wunderkind
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Post by wunderkind on Jan 16, 2012 20:18:45 GMT -5
I think almost everybody listed in this thread will be on the chart somewhere -- 100 is a pretty big list.
I am sure Alanis Morissette will make the list. She has sold more than 20 million cds in the US since 95 (and about 60 million worldwide).
People are also forgetting Norah Jones -- she was huge just a few years back and was a big part of the 2000s music scene even without being plastered all over tv and the tabloids.
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jenglisbe
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Post by jenglisbe on Jan 16, 2012 20:46:56 GMT -5
Looks like this list covers only 1990-present? Weird. But, it definitely allows for higher rankings for some than we would have thought, otherwise. www.sacbee.com/2012/01/14/4187583/vh1-honors-women-who-rock-it-out.htmlVH1 Honors Women Who ROCK-IT-OUT in "100 Greatest Women in Music"5-Night Special Premieres Monday, February 13th at 10 PM/9c on VH1 Published: Saturday, Jan. 14, 2012 NEW YORK, Jan. 14, 2012 /PRNewswire/ -- Women rule and countdown specials rock! VH1 is combining the two together for a week paying homage to the women who made their mark in the music industry. "100 Greatest Women in Music" will honor female artists who have thrived in the music industry from 1990 to present day. The list will honor female artists in a range of genres including pop, R & B, rap, country and rock. The 5-night, 1-hour special "100 Greatest Women in Music" premieres Monday, February 13th at 10 PM/9c and concludes Friday, February 17th. It's time to recognize the women who changed music history with the premiere of VH1's "100 Greatest Women in Music." Covering the past 20 years of music, VH1 premieres its exclusive '100 Greatest' countdown special solely dedicated to female music artists. VH1 explores which music icons have staying power after some 20 years in the music business and which newcomers belong on the same list with some of music's biggest names. Will the "Number One" title go to timeless icons including Madonna, Janet Jackson and Whitney Houston, or will it go to today's record-breaking newcomers including Lady Gaga, Katy Perry and Rihanna? Industry experts, pop culture commentators and music artists including Tori Amos, Gloria Estefan and Macy Gray will offer their views on who made the list and how the artists ranked. Let the debate begin! VH1's "100 Greatest Women in Music" is executive produced by Jeff Olde, Shelly Tatro and Karla Hidalgo for VH1. For additional information on VH1 follow @vh1 on Twitter or "Like" VH1 on Facebook, and visit VH1.com for all the latest in music and celebrity news. VH1 connects viewers to the music, artists and pop culture that matter to them most with TV series, specials, live events, exclusive online content and public affairs initiatives. VH1 is available in 99 million households in the U.S. VH1 also has an array of digital channels and services including VH1Classic, VH1 Soul, VH1 Mobile, VH1Games and extensive broadband video on VH1.com. Connect with VH1 at VH1.com. If it's just based on work from 1990-2011, Mariah should be #1 hands down. No one has had more influence and success in that time period. Not that I think she will be #1.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Jan 16, 2012 23:34:44 GMT -5
^She more than likely would not be No. 1, if it's compiled from industry-people voting. Success really shouldn't come into play, but it will to some degree for a list like this. I had mentioned the females who have had the most critical love since 1990 (Bjork/Harvey)- but I also doubt that they'll be Nos. 1 and 2.
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Jaws
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Post by Jaws on Jan 16, 2012 23:43:29 GMT -5
Should be interesting, but if Celine isn't #1, than this list is an automatic fail.
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carrieidol1
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Post by carrieidol1 on Jan 17, 2012 0:23:08 GMT -5
Should be interesting, but if Celine isn't #1, than this list is an automatic fail.
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carrieidol1
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Post by carrieidol1 on Jan 17, 2012 0:25:04 GMT -5
I wonder which ones will get bumped out by all these "new" females we speak of...?
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Verisimilitude
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Post by Verisimilitude on Jan 17, 2012 0:30:43 GMT -5
I wonder which ones will get bumped out by all these "new" females we speak of...? Most notably the soul jazzy singers of the '40s and '50s (Etta James, Ella Fitzgerald, Sarah Vaughn, Billie Holiday).
