Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 21, 2014 23:46:00 GMT -5
think you guys will like this one
goes for alt adds march 18
|
|
Chato
2x Platinum Member
Joined: June 2005
Posts: 2,028
|
Post by Chato on Feb 22, 2014 4:31:42 GMT -5
think you guys will like this one Oh no, not me! I don't! As per usual american alternative radio falls for the most nondescript of british (canadian, south african... insert any given english-speaking country here) bands to present their audiences some hot "alternative" they might not have heard of yet. Of course the ridiculously depressing state the british alternative/rock music scene is in doesn't help matters. But that's not even the main issue with these offenders. They are just part of a bigger problem. The current "indie" trend is en route to put the final nail in the coffin of alt radio's relevance. Just like bro-country buried mainstream country radio under a shroud of dumbed-down, stereotypical revelling. I mean, it wasn't easy to take when alt radio was dominated by the broship of nu-metal, watered down post grunge and artless mallcore in the early to mid 2000s. But at least no one tried to sell Limp Bizkit, blink-182 and Creed as something they weren't. And that's the huge problem we're having now. Alternative radio now is dominated, on a larger scale (Neighbourhood, Foster the People, Young The Giant etc.) and on a smaller scale (Wild Cub, Bad Suns, Magic Man etc.), by bands that are just being sold as "indie" - regardless of what that term actually means. Does it really mean pre-fabricated, pretty-boy groups with guitars and pop star aspirations? Or is it just mainstream cultures latest hook? It's saddening to see a lively indie scene - i.e. folks who are trying and producing music that usually won't be supported by mainstream outlets - while most people will soon connect "indie" with that shitty fad that infested popular culture in the early to mid 2010's. Hair Metal, Pop-Punk, nu metal and the like were never intended to be anything but such fads. So it's a little disheartening to see "indie" go down like this. - rant over.
|
|
Green Baron
Diamond Member
Banned
Why do I start what I can't finish?
|
Post by Green Baron on Feb 22, 2014 11:34:35 GMT -5
I like it.
Too bad I don't see it getting past Top 40. I think it'll perform about the same as Aunt Betty by MC Rut (#38 peak)
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2014 12:50:28 GMT -5
think you guys will like this one word wall did...you even listen to the song
|
|
|
Post by American Idiot on Feb 22, 2014 15:40:58 GMT -5
think you guys will like this one Oh no, not me! I don't! As per usual american alternative radio falls for the most nondescript of british (canadian, south african... insert any given english-speaking country here) bands to present their audiences some hot "alternative" they might not have heard of yet. Of course the ridiculously depressing state the british alternative/rock music scene is in doesn't help matters. But that's not even the main issue with these offenders. They are just part of a bigger problem. The current "indie" trend is en route to put the final nail in the coffin of alt radio's relevance. Just like bro-country buried mainstream country radio under a shroud of dumbed-down, stereotypical revelling. I mean, it wasn't easy to take when alt radio was dominated by the broship of nu-metal, watered down post grunge and artless mallcore in the early to mid 2000s. But at least no one tried to sell Limp Bizkit, blink-182 and Creed as something they weren't. And that's the huge problem we're having now. Alternative radio now is dominated, on a larger scale (Neighbourhood, Foster the People, Young The Giant etc.) and on a smaller scale (Wild Cub, Bad Suns, Magic Man etc.), by bands that are just being sold as "indie" - regardless of what that term actually means. Does it really mean pre-fabricated, pretty-boy groups with guitars and pop star aspirations? Or is it just mainstream cultures latest hook? It's saddening to see a lively indie scene - i.e. folks who are trying and producing music that usually won't be supported by mainstream outlets - while most people will soon connect "indie" with that s**tty fad that infested popular culture in the early to mid 2010's. Hair Metal, Pop-Punk, nu metal and the like were never intended to be anything but such fads. So it's a little disheartening to see "indie" go down like this. - rant over. While I agree with your rant here, this isn't indie at all. Sounds more like Middle Class Rut meet Muse and Silversun Pickups to me. I like it a lot.
