Billboard Hot 100: 04/13/2013

[jebsib]

In the old days there were no airplay only hits. A record company released a song to radio and retail simultaneously. Thus the Hot 100 didn't exclude huge airplay hits until the record companies started changing the rules.

[velaxti]

Apr 2, 2013 12:12:42 GMT -5 @gagalicious said:

1 1 We Are Young - fun. ft. Janelle Monae (5th week of 6 @ #1)

[/b]
2 - Boyfriend - Justin Bieber
3 4 Somebody That I Used To Know - Gotye ft. Kimbra
4 3 Glad You Came - The Wanted
5 2 Stronger (What Doesn't Kill You) - Kelly Clarkson
6 5 Starships - Nicki Minaj
7 7 Wild Ones - Flo Rida ft. Sia
8 8 Part Of Me - Katy Perry
9 11 What Makes You Beautiful - One Direction
10 18 Call Me Maybe - Carly Rae Jepsen

and so the endless weeks of the same 8 songs in the top 10 begins~
[/quote]

7 of the songs in that top 10 also made the year-end top 10! :o That must be pretty rare.

[josh]

And the other 3 were #11 ( :O ), #28, and #31. Crazy week.

[elementd5]

Apr 2, 2013 15:45:02 GMT -5 renfield75 said:

Apr 2, 2013 12:12:42 GMT -5 @gagalicious said:

15 years ago (4/11/98)
1 1 All My Life - K-Ci & Jojo (2nd week of 3 @ #1)
2 6 Let's Ride - Montell Jordan ft. Master P & Silkk The Shocker
3 2 Frozen - Madonna
4 10 Too Close - Next
5 4 My Heart Will Go On - Celine Dion
6 7 Truly Madly Deeply - Savage Garden
7 3 Nice & Slow - Usher
8 9 Gone Till November - Wyclef Jean
9 15 Romeo And Juliet - Sylk-E Fyne ft. Chill
10 11 Deja Vu [Uptown Baby] - Lord Tariq & Peter Gunz

^what on Earth are half these songs


Hot 100 Airplay from 15 years ago

1 2 Truly Madly Deeply - Savage Garden (1st week of 5 @ #1)
2 1 My Heart Will Go On - Celine Dion
3 4 All My Life - K-Ci & Jojo
4 3 3 AM - Matchbox 20
5 6 Torn - Natalie Imbruglia

This was near the peak of airplay songs being excluded from the Hot 100, before the big chart overhaul, so minor songs with decent sales ranked higher than they really should have. "Romeo & Juliet" is one of the most forgettable top tens of the 90s, up there with KP & Envyi's "Swing My Way" and Divine's "Lately," which actually went all the way to number one! 1998 was a weird year for chart watchers...

Forgettable to who? Both of those (Shorty & Lately) are R&B classics.

[Au$tin]

Apr 2, 2013 18:24:59 GMT -5 elementd5 said:

Apr 2, 2013 15:45:02 GMT -5 renfield75 said:

This was near the peak of airplay songs being excluded from the Hot 100, before the big chart overhaul, so minor songs with decent sales ranked higher than they really should have. "Romeo & Juliet" is one of the most forgettable top tens of the 90s, up there with KP & Envyi's "Swing My Way" and Divine's "Lately," which actually went all the way to number one! 1998 was a weird year for chart watchers...

Forgettable to who? Both of those (Shorty & Lately) are R&B classics.

Well, for starters. I've never heard of any of them until today.

[Lozzy]

Apr 2, 2013 18:26:36 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

Apr 2, 2013 18:24:59 GMT -5 elementd5 said:

Forgettable to who? Both of those (Shorty & Lately) are R&B classics.

Well, for starters. I've never heard of any of them until today.

Well, do you listen to urban radio?

[Au$tin]

Apr 2, 2013 10:58:16 GMT -5 RadioBeatz said:

Why radio has kind of a resistance against Carry On and My Songs Know...... oh well at least I Heard Carry On a lot on my HAC station.

