Billboard Hot 100: 01/08/2022

[iforgot]

Jan 4, 2022 14:18:16 GMT -5 gikem said:

Debuts this week:

#50 Encanto Cast - We Don't Talk About Bruno
#54 Jessica Darrow - Surface Pressure
#79 V - Christmas Tree
#83 Muni Long - Hrs and Hrs
#92 Emmy Meli - I AM WOMAN
#94 Ari Lennox - Pressure
#96 Dierks Bentley, Breland & HARDY - Beers On Me
#99 Sam Hunt - 23

I hope ‘23’ takes off for Sam. I really like that one.

[Lukas]

Jan 4, 2022 19:40:26 GMT -5 cking33 said:

Do we know how close this was between Mariah and Adele? I got the stats from Talk of the Charts, but I don't know how to convert these into chart points. Can anyone do the math?

Here was Mariah:
4,900 sales (-39%)
35.4 million streams (-25%)
16.5 million airplay (-49%)

Here was Adele:
9,100 sales (+5%)
15.2 million streams (-10%)
94 million airplay (+7%)

From those, I get:

All I Want For Christmas Is You (284)
Easy On Me (282)

Depending on streaming tiers, it could vary a bit. But it was close nonetheless.

[jenglisbe]

It should be noted that Mariah didn't perform "AIWFCIY" at all this year, and the song has never been discounted at iTunes. It's a monster all on its own.

[dodgerslakers94]

All I Want for Christmas Is You will pass the torch to Santa Tell Me in the next few years and I'm here for it ;)

[degen]

Jan 4, 2022 23:54:05 GMT -5 dodgerslakers94 said:

All I Want for Christmas Is You will pass the torch to Santa Tell Me in the next few years and I'm here for it ;)

Yet “Santa Tell Me” didn’t even peak as high as it did as last year. Meanwhile AIWFCIY had one extra week at #1 compared to last year.

[dodgerslakers94]

Jan 5, 2022 1:21:15 GMT -5 degen said:

Jan 4, 2022 23:54:05 GMT -5 dodgerslakers94 said:

All I Want for Christmas Is You will pass the torch to Santa Tell Me in the next few years and I'm here for it ;)

Yet “Santa Tell Me” didn’t even peak as high as it did as last year. Meanwhile AIWFCIY had one extra week at #1 compared to last year.

Didn’t everybody streamed Christmas songs real early, just to make themselves feel jolly because of COVID? That might have been a correlation as to why certain songs peaked/early.

[fridayteenage]

Also underneath the tree did 5 spots better.

[smiley22]

Jan 4, 2022 15:37:04 GMT -5 85la said:

Jan 4, 2022 12:49:45 GMT -5 GW said:

Yeah, I don't know how or why Billboard would put that genie back in the bottle without the entire industry on board demanding it.  

Because for basically 50 years of the Hot 100's existence, that was pretty much their policy. Not like not allowing most Christmas to chart wasn't standard practice before. And presumably because the songs just reflect seasonal/routine popularity over the years, and less "newer, fresher, and of the moment" popularity, which is what the Hot 100 is mainly designed to capture. Although I will say, if these songs were allowed to chart in years past, they probably wouldn't have charted as highly as now, because the streaming of course didn't exist, the sales weren't there, and even airplay was probably lower, so the popularity they exhibit now through all the available metrics, in which they literally take up the #1 position and most of the top ten, creates a higher burden of logic to advocate for their removal. Yet at the same time, I as well am getting bored with them and it does seem a bit inauthentic and even unfair that they can just so easily score these weeks each year by default. But it's really tough to decide, because the consumption numbers are there, and mostly by consumer choice it seems with the streaming, so it does seem to be what the public wants and is listening to, so I'm just very ambivalent about the situation and just forcing myself to accept what is.

I think it's also obvious that if it weren't Mariah topping the chart each year, a lot of us would have very, very different opinions about it (including myself, as I'm also a fan and can admit I'm not immune from this bias).

