Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815...
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Post by Me. I Am l!nk!nfan815... on Jan 27, 2020 16:26:41 GMT -5
Ariana has been seen as this generation’s Mariah. Despite her legendary career, Mariah only has 5 Grammys, and she won had 2 for the first 15 years of her career. Ariana is the new Mariah indeed. (That is not ,want to say Ariana is on that level, just saying she’s seen as similar to Mariah and this seems to be part of it.) I didn’t know Mariah had only 2 before Emancipation. Was she not much respected in the industry back then? I always assumed she was sort of an Adele in early 90s regarding critical recognition. She has been nominated 34 times though, and 3 times for Album of the Year which is considered a lot for a female. They use to like her enough for a nomination but no even close for some wins. |
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 27, 2020 16:32:24 GMT -5
Ariana has been seen as this generation’s Mariah. Despite her legendary career, Mariah only has 5 Grammys, and she won had 2 for the first 15 years of her career. Ariana is the new Mariah indeed. (That is not ,want to say Ariana is on that level, just saying she’s seen as similar to Mariah and this seems to be part of it.) I didn’t know Mariah had only 2 before Emancipation. Was she not much respected in the industry back then? I always assumed she was sort of an Adele in early 90s regarding critical recognition. Mariah has been nominated 3 times for ROTY, 3 times for AOTY, and twice for SOTY yet hasn't won any. She was nominated for Pop Female 8 different times, but only won once (for "Vision of Love"). She went 0-for-4 in Pop Collaboration, including "One Sweet Day" losing to a random entry. She went 1-for-4 in R&B Female and didn't even get nominated for hits like "Touch My Body" and "Obsessed." The going assumption is that for most of the 90s she was slighted because of her marriage to Tommy, and that since then her image has worked against her. |
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 27, 2020 16:35:55 GMT -5
Browsing through that page and it's crazy that Björk has never won a Grammy!! I mean one of the most influential ARTISTS of all time. Part of the issue is that her peak was when alternative music in general was huge. For instance, in the 90s she lost Alternative Album to Nirvana and Radiohead, respectively. I know since then she lost to The White Stripes, but I can't remember who else. She's been nominated for Video several times, but her losses are to videos like "Scream" and "Ray of Light." So, tough competition. Of course, Grammy favorites tend to win regardless, so she obviously isn't one. |
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kimberly
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Post by kimberly on Jan 27, 2020 18:27:06 GMT -5
I can't believe that after these past few weeks (and s**t being totally legit or not) so many people still seem to care about who gets to win a Grammy like it means anything that great. I can't believe Diddy of all people was the only one to seemingly acknowledge the mess and not even at the actual show but a pre-party... I suppose the artists endorse the fraud and are willing to keep playing the game tryna appease certain top players, welp sad industry the entertainment one seems to be. Alicia kind of addressed it. It is an on-going scandal that concerns the nomination process and committees (and obviously the sexual misconduct) within the Academy. The winners last night were chosen by thousands of Grammy voters (as far as we know) and Deborah's allegations never mention awards being given out to losers of the vote. On the other hand, I think Taylor, Gaga and Beyonce skipping the show this year (thus leaving Ariana Grande as THE A-lister in the building) speaks to where the show is headed. Next thing you know, it'll be filled with David Dobriks and Nikita Draguns with no high-caliber artists in sight lmao. I'm excited about the Spotify Awards or whatever it is they're launching. They might bring some new ideas to the lazy-ass Academy about inclusivity. |
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 27, 2020 18:59:27 GMT -5
I can't believe that after these past few weeks (and s**t being totally legit or not) so many people still seem to care about who gets to win a Grammy like it means anything that great. I can't believe Diddy of all people was the only one to seemingly acknowledge the mess and not even at the actual show but a pre-party... I suppose the artists endorse the fraud and are willing to keep playing the game tryna appease certain top players, welp sad industry the entertainment one seems to be. Alicia kind of addressed it. It is an on-going scandal that concerns the nomination process and committees (and obviously the sexual misconduct) within the Academy. The winners last night were chosen by thousands of Grammy voters (as far as we know) and Deborah's allegations never mention awards being given out to losers of the vote. On the other hand, I think Taylor, Gaga and Beyonce skipping the show this year (thus leaving Ariana Grande as THE A-lister in the building) speaks to where the show is headed. Next thing you know, it'll be filled with David Dobriks and Nikita Draguns with no high-caliber artists in sight lmao. I'm excited about the Spotify Awards or whatever it is they're launching. They might bring some new ideas to the lazy-ass Academy about inclusivity. The thing that makes the Grammys different - even with sketchy practices - is that they are voted on by people in the industry. There are so many awards shows, most of which are decided by fans in some way or another (sales, voting, whatever). What will these Spotify Awards be? Do we really need another awards show, especially one where fans decide it? And really, are fans banding together to influence these shows any different than industry people voting for their friends/connections? |
