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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 19:28:12 GMT -5
#Mod: I can confirm that all players pronounced dead will remain so for the remainder of the game.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 19:28:56 GMT -5
to further clarify that theory, i think there is a scum group/independent that can nightkill, and a scum group/independent that can 'infect' people. so we want to scum hunt, obviously, but we probably also want to consider who the infect-scum might target.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 19:30:44 GMT -5
@antigonerising do you have any clue what Invincible's Chemist role is? I'm asking you specifically since you seem to me the most knowledgeable about various roles. If anyone else knows, feel free to answer.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 19:40:19 GMT -5
oh, ok. so, since Invincible is dead for good, hmm. some scum can daykill, maybe? or maybe someone had a one-shot power they chose to use early on for some reason. meh, speculating on this is probably not going to lead anywhere for now, so i'll stop. Um okay, that's messy. I'm wondering if the unconventional kill flavour is like a role that's specifically able to get its kill(s) disguised, or actually a mysterious-storm-maker role (and that's if it's even a vig type role), or just Kunt making things more fun to read... no point speculating anyway. actually no, i think this is a good thing to speculate on. from what i recall of the various roles and setups i've looked at before, the 'infecting' setup is unconventional (but also is generally only used when there are two or more scum groups). basically you don't know if you're infected or not, and if another scum faction kills you i don't think your infected status is revealed in your role flip. this is powerful, but balanced out by the nightkills and lynches; the viral scum needs to have a majority of living infected players, so if an infected player is killed then that's essentially a wasted infect for the viral-scum.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 19:47:04 GMT -5
@antigonerising do you have any clue what Invincible's Chemist role is? I'm asking you specifically since you seem to me the most knowledgeable about various roles. If anyone else knows, feel free to answer. off the top of my head, i don't recall seeing chemist, and i'm not really finding anything in a google search that turns anything useful up. i'll have to think about it more but anything i came up with would just be speculation...possibly the chemist could cure infected players? that would make sense.
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Lahey's Lucky Star
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Post by Lahey's Lucky Star on Jun 21, 2014 20:46:11 GMT -5
to further clarify that theory, i think there is a scum group/independent that can nightkill, and a scum group/independent that can 'infect' people. so we want to scum hunt, obviously, but we probably also want to consider who the infect-scum might target. What even are those roles anyway?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 21:24:32 GMT -5
to further clarify that theory, i think there is a scum group/independent that can nightkill, and a scum group/independent that can 'infect' people. so we want to scum hunt, obviously, but we probably also want to consider who the infect-scum might target. What even are those roles anyway? ok, say for example that we do have two scum factions. we'll call them the killers and the infectors. the killers are your conventional scum faction. they send in their targets and that target dies immediately. the infector, on the other hand, does not actually 'kill' anyone. instead he chooses someone to 'infect.' his goal is to infect a majority of living players - basically infectors kind of function like cult leaders, except the people they choose don't know they've been recruited to this other faction unless and until it's too late to do anything about it. the infector is more likely to be an independent role than a scum team, for balance reasons. why it's worth considering who the infect-scum might target: let's say they target you. that is one step closer to gaining their majority. but if the other scum faction later kills you, or town is convinced your scum and lynches you, then the infectors lose that step. if there is an infector in this game town is in a somewhat tougher position than usual because we want to lynch the people who seem most scummy, but by doing so we're probably helping the infector out b/c we're keeping all his non-scummy targets alive. how we can counteract this: assuming there is a 'normal' scum faction in the game, that scum faction will be trying to aim for the same people that the infector is to simultaneously knock off town players and keep the infector from reaching a majority. not sure there's anything we as town can actively do except try to accurately scum hunt, because trying to psyche the infector out by lynching unlikely suspects is more likely to backfire than work. it's possible we have a vig or similar role in the game to help us out; if so, that person hopefully has good aim. i suggested earlier that the Chemist might have been a role that could 'cure' people, i.e. if whoever the Chemist targeted that night was an already-infected person, then that person became uninfected. (note that this is different from a Doctor role, which would only protect a person if the person was targeted on the same night the Doctor targeted him.) i don't know for sure that is what the Chemist could do though, either way we just lost a power role so that is an unfortunate disadvantage so early in the game. --------- after all that, it should be pointed out that i am purely speculating on the setup at this point. i could very well be wrong, and maybe there is no 'infector' type role in the game. however, given what we do know about the flavor (Oprah's last email, Kunt putting the word 'viral' in bold red when announcing Invincible's death) i have a feeling that is the setup we're dealing with. i also have a couple of ideas about the cause of Invincible's death but i need to think on that some more. i agree with Josh that we should be moving out of RVS now so i think this would be a good starting point for everyone to move discussion forward; whether in agreement or disagreement of my theory i'd like to hear what everyone else thinks.
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Post by josh on Jun 21, 2014 21:32:01 GMT -5
So @antigonerising am I understanding correctly you think it could be like I was in Pokemon Mafia, a Marker? pulsemusic.proboards.com/post/4224880/thread scroll to the independent role. I think that's what you're thinking of. I feel like that role is better fit for independent than mafia, but who knows.
