Billboard Hot 100: 06/26/2021

[Groovy]

But seriously, what is Billboard's issue with TOTC? Are they threatened by people who can give chart watchers/stans a better explanation and analysis to their charts than they can?

[gikem]

Jun 13, 2021 10:36:55 GMT -5 Groovy said:

But seriously, what is Billboard's issue with TOTC? Are they threatened by people who can give chart watchers/stans a better explanation and analysis to their charts than they can?

I think it's because TOTC exposed Billboard's flaws on multiple occasions that resulted in them revising or delaying their charts. I don't think they'd be as easy of a target if they weren't as open about these issues as they were. So when Billboard found out that TOTC was maintaining a website using their archived statistics without their permission, all bets were off.

Billboard doesn't seem to have this same problem with ChartData, which often posts similar stats/predictions and may get just as much (if not more) attention as the Billboard Charts account, but is able to coexist without a problem because they don't really question Billboard's logic.

[Enigma.]

Solar Power dropped to #13 on Spotify. Not looking great for top 20 debut.

[gikem]

Putting the TOTC discussion aside for a sec, lots of big drops on US Spotify for the Polo G and Migos tracks today. Between both albums, the only track to stay above 1M was RAPSTAR.

[dremolus - solarpunk]

Third least favorite thing about the TOTC (after the bullying Billboard is doing and all the hard work the creators put into the site being taken down) is that I won't be able to see the biggest Spotify gains easier and I might miss a few songs from time to time. My compulsion hates missing shit.

[gikem]

Jun 13, 2021 10:22:58 GMT -5 Groovy said:

Jun 13, 2021 10:11:38 GMT -5 rimetm said:

Unfortunately, I inquired and was informed that the Cease and Desist extended to their social media presence as well, so there’s no way for them to convey predictions anymore.

Thug life

That post got taken down. rimetm was right, they definitely can’t post any of their predictions to Twitter now.

Come to think of it, is there anything they can do, even just on Twitter, or has Billboard’s cease-and-desist notice rendered them all but useless?

[Groovy]

Jun 13, 2021 10:52:15 GMT -5 gikem said:

Jun 13, 2021 10:36:55 GMT -5 Groovy said:

But seriously, what is Billboard's issue with TOTC? Are they threatened by people who can give chart watchers/stans a better explanation and analysis to their charts than they can?

I think it's because TOTC exposed Billboard's flaws on multiple occasions that resulted in them revising or delaying their charts. I don't think they'd be as easy of a target if they weren't as open about these issues as they were. So when Billboard found out that TOTC was maintaining a website using their archived statistics without their permission, all bets were off.

Billboard doesn't seem to have this same problem with ChartData, which often posts similar stats/predictions and may get just as much (if not more) attention as the Billboard Charts account, but is able to coexist without a problem because they don't really question Billboard's logic.

So really they have an issue who call them out for what their flawed logic and I guess they can be upset that they're essentially using their work without their permission but hopefully TOTC can still give out predictions and weekly YE updates. 

[s9983]

Why are predictions not allowed? It's not just TOTC making them, they could just easily make a new page and do the same thing considering there's another like 6-7 pages doing these predictions. It's literally PREDICTIONS. What's wrong with them?

[Groovy]

Sad day for chart watchers, some real ones went out today for us. Talk of the Charts, gone but not forgotten.

[Groovy]

Jun 13, 2021 12:10:50 GMT -5 s9983 said:

Why are predictions not allowed? It's not just TOTC making them, they could just easily make a new page and do the same thing considering there's another like 6-7 pages doing these predictions. It's literally PREDICTIONS. What's wrong with them?

They don't just do predictions, as Gikem said they were calling them out for things that were clearly wrong with them and were kinda using their work without permission. 

[Gary]

I guess we wait and see what is next and what level of using their property they find to be offensive

But yeah they are right and I am surprised they have not acted sooner than now

[shayonce]

they have access to soundscan and using that on their prediction in pulbic tweet. that might be the problem.
Billboard doesn't allow it which is why we don't see sound scan numbers on here no more, also chartdata stopped posting real numbers.

[thegreatdivine]

Jun 13, 2021 10:52:15 GMT -5 gikem said:

Jun 13, 2021 10:36:55 GMT -5 Groovy said:

But seriously, what is Billboard's issue with TOTC? Are they threatened by people who can give chart watchers/stans a better explanation and analysis to their charts than they can?