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gabe
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Post by gabe on Jan 27, 2020 19:00:12 GMT -5
it's laughable that ariana grande, one of the biggest people in the industry, didn't get a single award Idk why everyone is shocked. She literally had a song called "break up with your girlfriend, i'm bored." Mindless Bops =/= Grammy wins and how iconic is that? got everyone talking when she released the tracklist |
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kimberly
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Post by kimberly on Jan 27, 2020 19:29:52 GMT -5
Alicia kind of addressed it. It is an on-going scandal that concerns the nomination process and committees (and obviously the sexual misconduct) within the Academy. The winners last night were chosen by thousands of Grammy voters (as far as we know) and Deborah's allegations never mention awards being given out to losers of the vote. On the other hand, I think Taylor, Gaga and Beyonce skipping the show this year (thus leaving Ariana Grande as THE A-lister in the building) speaks to where the show is headed. Next thing you know, it'll be filled with David Dobriks and Nikita Draguns with no high-caliber artists in sight lmao. I'm excited about the Spotify Awards or whatever it is they're launching. They might bring some new ideas to the lazy-ass Academy about inclusivity. The thing that makes the Grammys different - even with sketchy practices - is that they are voted on by people in the industry. There are so many awards shows, most of which are decided by fans in some way or another (sales, voting, whatever). What will these Spotify Awards be? Do we really need another awards show, especially one where fans decide it? And really, are fans banding together to influence these shows any different than industry people voting for their friends/connections? Yeah I agree with you in all that -- but it is important to note that the "peers in the music industry" that vote for the grammy's are unfortunately only 21% women and 28% POC. So while Grammy's is and will be the biggest award for music, much like the Oscars, for years to come, they really need to change to keep up with the times. They can start by doing away with some of the old white men in the committee :))) and adding more women and POC into the mix. I'm excited for Spotify Awards because they're launching NOW, and social norms now are way different than when the Grammy's started. So they have to be representative of minorities, queer artists, and they will probably rely on people's streaming habits to give out the awards, which is pretty cool. (Idk if it's fan voted—I think if it's based on streams it sort of isn't?) Apple Music Awarded their AOTY to Golden Hour last year and Billie this year, accurately predicting the Grammy's. So if they go that route they might be able to tune into what's good more than what's popular. Either way, I'm excited to see what they come up with. |
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 27, 2020 20:40:47 GMT -5
The thing that makes the Grammys different - even with sketchy practices - is that they are voted on by people in the industry. There are so many awards shows, most of which are decided by fans in some way or another (sales, voting, whatever). What will these Spotify Awards be? Do we really need another awards show, especially one where fans decide it? And really, are fans banding together to influence these shows any different than industry people voting for their friends/connections? Yeah I agree with you in all that -- but it is important to note that the "peers in the music industry" that vote for the grammy's are unfortunately only 21% women and 28% POC. So while Grammy's is and will be the biggest award for music, much like the Oscars, for years to come, they really need to change to keep up with the times. They can start by doing away with some of the old white men in the committee :))) and adding more women and POC into the mix. I'm excited for Spotify Awards because they're launching NOW, and social norms now are way different than when the Grammy's started. So they have to be representative of minorities, queer artists, and they will probably rely on people's streaming habits to give out the awards, which is pretty cool. (Idk if it's fan voted—I think if it's based on streams it sort of isn't?) Apple Music Awarded their AOTY to Golden Hour last year and Billie this year, accurately predicting the Grammy's. So if they go that route they might be able to tune into what's good more than what's popular. Either way, I'm excited to see what they come up with. White people are 72% of the population at last count, so POC being 28% of the Grammy voters is actually on par with population. That's better than I'd assumed, actually. Obviously the % of women is too low. |
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seak05
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Post by seak05 on Jan 27, 2020 20:50:03 GMT -5
