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Post by jasontoralba on Apr 4, 2012 14:20:41 GMT -5
So its 1 million streaming = 100,000,000 AI? (That's a bit too much IMO). 1M On-Demand = 1B AI? ,, (i don't thinks so) hahaha |
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dbhmr
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Post by dbhmr on Apr 4, 2012 14:21:33 GMT -5
Yeah, I'm not sure what all the fuss is about. #1 debuts, if anything, feel like more a chart manipulation because it's always based on huge out-of-the-box sales. Which is great, and gives them a worthy #1 on the Digital Tracks chart, but I feel like the Hot 100 is, or is supposed to be, representative of the biggest song in the country period. Boyfriend had a huge blast, but We Are Young is zooming to the top of radio, the most streamed song, and still a huge seller. While I agree that the streaming addition to the formula may make the charts a bit more stale, I disagree that the potential decrease in #1 debuts is a bad thing. Remember that poll on the Hot 100 #1 debuts a few months back...and how atrocious half of that list looked?
I guess, to me, in spite of Bieber's surge, We Are Young still feels like the biggest song in the country, and I'm glad the Hot 100 reflects that--because that's what it's supposed to do.
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Post by jasontoralba on Apr 4, 2012 14:23:12 GMT -5
If there's one thing I may hate more than stan wars, it's the bickering over what should count in the methodology of the Hot 100 and in what proportion. then what other things should we talk about to stay relevant on this thread? |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 14:24:06 GMT -5
If Justin debuted at #1, we'd probably be hearing a bunch of bitching about front-loaded #1s. Billboard can never win, and people always have an issue when these chart makers change the rules. There's never going to be a completely fool-proof "accurate" (whatever that means) way to measure the popularity of songs. Billboard does the best they can, and in this digital age, it makes sense to include streaming. There are some issues that they will have to work out in terms of measuring a broader scope of legal streaming services, but they had to start somewhere...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 14:26:05 GMT -5
If Justin debuted at #1, we'd probably be hearing a bunch of bitching ... If Madonna debuted at #1, this would be considered the greatest thing ever here |
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icefire9
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Post by icefire9 on Apr 4, 2012 14:29:08 GMT -5
Haus of Max, I COMPLETELY agree with you.
Sales represents how many people are discovering a song (or at least, having the song grow on them enough to buy it).
Radio and Streaming are what people are listening to at the moment.
The difference between radio and Streaming is that people have direct control over what they listen to on steaming sites. Radio stations decide what to play, based only partially on what feedback they get from people, but we're all familiar with our complaints about radio so I'll just leave it at that.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 14:33:08 GMT -5
I'm ngl, I'm ecstatic that Bieber got denied.  |
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slamina
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Post by slamina on Apr 4, 2012 14:34:01 GMT -5
 Streaming counts for that much now? lol I didn't care either way, but Bieber not getting that number one after those sales is pretty bizarre. "Part Of Me" will be the most recent number one debut for quite some time now. haha |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 14:38:29 GMT -5
It was 40 years into the rock era before a #1 debut happened at all
The frequency of the event since, dilutes the significance of this statistic
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badrobot
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Post by badrobot on Apr 4, 2012 14:42:24 GMT -5
Lest you all forget, Fergie had the record for digital sales for awhile for a song that stalled at #2. And conversely artists have had huge airplay hits (Mary J. Blige's "Be Without You" comes to mind) that didn't hit #1.
Also, if you just look at where they rank on the component charts, you see this:
fun:
#2 Sales
#2 Airplay
#1 On-Demand
Bieber:
#1 Sales
#24 Airplay
N/A On-Demand
Which song looks to you like it was the most popular this week?
I don't care either way about the 2 songs (if anything I like Bieber's better) but when you have a large, song-based, revenue-generating portion of the industry like On-Demand Streaming, of COURSE it should be incorporated. It's still the smallest portion of the chart (as far as I can tell) -- and besides, this wasn't even a rule change this week, it happened weeks ago. Again, everyone is playing fair.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 14:47:40 GMT -5
Re #1 debuts: The Hot 100 is meant to show what's popular in one particular week. I don't see what a particular song's popularity in the following weeks (or previous for that matter) has anything to do with its popularity in that one solitary week..
