walt91
5x Platinum Member
Joined: March 2018
Posts: 5,965
Pronouns: he/they
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Post by walt91 on Jun 3, 2021 13:55:08 GMT -5
I find it ironic that BTS fans were extremely misogynistic towards Olivia Rodrigo saying her entire career is payola'd and it made no sense she was organically succeeding (and this isn't even the first case of their misogyny - remember the Grammy's when they were harassing Ariana and Gaga for becoming the first all female duo to win the Grammy award for Best Pop Duo/Group, on women's history month none the less). Yet, when anyone calls out the fandom and that BTS's 'Butter' clearly wasn't a hit, and is a same situation as TROLLZ/Willow/Franchise, people are suddenly racist? The mental gymnastics the BTS fandom does.. Using the misogyny card everywhere. You are not feminist the way you think you are for stanning women. this is really rich coming from someone who uses the xenophobia card way too much |
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Post by Lost In Musical Reverie on Jun 3, 2021 13:55:28 GMT -5
So...Masked Wolf will be releasing a new song tonight. Still sticking to the space aesthetic - it seems. Only 65 likes and 8 comments for a guy who has one of the biggest songs in the world lmao. Yeah he's definitely a one-hit wonder Absolutely! I only decided to share this to lighten the mood amid the ARMY drama, and also so we can all be familiarized with the 'failed follow-up' when it appears on Todd's "One Hit Wonderland" episode of him ten years from now. 😄 |
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divasummer
Diamond Member
Joined: November 2011
Posts: 10,044
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Post by divasummer on Jun 3, 2021 14:05:15 GMT -5
The real definition of chart manipulation - 'Baker Street' being #1 and ALLEGEDLY the Billboard chart director kept 'Shadow Dancing' at #1 that week because of Andy Gibb's manager threatened to pull Andy from a Billboard sponsored show. I think AT40 had to rerecord that week because they were told BS was #1. RSO allegedly was involved in a lot of chart manipulation, especially during 1977-78. Where there's smoke. Labels always manipulate the charts. The reverse happened in the 1990s when labels didn't release singles so they could sell more albums. It mostly worked. Best/worst example: No Doubt's 'Don't Speak' - clearly one of the 1990s iconic hits - nowhere to be found on H100 or the treasured year-end charts - 16 weeks at #1 radio and sold a ton of albums. For this week's chart. Olivia looks like she's going to have one of the best 2nd week multi-track/album bombs. Back then everyone knew what was going on. I feel like Billboard used to write if this song was eligible it would place here etc, etc. You had to be there I guess. It wasn't the worse thing in the world and at the last minute labels would put out a physical to get the peak the fans wanted. lol Billboard was/is an industry magazine. The industry is thinking about money. If BTS fans are buying and spending money than why would they change rules? Industry=Money. They don't care about chart watchers. lol |
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otaviohmg
Platinum Member
Caught up in my head, hopin' you gon' say Was it worth it? Put that work in Got me nothin'
Joined: September 2019
Posts: 1,465 
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Post by otaviohmg on Jun 3, 2021 14:10:24 GMT -5
guys let's talk about HaSeul finally returning to LOONA!
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divasummer
Diamond Member
Joined: November 2011
Posts: 10,044
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Post by divasummer on Jun 3, 2021 14:23:57 GMT -5
I think Billboard is to blame for greenlighting chart manipulation by BTS stans. They care more about clicks and revenue than accuracy. Plus, they have incredibly high bias towards BTS. Sales absolutely needs to have way less power on the charts since its an outdated medium that should've died in the 2010s. Your correct buying is outdated but people still do spend more money than you do on streaming. I purchased 20 songs in the last month. Probably equals 35.00 dollars.That equals more money than you spent on streaming. Why should that not be counted? |
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meg
Gold Member
The older i get, the more i understand the world but still, was not knowing the world better for me?
Joined: September 2020
Posts: 586
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Post by meg on Jun 3, 2021 14:24:51 GMT -5
You know what? I was going to ignore this but no. First you are bunch of psychopats for looking around internet for me and things I said only because I'm defending BTS here. Do you think it's a normal behavior? That's what I should expect from men I guess.