I think it's because TOTC exposed Billboard's flaws on multiple occasions that resulted in them revising or delaying their charts. I don't think they'd be as easy of a target if they weren't as open about these issues as they were. So when Billboard found out that TOTC was maintaining a website using their archived statistics without their permission, all bets were off.

Billboard doesn't seem to have this same problem with ChartData, which often posts similar stats/predictions and may get just as much (if not more) attention as the Billboard Charts account, but is able to coexist without a problem because they don't really question Billboard's logic.

I think why chartdata wouldn't get into trouble with Billboard the way TOTC did is because they post most of their Billboard stats as soon as Billboard posts them. That goes for Hot 100/Billboard 200 stats, radio stats and streaming stats. The only thing I know they post before Billboard are digital sales. The album projections they post comes from HDD and chartdata will only post about a song competing for a #1 debut when they see multiple chart prediction accounts say so or when the song's dominance is so massive that it's clear it'll be debuting at #1 so they're not posting anything on their account that isn't public information already.

TOTC did a lot more than just post weekly Hot 100 projections. They posted building Hot 100 year-end projections and their website (which I believe is the main reason Billboard has an issue with them) referenced material by Billboard that wasn't public knowledge and that Billboard would probably like to remain the sole publishers of. Stuff like the radio estimates and digital sales tracker probably didn't bother Billboard but stuff like their GOAT list, etc probably did.

I'd say Billboard should just let them be as all they do is inform everyday music fans who are curious about the inner-workings of charts but Billboard has every right to shut down anyone they feel is sharing private information that they haven't permitted them to and that's simply the truth.

I hope TOTC keeps sharing as much information as they can within the scopes of what's legal/allowed. They're definitely a valuable resource.

[iHype.]

I’m pretty sure Billboard outlined exactly what the issues were in the letter sent to them.

But yeah, calling out outliers in data, showing the ins and outs of formulas, and even highlighting what songs needed each week during the tracking week to secure placements was probably too directly threatening to their ecosystem.

[gikem]

Billboard should come for Pulse's Year-End Predictions thread next if that's really the main reason TOTC ultimately got blacklisted.

[iHype.]

Jun 13, 2021 13:03:53 GMT -5 gikem said:

Billboard should come for Pulse's Year-End Predictions thread next if that's really the main reason TOTC ultimately got blacklisted.

This is a forum dedicated to dozens of things and by chance has a thread where people post various different predictions for Hot 100 Year End.

Another was a website directly dedicated to it.

If Pulse was contacted by Billboard it’d be a matter of deleting specific threads or posts. Not deleting entire sections of websites.

[Baby Yoda Hot100Fan]

^We shouldn't be giving Billboard any more ideas ...

[nathanalbright]

Let Billboard try to do its one job and not do its other jobs for them.

[Enigma.]

Everyone can be like hey here are my predictions enjoy! It's totally another thing to build a website dedicated to replace Billboard (to put it harshly, TOTC do great job.)

[dremolus - solarpunk]

I don't think TOTC ever sought out to replace Billboard. As the name implies, it was meant to talk about chart activity, started by chart watchers like us who made it a hobby. It just so happened they were also more hard working and craftier than Billvoard expected

[Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ]

Jun 13, 2021 13:13:07 GMT -5 dremolus - solarpunk said:

I don't think TOTC ever sought out to replace Billboard

...but they really should. I'll sign a petition for that.

[Enigma.]

They should try another name than Hot 100 then

[Gary]

Don’t think the name is the problem. They are now on billboards radar. Something even close to being caught using their property could be a problem

[oliviafan101]

Fuck Billboard. Corporatist garbage at its worst.

[s9983]

In other news... Kiss me more is most probably going #1 the week doja cats album drops considering it's still doing so well

[phieaglesfan712]

Jun 13, 2021 14:54:21 GMT -5 s9983 said:

In other news... Kiss me more is most probably going #1 the week doja cats album drops considering it's still doing so well

It's too early to tell. Ed has a new single coming out that week, and it's not like Butter and Good 4 u are going anywhere. All I know is that week will be a very competitive race for #1 (and a very messy chart discussion).

[nathanalbright]

We'll be ready to keep it messy.

[Deleted]

well… i’m definitely gonna miss things like randomly looking up the weakest #1’s of 1976 on the GOAT list

[nathanalbright]

And then you can compare it to the weakest hits from today, arguing how some chart run of a forgotten hit is going to resemble that of a contemporary song to get people riled up.

[tanooki]