Billboard Hot 100: 05/04/2024

[Caviar]

It was a good run!

[velaxti]

Apr 20, 2024 13:31:20 GMT -5 @pikandru said:

As a TLDR final note here on this subject:

Mariah and The Beatles have the most #1s on the hot 100. They had to score legitimately big hits with nearly every single one of those to achieve that, and that’s why their records are considered so impressive and prestigious. Sure you may have the outlier like Thank God I Found You you can say that’s not really the case for… but it’s most definitely an outlier. They could not just put out literally anything and have their big fanbase go stream the song for free over and over for a week to snatch that hot 100 #1, then freefall. By and large, they had to score legitimate hits for that. The music mattered. Taylor Swift can put out anything (and I do mean anything) right now and it’s a hot 100 #1 debut due to modern chart methodology. The prestige there is gone. And it will keep slipping the more and more that becomes the “norm.”

I understand the point you're making. There's a Youtube channel which posts videos of all the #6s, #7s, #8s, etc, in Hot 100 histoy, and the issue you mentioned is very present there and quite jarring actually when you get to the end of the video and it starts consisting mostly of album tracks that charted for 4 weeks. And it is an interesting idea that you presented. I think another method that could probably achieve what you're looking for is to have a rolling chart where you take into acount the past 14 (or 21, 28, etc.) days instead of the past 7. For example if the chart was 14 days then then those song that go like 9-45-82-OUT probably peak at 20-something instead. But that has same downsides like the charts being more out of date and each week's points would count for multiple charts. I wouldn't mind either of those ideas, but they shouldn't replace the official Hot 100 imo.

Something I would like is actually a rolling yearly chart (maybe those of us on Pulse could retroactively do it as I think we have the data to at least estimate it). Getting #1 on that chart would be a HUGE achievement and very prestigous. But again it would be very out-of-date, most songs would peak months after their real world peak, but it would be easier to compare how big a hit is. But it would solve the problem we have now with year-end charts where songs released at certain times of the year have big advantages/disadvantages (some big hits completely miss the chart if their points are split between two years), and it would be interesting for us chart nerds.

In past decades you could look at a song's weekly peak and have a rough idea of how well the song did, which we can't do anymore. I think that's why some people put more importance in other things now than they might have done in the past. The year-end charts can tell you that Levitating was a bigger hit than HISS, or whether We Can't Be Friends was bigger than yes, and? or not, which weekly chart peaks can't really convey anymore.

But I think standard weekly charts are here to stay, and shouldn't be changed. HISS, for example, whilst it exited the charts very quickly and probably can't be considered a hit song in the standard way, it undeniably was a huge deal the week it went #1 and that's what the weekly Hot 100 charts are supposed to reflect.

Nowadays to tell the biggest songs, you can't just look at peak positions anymore and have a rough estimate of how big they were, you have to look at whether they made it to 20+ or 52+ weeks on the chart and so on.

[fridayteenage]

In its first day, Fortnight already in the upper half of 2020s 1st week numbers on Youtube.
17M so far.

1st weeks: All Too Well 41M
Anti-Hero 37M
Cardigan 34M
Willow 31M
Bejeweled 17M
The Man 16M
I Can See You 15M
I Bet You Think About Me 15M
Lavender Haze 14M
Karma 12M

[GW]

Apr 20, 2024 13:12:00 GMT -5 @pikandru said:

....Except I will also just note that flash in the pan stuff has always been a part of the hot 100. No one is arguing billboard needs to do something to eliminate that entirely. But that becoming the new majority of what the top ten now is from week to week (which is on its way to happening at this rate) will inevitably dilute the h100’s prestige and rep in the industry. But ultimately, that’s on billboard if they want to let that happen. Certainly not me.

It's a weekly chart - always has been. It's not intended to generate big runs to justify that a hit is "real" by whatever subjective criteria one such as yourself may use.  It's very of-the-moment.  Streaming has emphasized this fact and opened he floodgates for album bombs, but the chart is accurate as a one-week snapshot. It's simply the reality of where we're at with technology and consumption methods and habits.  You're trying to go back in time to when the charts were inaccurate and even manipulated due to a lack of technology.  Those days are long gone.


Things have to evolve and change to match the present day, and if not, they become irrelevant and useless. Again, it's a weekly chart, and "weeks on" is available in the chart histories to give some context to any given peak. 

