight - especially since there's still those ridiculous Clear Channel/iHeartRadio "deals" in which a new song gets played as often as every hour, guaranteed, and all of that airplay counts toward the Hot 100 (as far as I understand.)

[Gary]

Still, overwhelming #1 in sales and overwhelming #1 in streaming. Although airplay is still low, they made the right choice for #1

[Deleted]

Apr 15, 2015 20:54:19 GMT -5 Verisimilitude said:

The only other country that does include airplay in their official chart is Canada.

...huh?

[slamina]

Oh god. Looks like we're looking at another mull-week monster. I like when there's more turnover than this. It just gets really stagnant and boring. :/

[Green Baron]

Apr 15, 2015 20:59:30 GMT -5 Gary said:

Still, overwhelming #1 in sales and overwhelming #1 in streaming. Although airplay is still low, they made the right choice for #1

They didn't make a right choice for #1. The given numbers that the song produced were higher than Uptown Funk's, period. That's why it's #1.

[crystalphnx]

Apr 15, 2015 21:27:32 GMT -5 @markg94 said:

Apr 15, 2015 20:54:19 GMT -5 Verisimilitude said:

The only other country that does include airplay in their official chart is Canada.

...huh?

Could you possibly say a bit more about what you find confusing or unclear?

The Canadian Hot 100, much like the Hot 100, combines single sales, streaming, and radio audience. Whereas...

The ARIA Top 100 (Australia) only utilizes sales. The UK Singles Chart (compiled by the OCC) only utilizies sales and streaming. Etc.

Were you thinking of other official charts that use airplay, besides the US and Canada, that weren't mentioned?

[Rose "Payola" Nylund]

Apr 15, 2015 21:38:16 GMT -5 Gary said:

Apr 15, 2015 21:34:36 GMT -5 Green Baron said:

They didn't make a right choice for #1. The given numbers that the song produced were higher than Uptown Funk's, period. That's why it's #1.

What do those numbers mean to you?  Why is it not the right choice? 

I think he's saying it's not a choice at all because the numbers themselves give the result we get.

[Green Baron]

Apr 15, 2015 22:00:33 GMT -5 Gary said:

Apr 15, 2015 21:52:11 GMT -5 Rose "Payola" Nylund said:

I think he's saying it's not a choice at all because the numbers themselves give the result we get.

Well yes, but why do we not believe those numbers?  Is there a better choice?  Why?  (was hoping he could expand on that other than the obvious: it knocked Uptown Funk from #1 and denied it a shot at the record)

I never mentioned not believing those numbers. I'm just saying, since you said Billboard made the right choice for #1, that Billboard doesn't choose what song goes #1. They just look at the statistics and compute to find out which one has more points.

[Gary]

Apr 15, 2015 22:12:02 GMT -5 Green Baron said:

Apr 15, 2015 22:00:33 GMT -5 Gary said:

Well yes, but why do we not believe those numbers?  Is there a better choice?  Why?  (was hoping he could expand on that other than the obvious: it knocked Uptown Funk from #1 and denied it a shot at the record)

I never mentioned not believing those numbers. I'm just saying, since you said Billboard made the right choice for #1, that Billboard doesn't choose what song goes #1. They just look at the statistics and compute to find out which one has more points.

They do in fact choose.  They set the formula.  They could have selected a different formula or some other method.  What would you say is #1, instead of the one announced today?

[tekkenguy]

Fun fact: "See You Again" has more points this week than "Uptown Funk" had in all but one of its 14 weeks at #1.

[jenglisbe]

Apr 15, 2015 22:13:52 GMT -5 Gary said:

Apr 15, 2015 22:12:02 GMT -5 Green Baron said:

I never mentioned not believing those numbers. I'm just saying, since you said Billboard made the right choice for #1, that Billboard doesn't choose what song goes #1. They just look at the statistics and compute to find out which one has more points.

They do in fact choose.  They set the formula.  They could have selected a different formula or some other method.  What would you say is #1, instead of the one announced today?

Choosing a formula is different than choosing a specific song. They don't change the formula week-to-week to ensure a specific song is #1.

[jenglisbe]

How many weeks was "One Sweet Day" on Hot 100 Airplay before it debuted on the Hot 100?