I do agree with some of your sentiment, but think Christmas songs charting do represent the “moment”. Should new Christmas songs be allowed to chart or would they only penalized older songs. They may change the rules but I hope they let AIWFCIY run it’s natural course before doing so because to change the rules this decade would be criminal.

[dremolus - solarpunk]

Notable Gains:
#9. Ed Sheeran - Shivers (+14) *gained in points*
#12. Lil Nas X and Jack Harlow - INDUSTRY BABY (+10)
#14. Doja Cat - Need to Know (+10) *gained in points*
#16. Kodak Black - Super Gremlin (+10) *gained in points*
#17. GAYLE - abcdefu (+10) *gained in points*
#35. Lil Nas X - THATS WHAT I WANT (+14) *gained in points*
#39. Post Malone and The Weeknd - One Right Now (+11) *gained in points*
#40. Adele - Oh My God (+17) *gained in points*
#44. Dustin Lynch feat. Lauren Alaina or MacKenzie Porter - Thinking 'Bout You (+10) *gained in points*
#46. NEIKED, Mae Muller, and Polo G - Better Days (+10) *gained in points*
#60. Kane Brown - One Mississippi (+13) *gained in points*
#70. Cody Johnson - 'Til You Can't (+12) *gained in points*
#72. Coldplay and BTS - My Universe (+12) *gained in points*
#73. Jimmie Allen and Brad Paisley - Freedom Was a Highway (+13) *gained in points*
#78. Eric Church - Heart On Fire (+14) *gained in points*
#80. Taylor Swift - Message in a Bottle (+13) *gained in points*
#87. ACRAZE feat. Cherish - Do It To It (+10) *new peak, gained in points*

Notable Losses:
#30. Lil Durk feat. Morgan Wallen - Broadway Girls (-16)
#34. Dean Martin - Let It Snow, Let It Snow, Let It Snow (-22)
#45. Eartha Kitt With Henri Rene And His Orchestra - Santa Baby (-10)
#47. Michael Bublé - It's Beginning To Look A Lot Like Christmas (-17)
#67. Ed Sheeran and Elton John - Merry Christmas (-12)
#93. Kelly Clarkson - Christmas Isn't Canceled (Just You) (-14)

Re-entries:
#36. WizKid feat. Justin Bieber and Tems - Essence
#38. Doja Cat feat. SZA - Kiss Me More
#42. Doja Cat and The Weeknd - You Right
#88. Luke Combs - Doin' This
#89. Kelsea Ballerini feat. Kenny Chesney - Half of My Hometown
#90. Wale feat. J. Cole - Poke It Out

Notable Dropouts:
Cold as You (20 weeks)
Knowing You (18 weeks)
Bad Man (Smooth Criminal) (5 weeks)

Biggest Gain in Airplay: Bad Habits
Biggest Gain in Sales: My Universe

Gained in Points:
#2. Adele - Easy On Me (+3)
#7. Glass Animals - Heat Waves (+8)
#28. Silk Sonic (Bruno Mars & Anderson .Paak) - Smokin Out the Window (+4)
#32. Justin Bieber - Ghost (+7)
#43. Billie Eilish - Happier Than Ever (+8)
#51. Jordan Davis feat. Luke Bryan - Buy Dirt (+8)
#55. Chris Stapleton - You Should Probably Leave (+6)
#57. Michael Ray - Whiskey and Rain (+7)
#58. Morgan Wallen - Sand in My Boots (+8)
#62. Latto - Big Energy (+7) *new peak*
#63. Blxst and Tyga feat. Ty Dolla $ign - Chosen (+9)
#64. Imagine Dragons and JID - Enemy (+6) *new peak*
#77. Parker McCollum - To Be Loved By You (+6) *new peak*
#81. MoneyBagg Yo - Scorpio (+9) *new peak*
#85. Jon Pardi - Tequila Little Time (+4)
#86. Zac Brown Band - Same Boat (+8)

Top 10 Without Christmas Songs:
1. Easy On Me
2. STAY
3. Heat Waves
4. Shivers
5. INDUSTRY BABY
6. Need to Know
7. Super Gremlin
8. abcdefu
9. Bad Habits
10. Cold Heart (PNAU Remix)

[Baby Yoda Hot100Fan]

[gikem]

dremolus - solarpunk In the gains, you missed Bad Habits at #19 and Fancy Like at #33. Also, Cold As You dropped out already last week.

