kcdawg13
7x Platinum Member
You Are Now Listening to 103.5 Dawn FM
|
Post by kcdawg13 on Sept 4, 2019 15:06:36 GMT -5
Delicate made it to #12 without any huge initial support, the song debuted on the Hot 100 in March and didn't peak until July. It also spent 35 weeks on the chart, making it Taylor's only song since 1989 to last more than 20 weeks on the chart. That song is better than YNTCD and I feel like has performed better, especially after getting slashed by radio with her three previous singles. Taylor died and came back within the same era which is pretty unprecedented when big stars abandon albums when the singles perform poorly.
|
|
leonagwen
Diamond Member
#LiteralLegender
Joined: November 2011
Posts: 15,285
|
Post by leonagwen on Sept 4, 2019 15:57:23 GMT -5
This is a ridiculous argument. Delicate was the bigger hit.
|
|
|
Post by Rose "Payola" Nylund on Sept 4, 2019 16:10:32 GMT -5
A song’s hit status isn’t determined by how much it’s remembered or what people think of it in five, ten, or twenty years. It isn’t determined by its longevity or whatever else. Those things all play into its legacy and simply how well it’s remembered. A song’s hit status is purely numbers in the moment. Sales, airplay, streams, coverage - things that can be measured. Hits can be forgotten. Flops can be remembered. This whole idea that hits must be remembered needs to be dropped. Delicate can go down as one of Taylor’s most remembered songs but that doesn’t necessarily make it one of her biggest hits.
|
|
|
Post by neverduplicated on Sept 4, 2019 16:27:56 GMT -5
A song’s hit status isn’t determined by how much it’s remembered or what people think of it in five, ten, or twenty years. It isn’t determined by its longevity or whatever else. Those things all play into its legacy and simply how well it’s remembered. A song’s hit status is purely numbers in the moment. Sales, airplay, streams, coverage - things that can be measured. Hits can be forgotten. Flops can be remembered. This whole idea that hits must be remembered needs to be dropped. Delicate can go down as one of Taylor’s most remembered songs but that doesn’t necessarily make it one of her biggest hits. Agreed. Also how does anyone know if “Delicate” will be more remembered?it hasn’t been that long since it was on the charts. The song is one of my favs from Taylor but ultimately was a complete non-event. YNTCD has felt like more of a pop culture moment to me.
|
|
Grün
Platinum Member
Come As You Are
Joined: August 2010
Posts: 1,236
|
Post by Grün on Sept 4, 2019 22:18:47 GMT -5
A song’s hit status isn’t determined by how much it’s remembered or what people think of it in five, ten, or twenty years. It isn’t determined by its longevity or whatever else. Those things all play into its legacy and simply how well it’s remembered. A song’s hit status is purely numbers in the moment. Sales, airplay, streams, coverage - things that can be measured. Hits can be forgotten. Flops can be remembered. This whole idea that hits must be remembered needs to be dropped. Delicate can go down as one of Taylor’s most remembered songs but that doesn’t necessarily make it one of her biggest hits. Agreed. Also how does anyone know if “Delicate” will be more remembered?it hasn’t been that long since it was on the charts. The song is one of my favs from Taylor but ultimately was a complete non-event. YNTCD has felt like more of a pop culture moment to me. Exactly how I feel. All in all, neither hit will be in her top 5 biggest songs, so I guess it doesn't really matter anyway.