[Deleted]

Apr 20, 2024 14:07:13 GMT -5 avamaxstan said:

That user really lost the plot once he invoked Mariah, the original pioneer of chart manipulation tactics to get Hot 100 #1’s for the entire 90s. So unserious lol

I don’t want to just keep arguing, but just for the record I of course know that Mariah was big on chart manipulation back in the day (or rather the label). Yet it was pretty hard for her to score a fluke hit nonetheless because methodology at the time didn’t allow for it nearly as easily as now.

How can you make an argument for any of her #1s being flash in the pans except TGIFY maybe? I guess maybeee My All as well if you want to reach a bit. But once the music started being stuff that the general public wasn’t really here for (like Loverboy) she stopped being able to get the #1s even with the chart games. It just wasn’t that easy to have these fluke inflated peaks on the chart until modern times. Possible, but not the easy.

[Deleted]

I really think there should be an emphasis on a Streaming 100 chart where streaming can just run rampant with whatever song was trendy for 2 days or whatever. But Hot 100 should put some rigidity back into the methodology regarding streaming. I really don’t feel my mind can be changed on this, that’s just what I think would better represent what the chart has always been up until like 3-4 years ago. I also don’t really care if a huge undeniable smash is a song I hate for what it’s worth. It’s not an emotional thing. I wouldn’t try to deny that song its prestige and achievement when it’s factually obvious it was a smash in every way, no matter what I think of it (*cough Last Night *cough).

[Skibidi Bop Bop]

If streaming will only count points for the song being listened to in full, or if it should be at least 2 minutes long to make it onto the chart, then it's fair enough.

[Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ]

[chartfreak]

Is there something contagious? Lots of coughing going around.

[mms82]

Cause the haters gonna hate hate hate hate

Taylor’s album tracks are bigger than any other song this week, and they deserve to chart as such. I don’t get people that want to manipulate the chart because of their old “feels” of a song not being as big

[Deleted]

Apr 20, 2024 18:02:07 GMT -5 chartfreak said:

Is there something contagious? Lots of coughing going around.

It happens when you hit 30 and get old *cough shrugs *cough

[wavey.]

Cover your mouth.

[mms82]

Apr 20, 2024 17:28:23 GMT -5 Ｓｏｕｎｄｃｌ🕤ｃｋ said:

Lift Yourself (Poopity Scoop) is still the best Drake dis of all tiime

[pnobelysk]

I understand celebrity is a weird chasm of chaos and scandal. But it makes me really depressed that Kanye is a nazi and other artists still feel good about engaging with him/ working etc. there are so many artists I’ve tried to get better at accepting others can separate the art etc. but Kanye feels so different to me. There’s no one in my life I could come across who is a nazi and I’d feel comfortable speaking / working with them

[fridayteenage]

apple music combined versions; songs higher than her lowest song:

10 Drake - Push Ups
17 Like That
23 Type Shit
25 Get it Sexxy
30 Wanna Be
36 Too Sweet

[fengyu]

United States Apple Music Top Songs | 00:02 EDT | All charts

1 Taylor Swift - Fortnight (feat. Post Malone)
2 Taylor Swift - The Tortured Poets Department
3 Taylor Swift - Down Bad
4 Taylor Swift - So Long, London
5 Taylor Swift - But Daddy I Love Him
6 Taylor Swift - My Boy Only Breaks His Favorite Toys
7 Taylor Swift - Florida!!! (feat. Florence + the Machine)
8 Taylor Swift - I Can Do It With a Broken Heart
9 Taylor Swift - Who’s Afraid of Little Old Me?
11 Taylor Swift - Guilty as Sin?
12 Taylor Swift - Fresh Out The Slammer
13 Taylor Swift - loml
14 Taylor Swift - The Alchemy
15 Taylor Swift - The Smallest Man Who Ever Lived
16 Taylor Swift - I Can Fix Him (No Really I Can)
18 Taylor Swift - Clara Bow
19 Taylor Swift - thanK you aIMee
20 Taylor Swift - So High School
21 Taylor Swift - The Black Dog
22 Taylor Swift - imgonnagetyouback
24 Taylor Swift - The Albatross
26 Taylor Swift - Chloe or Sam or Sophia or Marcus
27 Taylor Swift - I Hate It Here
28 Taylor Swift - How Did It End?
29 Taylor Swift - The Prophecy
31 Taylor Swift - I Look in People's Windows
32 Taylor Swift - Cassandra
33 Taylor Swift - Peter
34 Taylor Swift - The Bolter
35 Taylor Swift - The Manuscript
37 Taylor Swift - Robin

10 Drake - Push Ups

[Deleted]

Apr 20, 2024 14:38:34 GMT -5 theycallmedualian said:

top25 early prediction by TOTC. sorry for the low quality image, i pirated it. 