Easy. "Carry On" has still not been released to pop radio. The same thing happened with "Some Night," which has still not been released to pop radio. When a song isn't given an adds date to the biggest format in the country, said format doesn't really want to grab ahold of the songs that quickly. That's why it took "Some Nights" forever to get to its peak. "Carry On" is following a similar pattern, though it is moving slower than "Some Nights" at this point, which makes sense since "Some Nights" is far superior.

"My Songs," on the other hand, is in a weird position. It's a bit too pop for alternative and just a bit too alternative for pop. They're both playing the song, but neither format is really "into" the song enough at the moment. I think it'll eventually blow up here in a bit, though. Its call out scores are starting to come in and they're looking pretty good. Sales are also steady.

[Deleted]

Yeah, "Swing My Way" is absolutely a classic and I will tolerate none of this 'forgettable' foolery being attached to it >:( "Lately" was also pretty inescapable (it showed up on both the 1998 and 1999 year-end charts), but I was kind of meh on that one.

Now if you were talking about "Deja Vu (Uptown Baby)" or "Romeo & Juliet," then I'd understand I remember both of those songs but they didn't seem like top 10 hits at the time; certainly neither of them were crossovers. I'm especially surprised "Let's Ride" managed to get to #2. For some reason my brain always tries to force Montell Jordan into one-hit wonder status even though I know he actually had three (by Hot 100/top ten standards).

Somewhere out there is a person who would look at that 1998 top 10 and wonder 'This list is flawless! Except...who the hell is Savage Garden?' Meanwhile I'm still salty that the song didn't get to be our prom theme b/c my classmates voted for "All the Times" by...hell, I don't even remember who all was on that stupid song I just remember that I loathed it, and one of my classmates was pissed b/c "All My Life" didn't even make the ballot for some strange reason.

[Au$tin]

Apr 2, 2013 18:30:21 GMT -5 Lozzy said:

Apr 2, 2013 18:26:36 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

Well, for starters. I've never heard of any of them until today.

Well, do you listen to urban radio?

We don't even HAVE an urban station in my area.

[jebsib]

That 1998 chart is such a good example of why BB had to overhaul the Hot 100 within 6 months.

[Deleted]

Well if you never get the chance to hear it how can you say with certainty that any of these songs are 'forgettable'? But then, I kind of come from the point of view that at the end of the day, probably 75-80% of all top 10s are 'forgettable' to some degree, even within the confines of their own genre, so I see no real point in calling out the urban songs for being so. That just happens to be the genre that was trendy at the time so it's easy to pick on most of those songs.

[allow that]

Apr 2, 2013 20:03:09 GMT -5 @cynthiarose said:

Yeah, "Swing My Way" is absolutely a classic and I will tolerate none of this 'forgettable' foolery being attached to it >:( "Lately" was also pretty inescapable (it showed up on both the 1998 and 1999 year-end charts).

WORDDDD.

"Swing My Way" = iconic. Thou shall not use lack of knowledge as "proof" of some Billboard flaw. It's a hit through and through. Also who remembers the remix from Can't Hardly Wait that essentially turned into a lost TLC track?

As for "Lately" I feel like I hear it still but in the most random places? (department stores, dentist office, etc). Go figure. Also remember the Samantha Mumba remake??

Now if you were talking about "Deja Vu (Uptown Baby)" or "Romeo & Juliet," then I'd understand I remember both of those songs but they didn't seem like top 10 hits at the time; certainly neither of them were crossovers.

I only heard "Romeo & Juliet"at the time due to a trip out to Arizona, but it sure as hell didn't get play in NYC. On the other hand I feel like "Deja Vu" probably went Top 10 on Hot 97 airplay alone.

I'm especially surprised "Let's Ride" managed to get to #2. For some reason my brain always tries to force Montell Jordan into one-hit wonder status even though I know he actually had three (by Hot 100/top ten standards).

CLASSIC! "Let's Ride," "I Like," and "Fallin'" are my three favorite Montell singles... sometimes I forget he's the force behind "This Is How We Do It" just 'cuz I played out his other shit so much. Montell definitely contributed a great deal to Urban radio in the 90's and I'm surprised his legacy doesn't pop out a bit more to this day. WHERE IS HE NOW?