And second. I wasn't going to say that beause it's really private and sensitive but okay. I will make you feel stupid. This screenshot going around? Yeah that's me. I have OCD since I was child because of traumatic experience from where I was 3. For years it was only things like a need of touching something with both of my hands, or having special numbers, like I needed to do something four times because my family would die. Then it evolved into horrible intrusive thoughts. The worst you can imagine, which is completely normal which OCD as my terapist laters told me. So to quiet down those thoughts I was reading really fucked up fics. Worse than you see on this picture. It didn't really helped that much so I finally went to terapy and started taking meds. The thoughts are now like 70% more normal so I didn't read any of those since last year. And they now gross me out. You don't believe me? I can show your my meds. I hope you are happy.
And BTS still more organic than most of your faves who use playlisting and payola but can barely sell out arenas.
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dovahduck
Platinum Member
Kavinsky finally dropped! :)
Joined: April 2018
Posts: 1,871
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Post by dovahduck on Jun 3, 2021 14:33:00 GMT -5
^I'm not gonna read all of that like many on here so I'm happy for you or I'm sorry that happened.
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Post by phieaglesfan712 on Jun 3, 2021 14:40:36 GMT -5
That’s not going to help things. To be honest, I don’t really have a problem with meg’s long posts. I just wish she would use the spoiler function when she has a long post. It would make scrolling through posts a lot easier. |
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Post by Lukas on Jun 3, 2021 14:44:06 GMT -5
And BTS still more organic than most of your faves who use playlisting and payola but can barely sell out arenas. I agree with you; I really think how fast an artist can sell out arenas should be the sole and only factor in determining how they perform on a chart that measures US public consumption in sales, radio, and streaming. The other thing I want to say is that it's insanely hypocritical how BTS stans continue to use the "we don't have playlisting or payola like western artists do" even on songs which actually do have them. You can argue this for songs like "Life Goes On" that didn't have any radio support and little playlisting, that's fair, but not for "Butter." "Good 4 U" debuted at #21 on Spotify's Today's Top Hits playlist and had to blow up organically and have public support to reach #1 on any playlist. "Butter" debuted in the top 2. "Good 4 U" also had no radio push since it release and only got some once it started to increase in streams in the middle of the week, which is again, organic, or at least more organic than "Butter" which got huge radio promotion from Columbia since its release, and although "Good 4 U" is a week older, "Butter" is ahead of it on radio. And also, even with the website sales added on, "Good 4 U" is still #1 on Nielsen's consumption chart, but it's #2 on the Hot 100 solely because Billboard weighs sales very high. If BTS stans ACTUALLY cared about a chart which favored songs which have lower playlisting and radio support, they wouldn't care if "Good 4 U" went #1 because it's relying on those factors less than their faves' song. The only reason "Good 4 U" is ahead of "Butter" now on playlisting is because enough time has passed for streaming services like Spotify to "know" that "Good 4 U" is the more popular song. It's that simple. |
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divasummer
Diamond Member
Joined: November 2011
Posts: 10,044
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Post by divasummer on Jun 3, 2021 14:47:05 GMT -5
^I'm not gonna read all of that like many on here so I'm happy for you or I'm sorry that happened. Agree with your post and MEG maybe hanging on the internet isn't for you. Seriously. Kids are stuck on it, clicking away, getting likes, getting self gratification from a computer etc. If you need help MEG PM me? |
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Groovy
6x Platinum Member
Joined: October 2017
Posts: 6,719
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Post by Groovy on Jun 3, 2021 14:53:11 GMT -5
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meg
Gold Member
The older i get, the more i understand the world but still, was not knowing the world better for me?