[allow that]

Apr 15, 2015 22:23:02 GMT -5 tekkenguy said:

Fun fact: "See You Again" has more points this week than "Uptown Funk" had in all but one of its 14 weeks at #1.

Wow! I guess that puts a lot into perspective. January/February #1's are notoriously weak.

[Gary]

Apr 15, 2015 22:32:44 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

Apr 15, 2015 22:13:52 GMT -5 Gary said:

They do in fact choose.  They set the formula.  They could have selected a different formula or some other method.  What would you say is #1, instead of the one announced today?

Choosing a formula is different than choosing a specific song. They don't change the formula week-to-week to ensure a specific song is #1.

You can "choose" whatever formula you want to manipulate whatever outcome you desire.  The magazine we all follow chose a formula that set the outcome for this week at #1.  Their magazine, they can chose whatever they want.  The question I am asking is why is the formula they CHOSE, to be in place for this particular week (obviously the same as many prior weeks) that led to the outcome at #1, not the right choice?

This is turning into a ridiculous conversation.  My original post, in response to a post about the 27th or whatever) most popular song at radio being #1 makes the Billboard method a joke.  Well, what makes it not a joke?  What is the right #1?  Looks like the method chosen by the magazine landed the right one.  If that isn't the right one, what is?

[jenglisbe]

Apr 15, 2015 22:40:50 GMT -5 Gary said:

Apr 15, 2015 22:32:44 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

Choosing a formula is different than choosing a specific song. They don't change the formula week-to-week to ensure a specific song is #1.

You can "choose" whatever formula you want to manipulate whatever outcome you desire.  The magazine we all follow chose a formula that set the outcome for this week at #1.  Their magazine, they can chose whatever they want.  The question I am asking is why was that not the right choice?

You replied to a post that said Billboard doesn't choose what song goes to #1 by saying yes they do. They may indirectly determine #1 because of the formula, but that's different than chart managers saying, "We want this to be #1 so this week let's change the formula to ensure it's #1." That would literally be Billboard choosing what is #1; Billboard set a formula (based on input from record labels) that determines what is #1. Saying Billboard chooses the #1 under the current system is like saying Americans choose every policy a President signs because they chose that President.

[Gary]

Apr 15, 2015 22:47:00 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

Apr 15, 2015 22:40:50 GMT -5 Gary said:

You can "choose" whatever formula you want to manipulate whatever outcome you desire.  The magazine we all follow chose a formula that set the outcome for this week at #1.  Their magazine, they can chose whatever they want.  The question I am asking is why was that not the right choice?

You replied to a post that said Billboard doesn't choose what song goes to #1 by saying yes they do. They may indirectly determine #1 because of the formula, but that's different than chart managers saying, "We want this to be #1 so this week let's change the formula to ensure it's #1." That would literally be Billboard choosing what is #1; Billboard set a formula (based on input from record labels) that determines what is #1. Saying Billboard chooses the #1 under the current system is like saying Americans choose every policy a President signs because they chose that President.

Yes Billboard set a formula based on input from record labels that determines #1.  They chose the final formula that determined this weeks #1 and all prior #1's for that matter.  They could have easily gone a different direction with a different formula.



This is turning into a ridiculous conversation. My original post, was in response to a post about the 27th or whatever) most popular song at radio being #1 makes the Billboard method a joke. Well, what makes it not a joke? What is the right #1? Looks like the method chosen by the magazine landed the right one, in my opinion. If that isn't the right one, what is?

Hopefully that is more clear as to what my question is?

[badrobot]

You guys are stuck on crazy semantics here, and jenglisbe is being a bit pedantic/cryptic. I think jenglisbe is just saying an algorithm led to SYA being #1, not any choice being made, and is not criticizing the end result, but rather just spending a lot of posts picking at one word by saying BB didn't "chose" anything.

Bottom line -- if anyone doesn't think a song should be #1, they should keep in mind that they're criticizing an algorithm, not a singular event.

I don't really see how anyone could think SYA shouldn't deserve to be #1 anyway. When a song dominates 2 of the 3 major components by selling roughly 3x its next competitor and almost breaking a record for streaming, it seems pretty clear cut.