[renfield75]

Apr 2, 2013 20:19:08 GMT -5 @cynthiarose said:

Well if you never get the chance to hear it how can you say with certainty that any of these songs are 'forgettable'? But then, I kind of come from the point of view that at the end of the day, probably 75-80% of all top 10s are 'forgettable' to some degree, even within the confines of their own genre, so I see no real point in calling out the urban songs for being so. That just happens to be the genre that was trendy at the time so it's easy to pick on most of those songs.

It's got nothing to do with "calling out urban songs." What's the airplay on the aforementioned songs since 1998? It has nothing to do with the genre or the quality of the song or how much any individual person likes the song. Next's "Too Close" was a massive hit that still receives significant airplay. "Romeo & Juliet" and "Swing My Way" aren't hugely played or, probably, remembered by most people today. Does anyone think Divine's song is, across the board, as well remembered as "Gettin' Jiggy With It," "My Heart Will Go On," or "All My Life"? Let's be realistic about Divine's legacy here, no matter how much you may like the song (and I never diminished the quality of any of the songs I mentioned). Had there been songs from other genres represented back then I might have mentioned them too, but urban dominated then and not all of those songs made a big transition to the 21st century airwaves. There are huge hits from the early 90s I love (when I was in high school), but I realize most people have forgotten them today. Lisa Fischer's 1991 hit "How Can I Ease The Pain" was a big R&B hit that still gets some quiet storm play but I would say most of America (represented by the Hot 100) is unfamiliar with that track in 2013. People get so defensive over their favorites in here sometimes...

And baby squirrel, I'm not arguing with you specifically, just a general rebuttal.

[renfield75]

Apr 2, 2013 18:24:59 GMT -5 elementd5 said:

Forgettable to who? Both of those (Shorty & Lately) are R&B classics.

Forgettable to the majority of America. You think those songs are R&B classics in the same sense as "Superstition," "Sexual Healing," "Bump 'N' Grind," or "End Of The Road"?

I'm not talking about R&B fans specifically, since this is the Hot 100 thread. People who weren't listening to R&B radio in 1998, or following the charts, are probably not going to know those songs. It's not because they're bad, they just haven't endured in the public consciousness for whatever reasons.

[Agent Yoncé]

As a R&B fan, I'm a bit shocked to see 'Lately' & 'Swing My Way' deemed as classics in that world. Notable hits from that year? Sure. Songs that get heavy recurrents spins? Not even close, especially for the latter one. Some true R&B classics from that year are 'Too Close', 'The Boy is Mine', 'Nobody's Suppose To Be Here', but not those songs.

[Deleted]

A lot of major hits are forgettable. Why are we once again taking this out on R&B music? If I looked at a random charts from decades of the past, I'd find plenty of hits that haven't endured.

[Rose "Payola" Nylund]

I don't think we should diminish those songs as R&B hits but comparing them to some other songs out that the time that didn't have the benefit of an available retail single, then it's fair to say that they weren't as big as the songs getting the multi-format airplay that wasn't reflected in the Hot 100 at that time. All we can say when looking back at this period is that the Hot 100 reflected what it measured at the time but that it's measurements didn't give a full representation of what was likely a more true picture. At least I think we should be able to say that without diminishing the songs that did end up having good showings on the Hot 100.

[KeepDeanWeird]

Apr 2, 2013 16:11:17 GMT -5 jebsib said:

In the old days there were no airplay only hits. A record company released a song to radio and retail simultaneously. Thus the Hot 100 didn't exclude huge airplay hits until the record companies started changing the rules.

The 'key" single that started the trend = MiMi's "I'll Be There." Columbia was desperate to boost sales of "MTV Unplugged" after realizing that ppl were opting for the single (since the other songs had been released previously). After a swift rise to #1, the track dropped after its second week at the top. While record companies may have quietly released limited copies of singles or not replenished supplies, this was the first one that was taken off the market at such an early (and high profile) chart run.