[leonagwen]

Jan 4, 2022 21:46:52 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

It should be noted that Mariah didn't perform "AIWFCIY" at all this year, and the song has never been discounted at iTunes. It's a monster all on its own.

She had the McDonald's promotion.

[Choco]

Jan 4, 2022 23:54:05 GMT -5 dodgerslakers94 said:

All I Want for Christmas Is You will pass the torch to Santa Tell Me in the next few years and I'm here for it ;)

Every year this is predicted and every year it only performs above the average on Spotify. It could happen but not in the next few years at least.

[jenglisbe]

Jan 5, 2022 8:43:32 GMT -5 leonagwen said:

Jan 4, 2022 21:46:52 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

It should be noted that Mariah didn't perform "AIWFCIY" at all this year, and the song has never been discounted at iTunes. It's a monster all on its own.

She had the McDonald's promotion.

Are you saying you think that helped "AIWFCIY" on the Hot 100?

[GW]

Jan 4, 2022 15:37:04 GMT -5 85la said:

Jan 4, 2022 12:49:45 GMT -5 GW said:

Yeah, I don't know how or why Billboard would put that genie back in the bottle without the entire industry on board demanding it.  

Because for basically 50 years of the Hot 100's existence, that was pretty much their policy. Not like not allowing most Christmas to chart wasn't standard practice before. And presumably because the songs just reflect seasonal/routine popularity over the years, and less "newer, fresher, and of the moment" popularity, which is what the Hot 100 is mainly designed to capture. Although I will say, if these songs were allowed to chart in years past, they probably wouldn't have charted as highly as now, because the streaming of course didn't exist, the sales weren't there, and even airplay was probably lower, so the popularity they exhibit now through all the available metrics, in which they literally take up the #1 position and most of the top ten, creates a higher burden of logic to advocate for their removal. Yet at the same time, I as well am getting bored with them and it does seem a bit inauthentic and even unfair that they can just so easily score these weeks each year by default. But it's really tough to decide, because the consumption numbers are there, and mostly by consumer choice it seems with the streaming, so it does seem to be what the public wants and is listening to, so I'm just very ambivalent about the situation and just forcing myself to accept what is.

I think it's also obvious that if it weren't Mariah topping the chart each year, a lot of us would have very, very different opinions about it (including myself, as I'm also a fan and can admit I'm not immune from this bias).

I'm not even going to disagree with what you're saying, I'm aware of the history.  But you didn't really hit on my key point - reversing the rule change literally because holiday songs are too popular for 6 weeks out of the year.  That would be a very odd move - "That's it, we've had enough, no more holiday songs unless they're new, sorry!"  

I'm of the opinion that that knew exactly what the possibilities were when they made the decision 10 years ago to allow old songs to re-enter, and at least in part made the change BECAUSE the chart was omitting very popular (potentially even #1) hits. The effects were immediate.

What's popular for the week is what's popular for the week, and chart within the recurrent rules.  Even if they moved the recurrent rules up to top 10 only, we're still in the same boat for 8-10 songs every year.  If they're that popular, they shouldn't be treated differently than any other song that happens to regain massive popularity, even if only for one week.

The Hot 100 is obviously a different chart than it used to be, in many ways. Holding on to what they used to do and using that as a rationale for going backwards seems shortsighted to me.

[Baby Yoda Hot100Fan]

^She also had Mariah’s Christmas: The Magic Continues on Apple TV +. Granted, that didn't have AIWFCIY in it either.