|
|
Chato
2x Platinum Member
Joined: June 2005
Posts: 2,028
|
Post by Chato on Feb 23, 2014 4:15:41 GMT -5
did...you even listen to the song Yes I did! Imo this is by the numbers rock, made in hopes of inclusion on sports broadcasts and a third stage gig at Donington. But, as I said, that's not even the main issue here. Anyway, I didn't mean to offend anyone here.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 13:03:29 GMT -5
so how did this make u go on a huge ra-nevermind
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 23, 2014 14:41:02 GMT -5
think you guys will like this one It's saddening to see a lively indie scene - i.e. folks who are trying and producing music that usually won't be supported by mainstream outlets - while most people will soon connect "indie" with that s**tty fad that infested popular culture in the early to mid 2010's. Hair Metal, Pop-Punk, nu metal and the like were never intended to be anything but such fads. So it's a little disheartening to see "indie" go down like this. - rant over. To say that Hair Metal, Pop-Punk, and Nu-Metal were meant to be fads whereas Indie has fallen victim to the mainstream adopting it and contaminating and thus making it a fad...to me that's totally pretentious and arrogant. Every genre of music (and related subculture) that's ever caught on to the extent that Indie has now has started out as a niche and rose to prominence because of artists who were fresh enough to make it exactly what the musical climate was missing and early supporter fans who were passionate enough about the music to make it visible. If you think indie somehow has higher ambitions than all the other genres you mentioned, then I think you need to seriously get off your high horse. My horse in this race is nu-metal, so if you wanna take me on head-to-head on the merits of the genre, the ambitions of its musicians, its emergence from birth to mainstream success to backlash...let's do this. Convince me that Indie deserved a fate any different from nu-metal. Deftones is to Modest Mouse as Limp Bizkit is to fun. Every genre has its genius and its complete s**t.
|
|
Devin
Diamond Member
Best Rock Poster 2011―2014
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 13,948
My Charts
Pronouns: He/Him
|
Post by Devin on Feb 23, 2014 14:50:57 GMT -5
Deftones is to Modest Mouse as Limp Bizkit is to fun. Every genre has its genius and its complete s**t. Hey man, I think fun. are creative and their lyrics/music aren't that bad. I think you're being a bit harsh with that comparison.
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 23, 2014 15:16:45 GMT -5
Deftones is to Modest Mouse as Limp Bizkit is to fun. Every genre has its genius and its complete s**t. Hey man, I think fun. are creative and their lyrics/music aren't that bad. I think you're being a bit harsh with that comparison. Yeah and Limp Bizkit has one of the best rhythm sections around. Wes Borland is a plenty creative guitar player and the Rivers/Otto combo on bass and drums gets a pretty killer groove. Again, I will take anyone to task who thinks indie is inherently superior and more artful than nu-metal. Your move guys. I'm gonna put up a fight and will be a vocal minority to be reckoned with.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2014 16:03:34 GMT -5
what the hell happened here
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 23, 2014 16:40:12 GMT -5
what the hell happened here His rant broadly dissed a lot of music, some of which deserved a lot more respect than he gave it. Sorry man, but I'm a fighter for justice!
|
|
Green Baron
Diamond Member
Banned
Why do I start what I can't finish?
|
Post by Green Baron on Feb 23, 2014 16:46:40 GMT -5
can we not call Deftones nu metal
please
they evolved into better things
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 23, 2014 17:13:52 GMT -5
can we not call Deftones nu metal please they evolved into better things That may be true, but they were always edgy, talented, and respected. I love their new records for sure, but some of their old records were awesome as well. I feel like you saying they evolved into better things is placing a value judgment on a genre name which is the whole issue I'm taking with this. That era of alternative-metal had a lot of great music and a lot of bad music just as with any other "trend" or "fad". The idea that "nu-metal" due to the derogatory name attached to what should be termed "alternative metal" is somehow inherently beneath indie is precisely the mentality I have a huge problem with. You're saying not to lump Deftones with bad bands like Limp Bizkit, Coal Chamber, Crazy Town, etc. I'm saying that the s**tty alt-metal bands of that era should not bring that whole genre down to the point that we have to call a band as great as the Deftones something different from it. Or if we're gonna do that, let's be consistent and apply that standard to all genres, where the good and bad are separated into two distinct genre names based on whether the music is actually good.
|
|
Green Baron
Diamond Member
Banned
Why do I start what I can't finish?