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Post by jasontoralba on Apr 4, 2012 14:53:25 GMT -5
Billboard is clever enough to change the rule in the time when there is no holiday rush, performances that will create download hype, no debuts and instances that even without on-demand, it won't change the top positions. Imagine if they implement it this week or others time.
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Oprah
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Post by Oprah on Apr 4, 2012 14:57:26 GMT -5
Re #1 debuts: The Hot 100 is meant to show what's popular in one particular week. I don't see what a particular song's popularity in the following weeks (or previous for that matter) has anything to do with its popularity in that one solitary week.. Because it's not necessarily an accurate measure of that, either; stans rushing to buy something doesn't mean the song is actually huge. There's a good chance most people aren't even aware of the songs existence in the first week let alone listen to it frequently. The number a song pulls in its first week says more about the size of the artist's fanbase than the reception the song is getting. |
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Post by closeyoureyes on Apr 4, 2012 14:59:00 GMT -5
I'm all for Billboard changing up it's rules now & then, especially cuz the Hot 100 seems to get into a rut every few years.
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Kurt
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Post by Kurt on Apr 4, 2012 14:59:09 GMT -5
If I listen to an iTunes radio station, is that streaming that counts, or do only paid services count? I know this is like three pages behind now, haha, but I just wanted to answer this since my station is part of iTunes's radio directory. I can almost guarantee that they're not included--there's no reporting done by station owners and no statistics reported back to us about how much we stream each song (oh, how I wish they did, though, so I could do charts and stuff  ). In fact, they can't even guarantee I name my songs correctly and accurately, which could greatly change the way the chart looked if they were included (i.e. I named every song "Boyfriend" by Justin Bieber, haha). |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 15:05:36 GMT -5
I just hope Billboard has something in place to prevent chart manipulation from streaming music. If one person buying 50 copies of a single doesn't count for 50 purchases, one person playing a song 50 times in a row shouldn't count for 50 plays. Who's to say the person is even listening?
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Rodze
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Post by Rodze on Apr 4, 2012 15:08:50 GMT -5
Actual shocking news.
I'm want to know the new formula. :(
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Post by Fat Ass Kelly Price on Apr 4, 2012 15:16:43 GMT -5
If there's one thing I may hate more than stan wars, it's the bickering over what should count in the methodology of the Hot 100 and in what proportion. then what other things should we talk about to stay relevant on this thread? There's a productive way of doing it, then there's the Pulse way. Pulse is too accustomed to discussion fueled by stanning, that actually discussions are pursued using the same stanning tactics that diminishes the entire discussion. Hence, why I think I may hate when Pulse tackles a topic that could be worthwhile. |
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Verisimilitude
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Post by Verisimilitude on Apr 4, 2012 15:20:35 GMT -5
Bieber easily hit #1 in Canada this week, having sold 55K of "Boyfriend" digitally. And there's no streaming rules there... YET.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 15:24:57 GMT -5
Re #1 debuts: The Hot 100 is meant to show what's popular in one particular week. I don't see what a particular song's popularity in the following weeks (or previous for that matter) has anything to do with its popularity in that one solitary week.. Because it's not necessarily an accurate measure of that, either; stans rushing to buy something doesn't mean the song is actually huge. There's a good chance most people aren't even aware of the songs existence in the first week let alone listen to it frequently. The number a song pulls in its first week says more about the size of the artist's fanbase than the reception the song is getting. I think that does measure its popularity though. If people like a song but aren't willing to pay money to buy it, that shows just how popular it isn't with them. How does one accurately measure the reception a song is getting though? Sales, airplay and streaming can all be very easily manipulated. |
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moore746
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Post by moore746 on Apr 4, 2012 15:37:32 GMT -5
Re #1 debuts: The Hot 100 is meant to show what's popular in one particular week. I don't see what a particular song's popularity in the following weeks (or previous for that matter) has anything to do with its popularity in that one solitary week.. Because it's not necessarily an accurate measure of that, either; stans rushing to buy something doesn't mean the song is actually huge. There's a good chance most people aren't even aware of the songs existence in the first week let alone listen to it frequently. The number a song pulls in its first week says more about the size of the artist's fanbase than the reception the song is getting. But with Hold It Against Me, for example, the song saw an initial rush of sales (a record for a female at the time) and a record-breaking start at radio. In the following weeks the song kind of tanked, but for that one solitary week it was the biggest song in the country and the charts reflected it. In this one solitary week Boyfriend was bigger than We Are Young, there is no denying it (like I've said earlier, let's throw YouTube numbers in there). |
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Post by Adonis the DemiGod! on Apr 4, 2012 15:40:05 GMT -5
There's some bs going on here.