[Deleted]

Apr 2, 2013 21:01:21 GMT -5 renfield75 said:

Apr 2, 2013 20:19:08 GMT -5 @cynthiarose said:

Well if you never get the chance to hear it how can you say with certainty that any of these songs are 'forgettable'? But then, I kind of come from the point of view that at the end of the day, probably 75-80% of all top 10s are 'forgettable' to some degree, even within the confines of their own genre, so I see no real point in calling out the urban songs for being so. That just happens to be the genre that was trendy at the time so it's easy to pick on most of those songs.

It's got nothing to do with "calling out urban songs." What's the airplay on the aforementioned songs since 1998? It has nothing to do with the genre or the quality of the song or how much any individual person likes the song. Next's "Too Close" was a massive hit that still receives significant airplay. "Romeo & Juliet" and "Swing My Way" aren't hugely played or, probably, remembered by most people today. Does anyone think Divine's song is, across the board, as well remembered as "Gettin' Jiggy With It," "My Heart Will Go On," or "All My Life"? Let's be realistic about Divine's legacy here, no matter how much you may like the song (and I never diminished the quality of any of the songs I mentioned). Had there been songs from other genres represented back then I might have mentioned them too, but urban dominated then and not all of those songs made a big transition to the 21st century airwaves. There are huge hits from the early 90s I love (when I was in high school), but I realize most people have forgotten them today. Lisa Fischer's 1991 hit "How Can I Ease The Pain" was a big R&B hit that still gets some quiet storm play but I would say most of America (represented by the Hot 100) is unfamiliar with that track in 2013. People get so defensive over their favorites in here sometimes...

And baby squirrel, I'm not arguing with you specifically, just a general rebuttal.

You do realize that your examples are saying what I also stated, right? I'm not vouching for the timelessness or impact of most of these songs compared to obviously much huger hits. My love for that one KP & Envi song must have confused you, it's not that serious and I wasn't trying to make it out to be. And I didn't say "Lately" was a classic, though I can see why you think I implied it was. I simply said it was inescapable for a while so it's not completely forgettable as one would think at first. I think the issue with me is I tend to mix flippancy with serious tone, so everything comes off serious.

Since you brought it up though. As an urban fan on a board where most posters prefer pop, I DO feel like people pick on r&b (or urban overall) a lot here and then try to brush it off when it's pointed out. trumandare's most recent posts are not that much of an outlier. The number of times I've seen someone bitch about how utterly awful the early/mid 2000s were b/c urban was so dominant, or how all these urban songs in the 90s top ten was obvious proof that the Hot 100 was horribly flawed and needed fixing*, is very hard to ignore...that is, if you're an urban fan. There is not nearly as much complaining about when electro-pop took over and if you were anything outside of that it was like a miracle if you broke the top 20, presumably because more people find that tolerable.

10 or 15 years from now how many people are going to remember "Down," "Ridin' Solo," "Like a G6," "Cooler Than Me," or "Replay," for example? Or if they do how many will think they were classics? But no one really talks about that. People like to focus on how labels not releasing certain songs commercially is what allowed r&b to take over in the 90s while conveniently ignoring the fact that those songs taking over WERE selling, hence why they were able to peak so high in the first place...it's not like they weren't keeping up in comparison to other genre singles that were for sale. A lot of those mysterious top 10 songs would likely have still been top 20 hits even if the airplay-only singles had been available for individual sale and crowded them out. The huge airplay monsters continue to be remembered as the soundtrack of the time. So what was really lost?


*Mind you, I'm not saying the Hot 100 was accurate back then b/c lolololol, it wasn't. I will say though that a lot of the songs that people would deem 'forgettable' now were pretty solid hits, if not necessarily classics, in urban so it's not like the Hot 100 was being flooded with absolute flops and quick peakers. The Hot 100 is fun to follow for me still - especially this mid-90s part b/c there are soooooo many r&b jams that even back in the day I would have never guessed were Hot 100 top 10s too, b/c my pop/rock/country loving friends didn't know anything about them - but I reached the point a while ago where it's moderately pointless at any given moment unless I'm just trying to generate an era-specificl playlist and need help jogging my memory, b/c there was always some fatal flaw that kept it from being truly reflective of the times. The separate genre (now, airplay specifically) charts are better IMO if one wants some semblance of accuracy.