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Post by exfactor003 on Jan 17, 2012 2:30:35 GMT -5
Should be interesting, but if Celine isn't #1, than this list is an automatic fail. she has certainly been the most commercially successful female artist of the last twenty or so years, but it's doubtful that she'll be #1.
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Post by neverduplicated on Jan 17, 2012 2:33:55 GMT -5
^She more than likely would not be No. 1, if it's compiled from industry-people voting. Success really shouldn't come into play, but it will to some degree for a list like this. I had mentioned the females who have had the most critical love since 1990 (Bjork/Harvey)- but I also doubt that they'll be Nos. 1 and 2. Why do you seem to equate critical love with deserving a higher place on a "greatest" list? Do you personally feel they Bjork and PJ Harvey deserved numbers 1 and 2 based on that criteria? Obviously I can see it as part of the criteria, but why should a group of critics, some of whom don't even write anymore, be any more important than actual musicians and people who work in the industry?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2012 2:42:23 GMT -5
VH1 lists such as these are typically annoying to me b/c the criteria is vague at best (if they even bother to name any of it), making much of the list seem arbitrary and inconsistent. They will lean toward critical acclaim one minute but then give someone a boost for commercial success the next. this makes it hard to guess what they are going to do, particularly in regard to someone like Britney whose commercial-to-critical ratio is so extreme that she will either find herself near the top or near the very bottom of the list, but nowhere in between.
Nonetheless I'm going to predict some things anyway.
- Celine is going to be unfairly shafted and miss the top 10...maybe even barely squeak into the top 20 - Mariah, Whitney, and Beyonce will all make top 10 - Britney will be somewhere in the 8-15 range...if she doesn't make the lower part of the top 10 she will have barely missed it - Lauryn Hill, Alanis, and Amy Winehouse will all make the top 20; one or more could possibly be top 10 - TLC will be counted collectively and make top 30 (possibly top 20) - Adele will make top 30 - Gwen Stefani, P!nk, and Courtney Love will be somewhere in the top 50 - Madonna will be #1 even though an important chunk of her career occurred in the 80's.
People who I think will make the middle (40-60 range) of the list: - Kelly - Carrie - Taylor - Gaga - Rihanna
Bottom 40: - Fergie - Aaliyah - Brandy - Norah Jones - Christina - Avril - Jewel - En Vogue - Erykah Badu - Jill Scott
It will be interesting to see if they give Destiny's Child a collective ranking like I expect to happen with TLC and En Vogue, or if they will just completely ignore the group since it's a given they'll be recognizing Beyonce by herself.
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Kurt
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Post by Kurt on Jan 17, 2012 2:54:30 GMT -5
Should be interesting, but if Celine isn't #1, than this list is an automatic fail. Even I have zero doubt she won't be #1, lol.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Jan 17, 2012 8:46:43 GMT -5
nevrdup- critical love kinda matches up to some degree with these kinds of features, no matter who's compiling it. Like I said, if it was just VH1 itself compiling it, without input from outside sources, then I think the list would look very commercial-driven. There's a chance that this won't look that commercial-driven as, say, it's Best Songs of the 2000s list. The recent 100 Greatest Artists had a lot of commonalities with the 1998 list (albeit, some with notably different rankings), but it did include a few newer acts and a couple older who are very commercial and didn't make the first list (i.e. Journey).
Aside from Bjork and PJ Harvey, M.I.A. and Missy Elliott would be two other 1990-present females to see the most critical love. Someone like Mimi Carey has not seen anywhere near the amount of critical love that they have, but she's been far more commercially successful- and that will play a role in a list like this, no doubt.
Most interesting, to me, will be how voters treat females whose heyday preceded 1990. Like said, Aretha Franklin was way beyond her peak (in every way) once 1990 rolled around, but she's still made music.
VH1 greatest lists are going to look quite different overall than a list from other sources- but, they're fun and definitely inspire debate (as any list does). And like someone said, it's likely that most of the names being tossed around in here will make an appearance- 100 positions, with most of the all-time heavies pushed out (or down), is a lot of numbers to fill up.