Having watched the charts for over 20 years, I can tell you the Hot 100 formula right now is probably the most "fair" it's ever been. I think they have more kinks to work out with how they factor in streaming (that whole "watched a video and a song happened to be in it" vs. "watched a video BECAUSE of the song" issue is still fuzzy and really hard to figure out how to handle programatically), but they have shown a willingness to evolve and adapt that they were WAY too hesitant to embrace in the late 90s / early 00s.

[Gary]

The written word is a funny thing, many interpretations. The song dominates in 2 of 3 metrics and is low in the 3rd. They "chose" the right #1. I thought was clear that I meant the method and not any one person making an actual choice.  As it was the method that I was responding to in the first place. Sorry for leading this thread down yet another weird path. (This thread has seen its share for sure)

[jenglisbe]

Is there not a thread for next week? Anyway "SYA" is setting streaming records:
www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/wiz-khalifas-furious-7-single-789034

[Deleted]

Apr 15, 2015 21:40:51 GMT -5 crystalphnx said:

Apr 15, 2015 21:27:32 GMT -5 @markg94 said:

...huh?

Could you possibly say a bit more about what you find confusing or unclear?

The Canadian Hot 100, much like the Hot 100, combines single sales, streaming, and radio audience. Whereas...

The ARIA Top 100 (Australia) only utilizes sales. The UK Singles Chart (compiled by the OCC) only utilizies sales and streaming. Etc.

Were you thinking of other official charts that use airplay, besides the US and Canada, that weren't mentioned?

Oh oops I misread it as "doesn't" instead of "does"

[thebops]

I am a little surprised that so many people are happy that UF won't break the record. I'm all for turnover and I could understand if it was week 8 or even 10, but at week 14 I was hoping to see a new record set. Even though it is tough to compare eras, a record is still a record and breaking one that is close to 2 decades old is something that doesn't happen very often. Was hoping for a rebound week 15 for UF but it doesn't look realistic now. I thought the streaming was going to be closer.

[thebops]

Also, LOL at the Billboard article paragraph: "The origin of "Dance"? Walk the Moon's Nicholas Petricca recently told Billboard that he and his girlfriend were at a Los Angeles club and "it was taking forever to get a drink at the bar. I was frustrated because there was great music playing and I wanted to be out there. She was like, 'Shut up and dance with me!"

Sorry, but that is about the lamest story on how a song title got its name.

[ry4n]

Apr 15, 2015 21:40:51 GMT -5 crystalphnx said:

The ARIA Top 100 (Australia) only utilizes sales.

The ARIA charts do include streaming actually (as of November-ish last year). Though they have a small weight and their effect in the official chart isn't as noticeable as, say, the UK.

I think almost every country includes streaming now. Except maybe France cuz they're slow to add anything to theirs.

[rimetm]

Let's do it!

-Somebody actually keeps up at #11, which means FourFiveSeconds crashes 9-13.

-B Better Have My Money is out of the top 20 19-21 thanks to Post to Be.

-Dear Future Husband surges 39-26. Could it follow the usual Meghan trajectory and challenge top 10 in 2 weeks or so?

-Rae Sremmurd now have their 2nd top 30. With its slow trajectory (51-33-34-30), could it stall?

-Heartbeat Song continues its seesaw (31-24-31).

-Other than Worth It, Honey, I'm Good becomes a hit in a 45-34 move. No longer hits are Only (38-41) and Outside (32-46).

-Where Are U Now blasts 64-42 following its consistent top 20 sales.

-Hey Mama hits the top 50 54-44 for basically the same reason.

-Elastic Heart returns 52-47 thanks to top 40 sales and Slow Motion makes it 51-45. These 4 collectively boot 7/11 (49-51), Ain't Worth the Whiskey (48-55), Night Changes (50-X, recurrent), and Animals (47-X, recurrent).

-All Day recovers 69-52 because...well, I don't know. Can someone fill me in?

-Furious 7 songs are doing well. Not only does GDFR bullet and Get Low gains 77-61, but Ride Out is the top debut at #70 and Go Hard or Go Home comes back at a new peak of #86.

-You Know You Like It follows its soundtrack brother 83-67; could it be the enduring hit and get AlunaGeorge some notice in the US?

-Commas blasts 98-79.

-Twentyonepilots make a second, slightly bigger debut with Tears in My Heart at #82.