Joined: September 2020
Posts: 586
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Post by meg on Jun 3, 2021 14:53:19 GMT -5
^I'm not gonna read all of that like many on here so I'm happy for you or I'm sorry that happened. Agree with your post and MEG maybe hanging on the internet isn't for you. Seriously. Kids are stuck on it, clicking away, getting likes, getting self gratification from a computer etc. If you need help MEG PM me? My god why so many of you think I'm a teenager or something? I wish. My first group that I liked was Take That. That should tell you about my age. And also once said I wrote about Michael Jackson in my bachelor's thesis. I'm not gonna argue with all of you about chart manipulation and all that anymore. I'm tired myself. And yes I will use a spoiler option next time I will have a need to write an essey. But some of you went too far today and you still don't see it. And I don't need help, thanks. |
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Leo ✔
Diamond Member
Julia Michaels Stan
Happy happy happy ♪
Joined: June 2016
Posts: 75,497
My Charts
Pronouns: He/him/his
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Post by Leo ✔ on Jun 3, 2021 14:57:57 GMT -5
Agree with your post and MEG maybe hanging on the internet isn't for you. Seriously. Kids are stuck on it, clicking away, getting likes, getting self gratification from a computer etc. If you need help MEG PM me? My god why so many of you think I'm a teenager or something? Maybe you aren't a teenager but your behaviour is like a teenager. Imagine fighting in an internet forum about 7 millionaire dudes that don't even know who tf you are? lmao chill out a bit |
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Post by Baby Yoda Hot100Fan on Jun 3, 2021 15:13:12 GMT -5
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Post by Rose "Payola" Nylund on Jun 3, 2021 15:13:14 GMT -5
I keep seeing arguments of, “how is fans buying and supporting an artist inorganic?” I haven’t seen anyone articulate arguments against explicitly They aren’t buying and supporting in an organic matter... you know, downloading a copy on iTunes to listen to it, and/or streaming it when they want naturally because they really like the song. No, they’re buying multiple unnecessary copies which half of them don’t even download and listen to, not even using their own money half the time, in order to get them a higher placement on the Hot 100. And since all the donations are so focused on the Hot 100, the song fails to hit #1 in most other western countries’ charts. Where is the support in those countries? Right, it’s there, but it’s more organic, resulting in more realistic chart positions that reflect its actual popularity/consumption. It’s not natural when the charts have been tactically influenced by fans trying to get a particular position; the chart should represent behaviour as though the chart didn’t exist at all in a vacuum. We’d still see huge sales for BTS organically, but it wouldn’t be absurdly inflated by the non-consumed website sales. Then they might argue, they want to support the artist monetarily. Well, sadly, with a good formula, this falls apart because “Good 4 U” was #1 in revenue & consumption this week, as we know, the Hot 100 weighs sales twice as heavily as it should (relative to streams in the consumption formula). Plus, we all know you wouldn’t “support” the artist if your efforts weren’t vicariously vindicated via the precious #1 spot on the coveted Hot 100 chart. So yes, fans buying is inorganic when it’s done in a planned, methodical, tactical way to ensure a certain position on a chart. It’s really not hard to grasp. The typical argument that fanbase uses against this is that their buying 'makes up' for the playlisting and radio spin payola of other songs... like Butter didn't have a massive radio campaign with that Columbia bus which toured around radio stations promoting the song, and the obvious massive radio deal and #2 on TTH? Peak hypocrisy, it's actually laughable. Especially when Olivia's songs had no radio deal/push initially, and were organically fueled. With all this said, Billboard hasn’t done anything because they’re obsessed with the clout and revenue BTS generates by topping all their charts constantly, aka they’re corrupt and don’t care about creating an accurate chart. Unfortunately, they hold all the influence, legacy and importance when it comes to discussing charts so they aren’t being dethroned as the flagship brand any time soon, so we all have to deal with it. 👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏👏 |
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mylo
Charting
Joined: February 2021
Posts: 276
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Post by mylo on Jun 3, 2021 15:13:38 GMT -5
You know what? I was going to ignore this but no. First you are bunch of psychopats for looking around internet for me and things I said only because I'm defending BTS here. Do you think it's a normal behavior? That's what I should expect from men I guess. And second. I wasn't going to say that beause it's really private and sensitive but okay. I will make you feel stupid. This screenshot going around? Yeah that's me. I have OCD since I was child because of traumatic experience from where I was 3. For years it was only things like a need of touching something with both of my hands, or having special numbers, like I needed to do something four times because my family would die. Then it evolved into horrible intrusive thoughts. The worst you can imagine, which is completely normal which OCD as my terapist laters told me. So to quiet down those thoughts I was reading really f**ked up fics. Worse than you see on this picture. It didn't really helped that much so I finally went to terapy and started taking meds. The thoughts are now like 70% more normal so I didn't read any of those since last year. And they now gross me out. You don't believe me? I can show your my meds. I hope you are happy. And BTS still more organic than most of your faves who use playlisting and payola but can barely sell out arenas. Xenophobia and now Sexism. Wow. |
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Post by Rose "Payola" Nylund on Jun 3, 2021 15:17:39 GMT -5
And BTS still more organic than most of your faves who use playlisting and payola but can barely sell out arenas. I mean, most of my favs would be lucky to sell 2,000 seat venues where I live but that has zero impact on how enjoyable their music is or how solid they are as artists. It’s unfortunate how much justification you need from charts and sales and records to justify how good your favs are. Sad even. |
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meg
Gold Member
The older i get, the more i understand the world but still, was not knowing the world better for me?