I wanna see the receipts.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Apr 4, 2012 15:44:05 GMT -5
Well that was an interesting finish.
I'm still not sure how this On-Demand thing works, butit is a bit different from the regular streaming, which is why it gets more weight than streaming at AOL, Yahoo, etc.
YouTube is problematic, because there's non-official streaming (meaning, listening to/watching something that he record label did not post).
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#LisaRinna
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Post by #LisaRinna on Apr 4, 2012 15:49:10 GMT -5
Aren't VEVO channel streams counted already though?
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maria4hitz
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Post by maria4hitz on Apr 4, 2012 15:52:26 GMT -5
Country Chart News: Top 30 Digital Singles: The Week of April 4, 2012 LW TW Artist Song Title TW LW Total 1 1 Taylor Swift Eyes Open 111,000 176,000 287,000 6 2 Luke Bryan Drunk On You 82,000 52,000 365,000 2 3 T. Swift/Civil Wars Safe & Sound 78,000 93,000 906,400 4 4 Eric Church Springsteen 73,000 59,000 318,000 3 5 Carrie Underwood Good Girl 66,000 69,000 498,000 5 6 Lee Brice A WomanLike... 54,000 57,000 691,000 8 7 Miranda Lambert Over You 49,000 43,000 463,000 9 8 Jason Aldean Fly Over States 47,000 40,000 265,000 7 9 Kip Moore Somethin' Bout A Truck 46,000 33,000 434,000 11 10 Blake Shelton Drink On It 38,000 27,000 314,000 10 11 Jake Owen Alone With You 35,222 31,000 617,000 15 12 Lady Antebellum Dancin' Away... 33,000 27,000 374,000 12 13 Taylor Swift Ours 32,000 31,000 1,011,000 14 14 Luke Bryan I Don't Want ... 31,000 27,000 1,461,000 13 15 Toby Keith Red Solo Cup 31,000 29,000 1,668,000 18 16 Eli Young Band Even If It Br... 27,000 23,000 182,000 16 17 Brantley Gilbert You Don't Kn... 25,000 24,000 347,000 17 18 Tim McGraw Better Than I... 24,000 24,000 333,000 71 19 Matt Nathanson Run 24,000 06,000 224,000 20 20 Rascal Flatts Banjo 23,000 19,000 144,000 NEW 21 Rascal Flatts She's Leaving 23,000 00,011 23,000 23 22 Blake Shelton God Gave Me... 18,000 18,000 1,517,000 21 23 Rodney Atkins He's Mine 18,000 19,000 177,000 26 24 The Band Perry If I Die Young 17,000 15,000 4,039,000 22 25 Lady Antebellum Just A Kiss 17,000 18,000 2,366,000 24 26 Jason Aldean Dirt Road Anth... 17,000 17,000 2,915,000 33 27 Dierks Bentley Home 16,000 12,000 332,000 25 28 Luke Bryan Country Girl... 15,000 15,000 1,781,000 30 29 Gloriana (Kissed You)G.N 15,000 13,000 124,000 28 30 Taylor Swift Mean 15,000 13,000 1,574,000 www.roughstock.com/blog/country-chart-news-top-30-digital-singles-the-week-of-april-4-2012 |
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Oprah
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Post by Oprah on Apr 4, 2012 15:56:18 GMT -5
Because it's not necessarily an accurate measure of that, either; stans rushing to buy something doesn't mean the song is actually huge. There's a good chance most people aren't even aware of the songs existence in the first week let alone listen to it frequently. The number a song pulls in its first week says more about the size of the artist's fanbase than the reception the song is getting. But with Hold It Against Me, for example, the song saw an initial rush of sales (a record for a female at the time) and a record-breaking start at radio. In the following weeks the song kind of tanked, but for that one solitary week it was the biggest song in the country and the charts reflected it. In this one solitary week Boyfriend was bigger than We Are Young, there is no denying it (like I've said earlier, let's throw YouTube numbers in there). It's actually quite easy to deny it, WAY is huge right now. I'm willing to bet far more people have heard it and actively listened to it last week than Bieber's song, the rise of which was once again primarily fueled by stans. I'm not saying big first weeks should be totally discounted, but I also don't think they're quite as reflective of song's popularity so much as the size of a fanbase. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 16:04:21 GMT -5
Unless there's a way to tally every single song listened to by every single person in the country during the course of the week, there's really no way of knowing that.