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carrieidol1
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Post by carrieidol1 on Jan 17, 2012 10:59:47 GMT -5
I do think Celine could make the top 10, if not, 20. She does a deserve a top 10 slot nonetheless. I think Mariah has a good shot at #1, or top 5. Whitney as well. Beyonce could land somewhere in the top 10. Madonna will move up from her original position (8), but I honestly don't see her coming in at #1. I'd say top 5 for her as well. The people who were in the top 10 from the last list that I think will stay are; Aretha, Tina, Janis, Bonnie, and Billie. The rest I feel can be easily pushed out by the newbies of the past 20 years. I also was surprised to see Reba missing from the original list, here's to hoping she's included in this one! My top 10 prediction: 10: Beyonce 9: Bonnie Rait 8: Celine Dion 7: Tina Turner 6: Billie Holiday 5: Janis Joplin 4: Aretha Franklin 3: Madonna 2: Whitney Houston 1: Mariah Carey That's my prediction... Also, the Carrie stan in me wonders if Carrie can pull in at a higher position than Taylor?
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Post by when the pawn... on Jan 17, 2012 11:49:34 GMT -5
This is 1900 until now? My prediction is
1 Madonna 2 Mariah Carey 3 Beyonce
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Jan 17, 2012 14:53:39 GMT -5
carrieidol, if you were betting on those predictions, I think you'd end up on the losing side of the spectrum. Do you follow best-of/greatest lists? granted, this is VH1, but I imagine certain acts still would will rank above others. But, we'll see. I don't think it's a matter of anyone "moving up-" comparing the previous list with this one is like comparing apples and oranges, given this one is supposed to cover 1990-present. Once we see the final list, we'll know if voters had pre-1990 stuff on their minds.
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carrieidol1
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Post by carrieidol1 on Jan 17, 2012 14:58:03 GMT -5
carrieidol, if you were betting on those predictions, I think you'd end up on the losing end. I don't think it's a matter of anyone "moving up-" comparing the previous list with this one is like comparing apples and oranges, given this one is supposed to cover 1990-present. Once we see the final list, we'll know if voters had pre-1990 stuff on their minds. I don't know. I don't know how the results will be tallied and cast, but if the group of people voting are younger, I see a top 10 much like what I posted... I might not know enough about how they gather the results to be able to predict and accurate top 10, but if my opinion weighed anything that's what I would think it would be. I'm probably wrong (which is why I have no money on it)... But that's just what I think. People don't often remember anything past the last 10/20 years. With that in mind, Mariah, Celine, Whitney, etc dominated... If the results from the previous show are weighed in with this one, the results will be different. But if they're starting a new list from scratch, I see a lot of the more recent people charting higher than some of the veteran females that were on the original list.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Jan 17, 2012 15:00:29 GMT -5
^It is a new list from scratch, definitely. I imagine Tori Amos, Gloria Estefan and Macy Gray were among the voters (as VH1 announced them as commentators- same with Jordin Sparks). I'm sure it's a mix of older and newer acts who were surveyed, as it is with other VH1 "Greatest" lists.
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Verisimilitude
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Post by Verisimilitude on Jan 17, 2012 15:47:27 GMT -5
^It is a new list from scratch, definitely. I imagine Tori Amos, Gloria Estefan and Macy Gray were among the voters (as VH1 announced them as commentators- same with Jordin Sparks). I'm sure it's a mix of older and newer acts who were surveyed, as it is with other VH1 "Greatest" lists. I remember watching the original with Susan Sarandon as the host in 1999. Shania Twain and even Tyra Banks was one of the commentators.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Jan 17, 2012 15:54:00 GMT -5
^That one surveyed only females- prominent women in music and other industries. Not sure if that was the case with this one. I'm sure the new special will have some "funny" commentators, too. Jordin Sparks anyone? (Though she is a recording act, so at least it's relevant to what the list is about).