Yeah I agree with you in all that -- but it is important to note that the "peers in the music industry" that vote for the grammy's are unfortunately only 21% women and 28% POC. So while Grammy's is and will be the biggest award for music, much like the Oscars, for years to come, they really need to change to keep up with the times. They can start by doing away with some of the old white men in the committee  ) and adding more women and POC into the mix. I'm excited for Spotify Awards because they're launching NOW, and social norms now are way different than when the Grammy's started. So they have to be representative of minorities, queer artists, and they will probably rely on people's streaming habits to give out the awards, which is pretty cool. (Idk if it's fan voted—I think if it's based on streams it sort of isn't?) Apple Music Awarded their AOTY to Golden Hour last year and Billie this year, accurately predicting the Grammy's. So if they go that route they might be able to tune into what's good more than what's popular. Either way, I'm excited to see what they come up with. White people are 72% of the population at last count, so POC being 28% of the Grammy voters is actually on par with population. That's better than I'd assumed, actually. Obviously the % of women is too low. That's if you count Hispanic in white, it's 60% if you take out Hispanic www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/US/IPE120218(and that's ignoring that younger generations are more diverse, and racial breakdowns within music) |
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 27, 2020 20:51:32 GMT -5
White people are 72% of the population at last count, so POC being 28% of the Grammy voters is actually on par with population. That's better than I'd assumed, actually. Obviously the % of women is too low. That's if you count Hispanic in white, it's 60% if you take out Hispanic www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/US/IPE120218(and that's ignoring that younger generations are more diverse, and racial breakdowns within music) Ah gotcha, thanks. How is the Hispanic population counted in the Grammys breakdown? |
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seak05
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Post by seak05 on Jan 27, 2020 20:58:10 GMT -5
Ah gotcha, thanks. How is the Hispanic population counted in the Grammys breakdown? Generally you wouldn't count them in white, and given that it's listed as PoC (as opposed to Black), I'm guessing that is also how it's broken down here. So I would guess that the 72% is White only, non-Hispanic. |
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kimberly
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Post by kimberly on Jan 27, 2020 21:02:11 GMT -5
Yeah I agree with you in all that -- but it is important to note that the "peers in the music industry" that vote for the grammy's are unfortunately only 21% women and 28% POC. So while Grammy's is and will be the biggest award for music, much like the Oscars, for years to come, they really need to change to keep up with the times. They can start by doing away with some of the old white men in the committee ) and adding more women and POC into the mix. I'm excited for Spotify Awards because they're launching NOW, and social norms now are way different than when the Grammy's started. So they have to be representative of minorities, queer artists, and they will probably rely on people's streaming habits to give out the awards, which is pretty cool. (Idk if it's fan voted—I think if it's based on streams it sort of isn't?) Apple Music Awarded their AOTY to Golden Hour last year and Billie this year, accurately predicting the Grammy's. So if they go that route they might be able to tune into what's good more than what's popular. Either way, I'm excited to see what they come up with. White people are 72% of the population at last count, so POC being 28% of the Grammy voters is actually on par with population. That's better than I'd assumed, actually. Obviously the % of women is too low. BITCH WHERE? I knew you were racist but like this is low-key klan type of bullshit. If you do some research, you will see 60% of Americans are White (aka European-Americans). If you look at the data closely, most common age among POC is 27, while it is 58 among whites. So the POC are younger and most likely listen to more music and reflect the taste of consumers better. That is besides the fact that GRAMMYs are not an American, national, patriotic award show. 2 of the Best New Artist nominees were NOT American this year. Last year's winner, Dua Lipa was NOT American. The year before, Alessia Cara is NOT American. My point is that the world and people who release Grammy eligible music do not and should not reflect US census or your crappy understanding of racial politics. |
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Caviar
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Post by Caviar on Jan 27, 2020 21:21:43 GMT -5
The Grammys Can’t Go On Like This
VULTURE This was always going to be a heavy Grammy ceremony, but there was no way to tell just how heavy it would get. Upheaval at the highest levels of the Recording Academy had muddied the days leading up to the show. On January 16, it was announced that Academy president and CEO Deborah Dugan — hired last year to replace longtime figurehead Neil Portnow after he advised women in the music industry to “step up” to gain better representation on the show — had been abruptly placed on administrative leave. Dugan alleges that she was a victim of sexual harassment and discrimination during her tenure as head of the Recording Academy, that her ideas about bringing greater diversity to the organization were met with a mix of glib indifference and outright obstinance, and that initiatives announced after she was put on leave were actually ideas she had personally green-lit and were just being rolled out to help the Academy keep up appearances. The show needed to be caustic and political, to give a class of young and promising pop stars space to read the riot act to the old dinosaurs, but calamity had other plans. The Sunday helicopter crash that claimed the lives of NBA veteran Kobe Bryant, his daughter Gianna, and several others cast a pall over the Grammys, fatefully staged at the Staples Center in Los Angeles, which had served as a home base for Bryant in 17 of his 20 years as a Laker — and, last night, as a meeting ground for