[kcdawg13]

Taylor's numbers are insane, absolutely. HOWEVER after listening to the whole album, the numbers seem really front loaded. I really don't see this having the staying power of Midnights, there's just zero hooks. I expect a pretty harsh drop off in streams next week. I'll probably regret saying that but we'll see lol

[Deleted]

Apr 21, 2024 0:21:11 GMT -5 kcdawg13 said:

Taylor's numbers are insane, absolutely. HOWEVER after listening to the whole album, the numbers seem really front loaded. I really don't see this having the staying power of Midnights, there's just zero hooks. I expect a pretty harsh drop off in streams next week. I'll probably regret saying that but we'll see lol

Her Dawn FM era!

[thegreatdivine]

Apr 21, 2024 0:21:11 GMT -5 kcdawg13 said:

Taylor's numbers are insane, absolutely. HOWEVER after listening to the whole album, the numbers seem really front loaded. I really don't see this having the staying power of Midnights, there's just zero hooks. I expect a pretty harsh drop off in streams next week. I'll probably regret saying that but we'll see lol

I agree. I listened to the entire 31-track affair last night and the second album is MUCH BETTER to me. I'd have been fine with her just releasing that instead of the bloated mess the first album makes the whole thing become. Fortnight is definitely a choice for a lead single because that song sucks. 

I think Taylor should stick to 15-20 tracks for her studio albums and leave the 25-30+ track records to the TV releases. 

I don't wanna say she needs a break, but she does. She can of course release the remaining TV albums but outside of that, I think her main focus should be finishing her tour, taking a few years off and then making a return (she has a massive back catalog that's putting up record numbers so she'll still easily be the most consumed artist year after year even without dropping any new music). 

[sayhey]

So, the first-day radio AI numbers are in for Taylor's new album:

Taylor Swift - Fortnight (feat. Post Malone) - 8.01
Taylor Swift - My Boy Only Breaks His Favorite Toys - 2.46
Taylor Swift - But Daddy I Love Him - 2.08
Taylor Swift - Florida!!! (feat. Florence + the Machine) - 2.01
Taylor Swift - I Can Do It With a Broken Heart - 1.61

Cruel Summer understandably lost 1.52M AI due to pop radio picking up her new songs.

Fortnight had a great start at 8.01M AI, impressive! This should do well on Pop/HAC/AC. Even though it's a cute song, I feel like it's a bit uneventful for a lead single. ICDIWABH is much more striking and memorable imo! But if her fanbase and Taylor herself favor Fortnight, then who am I to argue haha! I still feel like ICDIWABH will eventually overshadow Fortnight though, but that remains to be seen of course!

As for MBOBHFT and BDILH, I don't see the radio appeal there. I'm assuming her fans requested those songs specifically on the radio. Also, I was excited for Taylor's collaboration with Florence but I have to admit that I was underwhelmed. I was really hoping for a creative, melodic song that combined their vocals harmoniously and felt like their duet could result in a multi-format radio smash but the result was a bit more generic than I expected. Still, I'm glad that Taylor has collaborated with artists like Florence and Lana recently. I'm interested to see how she'll evolve sonically in the future. I'd like to see her make a truly off-the-wall, quirky sounding indie record eventually.

[After Minutes]

I've never felt so out of touch with popular culture, to me this album is horrid, I would really like to partake in the Taylor Swift appreciation, go to her concert and be part of the moment and tell my future grandchildren about it but I just can't force myself to care about or enjoy the music and that genuinely makes me a little upset

[jenglisbe]

Apr 20, 2024 14:07:13 GMT -5 avamaxstan said:

That user really lost the plot once he invoked Mariah, the original pioneer of chart manipulation tactics to get Hot 100 #1’s for the entire 90s.

The entire 1990s? What manipulation occurred for her debut singles? What manipulation occurred for "Dreamlover" to get to #1? If anything she was hurt in the early 1990s as Tommy cut supplies for "Can't Let Go," which possibly kept it from hitting #1. Additionally Mariah (more so her Sony team) was by no means the original pioneer. Chart tactics have been going on since at least the 1970s, and likely before. Please look into the "Shadow Dancing" and "Baker Street" controversy from 1978.