"How Can I Ease the Pain" is flawless btw, I will tolerate no dissent on the timelessness of that gem, either

[Lozzy]

Apr 2, 2013 23:28:52 GMT -5 @cynthiarose said:

10 or 15 years from now how many people are going to remember "Down", "Ridin' Solo", "Like a G6", "Cooler Than Me", or "Replay", for example?

Everyone on Pulse thanks to me.

[josh]

Like a G6 is unforgettable. So flawless.

[Deleted]

Cynthia.. :'(

[Deleted]

TRUTH has been served

[Az Paynter]

Apr 2, 2013 23:46:56 GMT -5 josh said:

Like a G6 is unforgettable. So flawless.

The first part, no contest. Arguments could be made on the second part though.

[HolidayGuy]

It wasn't a coincidence that the trend of limited singles started shortly after SoundScan, since that's when more precise sales data became available.

[Quixotic Music Lover]

Apr 2, 2013 23:23:21 GMT -5 KeepDeanWeird said:

Apr 2, 2013 16:11:17 GMT -5 jebsib said:

In the old days there were no airplay only hits. A record company released a song to radio and retail simultaneously. Thus the Hot 100 didn't exclude huge airplay hits until the record companies started changing the rules.

The 'key" single that started the trend = MiMi's "I'll Be There." Columbia was desperate to boost sales of "MTV Unplugged" after realizing that ppl were opting for the single (since the other songs had been released previously). After a swift rise to #1, the track dropped after its second week at the top. While record companies may have quietly released limited copies of singles or not replenished supplies, this was the first one that was taken off the market at such an early (and high profile) chart run.

If I recall Madonna was the first superstar who forgo HOT 100 success by not releasing a commercial single or delaying the release. "Into The Groove" was a major hit around the world in 1985 (I think) but was never released as a single. "Rescue Me" was released as a single but I believe it had already spent several weeks on the airplay chart, so its' HOT 100 run was short.

Then there is MC Hammer whose "U Can't Touch This" was only available as a 12-inch single. If it has been available as a cassette single, it would have undoubtedly hit #1.

[Deleted]

'Stairway to Heavan' - on many all time lists one of the biggest songs ever, was never released as a single - from a superstar group that preceded Madonna by a decade

[Lozzy]

Apr 3, 2013 8:18:24 GMT -5 Quixotic Music Lover said:

"Rescue Me" was released as a single but I believe it had already spent several weeks on the airplay chart, so its' HOT 100 run was short.

Yeah, it wasn't released until when it was already peaking in airplay. :(

Hot 100 Airplay & Hot 100 runs:
71-54-55-47-47-42-31-30-21-11-08-06-06-08-13-17-22-23-29-35-off
00-00-00-00-00-00-00-00-00-00-00-00-00-15-14-11-09-16-28-59-90-off

[Rose "Payola" Nylund]

b/c lolololol. It wasn't.

Cynthia slays again.

[Quixotic Music Lover]

Apr 3, 2013 8:23:59 GMT -5 @2m said:

'Stairway to Heavan' - on many all time lists one of the biggest songs ever, was never released as a single - from a superstar group that preceded Madonna by a decade

I was thinking of using "Stairway To Heaven" as an example, but I am not sure if it was ever played by Top 40 stations (the only stations Billboard surveyed for the HOT 100 until 1991). I know it was a huge hit on the FM Album rock stations that were so popular in the 1970s.

As for the domination of urban music in the late 90s and early 2000s, I look at it as payback for earlier times when urban music was persona non grata in the upper reaches of the HOT 100. Specifically between 1980 and 1982 when Adult Contemporary music (Air Supply, Ronnie Milsap, Eddie Rabbit, Dan Fogelberg, etc.) dominated (and nearly put me to sleep, I switched to the 60s oldies stations). Michael Jackson's "Thriller" album was the catalyst for change.