fans and players grieving through the news of his passing. The mood outside filtered into the show inside, as presenters and performers attempted to strike a balance between remembrance and uplift. Lizzo opened the show by dedicating it to Bryant. Lil Nas X sang a bit of “Old Town Road” next to a Bryant jersey. The all-star hip-hop tribute to Nipsey Hussle, featuring Meek Mill, YG, John Legend, Roddy Ricch, and Kirk Franklin, paid respects to both the fallen rapper and the sports figurehead whose losses bookended a tumultuous year for lovers of L.A. culture. The Grammys struggled to lift spirits and bring people together, succeeding only intermittently between moments of chaos and memories of fresh losses. As host for the Grammy’s, Alicia Keys took on the unenviable task of marshaling the conflicting energies the evening necessitated. Bringing Boyz II Men out to revisit their cover of G.C. Cameron’s “It’s So Hard to Say Goodbye to Yesterday” was the purest, saddest acknowledgment of what many viewers inside and far beyond Staples were feeling last night, a necessary beat to cry together in a room whose significance had turned grim in a flash. Keys’s opening monologue, delivered in part over piano (to the tune of a Lewis Capaldi song), was by turns both the earliest sign that we were in for multiple hours of taxing, incongruous moods and the only time the allegations between Dugan and Portnow were even tacitly mentioned: “We refuse the negative energy. We refuse the old systems … We want to be respected and safe in our diversity. We want to be shifting to realness and inclusivity,” Keys said. It was a big check that the four-hour broadcast couldn’t cash, as the night ping-ponged between good ideas executed strangely and shaky ones delivered in undue confidence. Aerosmith’s performance of the 1993 hit “Living on the Edge” (the chorus of which goes, “You can’t help yourself from falling”) on a stage decorated with flames and skulls was bafflingly inappropriate. Outgoing executive producer Ken Ehrlich’s tribute — a star-studded rendition of the staple from the Fame musical “I Sing the Body Electric” that got off to a jarringly rocky start trying to squeeze Camila Cabello into the mix — depicted the widening gulf between Grammy brass and industry talent so neatly that the audience cam couldn’t help but cut to Ariana Grande, who had accused Ehrlich of lying about the reasons she skipped last year’s show after he had alienated the pop-radio heavyweight during preshow negotiations. This year’s solution was to give as much face time to as many pop stars under 40 as were willing to show and to give medleys to Lil Nas X, Ariana Grande, the Jonas Brothers, and Tyler, the Creator. But for every notable musician who did show, there was one who didn’t. Absent from “music’s biggest night” were a disconcerting number of the industry’s most successful stars: Taylor Swift didn’t show, nor did Drake, Future, Beyoncé, Frank Ocean, Jay-Z, Rihanna, Lady Gaga, and Kanye West, who instead held a midnight Sunday Service event on West Coast time that suggested he had been in the area. We were told Dave Chappelle was not around to accept the award for Best Comedy Album, his third consecutive win in the category in a row, but someone who certainly looks like him could be seen seated in the audience between country stars Brandi Carlile and Tanya Tucker, who presented the award and received it in his absence. Was Chappelle late? Did a soft Grammy boycott happen this year? Diddy delivered harsh words at Clive Davis’s preshow party: “Truth be told, hip-hop has never been respected by the Grammys. Black music has never been respected by the Grammys to the point that it should be.” Points were made. Only three black artists have won Album of the Year in the 21st century, and the last, jazz pianist Herbie Hancock, who won for the Joni Mitchell tribute album River: The Joni Letters, was way back in 2008. The hip-hop and R&B awards are constantly being shuffled out of the broadcast, so if you skipped the preshow, you might have thought Lizzo, the evening’s most nominated act, had won only Best Pop Solo Performance (for “Truth Hurts”). The message, that hip-hop and R&B are only sporadically deserving of top honors, is hard to handle in the era of Beyoncé, Rihanna, Drake, and Kendrick Lamar, all of whom made era-defining records over the past decade only to be largely shut out of the top honors at what felt like the peak of their creative powers — and in favor of Adele, Ed Sheeran, Swift, and others whose music is geared for broader mainstream appeal. The goodwill engendered last year by Childish Gambino’s wins for Record and Song of the Year dried up. Latinx performers got their trophies before the show and were represented in performances only by Rosalía and Cabello (the latter literally sang twice). The lone acknowledgment of a busy year for K-pop was a brief appearance from BTS, who sang a fraction of their Lil Nas X collaboration, “Seoul Town Road,” in a medley of “Old Town Road” remixes. Billie Eilish’s history-making sweep of Best New Artist and Album, Record, and Song of the Year — the first time a performer has done so since easy-listening star Christopher Cross pulled it off in 1981 and the first time in 62 Grammys ceremonies when a teen was declared to have the best album on her first attempt at one — shouldered some of the burden for the Academy’s questionable choices last night. Preexisting frustrations and the ceremony’s dubious timing made what ought to have been a well-deserved celebration of one of last year’s best, most successful pop albums run a little catty. Notoriety breeds scrutiny. Familiarity breeds contempt. In a night full of pop stars being spotlighted at the cost of face time for hip-hop artists, Eilish’s gothic Gucci threads and AAVE vocal affectations are