|
|
nickd
4x Platinum Member
Joined: November 2017
Posts: 4,416
|
Post by nickd on Sept 5, 2019 20:30:31 GMT -5
I hate when people say things will be remembered or my friends all love/loved it etc. That is subjective and irrelevant. There is a reason that those assessments above aren't metrics on Billboard; you can't quantify them. Plain and simple, You Need To Calm Down was bigger than Delicate. When people look back in ten years, they will only look at the chart position anyway. No one cares outside music boards. Longevity is important, but so is consistency. Delicate couldn't even hit the top ten. You Need to Calm Down has hovered in the top twenty since it was released. Both are hits, but Calm was bigger. Plus, if we want to get into pop culture. This song is Taylor's first notable political single. The devil herself (Kellyanne) sang this song on Fox News. I think it will be "remembered" for that, or that it sparked a petition with half a million signatures. People need to stop ranking songs higher because they like them more or they resonate more. Long story short, is Delicate a better song, yes. Is it bigger, no. You may have a point about how the political angle may make You Need To Calm Down more remembered in the long run than Delicate which was a safe radio single that lacked anything controversial for people to help remember it 10 years down the line. But lets not act like chart peaks are more important than overall consumption because then Today Was A Fairytale would be getting more than 1/10th of Love Story's streams right now (I think it's getting around 1/20th). You Need To Calm Down will almost certainly overtake Delicate on Spotify streams, but probably will never have half as many on Youtube. Not sure about Amazon Prime/Apple Music streams. Delicate's Year End Hot 100 chart position is probably higher than what YNTCD will get and Delicate's Year End Radio Songs position will be much higher than YNTCD's. Overall, they seem pretty even so far. I think how well a song is remembered can be counted towards how big of a hit it was though - strong recurrent stats can be measured in lifetime streams, sales and airplay, certifications, etc.
|
|
nickd
4x Platinum Member
Joined: November 2017
Posts: 4,416
|
Post by nickd on Sept 5, 2019 20:56:00 GMT -5
Yeah, hard disagree with all of that. The GP doesn't care about the charts at all. No normal person is going to even know this peaked higher than Delicate. Besides, the charts only tell us what happens on a week-by-week basis. A peak is nothing but that. This song managed to be the second most popular song over an arbitrary seven day period. That doesn't mean it will be remembered more than the other 98 songs below it. That's not what the charts showcase at all. At the end of the day, charts and stats mean virtually nothing when it comes to a song's actual impact. Yes, that's a thing that's difficult to measure, and yes, one person's anecdotes don't dictate everyone else's experience. But you'd have to be a dolt to think a chart peak dictates these things as well. Let's list examples of this. -Oops...I Did It Again! versus Hold It Against Me Guess which one was the #1 hit? Not the bigger and more impactful song. -Leavin' versus I Kissed a Girl Guess which one went #1 on pop? Not the one that launched an artist's massive career. -Crack a Bottle versus Till I Collapse Guess which one of these Eminem songs was a #1 hit? Guess which one wasn't even a single? Guess which one is one of this iconic artist's most well known songs? Hell, here's a Taylor example! -...Ready for It? versus Teardrops on My Guitar Guess which one is a top 5 hit? Not the one that inspired muliple girls to get wavy hair and wear sundresses. Not the one that launched her pop career. Not the one with higher recurrent airplay. There's just too many factors to consider when we discuss these things. It's just not a simple "well it peaked higher" or "well it lasted longer." There's just too many variables that come into play with how the charts play out. The charts are a big, massive picture. But it's not the big picture that determines a song's impact. It's the small details a chart can't immediately tell you. And, no, before we jump to this stupid argument, me liking Delicate more than this doesn't at all play into my opinion here. I'm not stupid enough to let personal opinion cloud my judgement and it's absurd to claim that's the only possible way I could come to these conclusions just because our conclusions aren't the same. Also, let's be completely honest with ourselves. No matter if this or Delicate is the biggee hit or will be better remembered through time, neither of them are even remotely close to her biggest or most well known songs anyway, so why does it matter? When the discussion of Taylor comes up, you can bet your ass at least 10-15 other tracks will come up before these two tracks we're arbitrarily comparing. (Unless the discussion is about quality or fan favorites between her own fans. Swifities love Delicate.) For what it's worth, I'm not sure how Leavin' managed to do better on Pop but I Kissed A Girl did much better on the Hot 100, but in terms of peak and longevity. Teardrops On My Guitar also has ...Ready For It handily beaten in Hot 100 longevity. Teadrops had 48 weeks vs 20 for Ready For It, including 40 weeks in the top 50 vs 13 for Ready For It. Oops... I Did It Again also had Hold It Against Me slightly beat on Hot 100 longevity but I also think songs early in an artist's career tend to be remembered better, the songs that made people become fans because they were hits rather than the ones that became hits because the artist had fans.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2019 7:32:31 GMT -5
The big drops finally started for this. On radio, it lasted just as much as RFI and End Game but a little longer than Look and Me.
