Why does NOTHING cross over to pop anymore?

[jebsib]

I get that music is cyclical; I understand that it isn't the mid-90s anymore, and that the trend at top 40 has been rhythmic for a long time ... but this is unprecedented, isn't it?

[American Idiot]

Honestly, I could care less if songs from the Alternative or Active Rock charts are sent over to Pop. Usually it's around six months to a year or even more after it debuts anyway, once the song became a major hit, and if I end up hearing it again makes me want to pull my ears out. Examples at the top of my head now would be Trapt's "Headstrong," Crossfade's "Cold," etc, etc, etc.

[metalfan87]

Jul 13, 2010 16:35:50 GMT -5 American Idiot said:

Honestly, I could care less if songs from the Alternative or Active Rock charts are sent over to Pop. Usually it's around six months to a year or even more after it debuts anyway, once the song became a major hit, and if I end up hearing it again makes me want to pull my ears out. Examples at the top of my head now would be Trapt's "Headstrong," Crossfade's "Cold," etc, etc, etc.

and Shinedown's Second Chance

[Pipa]

And "Use Somebody".

[metalfan87]

Jul 13, 2010 16:50:30 GMT -5 Pipa said:

And "Use Somebody".

and Saving Abel's Addicted

[jvandyck87]

There have been plenty of songs to cross over, but it's been much less often. Ten years ago, a third of the chart would be alt/rock crossovers. Now it ranges in the 0, 1, 2 MAYBE 3 songs at a time. I don't think anything in the CHR top 40 currently is an alt/rock crossover. The closest is Neon Trees - Animal at #47.

[metalfan87]

Jul 13, 2010 17:27:36 GMT -5 jvandyck87 said:

There have been plenty of songs to cross over, but it's been much less often. Ten years ago, a third of the chart would be alt/rock crossovers. Now it ranges in the 0, 1, 2 MAYBE 3 songs at a time. I don't think anything in the CHR top 40 currently is an alt/rock crossover. The closest is Neon Trees - Animal at #47.

don't forget Shinedown's If You Only Knew

[Devin]

Jul 13, 2010 17:30:07 GMT -5 @metalfan87 said:

Jul 13, 2010 17:27:36 GMT -5 jvandyck87 said:

There have been plenty of songs to cross over, but it's been much less often. Ten years ago, a third of the chart would be alt/rock crossovers. Now it ranges in the 0, 1, 2 MAYBE 3 songs at a time. I don't think anything in the CHR top 40 currently is an alt/rock crossover. The closest is Neon Trees - Animal at #47.

don't forget Shinedown's If You Only Knew

That left the chart a while ago, I think maybe last year

[jebsib]

But why?

Has the format gone to an extreme?

[No Brake$]

Pop is in, and currently alt\rock isn't. I mean even Electronic\Alt is even on its way out. A new sound will eventually breakthrough in the next year or two (I think a more organic approach will be up next, a lot of younger bands seem to be experimenting with it, and the Fall Out Boy\All-American Rejects\ish stuff look to be on the way out. Kings Of Leon-ish type bands are going to be the next thing to hit if you ask me, and then you'll see more crossovers.

On the current chart, the only songs I see potentially crossing over are Animal (I mean already had as pointed out earlier), "Crossfire", maybe "Wild & Young", and "Impossible" (obviously next Spring).

Good question though!

[Minor Scratch]

No its more of the fact that Alternative bands who cross over to CHR alienate their fanbases the most. This is the format that get the most sellout chants. Not only that, alienating an already huge fanbase for CHR audiences is not going to sell records for the band. There are so many bands that I can sift thru that had this problem and weren't sure which direction to go next considering they had CHR hits which their earlier fanbase didn't approve of. Its not the 80s and 90s anymore where power ballads took the band to skydom.

Indie rock is also selling amazingly as well and fanbases growing at an alarming rate without having big hit singles. Alternative bands are going this route as well and starting to realize that if they put out quality product, promote heavily through the Internet, and tour non-stop, they can still make it big without having to go to radio.

[No Brake$]

Real good point fellow Texan.

Power Ballads, ha, I'm trying to remember the last time an alternative artist had a real power ballad off of the album to make them huge. Kings of Leon maybe, other than that...?