[jenglisbe]

Jan 5, 2022 10:16:59 GMT -5 GW said:

Jan 4, 2022 15:37:04 GMT -5 85la said:

Because for basically 50 years of the Hot 100's existence, that was pretty much their policy. Not like not allowing most Christmas to chart wasn't standard practice before. And presumably because the songs just reflect seasonal/routine popularity over the years, and less "newer, fresher, and of the moment" popularity, which is what the Hot 100 is mainly designed to capture. Although I will say, if these songs were allowed to chart in years past, they probably wouldn't have charted as highly as now, because the streaming of course didn't exist, the sales weren't there, and even airplay was probably lower, so the popularity they exhibit now through all the available metrics, in which they literally take up the #1 position and most of the top ten, creates a higher burden of logic to advocate for their removal. Yet at the same time, I as well am getting bored with them and it does seem a bit inauthentic and even unfair that they can just so easily score these weeks each year by default. But it's really tough to decide, because the consumption numbers are there, and mostly by consumer choice it seems with the streaming, so it does seem to be what the public wants and is listening to, so I'm just very ambivalent about the situation and just forcing myself to accept what is.

I think it's also obvious that if it weren't Mariah topping the chart each year, a lot of us would have very, very different opinions about it (including myself, as I'm also a fan and can admit I'm not immune from this bias).

I'm not even going to disagree with what you're saying, I'm aware of the history.  But you didn't really hit on my key point - reversing the rule change literally because holiday songs are too popular for 6 weeks out of the year.  That would be a very odd move - "That's it, we've had enough, no more holiday songs unless they're new, sorry!"  

I'm of the opinion that that knew exactly what the possibilities were when they made the decision 10 years ago to allow old songs to re-enter, and at least in part made the change BECAUSE the chart was omitting very popular (potentially even #1) hits. The effects were immediate.

What's popular for the week is what's popular for the week, and chart within the recurrent rules.  Even if they moved the recurrent rules up to top 10 only, we're still in the same boat for 8-10 songs every year.  If they're that popular, they shouldn't be treated differently than any other song that happens to regain massive popularity, even if only for one week.

The Hot 100 is obviously a different chart than it used to be, in many ways. Holding on to what they used to do and using that as a rationale for going backwards seems shortsighted to me.

To be fair, the effects weren't exactly immediate. "AIWFCIY" charted for 5 holiday seasons before it even entered the top 10. In the first 4 seasons of the rule change, no more than 4 old holiday songs charted. To the end, I don't think Billboard necessarily saw this coming. It wasn't until 2017/2018 that we had a real indication holiday songs were going to have a huge impact on the Hot 100.

[joshtheking]

Chart prediction for Pressure: Top 50 Peak, beats reccurency rules for about 5 weeks due to radio, just about makes the year end

[GW]

Jan 5, 2022 10:31:38 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

Jan 5, 2022 10:16:59 GMT -5 GW said:

I'm not even going to disagree with what you're saying, I'm aware of the history.  But you didn't really hit on my key point - reversing the rule change literally because holiday songs are too popular for 6 weeks out of the year.  That would be a very odd move - "That's it, we've had enough, no more holiday songs unless they're new, sorry!"  

I'm of the opinion that that knew exactly what the possibilities were when they made the decision 10 years ago to allow old songs to re-enter, and at least in part made the change BECAUSE the chart was omitting very popular (potentially even #1) hits. The effects were immediate.

What's popular for the week is what's popular for the week, and chart within the recurrent rules.  Even if they moved the recurrent rules up to top 10 only, we're still in the same boat for 8-10 songs every year.  If they're that popular, they shouldn't be treated differently than any other song that happens to regain massive popularity, even if only for one week.

The Hot 100 is obviously a different chart than it used to be, in many ways. Holding on to what they used to do and using that as a rationale for going backwards seems shortsighted to me.

To be fair, the effects weren't exactly immediate. "AIWFCIY" charted for 5 holiday seasons before it even entered the top 10. In the first 4 seasons of the rule change, no more than 4 old holiday songs charted. To the end, I don't think Billboard necessarily saw this coming. It wasn't until 2017/2018 that we had a real indication holiday songs were going to have a huge impact on the Hot 100.

Sorry for not being suuuuuuper clear and assuming chart watchers like yourself would know I was referring to Whitney Houston, but that's what I was referring to in that entire paragraph - the effects of the "old song" rule were immediate.  As for holiday songs, I said I believe they knew the POSSIBILITIES, not necessarily the outcome.  But either way, my point still stands.  It would be a very awkward decision to reverse course now simply because the songs are proving to be too popular every year.  