[Az Paynter]

After his first full day, Drake is up to #12 on Spotify. It does call into question his ability to break up Taylor getting a top 10 lockout for the second time, since I believe he also got bumped from the top 10 on Apple Music once dupes of Taylor's songs were combined? (QUICK EDIT: Oh, I see upthread on this page, he was still #10).

[Future Captain]

Pretty steep drops all around. I think more comparable to the TVs rather than Midnights?

[Enigma.]

-42% on Spotify globally, we'll know the US drop when dremolus blesses us with the recap.

[David]

Apr 21, 2024 2:12:49 GMT -5 thegreatdivine said:

Apr 21, 2024 0:21:11 GMT -5 kcdawg13 said:

Taylor's numbers are insane, absolutely. HOWEVER after listening to the whole album, the numbers seem really front loaded. I really don't see this having the staying power of Midnights, there's just zero hooks. I expect a pretty harsh drop off in streams next week. I'll probably regret saying that but we'll see lol

I agree. I listened to the entire 31-track affair last night and the second album is MUCH BETTER to me. I'd have been fine with her just releasing that instead of the bloated mess the first album makes the whole thing become. Fortnight is definitely a choice for a lead single because that song sucks. 

I think Taylor should stick to 15-20 tracks for her studio albums and leave the 25-30+ track records to the TV releases. 

I don't wanna say she needs a break, but she does. She can of course release the remaining TV albums but outside of that, I think her main focus should be finishing her tour, taking a few years off and then making a return (she has a massive back catalog that's putting up record numbers so she'll still easily be the most consumed artist year after year even without dropping any new music). 

Curious to hear you elaborate on why Taylor "needs" to take a break? She's still performing well and has said that she's happiest when she's making things. Shouldn't she be allowed to do what makes her happy?

[fridayteenage]

Apr 21, 2024 4:24:30 GMT -5 sayhey said:

As for MBOBHFT and BDILH, I don't see the radio appeal there. I'm assuming her fans requested those songs specifically on the radio. Also, I was excited for Taylor's collaboration with Florence but I have to admit that I was underwhelmed. I was really hoping for a creative, melodic song that combined their vocals harmoniously and felt like their duet could result in a multi-format radio smash but the result was a bit more generic than I expected. Still, I'm glad that Taylor has collaborated with artists like Florence and Lana recently. I'm interested to see how she'll evolve sonically in the future. I'd like to see her make a truly off-the-wall, quirky sounding indie record eventually.

I don't see them doing that with 'my boy' at all.

[thegreatdivine]

Apr 21, 2024 6:15:21 GMT -5 Az Paynter said:

After his first full day, Drake is up to #12 on Spotify. It does call into question his ability to break up Taylor getting a top 10 lockout for the second time, since I believe he also got bumped from the top 10 on Apple Music once dupes of Taylor's songs were combined? (QUICK EDIT: Oh, I see upthread on this page, he was still #10).

Push Ups is #8 on US Apple Music right now. 

Apr 21, 2024 7:00:41 GMT -5 David said:

Apr 21, 2024 2:12:49 GMT -5 thegreatdivine said:

I agree. I listened to the entire 31-track affair last night and the second album is MUCH BETTER to me. I'd have been fine with her just releasing that instead of the bloated mess the first album makes the whole thing become. Fortnight is definitely a choice for a lead single because that song sucks. 

I think Taylor should stick to 15-20 tracks for her studio albums and leave the 25-30+ track records to the TV releases. 

I don't wanna say she needs a break, but she does. She can of course release the remaining TV albums but outside of that, I think her main focus should be finishing her tour, taking a few years off and then making a return (she has a massive back catalog that's putting up record numbers so she'll still easily be the most consumed artist year after year even without dropping any new music). 

Curious to hear you elaborate on why Taylor "needs" to take a break? She's still performing well and has said that she's happiest when she's making things. Shouldn't she be allowed to do what makes her happy?

She can do whatever she wants. I just made a suggestion. I think her writing is her greatest strength and it's taken a hit lately. Some of her most cringeworthy lyrics in years are on Midnights and the first half of her latest album. 

[👑 Eloquent ™]

People are naive if they believe Taylor has lost any writing talent or ability whatsoever. People may not like her lyrical choices (mostly vocal detractors online from what I've seen personally) but every line has a very deliberate purpose and likely a meaning beyond what the average person will see (like the "golden retriever" line for instance). I just think it's humorous all the hoopla about how awful some of the lines are on TTPD while the same people glaringly ignore some of the best writing throughout the rest of the album.