|
|
rfucom
Diamond Member
Beerbongs fanatic
Joined: December 2008
Posts: 10,118
|
Post by rfucom on Sept 6, 2019 10:45:22 GMT -5
Delicate have a longetivity but this is not.
|
|
Deleted
Joined: January 1970
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Sept 6, 2019 11:07:52 GMT -5
I’m wondering if this can cling to the Hot 100 Top 10 this week before completely leaving.
|
|
theflying
3x Platinum Member
Joined: August 2006
Posts: 3,003
|
Post by theflying on Sept 9, 2019 22:59:59 GMT -5
2-13-13-16-15-15-16-18-14-4-12
Really solid run there.
|
|
mcsteamy
Platinum Member
Joined: April 2010
Posts: 1,436
|
Post by mcsteamy on Sept 10, 2019 16:48:47 GMT -5
This had a 180° turn on me, I love it now after hating it for months now.
|
|
|
Post by neverduplicated on Oct 3, 2019 17:04:34 GMT -5
Hot 100 chart run up to 15th week (10/5/19):
2-13-13-16-15-15-16-18-18-14-4-12-24-21-23
2 weeks top 10 12 weeks top 20 15 weeks top 40
Still gaining at Hot AC, up to #4 with the largest bullet in the top 10.
I'm actually amazed that this song hasn't burnt on me yet.
|
|
Choco
Diamond Member
james dean daydream
Joined: February 2009
Posts: 27,723
My Charts
Pronouns: he/him
|
Post by Choco on Oct 3, 2019 17:17:55 GMT -5
This one did it's job imo. It's a distant second to "Delicate" for best run for a TS single in the last few years.
|
|
|
Post by Love Plastic Love on Oct 3, 2019 21:17:51 GMT -5
My radio stations are spinning this like it is her new single lol. If it is holding well on pop, it is solely because of my radio stations. I have no idea why they haven't transitioned to Lover yet.
|
|
Eloqueen™
Diamond Member
TSC: Certified Member
Joined: September 2007
Posts: 21,809
|
Post by Eloqueen™ on Oct 3, 2019 21:43:35 GMT -5
Yeah, this was undeniably a hit. Good run for Taylor.
|
|
#brayden
3x Platinum Member
Joined: January 2009
Posts: 3,609
|
Post by #brayden on Oct 3, 2019 22:10:10 GMT -5
Never hated this and never thought it was a bad single choice. Pop radio did it kind of dirty, though. I'm convinced the negative callouts had more to do with "ME!" souring people on her.
|
|
MissAmericana
Platinum Member
How long could we be a sad song?
Joined: August 2019
Posts: 1,858
My Charts
Pronouns: They/Them
|
Post by MissAmericana on Oct 3, 2019 23:31:35 GMT -5
I'd love to see this hit number one on HAC. It's gaining more than anything else in the top 5 and is only about 1000 spins away from number one, plus it doesn't seem to be slowing down either.
|
|
Joe1240
6x Platinum Member
Taylor Swift-The Best in Pop & Country Music!