Joined: September 2020
Posts: 586
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Post by meg on Jun 3, 2021 15:34:42 GMT -5
My god why so many of you think I'm a teenager or something? Maybe you aren't a teenager but your behaviour is like a teenager. Imagine fighting in an internet forum about 7 millionaire dudes that don't even know who tf you are? lmao chill out a bit They helped me a lot mentally when I was in a bad place so I will fight for them. Doesn't matter they are millionaires. They are still humans. mylo that was about western artists in general, not specificly about women. You called me xenophobic, misogynist and sexist today. Let's add homophobic, islamophobic, pro Izrael, antisemitic and transphobic. Let's have a whole variety. Funny thing is that I only listen to women if we talk about western artists. Not a single man. Rose "Payola" Nylund I'm a fan of korean artists that has less than 100 followers on spotify or they don't have spotify account at all. Some that are not even known in Korea. I don't need justification from charts. If BTS didn't charted in US I would be fine too. But they deserve it. That's all. And that's true a lot of small artists that can sell only 2k venues are better than some that sell 20k ones. But we are talking about the big ones here. Not argue with anyone by the way. Just answering people that are quoting me. |
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spiritboy
3x Platinum Member
Joined: April 2008
Posts: 3,402
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Post by spiritboy on Jun 3, 2021 15:36:56 GMT -5
Is she releasing a new single? :o |
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Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ
Diamond Member
Joined: August 2017
Posts: 11,073
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Post by Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ on Jun 3, 2021 15:37:04 GMT -5
And BTS still more organic than most of your faves who use playlisting and payola but can barely sell out arenas. so, you first write a post to make us feel sorry, and then you finish it with this. Idk what to say...I wish you all the best, and my advice is to save that energy for something useful. |
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Post by Mayman on Jun 3, 2021 15:38:11 GMT -5
Is she releasing a new single? :o I think this is just a soundtrack song, her new single, "Love Again", will have it's music video released tonight. |
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meg
Gold Member
The older i get, the more i understand the world but still, was not knowing the world better for me?
Joined: September 2020
Posts: 586
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Post by meg on Jun 3, 2021 15:41:13 GMT -5
And BTS still more organic than most of your faves who use playlisting and payola but can barely sell out arenas. so, you first write a post to make us feel sorry, and then you finish it with this. Idk what to say...I wish you all the best, and my advice is to save that energy for something useful. That may be more mean that it should but you went too far and I got mad. I don't need you to feel sorry for me. I only didn't want lies to be spread about me. That's all. Truce or whatever. |
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Post by Rose "Payola" Nylund on Jun 3, 2021 15:44:13 GMT -5
Rose "Payola" Nylund I'm a fan of korean artists that has less than 100 followers on spotify or they don't have spotify account at all. Some that are not even known in Korea. I don't need justification from charts. If BTS didn't charted in US I would be fine too. But they deserve it. That's all. And that's true a lot of small artists that can sell only 2k venues are better than some that sell 20k ones. But we are talking about the big ones here. They deserve it but the lesser-known artists you like don’t? Or other artists don’t? You’ve said they deserve it a lot this week but what is it that makes them more deserving than others? |
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jenglisbe
Diamond Member
Joined: January 2005
Posts: 35,659
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Post by jenglisbe on Jun 3, 2021 15:44:54 GMT -5
There's nothing I dislike more than people who get everything they want and still find ways to play the victim. BTS will be getting #1's until the day they retire and all the positive press anyone could ever ask for and we'll still have to deal with stans portraying them as the underdogs because one music journalist thinks their popularity in the US might be just a little bit inflated. It's like getting the stats isn't enough, if they can't win over the hearts and minds of everyone on the planet then they feel like they've failed. This makes me think of standom in general, and how interesting - but also unhealthy/dangerous - it is. People who take artists this seriously have an almost codependent relationship with the artist. |
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meg
Gold Member
The older i get, the more i understand the world but still, was not knowing the world better for me?