[gikem]

In other news, Cold Heart finally made it to #1 in Canada.

[phieaglesfan712]

Cold Heart: #1 UK, ARIA, and Canada. #1 on the Hot 100 next.

[renfield75]

Jan 5, 2022 11:10:02 GMT -5 GW said:

Jan 5, 2022 10:31:38 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

To be fair, the effects weren't exactly immediate. "AIWFCIY" charted for 5 holiday seasons before it even entered the top 10. In the first 4 seasons of the rule change, no more than 4 old holiday songs charted. To the end, I don't think Billboard necessarily saw this coming. It wasn't until 2017/2018 that we had a real indication holiday songs were going to have a huge impact on the Hot 100.

Sorry for not being suuuuuuper clear and assuming chart watchers like yourself would know I was referring to Whitney Houston, but that's what I was referring to in that entire paragraph - the effects of the "old song" rule were immediate.  As for holiday songs, I said I believe they knew the POSSIBILITIES, not necessarily the outcome.  But either way, my point still stands.  It would be a very awkward decision to reverse course now simply because the songs are proving to be too popular every year.  

Their hand was forced on both the Hot 100 and BB 200 because of the Michael Jackson fiasco in 2009. He clearly had the best-selling album in the country for 6 weeks and would have had many songs in the top 40 (and top 10) but the recurrent and catalog rules excluded them. As that situation went on for weeks it was embarrassing for Billboard, almost on the scale of the 90s "no-airplay cuts" debacle. When Whitney passed they knew they had to accommodate that. The Christmas songs just became a beneficiary of that, especially as their streaming presence grew.

[jenglisbe]

Jan 5, 2022 13:50:36 GMT -5 renfield75 said:

Jan 5, 2022 11:10:02 GMT -5 GW said:

Sorry for not being suuuuuuper clear and assuming chart watchers like yourself would know I was referring to Whitney Houston, but that's what I was referring to in that entire paragraph - the effects of the "old song" rule were immediate.  As for holiday songs, I said I believe they knew the POSSIBILITIES, not necessarily the outcome.  But either way, my point still stands.  It would be a very awkward decision to reverse course now simply because the songs are proving to be too popular every year.  

Their hand was forced on both the Hot 100 and BB 200 because of the Michael Jackson fiasco in 2009. He clearly had the best-selling album in the country for 6 weeks and would have had many songs in the top 40 (and top 10) but the recurrent and catalog rules excluded them. As that situation went on for weeks it was embarrassing for Billboard, almost on the scale of the 90s "no-airplay cuts" debacle. When Whitney passed they knew they had to accommodate that. The Christmas songs just became a beneficiary of that, especially as their streaming presence grew.

Right. And as annoying as it may be for some people to see holiday songs clog the Hot 100, there would be as many or more people (and possibly media) griping if holiday songs were the top songs across Spotify, Pandora, etc yet nowhere to be found on the Hot 100 (i.e. just like with Michael's albums and singles).

[jenglisbe]

One thing that has changed as sales have dwindled is that holiday songs actually sell for longer. I am looking at the Digital Songs chart for 1/7/06, which represented December 19-25. Holiday songs actually fell in sales that week even though Christmas was the last day of the chart week. Here are the holiday songs on it (yup, only two):
12. All I Want for Christmas is You
50. Feliz Navidad

[85la]

Jan 5, 2022 6:05:23 GMT -5 smiley22 said:

Jan 4, 2022 15:37:04 GMT -5 85la said:

Because for basically 50 years of the Hot 100's existence, that was pretty much their policy. Not like not allowing most Christmas to chart wasn't standard practice before. And presumably because the songs just reflect seasonal/routine popularity over the years, and less "newer, fresher, and of the moment" popularity, which is what the Hot 100 is mainly designed to capture. Although I will say, if these songs were allowed to chart in years past, they probably wouldn't have charted as highly as now, because the streaming of course didn't exist, the sales weren't there, and even airplay was probably lower, so the popularity they exhibit now through all the available metrics, in which they literally take up the #1 position and most of the top ten, creates a higher burden of logic to advocate for their removal. Yet at the same time, I as well am getting bored with them and it does seem a bit inauthentic and even unfair that they can just so easily score these weeks each year by default. But it's really tough to decide, because the consumption numbers are there, and mostly by consumer choice it seems with the streaming, so it does seem to be what the public wants and is listening to, so I'm just very ambivalent about the situation and just forcing myself to accept what is.