|
Post by Green Baron on Feb 23, 2014 17:27:07 GMT -5
can we not call Deftones nu metal please they evolved into better things That may be true, but they were always edgy, talented, and respected. I love their new records for sure, but some of their old records were awesome as well. I feel like you saying they evolved into better things is placing a value judgment on a genre name which is the whole issue I'm taking with this. That era of alternative-metal had a lot of great music and a lot of bad music just as with any other "trend" or "fad". The idea that "nu-metal" due to the derogatory name attached to what should be termed "alternative metal" is somehow inherently beneath indie is precisely the mentality I have a huge problem with. You're saying not to lump Deftones with bad bands like Limp Bizkit, Coal Chamber, Crazy Town, etc. I'm saying that the s**tty alt-metal bands of that era should not bring that whole genre down to the point that we have to call a band as great as the Deftones something different from it. Or if we're gonna do that, let's be consistent and apply that standard to all genres, where the good and bad are separated into two distinct genre names based on whether the music is actually good. that's not where i'm going with this at all. Their first two albums were straight up nu-metal, and with White Pony they started evolving and experimenting, dropping most of their nu-metal roots. The same goes with System of a Down, another band mislabeled as nu metal. They never had the rap-influenced, DJ-scratching sounds of Korn, instead being more influenced by thrash and death metal. If anything, the nu-metal scene really wasn't as bad as people made it out to be. Early Linkin Park, early Korn, early Deftones were all great. The bad overtook the good
|
|
Chato
2x Platinum Member
Joined: June 2005
Posts: 2,028
|
Post by Chato on Feb 23, 2014 17:37:34 GMT -5
Again, I will take anyone to task who thinks indie is inherently superior and more artful than nu-metal. Your move guys. I'm gonna put up a fight and will be a vocal minority to be reckoned with. Indie ≠ genre. Simple as that. One thing I was trying to point out is the irony/cynicism of pre-fabricated pretty-boy pop bands being marketed as 'indie'. And again, please try not to feel offended by the mere fact that I didn't like 90% of what was on alt-radio back in the early/mid 2000s. But I'm sure that anyone with clear conscious mind was well aware back in 2001, that the guys who gave us this little nugget were part of a HUGE fad. ;)
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 23, 2014 18:57:42 GMT -5
That may be true, but they were always edgy, talented, and respected. I love their new records for sure, but some of their old records were awesome as well. I feel like you saying they evolved into better things is placing a value judgment on a genre name which is the whole issue I'm taking with this. That era of alternative-metal had a lot of great music and a lot of bad music just as with any other "trend" or "fad". The idea that "nu-metal" due to the derogatory name attached to what should be termed "alternative metal" is somehow inherently beneath indie is precisely the mentality I have a huge problem with. You're saying not to lump Deftones with bad bands like Limp Bizkit, Coal Chamber, Crazy Town, etc. I'm saying that the s**tty alt-metal bands of that era should not bring that whole genre down to the point that we have to call a band as great as the Deftones something different from it. Or if we're gonna do that, let's be consistent and apply that standard to all genres, where the good and bad are separated into two distinct genre names based on whether the music is actually good. that's not where i'm going with this at all. Their first two albums were straight up nu-metal, and with White Pony they started evolving and experimenting, dropping most of their nu-metal roots. The same goes with System of a Down, another band mislabeled as nu metal. They never had the rap-influenced, DJ-scratching sounds of Korn, instead being more influenced by thrash and death metal. If anything, the nu-metal scene really wasn't as bad as people made it out to be. Early Linkin Park, early Korn, early Deftones were all great. The bad overtook the good I think we agree with everything we're saying; I just define nu-metal more broadly than you; I take nu-metal to be the dirty way of saying "alt-metal" and include more artsy alt-metal records like White Pony, Toxicity, Sevendust's Animosity, Ra's From One, etc.
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 23, 2014 19:06:19 GMT -5
Again, I will take anyone to task who thinks indie is inherently superior and more artful than nu-metal. Your move guys. I'm gonna put up a fight and will be a vocal minority to be reckoned with. Indie ≠ genre. Simple as that. One thing I was trying to point out is the irony/cynicism of pre-fabricated pretty-boy pop bands being marketed as 'indie'. And again, please try not to feel offended by the mere fact that I didn't like 90% of what was on alt-radio back in the early/mid 2000s. But I'm sure that anyone with clear conscious mind was well aware back in 2001, that the guys who gave us this little nugget were part of a HUGE fad. ;) Yes, but your point on "Nookie" sorta makes MY point. Nu-metal existed long before "The Nookie" with Korn, Deftones, Helmet, and EARLY Tool (their first EP could qualify but after that their progginess made them not exactly a fit in this genre) all putting out music that was on the cutting edge relative to its time. 2001 was the parallel to what you're talking about now with indie. This is when the mainstream copycats were coming along, piggy-backing on the trend and parasitically sending it towards its fate of being a fad. That's why I made the comparison between Limp Bizkit and fun. in the first place. They applied mass appeal lowest common denominator-isms to the trends pioneered by the trail-blazing artists that came before them. Also, maybe Indie isn't supposed to be a genre, but it is one, and I feel like for the purpose of this conversation you have to acknowledge it as one or you can't be comparing it to other genres.
|
|
Chato
2x Platinum Member
Joined: June 2005
Posts: 2,028
|
Post by Chato on Feb 24, 2014 14:19:57 GMT -5
Agreed 98%. Still I think indie is a concept, rather than a genre.