bound to make her a centerpiece for some of the anger the show aroused in the viewing audience, the same way Grande caught smoke upon the release of “7 Rings.” The Academy’s thinking, presumably, isn’t sinister; at a time when pop music’s guard is changing, the members went all in on one of the youngest, most promising prospects. Thing is, with Lil Nas X present as a reminder that “Old Town Road” smoked “Bad Guy” on the charts all summer and with the breakthrough year that Lizzo had, Eilish’s sweep seemed all the more jarring. Bright spots in a night that dragged like hell included Tyler, the Creator’s triumphant performance of IGOR’s “Earfquake” and “New Magic Wand.” The first-time winner then ripped the show a new one for shrinking his album’s mellifluous blend of soul, trap, and rock into a rap category and for the outdated, unsubtle coding of “urban” as a descriptor for black music. Eilish and Finneas were gracious and mercifully curt in their speeches and quietly devastating in their performance of the When We All Fall Asleep, Where Do We Go? highlight “When the Party’s Over.” The Nipsey tribute was heartwarming, as were tributes to folk legend John Prine by Bonnie Raitt and to the late Dr. John by Trombone Shorty and members of the Preservation Hall Jazz Band. (Usher’s Prince workout was too mannered to pop despite the presence of FKA Twigs and Sheila E. as backup. It feels like we get a new Prince tribute every year now, which is fine, except that the list of iffy ones is longer than the list of great ones.) Gary Clark Jr. and the Roots gave a caustic reminder of a tumultuous year in politics, and Rosalía dazzled while playing El Mas Querer’s “Malamente” and the new single “Juro Qué.” Carlile and Tucker, who won her first two Grammys last night nearly 50 years after her 1972 debut single, “Delta Dawn,” gave a stately rendition of their 2019 collaboration, “Bring My Flowers Now,” off Tucker’s While I’m Livin’. This could have doubled as the resounding message to the Academy membership from this year’s talent: The Grammys can either be a show about recognizing modern music’s top-tier talent in their prime, or it can be a show about producers, presidents, and voting bodies who are too out of touch to spot a revolution until years after it happens. But it can’t be both. news.google.com/articles/CAIiEMBBTh_aWijTHOOyJ_pbhQoqGQgEKhAIACoHCAow-_uDCzDLlYADMJv59QU?hl=en-US&gl=US&ceid=US%3Aen
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Caviar
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Post by Caviar on Jan 27, 2020 21:24:59 GMT -5
Grammy Ratings Slip To All-Time Low In Demo Amidst Kobe Bryant Tribute & Billie Eilish Big Wins – Update
UPDATED, 1:12 PM: The 2020 Grammy Awards were dominated last night by collaboration performances, tributes to Kobe Bryant and Nipsey Hussle and Billie Eilish triple-threat wins. Yet music’s biggest night has become a smaller affair, again. Now that the final numbers are in, it is clear that the decline of the scandal-mired Record Academy’s ceremony has continued for another year to a new low in the key advertiser demographic. Pulling in 5.4 among adults 18-49 and 18.7 million viewers, the three-hour-plus CBS-aired show took a small tumble from 2019’s ceremony, which Alicia Keys also hosted. Specifically that’s a 4% drop in the key demo for the 62nd annual Grammy Awards from last year’s previous low. While not reaching the all-time audience low of 2006’s 17 million, the 2019 Grammys were down 6% from the TV audience that tuned in for the 61st annual Grammys. deadline.com/2020/01/grammy-ratings-slip-kobe-bryant-billie-eilish-cbs-1202842407/
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 27, 2020 21:31:13 GMT -5
White people are 72% of the population at last count, so POC being 28% of the Grammy voters is actually on par with population. That's better than I'd assumed, actually. Obviously the % of women is too low. BITCH WHERE? I knew you were racist but like this is low-key klan type of bulls**t. If you do some research, you will see 60% of Americans are White (aka European-Americans). If you look at the data closely, most common age among POC is 27, while it is 58 among whites. So the POC are younger and most likely listen to more music and reflect the taste of consumers better. That is besides the fact that GRAMMYs are not an American, national, patriotic award show. 2 of the Best New Artist nominees were NOT American this year. Last year's winner, Dua Lipa was NOT American. The year before, Alessia Cara is NOT American. My point is that the world and people who release Grammy eligible music do not and should not reflect US census or your crappy understanding of racial politics. I will admit fault in simply Googling to find the % of population that is white, and that giving me a misleading answer I didn't look further into it, and I thanked the poster who corrected me. Additionally, the issue of 'Hispanic' being an ethnic community versus a race isn't exactly a simple thing. Spanish people are considered 'white.' I'm not sure what you find 'Klan' like but am open to hearing you. We can PM if it's easier so as not to clog this thread. And while the Grammys don't only reward Americans, it is certainly 'an American show' in terms of where it's located, who constitutes the main players (i.e. producers and the like), and what audience it caters to (i.e. it airs for prime time in the U.S.). |
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14887fan
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Post by 14887fan on Jan 27, 2020 21:37:12 GMT -5
I didn’t realize the title of a song defined its quality now? The entire thank u, next album was wonderfully executed, from the music to its associated cycle. I really thought it had AOTY, so I’m mildly bummed that she walked away empty-handed last night.