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Post by josh on Jun 21, 2014 21:34:23 GMT -5
But the whole idea of an infecting scum (faction) came from the flavour and you thinking Invincible would come back to life, infected. However, with Kunt saying dead players are definitely dead and no longer in the game, that theory is out the window. Not to mention Invincible died, not became infected, so I'm kind of side-eyeing you for still being on the infector theory. I mean, sure it's possible, but the only thing that's happened so far is a daykill, no infection or anything. I could just not be following your train of thought at all, I suppose.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 21:44:42 GMT -5
I think the shot on Invincible was not from a town-aligned role (I doubt they would use their power this early). I think the Virus phrase is just the name of the mafia in this game while World represents town. PLOT TWIST!!!!However, something went wrong. Over the Bermuda triangle, a mysterious storm broke out as Invincible's aircraft was en route to the conference, causing his spaceship to crash. I'm trying to figure out whether the bolded term was the way he was killed or if it's just the flavor of the game. mod: can you reveal whether the bolded phrase has any particular meaning or is it just the flavor of the kill?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 21:45:11 GMT -5
@mod: can you reveal whether the bolded phrase has any particular meaning or is it just the flavor of the kill?Oops sorry about forget the @ symbol.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 21:46:43 GMT -5
#Mod: I mean, flavor is important...
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 21:47:52 GMT -5
I probably sounded like an idiot.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 21:52:21 GMT -5
#Mod: nah, I'm just being deliberately vague for funsies
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 22:04:06 GMT -5
But the whole idea of an infecting scum (faction) came from the flavour and you thinking Invincible would come back to life, infected. However, with Kunt saying dead players are definitely dead and no longer in the game, that theory is out the window. Not to mention Invincible died, not became infected, so I'm kind of side-eyeing you for still being on the infector theory. I mean, sure it's possible, but the only thing that's happened so far is a daykill, no infection or anything. I could just not be following your train of thought at all, I suppose. 1. yes, the Marker description sounds exactly like what i was talking about (is it just me or was your role kind of overpowered with the extra one-shot powers) 2. the infecting scum idea came from the flavor (when did you become British btw); the idea that Invincible would come back to life was related, but not the initial reason i had the idea (the theory works without having to bring a dead player back). i can see where i mistakenly made it seem that way. it is probably easier to think of my idea in terms of the marker role (b/c people will already understand how that works) than continuously referring to it as 'infector,' which hasn't been used here before. 3. i'm sticking with it because of, um, reasons? i'm probably screwing myself over with that non-explanation, but yeah, i'm just really convinced of this idea and don't see any reason to believe otherwise right now. @drag27 my feeling is that it doesn't matter whether the bolded phrase is significant or just kill flavor. what matters is a) whether or not we think another player caused Invincible's death; b) if so, why Invince; and c) possible reasons why should lead to speculation on who did it.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 22:17:08 GMT -5
@drag27 my feeling is that it doesn't matter whether the bolded phrase is significant or just kill flavor. what matters is a) whether or not we think another player caused Invincible's death; b) if so, why Invince; and c) possible reasons why should lead to speculation on who did it. a) I do believe that someone targeted him. b) I'm assuming it's because he was way quieter than normal. They probably assumed he was hiding a power role which he was in this case. c) At this point, we don't really have anything to go on especially since we're barely out of RVS (I'm assuming some of us are still in that phase).
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 22:23:15 GMT -5
ok i'll run with this since i threw it out there.
a) i believe another player caused Invincible's death. it could be a specific flavor power (storm maker) or it could just be a general kill power, and Kunt is having fun with the story as we go along (maybe the next person will die during a volcanic eruption or accidentally impale himself on an icepick, who knows). either way, another player caused it. b) if it was scum-fueled, they obviously saw Invincible as a threat. it's only day one so even if a scum player was a role cop or something similar, he wouldn't have been able to use that power yet. if it was town-fueled (vig), they probably got suspicious of multiple things he said and acted on an impulse. c) we should examine Invince's posts to see if there's anything that might have made him a 'threat' to scum. i'm not here for outing power roles so we really shouldn't look much into who might have killed him for town reasons.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 21, 2014 22:28:30 GMT -5
i have no idea why 'much' is even in that last sentence i typed. we shouldn't look at all into who might have killed him for town reasons. i'm tired so i'm not following my own advice and examining Invince's posts right now but don't take that to mean i'm lazy scum. i'm only lazy oh, i probably won't be on much or at all tomorrow, just fyi.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 21, 2014 22:35:06 GMT -5
So the going theory is that another player caused Invince's death and it wasn't just a random thing? (do 'random' things happen in non-bastardized mafia games?)
Did anyone mention being suspicious of Invince at all? I do remember a vote a few pages back from someone that I kind of took to be something slightly above RVS. I'll go and check who it was.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 21, 2014 22:36:19 GMT -5
Nevermind. It was josh and it sounded pretty RVS so nevermind.