[The Party Captain]

Nothing crosses over to pop, because now, the kids don't want to be rock stars like Bruce Springsteen. They want to be like Lil Wayne and snort coke.

[Nicholas2.0]

Jul 14, 2010 20:47:15 GMT -5 The Party Captain said:

They want to be like Lil Wayne and snort coke.

Right, because when I think of Lil Wayne, I don't think...you know, rapper. Even playing into your stupid generalization, I don't associate Lil Wayne with sipping syrup or smoking marijuana. No, when I hear the name "Lil Wayne," the association that immediately comes to mind is sniffing cocaine.

[The Party Captain]

Okay. Somebody did not get the joke.

Sorry I forgot about mentioning Lil Wayne's vast philanthropy to the Boys and Girls Clubs of America. You realize he's in jail, right?

[mcbrearty]

Primarily pop wants wants dance songs. If a song has lyrics that sound like they'll suit in a niteclub, pop will want it.

[The Party Captain]

Heard a "Breakeven" dance remix the other day and I wanted to harm all those involved.

We all must remember that rock 'n' roll is a relatively old musical revolution (50s, 60s). I think the Rhythmic times we face are simply a phase. It'll swing back eventually. Either that, or we'll start listening to something completely different like epic 11-minute dance folk opera remixes.

[Nicholas2.0]

Jul 15, 2010 18:37:20 GMT -5 The Party Captain said:

Okay. Somebody did not get the joke.

No, I understand you were trying to be funny, but it didn't come across like you knew who you were talking about at all, that you were just choosing a popular rapper at random and chose an equally random illegal drug. I think you ought to recognize his talent as a rapper, before you take a cheap shot at him for a drug he's not even notorious for using and just dismiss him like he's some kind of no-talent ass-clown, to quote Michael Bolton (the Office Space one, of course). Your joke came off like you were impugning the entire hip hop genre.

[PHOBES]

The other day my station aired a promo for their "Sound of Summer" playlist, went something like:

"107.5 Summer - 'California Gurls we're unforgettable' - The soundtrack to your summer - 'Your Love, Your Love, Your Love Is My Drug, Your Love, Your Love, Your Love - All summer, on 107.5 KZL - 'Juuuuuuuuuust GIVE Me a Siiiign'"

I think my station's the only one that plays that last one, since it just vanished after falling from the top 50.

Jul 15, 2010 23:16:38 GMT -5 The Party Captain said:

Heard a "Breakeven" dance remix the other day and I wanted to harm all those involved.

Yeah there's a rhythmic leaning station in my area that plays that and a remix of "Need You Now," takes so much away from the song.

Jul 17, 2010 3:31:32 GMT -5 Nicholas2.0 said:

Jul 15, 2010 18:37:20 GMT -5 The Party Captain said:

Okay. Somebody did not get the joke.

I think you ought to recognize his talent as a rapper, before you take a cheap shot at him for a drug he's not even notorious for using.

His wikipedia page has an entire section entitled "Drug use and arrests" (including mention of a cocaine-related arrest), obviously it's a big part of who he is. And who cares what kind of drug it is? It's not like it'd be excusable if it were a different illegal substance.

And, I can't bring myself to call Lil' Wayne and his Young Money clones talented rappers. Thank God B.O.B, Jay-Z, and Eminem have taken over the airwaves where I live. Even if I could understand more than half of what's being said through all the auto-tune, I'm sure I wouldn't care for anything as grotesque as what I can actually hear.

[Rose "Payola" Nylund]

It's not just rappers that are known for drug use though. Most rock pioneers have had their days and I'm sure a lot of rock'n rollers today are as well.

You could easily use the line above and say kids want to be like so-and-so and abuse heroin.

[The Party Captain]

Jul 17, 2010 3:31:32 GMT -5 Nicholas2.0 said:

Jul 15, 2010 18:37:20 GMT -5 The Party Captain said:

Okay. Somebody did not get the joke.

No, I understand you were trying to be funny, but it didn't come across like you knew who you were talking about at all, that you were just choosing a popular rapper at random and chose an equally random illegal drug. I think you ought to recognize his talent as a rapper, before you take a cheap shot at him for a drug he's not even notorious for using and just dismiss him like he's some kind of no-talent ass-clown, to quote Michael Bolton (the Office Space one, of course). Your joke came off like you were impugning the entire hip hop genre.