The GRAMMYs will always hold prestige. Hopefully they can turn things around now that Ken Ehrlich is *finally* gone, and the organization’s shifty inner mechanisms are being exposed.
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kimberly
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Post by kimberly on Jan 27, 2020 22:27:02 GMT -5
BITCH WHERE? I knew you were racist but like this is low-key klan type of bulls**t. If you do some research, you will see 60% of Americans are White (aka European-Americans). If you look at the data closely, most common age among POC is 27, while it is 58 among whites. So the POC are younger and most likely listen to more music and reflect the taste of consumers better. That is besides the fact that GRAMMYs are not an American, national, patriotic award show. 2 of the Best New Artist nominees were NOT American this year. Last year's winner, Dua Lipa was NOT American. The year before, Alessia Cara is NOT American. My point is that the world and people who release Grammy eligible music do not and should not reflect US census or your crappy understanding of racial politics. I will admit fault in simply Googling to find the % of population that is white, and that giving me a misleading answer I didn't look further into it, and I thanked the poster who corrected me. Additionally, the issue of 'Hispanic' being an ethnic community versus a race isn't exactly a simple thing. Spanish people are considered 'white.' I'm not sure what you find 'Klan' like but am open to hearing you. We can PM if it's easier so as not to clog this thread. And while the Grammys don't only reward Americans, it is certainly 'an American show' in terms of where it's located, who constitutes the main players (i.e. producers and the like), and what audience it caters to (i.e. it airs for prime time in the U.S.). hmmm what I find upsetting about your comment was your suggestion that "if 70% of population is white then 70% of nominees & winners should be white." This logic simply doesn't work because there is years and years of wrongdoings and even currently appropriating of cultures by whites in America. The most apparent example I can think of from this year's Grammy's is the fact that ROSALIA, a white woman from Spain, is the first hispanophone BNA nominee ever when Latin music exists and there are so many talented artists that broke out recently that are not white. You are right that hispanic covers a range from "white" to "Afro-Latinx", but why did the Grammy's never acknowledge Brown people making Latin music before ROSALIA? Or Eminem winning Rap album with literally all his albums when better rap music released by Black artists exist. This applies to Macklemore too. Grammy's isn't an "American" show, like yes it is in LA but so is everything else. It is an international event that is broadcast in so many countries and regions, and they capitalize off of that (see: BTS, Rosalia). The academy, while it's called "National" academy of arts, does not have any commitment whatsoever to maintain an American audience or winners. I think you are failing to understand that non-American people make/produce/sing music and therefore non-American people can be on the Grammy committees and among voters, nominees and winners. Music doesn't have borders, for example, the producer of "Old Town Road" is a Black dude from the Netherlands & was nominated! which is great! My point here is that whites are less than one third of the world's population (I'm guessing here - no conclusive data on this) and they will be less than half of the US by 2045 according to estimates. No reason for whites to dominate Grammys (and Oscars and Emmys and what have you) Progress is happening, and while it is taking longer than it should, it is underway. I have nothing more to add to this conversation. |
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 27, 2020 22:39:35 GMT -5
I will admit fault in simply Googling to find the % of population that is white, and that giving me a misleading answer I didn't look further into it, and I thanked the poster who corrected me. Additionally, the issue of 'Hispanic' being an ethnic community versus a race isn't exactly a simple thing. Spanish people are considered 'white.' I'm not sure what you find 'Klan' like but am open to hearing you. We can PM if it's easier so as not to clog this thread. And while the Grammys don't only reward Americans, it is certainly 'an American show' in terms of where it's located, who constitutes the main players (i.e. producers and the like), and what audience it caters to (i.e. it airs for prime time in the U.S.). hmmm what I find upsetting about your comment was your suggestion that "if 70% of population is white then 70% of nominees & winners should be white." That isn't what I suggested at all. I am tired of you misquoting and misrepresenting what I post. My actual quote was "White people are 72% of the population at last count, so POC being 28% of the Grammy voters is actually on par with population." Not only was the quote about voters (not nominees/winners), but it was an observation about the % and didn't involve the world "should" anywhere. I simply said I was surprised the % was even that high, which doesn't mean I think it's where it should be. I have been and will remain critical of both the Grammys and Oscars are their biases when it comes to winners, so I don't know why you think we disagree. |