-Crash and Burn, primarily fueled by sales, debuts at #96.

-Goodbye, experiencing a surge in its 69 cent price (that's already faded for next week), debuts at #98.

-Easton Corbin starts off at #99 with Baby Be My Love Song.

-Major Lazer has his first charter since Bubble Butt, getting a #100 spot with Lean On, which also features the clout-gaining DJ Snake and slightly familiar MO (who did at least have a hit with Iggy Azalea).

-Gone from the Hot 100 are I See You (100-X), Apparently (99-X), CoCo (77-X, recurrent), I Bet My Life (58-X, recurrent), and She Knows (55-X, recurrent).

-Set to go next week are 7/11 (49-51) and Homegrown Honey (62-81).

[jjose712]

Apr 16, 2015 2:07:04 GMT -5 thebops said:

Also, LOL at the Billboard article paragraph: "The origin of "Dance"? Walk the Moon's Nicholas Petricca recently told Billboard that he and his girlfriend were at a Los Angeles club and "it was taking forever to get a drink at the bar. I was frustrated because there was great music playing and I wanted to be out there. She was like, 'Shut up and dance with me!"

Sorry, but that is about the lamest story on how a song title got its name.

Yes, but that's the truth. They won't make a trilogy about that anecdote, that's for sure, but i suppose what they wanted to say it's that the most trivial moment could be the seed of a hit

And about being happy for SYA, i think it depends of your feelings for UF. I don't like the song (nothing against it, it's as simple as i don't like funk music) but i recognize it's a good song. The fact don't being a fan influence the feeling of wantin UF out of number one a good bunch of weeks ago, but frankly nothing on the chart looked if they have a chance to dethroned, so SYA is welcome to me.

Maybe in five or six i will be waiting for something to dethrone SYA, but i enjoy the change for now.
Anyway, the fact that there's no new Mark song on the charts (and i don't think it will be new Bruno material either) it means the song will stay in the charts for a good while. Stay with me still has tons of airplay even after two more successful songs, so i don't expect UF to drop like a stone (and in some charts like AC or Urban AC the songs that reach the top generally spend months and months in the high part of the chart)

[jarhys]

Why did Earned It gain in performance and fall from #4 to #6,
whereas Thinking Out Loud didn't gain in performance but stay at #5?

[allow that]

Apr 16, 2015 10:48:13 GMT -5 jarhys said:

Why did Earned It gain in performance and fall from #4 to #6,
whereas Thinking Out Loud didn't gain in performance but stay at #5?

Yeah I noticed that too. How did "Thinking Out Loud" possibly jump over a song that outgained it all week?

[ry4n]

Earned It dropped 4-9 on Streaming Songs and LMLYD dropped 6-12. Not sure what happened there.

[YourFaveIsAFlop]

Apr 16, 2015 2:07:04 GMT -5 thebops said:

Also, LOL at the Billboard article paragraph: "The origin of "Dance"? Walk the Moon's Nicholas Petricca recently told Billboard that he and his girlfriend were at a Los Angeles club and "it was taking forever to get a drink at the bar. I was frustrated because there was great music playing and I wanted to be out there. She was like, 'Shut up and dance with me!"

Sorry, but that is about the lamest story on how a song title got its name.

No worse than Shakira saying Hips Don't Lie came to her in a dream...even though the song had existed since 2004 as Dance Like This by Wyclef Jean, the label had brought Wyclef in specifically to remix something to save the Oral Fixation album and Shakira had used the phrase "hips don't lie" several months prior to the alleged "dream" in an interview with Ellen.

[85la]

Apr 16, 2015 10:56:19 GMT -5 allow that said:

Apr 16, 2015 10:48:13 GMT -5 jarhys said:

Why did Earned It gain in performance and fall from #4 to #6,
whereas Thinking Out Loud didn't gain in performance but stay at #5?

Yeah I noticed that too. How did "Thinking Out Loud" possibly jump over a song that outgained it all week?

I have a possible explanation: maybe Billboard changed the formula slightly (obviously without telling us), and based the "points increased" indicators as if the new formula were in place last week, which would also change the rankings from last week, hypothetically; so if the new formula were in place last week, TOL would have ranked no higher than #7.