Joined: September 2003
Posts: 6,958
|
Post by Joe1240 on Oct 4, 2019 0:58:36 GMT -5
Glad the song is still doing well. It’s her most successful since “I Don’t Wanna Live Forever” from 2016/2017. After “Me!” Underperformed, I think a lot of people were ready to write her off but this song has proved she can still do well on Pop Radio. I think The Clean Bandit remix also helped this out, made it feel fresh again.
|
|
nick64
Diamond Member
Joined: November 2011
Posts: 14,433
|
Post by nick64 on Oct 4, 2019 1:11:55 GMT -5
Glad the song is still doing well. It’s her most successful since “I Don’t Wanna Live Forever” from 2016/2017. After “Me!” Underperformed, I think a lot of people were ready to write her off but this song has proved she can still do well on Pop Radio. I think The Clean Bandit remix also helped this out, made it feel fresh again. Delicate?
|
|
Au$tin
Diamond Member
Pop Culture Guru
Grrrrrrrrrr. Fuckity fuck why don't you watch my film before you judge it? FURY.
Joined: August 2008
Posts: 54,613
My Charts
Pronouns: He/his/him
|
Post by Au$tin on Oct 4, 2019 2:07:20 GMT -5
"This is her biggest single since X" discussion continues I see. Here, have some stats.
Spotify: I Don't Wanna Live Forever 909,393,500 Look What You Made Me Do 503,462,272 ...Ready for It? 268,109,072 Gorgeous 181,236,460 End Game 196,111,343 Delicate 331,551,621 ME! 290,404,280 You Need to Calm Down 230,461,680 (Lover 121,250,816)
YouTube: I Don't Wanna Live Forever 566,157,230 Look What You Made Me Do 1,096,540,903 ...Ready for It? 255,048,002 Gorgeous 105,727,740 (lyric video only, no music video) End Game 214,955,002 Delicate 385,169,204 ME! 269,954,751 You Need to Calm Down 145,947,614 (Lover 61,404,106)
Hot 100: I Don't Wanna Live Forever 6-18-22-14-12-8-5-3-3-2-3-3-4-4-3-7-15-26-36-32-37-46-48 Look What You Made Me Do 77-1-1-1-3-3-5-4-10-25-34-37-31-44-60-72-70-76-66-55 ...Ready for It? 4-21-34-39-47-53-52-46-19-30-18-24-31-43-37-59-58-80-96 Gorgeous 13-69-85-89 (was not a US single) End Game 86-83-39-49-42-40-39-36-18-30-43-45-65-91 Delicate 84-66-52-46-54-51-52-56-46-36-34-28-37-25-27-20-23-15-12-12-13-17-16-19-25-29-25-27-29-37-33-34-38-43-49 ME! 100-2-3-8-9-11-11-14-15-31-39-52-55-58-61-66-63-58-11-54 You Need to Calm Down 2-13-13-16-15-15-16-18-18-14-4-12-24-21 (Lover 19-10-23-49-49)
Pop: I Don't Wanna Live Forever 26-19-16-13-11-10-7-5-5-4-3-2-2-2-2-2-3-5-7-10 Look What You Made Me Do 22-9-7-6-5-4-4-1-6-14-24-28-30-29-36-37 (#4 should probably be its real peak here, but we all know the story) ...Ready for It? 39-27-21-18-18-18-19-17-15-14-13-11-12-11-18-25-26-27-32-35 (was not actually pushed until late in its run) Gorgeous 45-49-45 (yes, it managed to chart without actually being a single here ever) End Game 50-33-25-20-15-14-13-12-11-10-11-10-12-13-22-35 Delicate 48-36-25-24-24-24-21-19-19-17-15-13-12-10-9-8-6-5-5-1-3-4-8-9-10 ME! 24-10-8-7-7-6-7-7-10-18-20-34-38-37 You Need to Calm Down 39-19-14-12-11-10-9-9-9-9-9-9-14-18-27-33 (pretty sure this had similar tactics of LWYMMD used to keep it afloat in the top 10 until album release) (Lover 49-33-25-18-17 [debuted before actual push given])