I think it's also obvious that if it weren't Mariah topping the chart each year, a lot of us would have very, very different opinions about it (including myself, as I'm also a fan and can admit I'm not immune from this bias).

I do agree with some of your sentiment, but think Christmas songs charting do represent the “moment”. Should new Christmas songs be allowed to chart or would they only penalized older songs. They may change the rules but I hope they let AIWFCIY run it’s natural course before doing so because to change the rules this decade would be criminal.

This is exactly what I'm talking about. It seems a lot of you are for Christmas songs charting only so Mariah can chart.

Having said this, I would be more willing to let them chart, but they would have to follow the same recurrency rules as all other songs. They absolutely should not be granted more leniency for charting. That is, as soon as they reach 52 weeks and fall below the top 25, they are out for good. The fact that many of them might gain enough points each year to re-enter the top 25 is not a "significant enough reason" to allow it to rechart (Billboard's stipulation for songs being allowed to break recurrency). These resurgences would just be due to routine/holiday activity, nothing special or significant about it. And yes, this rule should hold even if it prevents Mariah from reaching #1 again.

[jenglisbe]

Jan 5, 2022 15:12:42 GMT -5 85la said:

The fact that many of them might gain enough points each year to re-enter the top 25 is not a "significant enough reason" to allow it to rechart (Billboard's stipulation for songs being allowed to break recurrency). These resurgences would just be due to routine/holiday activity, nothing special or significant about it. And yes, this rule should hold even if it prevents Mariah from reaching #1 again.

Are you saying if "Blinding Lights" or "The Twist" had enough points to return to #1 on the Hot 100, Billboard still wouldn't allow it because they are recurrent? I doubt that.

[85la]

Jan 5, 2022 15:18:06 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

Jan 5, 2022 15:12:42 GMT -5 85la said:

The fact that many of them might gain enough points each year to re-enter the top 25 is not a "significant enough reason" to allow it to rechart (Billboard's stipulation for songs being allowed to break recurrency). These resurgences would just be due to routine/holiday activity, nothing special or significant about it. And yes, this rule should hold even if it prevents Mariah from reaching #1 again.

Are you saying if "Blinding Lights" or "The Twist" had enough points to return to #1 on the Hot 100, Billboard still wouldn't allow it because they are recurrent? I doubt that.

It depends on what the situation would be. If they were due to some special reworked/re-recorded version being promoted, or due to the death of either artist, I would say that would constitute a significant reason (actually The Twist hasn't reached 52 weeks yet, so it would be allowed to chart anyway), but seasonal/yearly holiday playlisting I do not believe is a good enough reason.

[Rose "Payola" Nylund]

Weeks on chart is arbitrary and relative based on their position. If a song hangs around in the top 10 for three years, it will never be manually removed due to recurrent rules or anything. If a song hits the top ten, falls off the chart but then becomes popular again two years later, enough that it would hit number one, why shouldn’t it be allowed to chart just because it happened to drop off in popularity after its first run? If people are consuming a song enough, regardless of whether they do it the first time it’s released or some time long after, why shouldn’t it be eligible to chart? The more arbitrary rules and requirements made for the chart, the less accurate and more ridiculous it’ll become. Or maybe The Twist shouldn’t have been allowed to chart again a second time, or Levitating shouldn’t have been allowed back on the chart because their second-time-around period of popularity was fake.

[JukeboxJacob]

I'm on team abolish all recurrency rules

[sheardbeard]

Jan 5, 2022 18:07:39 GMT -5 JukeboxJacob said:

I'm on team abolish all recurrency rules

I second that emotion.