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Post by josh on Jun 21, 2014 22:45:10 GMT -5
But the whole idea of an infecting scum (faction) came from the flavour and you thinking Invincible would come back to life, infected. However, with Kunt saying dead players are definitely dead and no longer in the game, that theory is out the window. Not to mention Invincible died, not became infected, so I'm kind of side-eyeing you for still being on the infector theory. I mean, sure it's possible, but the only thing that's happened so far is a daykill, no infection or anything. I could just not be following your train of thought at all, I suppose. 1. yes, the Marker description sounds exactly like what i was talking about (is it just me or was your role kind of overpowered with the extra one-shot powers) 2. the infecting scum idea came from the flavor (when did you become British btw); the idea that Invincible would come back to life was related, but not the initial reason i had the idea (the theory works without having to bring a dead player back). i can see where i mistakenly made it seem that way. it is probably easier to think of my idea in terms of the marker role (b/c people will already understand how that works) than continuously referring to it as 'infector,' which hasn't been used here before. 3. i'm sticking with it because of, um, reasons? i'm probably screwing myself over with that non-explanation, but yeah, i'm just really convinced of this idea and don't see any reason to believe otherwise right now. @drag27 my feeling is that it doesn't matter whether the bolded phrase is significant or just kill flavor. what matters is a) whether or not we think another player caused Invincible's death; b) if so, why Invince; and c) possible reasons why should lead to speculation on who did it. 1. off topic, but when you're independent, there's only you, so if you die, you lose. Whereas if you're mafia, you can die and your teammates can still win it for you. So you need a little extra something when you're independent. I think it seemed pretty balanced. 2. Xiivi did flavour, neighbourhood, etc. So I just copied him. 3. I guess, being so early, we really just have no clue about the setup, so it's nothing too bad to be on an idea like that, just as long as you don't get too stuck on it to think about things in a different way.
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Post by Baby Spice on Jun 21, 2014 23:53:17 GMT -5
Oh wow, I don't remember ever playing a game where a player was day-killed on the first day. Only in a Kunt game, lmao.
So far the only thing that jumped out at me was Invince's refusal to flavor claim, so he was my lead. Now I'm at a loss again.
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Post by Zeebz on Jun 22, 2014 0:28:36 GMT -5
Oh wow at Invince dying. I can see why a infectir role makes sense, but it seems far fetched given that Kunt said nobody would come back to life. However, could there be an infectir role in which they just die? That might be the case. Idk lmao I feel like I'm reaching. I think it could have been just a one shot killer who used their one shot prematurely. Good night all. If there are any questions then I'll answer in the morning.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 22, 2014 1:19:28 GMT -5
Any chance everyone can role claim?
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Post by Baby Spice on Jun 22, 2014 1:20:46 GMT -5
I feel like THIS early in the game that would be a really bad idea.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 22, 2014 1:27:20 GMT -5
How so? I've never really got the significance of the roles to the games other than to give the game a flavour. At least until now because I have a theory: #Mod: I mean, flavor is important... Assuming the flavours have accurate historical significance, I'm wondering if, because Kunt put the word "viral" in red when Invince was killed, if someone has a role that has been historical linked to biological warfare or some other relation to viruses, that person may well be scum. Though now that I've put that theory out there, nobody will admit to having such a role... I think we should at least keep this in mind for when it comes time for everyone to role claim anyway.
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Post by Baby Spice on Jun 22, 2014 1:36:47 GMT -5
Wait, are we talking about flavour claiming (as in title) or role claiming (as in what powers you have), because those are two completely different things, and some of us have already flavour claimed. It's not good to role claim early on because you don't want scum to know if you've got a power, because they'll want to kill the more powerful players.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Jun 22, 2014 2:24:22 GMT -5
Oh, sorry, I didn't realize. Flavour claiming is what I meant. The character you have or whatever. I agree it's not a good idea and pointless to reveal any power roles or whatever now.
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Post by Baby Spice on Jun 22, 2014 2:45:21 GMT -5
Lol, it's ok. With that said, I agree with your initial post in that flavour claiming is a good idea.
So far, the people who have claimed and their claims: Josh - Jesus Christ aka Conchita Wurst Drag - Army of Brazilian Stans Lahey - Xi Jinping antigonerising/Cynthia - Bill Clinton Ginger (Me) - The Citizens of Rihanna's Forehead Nick - Penguin Codex - The Only Mexican That Matters (Shakira) Lozzy - An army of Gentiles Zebra - Princess jback - Beyonce? (He said he was a legend, which lead Cynthia to believe his flavour was Beyonce, but he didn't confirm) Invincible was confirmed "Predator" with the role of World Chemist
That leaves Max and Landmarx.
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Post by Baby Spice on Jun 22, 2014 2:46:27 GMT -5
Army of Brazilian Stans sounds the most deadly tbh.
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