WW Chart: I Don't Wanna Live Forever 3-13-13-8-8-6-4-2-2-2-2-4-5-3-7-12-13-19-27-29-32-37-39 Look What You Made Me Do 1-2-1-1-1-3-4-11-18-18-21-21-27-33 ...Ready for It? 4-14-23-31-33-40-off-off-off-28-32-33-34-38-37 Gorgeous 13-33-36-37 End Game 29-39 Delicate failed to chart (literally only song on this list that didn't have initial hype to get it there, though, so...) ME! 2-3-4-6-7-7-8-9-11-21-28-29-34-off-off-off-off-20-39 You Need to Calm Down 4-8-11-14-11-13-15-17-19-21-9-16-19-23-26 (Lover 24-11-19-26-29-29)
RIAA Certs: I Don't Wanna Live Forever 4xP Look What You Made Me Do 4xP ...Ready for It? 2xP Gorgeous Gold End Game 1xP Delicate 1xP ME! 1xP You Need to Calm Down n/a (Lover n/a)
Spotify Playlist Counts: (good for measuring how much older songs still resonate with people; newer songs typically higher stats) I Don't Wanna Live Forever 6,680 playlists / 24,412,214 reach Look What You Made Me Do 2,583 playlists / 6,284,608 reach ...Ready for It? 1,575 playlists / 2,679,014 reach Gorgeous 833 playlists / 3,028,825 reach End Game 1,025 playlists / 3,326,923 reach Delicate 1,381 playlists / 23,834,961 reach ME! 1,641 playlists / 41,116,988 reach You Need to Calm Down 1,638 playlists / 56,976,205 reach (Lover 1,221 playlists / 98,405,697 reach)
Looking at all of these, I'd still say "Delicate" and "Look What You Made Me Do" (as well as IDWLF) performed better than this. Your regional area may vary with "Delicate" as it appears to not have done that well in some European countries that this did do well in, but where "Delicate" did do well in seems to make up for that given other stats.
I will say, the longevity on this one has been pretty impressive given how low and quickly it wound up peaking pretty much everywhere. That really aided in it surpassing/matching all of "ME!"'s totals.
|
|
MissAmericana
Platinum Member
How long could we be a sad song?
Joined: August 2019
Posts: 1,858
My Charts
Pronouns: They/Them
|
Post by MissAmericana on Oct 14, 2019 8:04:51 GMT -5
This is currently 703 spins away from becoming the number one song on HAC. And since everything in the top three is losing spins on a daily basis (while this is gaining, and currently at number four), it has a solid chance at getting to the top. Here are all the songs in the top four, their current spin count, and their spin gain/loss in the past 7 days.
#1. Senorita - 6614 (-112 spins) #2. Someone You Loved - 6510 (-45 spins) #3. I Don't Care - 6167 (-17 spins) #4. You Need to Calm Down - 5911 (+251 spins)
|
|
Eloqueen™
Diamond Member
TSC: Certified Member
Joined: September 2007
Posts: 21,809
|
Post by Eloqueen™ on Oct 14, 2019 8:55:03 GMT -5
The overall run of this song (particularly Hot 100 wise) is by far the most solid out of all the releases thus far this era IMO. It is looking to be the biggest hit off the album, unfortunately. Lover will become the ultimate #wastedpotential reference. lol
|
|
Choco
Diamond Member
james dean daydream
Joined: February 2009
Posts: 27,723
My Charts
Pronouns: he/him
|
Post by Choco on Oct 14, 2019 11:55:51 GMT -5
Really feels like the type of song Pop would play more than HAC... but I ain't mad! It's great that it's still getting airplay.
|
|
MissAmericana
Platinum Member
How long could we be a sad song?
Joined: August 2019
Posts: 1,858
My Charts
Pronouns: They/Them
|
Post by MissAmericana on Oct 14, 2019 12:32:22 GMT -5
This song is so incredibly stable. Here is a comparison of all her recent singles on their 17th week on chart, since YNTCD is entering its 17th week.