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felipe
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Post by felipe on Jan 28, 2020 7:49:54 GMT -5
I will admit fault in simply Googling to find the % of population that is white, and that giving me a misleading answer I didn't look further into it, and I thanked the poster who corrected me. Additionally, the issue of 'Hispanic' being an ethnic community versus a race isn't exactly a simple thing. Spanish people are considered 'white.' I'm not sure what you find 'Klan' like but am open to hearing you. We can PM if it's easier so as not to clog this thread. And while the Grammys don't only reward Americans, it is certainly 'an American show' in terms of where it's located, who constitutes the main players (i.e. producers and the like), and what audience it caters to (i.e. it airs for prime time in the U.S.). hmmm what I find upsetting about your comment was your suggestion that "if 70% of population is white then 70% of nominees & winners should be white." This logic simply doesn't work because there is years and years of wrongdoings and even currently appropriating of cultures by whites in America. The most apparent example I can think of from this year's Grammy's is the fact that ROSALIA, a white woman from Spain, is the first hispanophone BNA nominee ever when Latin music exists and there are so many talented artists that broke out recently that are not white. You are right that hispanic covers a range from "white" to "Afro-Latinx", but why did the Grammy's never acknowledge Brown people making Latin music before ROSALIA? Or Eminem winning Rap album with literally all his albums when better rap music released by Black artists exist. This applies to Macklemore too. Grammy's isn't an "American" show, like yes it is in LA but so is everything else. It is an international event that is broadcast in so many countries and regions, and they capitalize off of that (see: BTS, Rosalia). The academy, while it's called "National" academy of arts, does not have any commitment whatsoever to maintain an American audience or winners. I think you are failing to understand that non-American people make/produce/sing music and therefore non-American people can be on the Grammy committees and among voters, nominees and winners. Music doesn't have borders, for example, the producer of "Old Town Road" is a Black dude from the Netherlands & was nominated! which is great! My point here is that whites are less than one third of the world's population (I'm guessing here - no conclusive data on this) and they will be less than half of the US by 2045 according to estimates. No reason for whites to dominate Grammys (and Oscars and Emmys and what have you) Progress is happening, and while it is taking longer than it should, it is underway. I have nothing more to add to this conversation. The Grammys award American music or international music that is popular in America. I don’t think they ever tried to acknowledge the music scene in Spain or South Korea but they do acknowledge acts that breakthrough the American music scene. White people are the majority in the US, but you imply that the racial breakdown at the Grammys - or Oscars, should reflect the world demographics instead? |
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upsidedown
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Post by upsidedown on Jan 28, 2020 7:56:59 GMT -5
Grammy Ratings Slip To All-Time Low In Demo Amidst Kobe Bryant Tribute & Billie Eilish Big Wins – Update
UPDATED, 1:12 PM: The 2020 Grammy Awards were dominated last night by collaboration performances, tributes to Kobe Bryant and Nipsey Hussle and Billie Eilish triple-threat wins. Yet music’s biggest night has become a smaller affair, again. Now that the final numbers are in, it is clear that the decline of the scandal-mired Record Academy’s ceremony has continued for another year to a new low in the key advertiser demographic. Pulling in 5.4 among adults 18-49 and 18.7 million viewers, the three-hour-plus CBS-aired show took a small tumble from 2019’s ceremony, which Alicia Keys also hosted. Specifically that’s a 4% drop in the key demo for the 62nd annual Grammy Awards from last year’s previous low. While not reaching the all-time audience low of 2006’s 17 million, the 2019 Grammys were down 6% from the TV audience that tuned in for the 61st annual Grammys. deadline.com/2020/01/grammy-ratings-slip-kobe-bryant-billie-eilish-cbs-1202842407/ For 2020, nearly 19 million viewers and only down 4% from last year is actually great. And it didn't even hit the all time audience low. |
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Enigma.
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Post by Enigma. on Jan 28, 2020 8:22:19 GMT -5
Yea it's not a bad result at all!
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Choco
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Post by Choco on Jan 28, 2020 8:43:33 GMT -5
The ratings were really good. Broadcast is dying so 4% is a strong hold.