Joined: September 2020
Posts: 586
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Post by meg on Jun 3, 2021 15:49:47 GMT -5
Rose "Payola" Nylund I'm a fan of korean artists that has less than 100 followers on spotify or they don't have spotify account at all. Some that are not even known in Korea. I don't need justification from charts. If BTS didn't charted in US I would be fine too. But they deserve it. That's all. And that's true a lot of small artists that can sell only 2k venues are better than some that sell 20k ones. But we are talking about the big ones here. They deserve it but the lesser-known artists you like don’t? Or other artists don’t? You’ve said they deserve it a lot this week but what is it that makes them more deserving than others? You are getting mad when I write esseys but then you will not let go when I answer you. Is that make sense? A lot of small, tiny artists deserve to be big. I wish they were big. BTS were small artists once too. Really small. That didn't even charted an album or a song in Korea. But they got lucky? People resonated with their music? Who knows. And why this week? They deserve everything in general and it's my biased opinion. Nothing more. They are more deserving that some, not all. And there's a lot of reason for it that would be too long to write and you will yell at me again. The end. |
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mylo
Charting
Joined: February 2021
Posts: 276
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Post by mylo on Jun 3, 2021 15:57:15 GMT -5
Maybe you aren't a teenager but your behaviour is like a teenager. Imagine fighting in an internet forum about 7 millionaire dudes that don't even know who tf you are? lmao chill out a bit They helped me a lot mentally when I was in a bad place so I will fight for them. Doesn't matter they are millionaires. They are still humans. mylo that was about western artists in general, not specificly about women. You called me xenophobic, misogynist and sexist today. Let's add homophobic, islamophobic, pro Izrael, antisemitic and transphobic. Let's have a whole variety. Funny thing is that I only listen to women if we talk about western artists. Not a single man. Rose "Payola" Nylund I'm a fan of korean artists that has less than 100 followers on spotify or they don't have spotify account at all. Some that are not even known in Korea. I don't need justification from charts. If BTS didn't charted in US I would be fine too. But they deserve it. That's all. And that's true a lot of small artists that can sell only 2k venues are better than some that sell 20k ones. But we are talking about the big ones here. Not argue with anyone by the way. Just answering people that are quoting me. I echo your closing sentiment, I don't wish to start an argument - I am just a lowly chartwatcher. I can understand why u defend BTS the way that you do if they helped you out a dark place. Write massive essays on how great they are if you want but I am against bringing down other artists. If you believe (and the keyword is if) that BTS are the best thing since sliced bread then great but you don't have to bring other artists down to prove that. I dont blame their fans for massbuying either. Billboard haven't updated their rules and BTS fans are just exploiting that. I just wish we could all chart watch peacefully. |
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otaviohmg
Platinum Member
Caught up in my head, hopin' you gon' say Was it worth it? Put that work in Got me nothin'
Joined: September 2019
Posts: 1,465
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Post by otaviohmg on Jun 3, 2021 15:57:23 GMT -5
I'm going to take a hiatus
My grandpa is in the icu because of covid.
Hope everyone be safe and bye <3. brb
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gikem
3x Platinum Member
Joined: October 2020
Posts: 3,813
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Post by gikem on Jun 3, 2021 16:08:04 GMT -5
He should just release the videos for my.life and pride.is.the.devil already. We don’t need him making more videos of the other tracks from The Off-Season that most people already forgot about. |
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Post by phieaglesfan712 on Jun 3, 2021 16:36:32 GMT -5
He should just release the videos for my.life and pride.is.the.devil already. We don’t need him making more videos of the other tracks from The Off-Season that most people already forgot about. Or better yet, create a remix for One Too Many to get it into the Top 50. To be honest, I have just about forgotten about the J Cole album tracks and he should just abandon project. |
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Groovy
6x Platinum Member
Joined: October 2017
Posts: 6,719
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Post by Groovy on Jun 3, 2021 16:49:43 GMT -5
He should just release the videos for my.life and pride.is.the.devil already. We don’t need him making more videos of the other tracks from The Off-Season that most people already forgot about. Or better yet, create a remix for One Too Many to get it into the Top 50. To be honest, I have just about forgotten about the J Cole album tracks and he should just abandon project. Shut up about One Too Many already. |
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