This is hilarious. You're not angry at the fact that I insulted him. You're angry that I chose the wrong illegal drug.

Hip-hop is a fantastic genre. I will gladly give Eminem, Jay-Z, and Shad (an unknown, I know) praise. They keep hip-hop fresh and inventive. Lil Wayne and the Auto-Tune crew are just agents of stupidity.

I'll give Lil Wayne props as a lyricist. He is a fantastic and creative user of literary devices. But as a musician, his lack of depth and dimension is tremendous. When he's on his game, I'll call him a great poet. But if you wish to talk about his talent as a musician, I'm just going to laugh at you, if not pray for you.

Here's a link if you wanna talk crack.
www.theboombox.com/2009/09/11/lil-wayne-discusses-his-childhood-crack-cocaine-use/

[The Party Captain]

Kids today want to be like Regina Spektor and trip on acid.

[Nicholas2.0]

Jul 17, 2010 16:52:03 GMT -5 The Party Captain said:

This is hilarious. You're not angry at the fact that I insulted him. You're angry that I chose the wrong illegal drug.

That's your spin on my interpretation. Insult him all you want. I'm not sticking up for him as a person. He's pretty doggone ignorant about a lot of things, when you get right down to it. I just wanted you to acknowledge his staggering way with words (which you did, finally), however empty they may often be.

And, so we're clear, in no way was I attempting to put his musical and cultural contributions in the same league as Springsteen.

I'm ready to forget the whole thing and move on if you are.

[The Party Captain]

As Michael Scott would say, "Let's hug it out, bitch."

[onefrayedrepublic]

Alternative refuses to play poppy alternative as well. Outside of Denver (their home station), 3OH!3 can't get alt airplay despite being an alternative act. Don't Trust Me went to Alt. well before going to pop and should have been an absolutely epic smash on alt, but wasn't, despite my alt station (KTCL) playing it 40 times a week for 6 months. Alt is isolating itself by playing less and less music that's poppy. I find alt stations to be kind of dreary, which is why I've switched to mainly listening to pop recently. At some point alt will realize their error and bring the fun back.

EDIT: Not to pick out just my local boys... Bands like All Time Low, Mayday Parade should get at least a shot at Alt. Pop-punk used to be big at Alt, but now only pop will play it, and even then, they won't do much with it.

[Rich P.]

3OH!3 are two guys who get up on stage and rap with their apple laptop providing any required musical accompanyment. That's not Alternative.

[David]

There's a lot of things classified as "Alternative" and shouldn't be. But iTunes has moved 3OH!3 to "Electronic", or atleast they did with Streets Of Gold. I saw it labeled as that last night.

I wish more stuff would crossover. Even if I don't personally like it. I want diversity back in the Top 40. It makes things more interesting.

[Love Plastic Love]

Jul 21, 2010 11:16:46 GMT -5 David said:

There's a lot of things classified as "Alternative" and shouldn't be. But iTunes has moved 3OH!3 to "Electronic", or atleast they did with Streets Of Gold. I saw it labeled as that last night.

I wish more stuff would crossover. Even if I don't personally like it. I want diversity back in the Top 40. It makes things more interesting.

Same here. I was just thinking in the LP thread how mainstream alternative acts seem dead right now. I would like another explosion where rock/alternative acts are actually given a chance on mainstream. I mean, even in the heyday it didn't mean domination, but it was fun to see some variety.

[lockebox]

Jul 21, 2010 11:02:00 GMT -5 Rich P. said:

3OH!3 are two guys who get up on stage and rap with their apple laptop providing any required musical accompanyment. That's not Alternative.

This + they blow. :)

[Nicholas2.0]

Jul 20, 2010 22:12:25 GMT -5 onefrayedrepublic said:

Not to pick out just my local boys... Bands like All Time Low, Mayday Parade should get at least a shot at Alt. Pop-punk used to be big at Alt, but now only pop will play it, and even then, they won't do much with it.

The difference is the wave of pop-punk bands circa 10 years ago actually had at least a shred of punk in them and at least had some punk influences. The new generation of Warped bands only seems to be influenced by the previous generation of poppy bands and even the mainstream Alternative radio crossover bands, so that there's hardly any edgy "rock" left in the sound. And radio MD's rightfully call bullshit on that for the most part.