Quality aside, much like the film industry cluttering all the Oscar contenders towards the end of the year, the Grammys are also a game of hype and promotion. The thank u, next era wrapped up it's singles a year ago and after that she only did two mildly received collaborations. Compare that to Billie's album that is still top 10, and that always made me think Billie had the upper hand. The way the awards ended up, I think she probably came below Cuz I Love You too, and Lizzo's success is more recent than Ari's era. Age is probably why A Star is Born didn't land an AOTY nod in spite of wins from two different ceremonies.
Sometimes an old album can overcome that (think 25 and 1989), but it's gotta be some sort of juggernaut.
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Enigma.
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Post by Enigma. on Jan 28, 2020 9:38:12 GMT -5
Yep, I'm sure that ASIB would've got the AOTY nom last year had it been eligible. Well, the sweep was alright (4 Grammys).
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divasummer
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Post by divasummer on Jan 28, 2020 12:37:51 GMT -5
I don't know if it's because I'm getting older or what but the Grammy's were kind of "Eh" for me personally.
It was nicely put together but a little lackluster.
I'm also not as much into Hollywood anymore so that could be it as well.
I know I sound bitter but all the positive vibes, spreading the love and we are so diverse and a 1 unit etc was getting to much for me.
Most of the performances were good and you could tell took a lot of effort but I guess wasn't for me.
Ariana may have been my favorite performer of the night.
Go girl!!
Demi and Camilia were both disapointing.
I didn't hate either song but I just don't care for an emotional ballad by either of these women.
Strangely enough back in the day if Mariah, Whitney, Celine etc took on a ballad for a show it was a treat...
Usher started out a little shaky but a few seconds in I was loving it.
Lizzo was a good opener but not for me.
I sound superficial but I'm not onto the leotard anymore.
I know she loves her body and I will support her but she's not for me anymore.
Billie was ok, I'm not a big fan so the dreary song wasn't for me.
Not sure what was going on with Arowsmith and Run DMC. Was the sound messed up?
It was nice to see them though. There both legends.
I liked Alicia's performance of "Underdog".
I'm still waiting for this big Rosalia moment.
She's pretty hyped up and I own some of her music but I don't see the next groundbreaking international style star they keep talking about.
I admit I am ignorant when it comes to Spanish music and maybe her blending different styles of it is a bigger deal to some.
(I'm mostly into Reggaton)
It's probably just me because I hear people raving about some performances but I'm having a hard time remembering who performed???
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Enigma.
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Post by Enigma. on Jan 28, 2020 12:43:59 GMT -5
Getting older is probably one thing, BUT I think people don't have the balls to put on a spectacular performances any more: either do something surprising (like have a huge orchestra behind) or be so "extra" that it feels like a moment (like Gaga x Elton duet back in the day.. "take my picture Hollywood!!" never forget).
I think performance by Lana could've been a showstopper: Imagine Norman Fucking Rockwell with a big orchestra and dramatic visuals. Wonder why she didn't perform.
I appreciate Billie Eilish a lot though, she's on her own lane doing her thing and doing it amazingly well. I love her music too.
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Post by collegedropout on Jan 28, 2020 13:50:57 GMT -5
The Grammys are American. International acts can win too but it doesn't change that it is American.
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Post by ificanthaveyou on Jan 29, 2020 2:12:26 GMT -5
The Grammys are American. International acts can win too but it doesn't change that it is American. Lol this sounds so ethnocentric. Music is universal, and the Grammys taking place in American doesn’t change the fact that global artists are awarded at the show. This isn’t like the VMAs where each country has its own version of it. |
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felipe
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Post by felipe on Jan 29, 2020 9:09:54 GMT -5
The Grammys are American. International acts can win too but it doesn't change that it is American. Lol this sounds so ethnocentric. Music is universal, and the Grammys taking place in American doesn’t change the fact that global artists are awarded at the show. This isn’t like the VMAs where each country has its own version of it. They don't just "take place" in America, they are an American Awards show. Music is universal, but it has never been Grammys intent to award universal music. They do, however, award international music that is popular in America, specially English language music. |
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jenglisbe
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Posts: 35,542
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 29, 2020 9:29:25 GMT -5
The Grammys are American. International acts can win too but it doesn't change that it is American. Lol this sounds so ethnocentric. Music is universal, and the Grammys taking place in American doesn’t change the fact that global artists are awarded at the show. This isn’t like the VMAs where each country has its own version of it. Meanwhile, the Juno Awards, Brit Awards, etc... |
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Post by Rose "Payola" Nylund on Jan 29, 2020 11:51:00 GMT -5
The Grammys are open for all but it has an American point of focus.
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) and adding more women and POC into the mix.