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 24, 2014 14:25:25 GMT -5
Agreed 98%. Still I think indie is a concept, rather than a genre. Maybe it started that way. But I think now it's a genre, and a lot of the music you have a problem with is a pop form of the genre that has completely abandoned the concept (i.e. these new bands are major-label manufactured/fabricated).
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 24, 2014 17:52:07 GMT -5
Given how much I've posted in this thread I decided to finally listen to this song. I dig this track quite a bit. I'm definitely getting the Middle Class Rut comparisons, but I think this is better and heavier than "Aunt Betty". I think Active Rock will be a better home for this in today's climate than Alternative, even if it has some 'indie-isms'. That said, so far no FM stations have added it, just Sirius and Music Choice, so there's not enough support to suggest this charting anywhere. But with a little nudge (i.e. a good chunk of money), I could see top 30 on active and top 40 on alternative.
|
|
Green Baron
Diamond Member
Banned
Why do I start what I can't finish?
|
Post by Green Baron on Feb 24, 2014 18:02:11 GMT -5
Given how much I've posted in this thread I decided to finally listen to this song. I dig this track quite a bit. I'm definitely getting the Middle Class Rut comparisons, but I think this is better and heavier than "Aunt Betty". I think Active Rock will be a better home for this in today's climate than Alternative, even if it has some 'indie-isms'. That said, so far no FM stations have added it, just Sirius and Music Choice, so there's not enough support to suggest this charting anywhere. But with a little nudge (i.e. a good chunk of money), I could see top 30 on active and top 40 on alternative. I want this to do good on alternative though. Prove the indie hipsters better
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 24, 2014 18:10:03 GMT -5
Given how much I've posted in this thread I decided to finally listen to this song. I dig this track quite a bit. I'm definitely getting the Middle Class Rut comparisons, but I think this is better and heavier than "Aunt Betty". I think Active Rock will be a better home for this in today's climate than Alternative, even if it has some 'indie-isms'. That said, so far no FM stations have added it, just Sirius and Music Choice, so there's not enough support to suggest this charting anywhere. But with a little nudge (i.e. a good chunk of money), I could see top 30 on active and top 40 on alternative. I want this to do good on alternative though. Prove the indie hipsters better I think Chevelle's "Take Out The Gunman" is your best shot at that.
|
|
Green Baron
Diamond Member
Banned
Why do I start what I can't finish?
|
Post by Green Baron on Feb 24, 2014 18:10:58 GMT -5
I want this to do good on alternative though. Prove the indie hipsters better I think Chevelle's "Take Out The Gunman" is your best shot at that. Its bullet is too small though
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 24, 2014 18:13:00 GMT -5
I think Chevelle's "Take Out The Gunman" is your best shot at that. Its bullet is too small though +75 isn't bad. I agree that I don't think it's gonna blow up on the format, but I think it will do some healthy damage compared to what hard rock songs have recently done there.
|
|
krissirge
Gold Member
Joined: March 2013
Posts: 813
|
Post by krissirge on Feb 25, 2014 8:24:37 GMT -5
I will say with all honestly. Deftones haven't released a good album since White Pony. And Nookie is miles better than anything on alt radio these days.
|
|
jvandyck87
5x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 5,213
|
Post by jvandyck87 on Feb 25, 2014 9:14:41 GMT -5
I will say with all honestly. Deftones haven't released a good album since White Pony. And Nookie is miles better than anything on alt radio these days. :O
|
|
Pipa
Diamond Member
Sinner
1 week at #1: Of Monsters and Men - Alligator
Joined: December 2004
Posts: 10,448
My Charts
|
Post by Pipa on Feb 25, 2014 11:04:55 GMT -5
Nookie always has and always will be my least favourite song of all time.
|
|
Chato
2x Platinum Member
Joined: June 2005
Posts: 2,028
|
Post by Chato on Feb 25, 2014 13:54:13 GMT -5
I will say with all honestly. Deftones haven't released a good album since White Pony. And Nookie is miles better than anything on alt radio these days. To each their own opinion. But you might want to elaborate on the first point you made ;) Btw Isn't it great that we're having a thread here at the alt section with post count of 25+, on a song that isn't by KOL, FTP or any other pop-crossover? Feels like I'm real good at starting s**t
|
|
Superundercover
Platinum Member
3 Weeks: @ #1: Cage The Elephant - "Black Madonna"
Joined: June 2013
Posts: 1,925
|
Post by Superundercover on Feb 26, 2014 13:22:38 GMT -5
Top 50 on Active:
56 50 ROYAL BLOOD Out Of The Black 77 67 10 0.118
|
|