IDWLF - #15 (-8) LWYMMD - #70 (+2) RFI? - #61 (-2) Delicate - #23 (-3) ME! - #63 (+3) YNTCD - #28 (-1)*
This song really did well. I initially thought this was going to be her Chained to The Rhythm, but needless to say it has performed much, much better.
|
|
nickd
4x Platinum Member
Joined: November 2017
Posts: 4,416
|
Post by nickd on Oct 14, 2019 13:30:50 GMT -5
This song had much better callouts among older demographics than young ones on HAC back when stats were available for both demos. A couple months ago, stats for the older demo stopped being available (only for the young one) so I think that's why the callouts took a hit but the song kept rising on there. Pop skews younger than HAC and AC skews older, so hopefully that'll help it being one of the limited selection of songs AC takes to the top 5.
And yeah, the longevity is better than I thought it would be after seeing how ME! did.
I don't think it's as big as IDWLF, but it's not too far behind LWYMMD and Delicate and doing better than each on some metrics.
YNTCD had a lower peak than LWYMMD on pop radio, but better longevity, and significantly better performance on HAC, so overall radio airplay is better thanks to better longevity. Sales and Youtube is not as good. Spotify, so far LWYMMD is ahead, but YNTCD might still overtake it in the long run, even if it takes a couple years. Although LWYMMD had a bigger Spotify debut, now on its 17th week, YNTCD is at #82 on the worldwide charts compared to #105 for LWYMMD with an extra 840,000 weekly streams.
YNTCD is probably not going to do as well on radio as Delicate, since it already fell significantly short on Pop, and it's going to be difficult to outperform Delicate on HAC and AC since Delicate was the biggest hit of her career on AC, and her biggest by far on HAC. It will almost certainly overtake Delicate on Spotify though. Delicate will probably keep the lead on Youtube since that platform has died off pretty hard for Western music in the past two years. YNTCD does have more likes+dislikes than Delicate which suggests more people saw it, but I think much of the world only watches Youtube music videos once or twice before switching to audio streaming services, whereas in the past they were more likely to have a Youtube tab open for general music listening (without looking at the visual), since audio streaming market penetration was lower then. I suspect the superior performance of YNTCD on Spotify is also matched by superior performance on Apple Music and Amazon.
|
|
mediabase
Charting
Joined: February 2015
Posts: 156
|
Post by mediabase on Oct 15, 2019 18:46:45 GMT -5
It looks like this is going to hit No1 on HOT AC!
|
|
deepston
5x Platinum Member
Nightmare Dressed Like a Kitty
just like a folk song, our love will be passed on
Joined: August 2017
Posts: 5,661
|
Post by deepston on Oct 15, 2019 19:05:14 GMT -5
This song is so incredibly stable. Here is a comparison of all her recent singles on their 17th week on chart, since YNTCD is entering its 17th week. IDWLF - 15 (-8) LWYMMD - #70 (+2)
RFI? - #61 (-2) Delicate - #23 (-3) ME! - #63 (+3) YNTCD - #28 (-1)* This song really did well. I initially thought this was going to be her Chained to The Rhythm, but needless to say it has performed much, much better.
|
|
mediabase
Charting
Joined: February 2015
Posts: 156
|
Post by mediabase on Oct 17, 2019 8:32:44 GMT -5
You Need To Calm Down just 500 spins away from the No1 on HOT AC. Republic better write those checks! It would be a shame to miss the No1.
|
|
MissAmericana
Platinum Member
How long could we be a sad song?
Joined: August 2019
Posts: 1,858
My Charts
Pronouns: They/Them
|
Post by MissAmericana on Oct 17, 2019 8:53:51 GMT -5
This song is so incredibly stable. Here is a comparison of all her recent singles on their 17th week on chart, since YNTCD is entering its 17th week. IDWLF - 15 (-8) LWYMMD - #70 (+2)
RFI? - #61 (-2) Delicate - #23 (-3) ME! - #63 (+3) YNTCD - #28 (-1)* This song really did well. I initially thought this was going to be her Chained to The Rhythm, but needless to say it has performed much, much better. Yup, crazy how to only song to reach #1 on the list was also the song which had tumbled the most by the 17th week. And the fact that there are three #2 songs on this list... how unlucky can you get?
|
|