Is Midnights era bigger than 1989?

[NeRD]

From the sales, streaming records, touring demand, it sure feels like it.

Your thoughts?

[iHype.]

Touring demand has little to do with how big a current album is (rather a legacy, seeing as veteran artists get their highest-grossing tours much past their commercial peak).

We will have to see long term rather than just 3 weeks to have an idea of which era is bigger.

[Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ]

It's too early, and people who voted YES are underestimating 1989 era.

[jenglisbe]

Nov 19, 2022 13:42:05 GMT -5 Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ said:

It's too early, and people who voted YES are underestimating 1989 era.

Yup. This "era" is only like a month old lol. It's also tough to compare the pre-streaming era to now, but 1989 had a group of genuine hits and consistent album sales whereas this era doesn't have that (yet).

[suburbandreams]

1989 era will likely be bigger in the end as its much harder to release post album singles, Taylor skipped the pre album singles, and she is likely to do significantly less press than for 1989. She also isn't during her street walks, I think she only been photographed in public once since the era began.

However, I do think Taylor mania is at a new peak. Her fanbase is bigger and more passionate than ever. She also literally cannot get the press to stop talking about her. Even her remixes get articles written about them. What's scary is that she likely still has room to expand her fandom. I wonder if for her own sake she might try to dial it back now since her fandom size is now becoming a problem as she can't meet ticket demand.

[imbuemyblue]

It's far too early and as others have said it would be pretty hard for 'Midnights' to match its string of successful singles. But this era is undoubtedly huge, especially for the SPS era and will likely have many, many weeks in the top ten. I think we'll be looking at 5 mil+ SPS by the end of 2023, which is pretty wild. Gonna basically be the biggest album since 'Scorpion' (I do not acknowledge the existence of 'Dangerous', please and thank you).

[Positive Tension]

It's too early to tell, but I think 1989 will still go down as her peak era.

[suburbandreams]

Nov 19, 2022 18:23:55 GMT -5 imbuemyblue said:

It's far too early and as others have said it would be pretty hard for 'Midnights' to match its string of successful singles. But this era is undoubtedly huge, especially for the SPS era and will likely have many, many weeks in the top ten. I think we'll be looking at 5 mil+ SPS by the end of 2023, which is pretty wild. Gonna basically be the biggest album since 'Scorpion' (I do not acknowledge the existence of 'Dangerous', please and thank you).

Bad Bunny's album might turn out bigger to. Its streams are ridiculous.  But what makes Taylor's current run amazing is that every album she is putting out causes her back catalogue to increase in streams. I think she consistently has at least six albums charting on billboard.

[dremolus - solarpunk]

Midnights has been put for a month and 1989 has been out for 8 years lmao. Maybe wait a bit.

[🅳🅸🆂🅲🅾]

1989 was a sustained era with multiple hits that had longevity and a successful tour. Midnights has done quite well, but it has been less than a month.

[Nasarati]

I think there's a healthy argument to be made that Midnights represents the advent of "peak Taylor Swift," in terms of the fandom and media hysteria. One gets the feeling that when Midnights dropped, Taylor was not just a "popular musician" or a "mainstream pop star," but a cultural event that the entire world had their eyes obsessively trained on. Everyone I know was living and breathing T-Swift the week Midnights dropped, even people who I never knew to be fans of her. I think Midnights lowkey makes the case for Taylor as a legitimate cultural icon like Beyonce. Like, a figure of historical import.

[Marooned@Midnight]

It’s impossible to say yet, but I will say for whatever it’s worth the first month of this era “feels” much bigger than the first month of the 1989 era. If she can get a few sustained radio hits out of this I think there will be a strong argument for Midnights being her biggest era.

[HEADOFTHEPACK]

Far, far too early but the clear answer is (and I'm almost sure it will continue to be) no. Agree with above posters saying the hysteria/launch felt bigger, but no, for so many reasons (overall sales, cultural impact, singles etc etc).

I think there's an argument to be made for an album's opening sales/launch week-month whatever to be a culmination of what came before it. Midnights is a new 'pop' TS album coming off 2x successful surprise albums and 2x successful re-records. That + the pre-release hype and merch pretty much guaranteed a big moment. The tour being her first in some time and after a string of successful albums also factors here imo. It's such a huge build up of momentum.

[imbuemyblue]

I dunno, I wouldn't say *adamantly* that there is a clear answer. It's not like 'Midnights' is just going off hype or it would have levels off by now (just as it's not like '1989' coming off 'Red' had nothing going for it). It would also be somewhat unfair to say that it has to hit the exact sales of '1989' as that just pretty much literally cannot happen any more. I think this is probably just her 'Emancipation Of Mimi'; a re-peak that is hard to compare apples to apples because of how the industry has changed.

[Rose "Payola" Nylund]

I was thinking about this the other day. The album sales peak, the constant social media discussions, the news stories, it feels like Midnights is a new peak for Taylor’s popularity that even 1989 or Red didn’t peak. But I like what both suburbandreams and Nasarati said and how they framed it. It’s a new peak for Taylor, the artist/brand, but it doesn’t necessarily mean Midnights is a bigger era — that’ll come at the end when the final numbers and hits tally roles in, and 1989 would be hard to beat there. But at this moment in time, this feels like it could absolutely be a new peak for Taylor, which is insane.

[irice22]

It's so strange but "Midnights" definitely feels HUGE. I chose that.