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2012 21:54:50 GMT -5
I'm guessing Carrie and Kelly are going to be the only Idols in there, and Kelly better rank higher than Carrie. Carrie's wonderful and all, but let's be honest - without Kelly, Idol wouldn't have had enough credibility to launch Carrie's career. She practically made all of the singing shows popular because of her success. Anyway, I also think Mariah, Whitney, Celine, Madonna, and maybe even Britney will be in the top 10. If it was my choice, I would rank so many women higher, but that's the way it is going to be.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 23, 2012 22:33:20 GMT -5
Also, the Carrie stan in me wonders if Carrie can pull in at a higher position than Taylor? It's possible. It all depends on how they construct it. If it were to be based off of overall success, then the two are pretty split even. Taylor has more sales & tour revenue, and Carrie has better charting records and statistical records [as well as respectable sales]. They're about dead-even in the awards collection, and Carrie has the vocal credits, while Taylor has the writing credits. I'm curious to see which one comes out in a higher position than the other. I think they'll both be in the 30-50 range, though. If I were to think up a top 10, it would probably include... -Madonna -Mariah Carey -Whitney Houston -Beyoncé -Britney Spears -Celine Dion
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JamaicaFunk²
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Post by JamaicaFunk² on Jan 23, 2012 23:00:11 GMT -5
Also, the Carrie stan in me wonders if Carrie can pull in at a higher position than Taylor? It's possible. It all depends on how they construct it. If it were to be based off of overall success, then the two are pretty split even. Taylor has more sales & tour revenue, and Carrie has better charting records and statistical records [as well as respectable sales]. They're about dead-even in the awards collection, and Carrie has the vocal credits, while Taylor has the writing credits. I'm curious to see which one comes out in a higher position than the other. I think they'll both be in the 30-50 range, though. If I were to think up a top 10, it would probably include... -Madonna -Mariah Carey -Whitney Houston -Beyoncé -Britney Spears -Celine Dion Many are forgetting Janet. She had so much success from 1990-2002. Love Will Never Do, That's the way Love Goes, If, Got Til It's Gone, Together Again, Go Deep, Runaway, All For You, Someone to Call My Lover. And countless album sales. I think her lackluster past 5-6 years makes people forget what a big part of pop culture she has been.
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Mr. Wonder
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Post by Mr. Wonder on Jan 24, 2012 1:38:06 GMT -5
The top five should be Madonna, Janet, Whitney, Mariah, and Celine.
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like2throw
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Post by like2throw on Jan 24, 2012 3:40:11 GMT -5
The top five should be Madonna, Janet, Whitney, Mariah, and Celine. lol no wonder men are more respected in the music business, females need some better artists to represent them.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Jan 24, 2012 11:12:05 GMT -5
Those have been five of the most commercially successful females since 1990- but, I wouldn't necessarily count on that being a big factor in voters' naming their greatest females (if that, in fact, is how the list was compiled).
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 24, 2012 16:39:10 GMT -5
When does this air again?
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Jan 24, 2012 17:17:02 GMT -5
Begins airing Feb. 13, over five nights. The list- or at least most of it- may be released before that time.
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Mr. Wonder
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Post by Mr. Wonder on Jan 26, 2012 15:03:15 GMT -5
The top five should be Madonna, Janet, Whitney, Mariah, and Celine. lol no wonder men are more respected in the music business, females need some better artists to represent them. Right, who better than two of the most influential female artists of all time, and two of the most vocally acclaimed singers of all time? I'll give you Celine. -_-
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like2throw
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Post by like2throw on Jan 26, 2012 17:46:29 GMT -5
lol no wonder men are more respected in the music business, females need some better artists to represent them. Right, who better than two of the most influential female artists of all time, and two of the most vocally acclaimed singers of all time? I'll give you Celine. -_- their albums aren't acclaimed at all though ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ No one is checking for their music anymore to be honest like the male contemporaries sans Madonna, and that's only because she has a new album coming out. Can you honestly tell me they had equivalent "musical" impact to Prince, Bruce Springsteen, and such? Most of it is based on media hype, rather than their actual discographies. I aint downplaying, Im just making an observation based on what Ive read and seen, many still dont respect female artists to this day, and some of that boils down to the influences of the most popular ones. edit: if we were to rank it based on their actual Discographies, Janet would win, because her albums hold up better than the other three (whitney, mariah, and celine). Objectively, her albums have received more critical acclaim aswell. Yet most of the time she is ranked forth, again down to hype, rather than the music itself.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Jan 26, 2012 18:27:48 GMT -5
Music is a man's world, and male acts definitely fare better on the whole on best-of lists (whether it be albums, tracks or artists lists) than females. It's always been that way. That's why it's nice that VH1 has shows like this, to put the spotlight on females. Now, how the list itself ends up looking, we will see. The 1999 list was pretty good, on the whole.
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