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pnobelysk
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Post by pnobelysk on Apr 4, 2012 16:05:20 GMT -5
Kelly Clarkson, Stronger (What Doesn't Kill You) (136,000, -9%, 2.551 million)
Carrie Underwood, Good Girl (66,000, -4%, 498,000)
Scotty McCreery, Water Town Town (15,000, 3,519%, 37,000)
Kelly Clarkson, Mr. Know It All (13,000, -12%, 1.412 million)
Haley Reinhart, Free (12,000, -65%, 48,000)
Jennifer Hudson & Ne-Yo feat. Rick Ross, Think Like a Man (12,000, +5%, 95,000)
Scotty McCreery, The Trouble With Girls (12,000, +4%, 644,000)
Kris Allen, The Vision of Love (11,000, debut, 11,000)
Carrie Underwood, Jesus, Take the Wheel (11,000, +279%, 1.984 million)
Lauren Alaina, Georgia Peaches (10,000, +12%, 130,000)
Jason Aldean/Kelly Clarkson, Don't You Wanna Stay (9,000, +25%, 2.01 million)
Brad Paisley/Carrie Underwood, Remind Me (8,000, +15%, 1.487 million)
Casey James, Let's Don't Call It a Night (7,000, +75%, 88,000)
Carrie Underwood, Before He Cheats (6,000, +30%, 3.434 million)
Mandisa, Good Morning (3,000, +12%, 78,000)
Carrie Underwood, How Great Thou Art (2,000, +15%, 312,000)
Mandisa, Stronger (2,000, +7%, 174,000)
Songs performed on American Idol
Nicki Minaj, Starships (159,000, +13%, 1.039 million)
Nicki Minaj, Starships (45,000, +36%, 194,000)
Miranda Lambert, Gunpowder & Lead (15,000, +158%, 1.415 million)
Carrie Underwood, Jesus, Take the Wheel (11,000, +279%, 1.984 million)
Lifehouse, Everything (2,000, +964%, 32,000)
Congrats to kelly on her 4th 2 million seller! It's also nice to see she ll have her first 3 million seller in a month or so. Good girl gold next week, also nice to see Jesus Take the wheel is getting really close to 2 million. Also up further in the thread good to see Ours pass a million and safe and sound pasisng a million in 2 weeks or so. amazing sales for taylor as always
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 16:10:29 GMT -5
It's absolutely impossible to truly measure what is the most "popular" song. If people are waiting for Billboard to perfect the formula, they're going to be waiting forever. The Hot 100 provides a pretty good look at the most popular songs overall in the country. It's not without flaws, and it never will be. I don't understand why people continue to argue about it like popularity is something you can measure like you can measure how much milk is in a glass or something...
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2012 17:18:37 GMT -5
^Exactly.
Heck we could just be like the UK and be digital-only. But the Hot 100 definitely makes a solid effort to encompass a lot (even though they have a few blunders occasionally).
They had this set into motion beforehand though; so it wasn't some dubious last minute rule change. However, the part they floundered on was not releasing their new formula making things misleading for labels/artists/chart followers alike.
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