Though I'm an old man now.

[Envoirment]

I would say no. 1989 had 3 big #1 hits and the music videos were events - in particular "Bad Blood". The album is still being streamed very well all these years later despite being released very early on in the streaming era. Midnights has had a massive start, but I don't think it'll have the impact or influence that 1989 did paticularly in the long run. 1989 also cemented Taylor as an international superstar.

Granted it's somewhat difficult to compare them both given how big streaming is now and how much easier it is for big artists to get multiple top 10 debuts on the Hot 100 on release week. I wouldn't be surprised if Midnights becomes her 3rd best selling album SPS-wise after Fearless & 1989 in the long run.

[jenglisbe]

Nov 20, 2022 18:36:14 GMT -5 Envoirment said:

I would say no. 1989 had 3 big #1 hits and the music videos were events - in particular "Bad Blood". The album is still being streamed very well all these years later despite being released very early on in the streaming era. Midnights has had a massive start, but I don't think it'll have the impact or influence that 1989 did paticularly in the long run. 1989 also cemented Taylor as an international superstar.

Granted it's somewhat difficult to compare them both given how big streaming is now and how much easier it is for big artists to get multiple top 10 debuts on the Hot 100 on release week. I wouldn't be surprised if Midnights becomes her 3rd best selling album SPS-wise after Fearless & 1989 in the long run.

In addition to the three #1s, 1989 had two other top 10s. That all happened without the benefit of what can be done in the streaming era. She also had "Out of the Woods" do well throughout the era (it ultimately underperformed as a single, but that's because it had already been around so long when it was officially pushed).

[NeRD]

Nov 20, 2022 18:36:14 GMT -5 Envoirment said:

I would say no. 1989 had 3 big #1 hits and the music videos were events - in particular "Bad Blood". The album is still being streamed very well all these years later despite being released very early on in the streaming era. Midnights has had a massive start, but I don't think it'll have the impact or influence that 1989 did paticularly in the long run. 1989 also cemented Taylor as an international superstar.

Granted it's somewhat difficult to compare them both given how big streaming is now and how much easier it is for big artists to get multiple top 10 debuts on the Hot 100 on release week. I wouldn't be surprised if Midnights becomes her 3rd best selling album SPS-wise after Fearless & 1989 in the long run.

It may be easier to score Top 10 hits during album release week these days but it's a lot harder to score #1s from the same album after release week. Not sure pointing out 1989's 3 #1s is fair.

[Nasarati]

My suspicion is that in twenty years or whatever, if you run up to someone and say, "Quick, name a Taylor Swift song!" they will probably not answer "Anti-Hero" or "Lavender Haze" or whatever. They'll say, "Shake it Off!" or "Love Story!" or whatever. Midnights has hits, but they don't give off the character of career-defining hits.

That said, I still adamantly believe that this is a monumental peak for Taylor -- and the record, taken on the whole as an album statement, IS definitive.

Regardless, the only way to find out is to let history run its course. Maybe we will look back and see Midnights as a hysterical fad in a year where new pop music arrived at a tedious trickle and little seemed to stick to the charts. Or maybe we'll look back at it as the core achievement of one of the 20th century's most notable songwriters. Who can say!

[Envoirment]

Nov 20, 2022 19:35:06 GMT -5 NeRD said:

Nov 20, 2022 18:36:14 GMT -5 Envoirment said:

I would say no. 1989 had 3 big #1 hits and the music videos were events - in particular "Bad Blood". The album is still being streamed very well all these years later despite being released very early on in the streaming era. Midnights has had a massive start, but I don't think it'll have the impact or influence that 1989 did paticularly in the long run. 1989 also cemented Taylor as an international superstar.

Granted it's somewhat difficult to compare them both given how big streaming is now and how much easier it is for big artists to get multiple top 10 debuts on the Hot 100 on release week. I wouldn't be surprised if Midnights becomes her 3rd best selling album SPS-wise after Fearless & 1989 in the long run.

It may be easier to score Top 10 hits during album release week these days but it's a lot harder to score #1s from the same album after release week. Not sure pointing out 1989's 3 #1s is fair.

I wouldn't necessasrily say that's true, especially given how weak the top of the Hot 100 has been for most of this year. We just haven't really had anyone playing the game like they used to. People like Taylor/Katy/Rihanna etc would release videos to boost their songs once they had garnered a large amount of airplay. Beyoncé could quite easily score multiple #1s from her most recent album if her and her team decided to play the game. "Break My Soul" has been a #1 hit and "Cuff It" is garnering a large amount of airplay. All it would take is Beyoncé to release the music video and discount the song on iTunes (or even release some store remixes) and that's her second Hot 100 #1.

Katy Perry scored as many #1s from teenage dream as she did due discounting & music video releases once airplay was high (+ remixes).

You only have to see Taylor's power regarding all her store remixes of "Anti-Hero" to see she could get multiple #1s from this album is she wanted to try/play the game with multiple singles (which she may indeed do in future).

I would say her #1s from 1989 were more impressive as there was massive competition at the time she got those. Compared to what the current Hot 100 has been for most of the year (well barring Drake's recent album release as well).

[Joe1240]

It is way too early to decide on this one also both albums come from different music climates,1989 came at a time when post-album tracks when do well, talk shows and magazines were much bigger at the time in media so it stood out more. Midnights is different that it comes in the streaming era and artists do don't long rollouts with magazines etc. anymore.