American Idol's Biggest Star

[dbhmr]

It's 2020. American Idol's questionable return to television begins its 3rd (4th? 2nd? idk) season this Sunday. All relevant stars from the show have passed their respective career peaks, fan bases have wised up and grown up and mostly come together to celebrate all alumni talents, so I think we can have a polite and fair discussion about how Kelly Clarkson is, indeed, the biggest star to come from the juggernaut of a show/empire.



y/y? Come with your facts, stats, opinions, etc.



[If I don't argue about something other than politics I may lose my mind so]

[Deleted]

I think that Kelly Clarkson is definitely the biggest name out of American Idol and 2nd biggest is probably Carrie Underwood. But who is probably the 3rd biggest? Daughtry?

[Future Captain]

Kelly is undoubtedly number one with Carrie not far behind. Third place is a toss up between Daughtry and J-Hud maybe?

[woods]

Kelly overall, but Carrie for the past few years.

[Leo ✔]

Kelly is the original and the most successful, no doubts about it. There's nothing to discuss. haha

[BB🌕]

Kelly Clarkson
Jennifer Hudson
Carrie Underwood
Daughtry
Adam Lambert

[toomuchboy]

1. Kelly Clarkson
2. Carrie Underwood
3. Jennifer Hudson

I'd say Carrie right now if Kelly hadn't just taken over TV with The Voice, her talk show, hosting several awards shows, etc. Her music career feels dead for the most part, but even Carrie Underwood's is beginning to slow down now, too. JHUD's on the beginning of another peak with the big number in Cats and now the Aretha film on the way.

[sirskimask]

Top 5:

1. Kelly Clarkson
2. Carrie Underwood
3. Chris Daughtry
4. Jennifer Hudson
5. Jordin Sparks

[Jack]

Yeah it's Kelly, even though I'm surprised whenever I see a documentary or YouTube video it repeats the 2011ish line about it being Carrie (which has always actually just translated to "sold more domestic album units in mainland America"). I guess that line does get trotted out by a very populist "the rest of the world doesn't exist" kind of mentality.

Good on Idol for producing a contestants that have least made it discussion in the past. Would be a lot harder to have the discussion about The Voice, lol.

Worldwide success, multiple Hot 100 numbers ones, radio play, twice the streaming numbers of her nearest competitor, ten million more albums sold than her nearest competitor, talk show, Voice Judge mainstay at $30million dollars a year...get it Kelly. Now give us that damn new single.

[nightvision]

Outside the US: Kelly

Inside the US: maybe Carrie, not sure

[Az Paynter]

Kelly, it's a no-brainer. She may not be maintaining the same degree of success strictly in her music/recording career (after 17 years, important thing to note) but her celebrity status at this point is bigger than it's ever been and her international success and reach puts her comfortably out of Carrie's reach.

Which is absolutely not to say Carrie hasn't utterly killed it in her own career because she has MORE than held her own. But she hasn't reached the same international heights as Kelly by a long shot (an occupational hazard of her genre not being a major international pull) and she doesn't have her hooks into all these different areas like Kelly does to expand her own empire beyond music. It's her prerogative if she ever wants to go down that route though.

[SPRΞΞ]

But what if Carrie were to do the SuperBowl?

[irice22]

I hate to break to everyone, but Carrie Underwood is the bigger star. She’s sold more albums and her tours make a ton more money than Kelly’s.

[Love Plastic Love]

I feel like its splitting hairs between Kelly and Carrie. Then, Jennifer Hudson. Then...Taylor? lmao

[Kurt]

Weird to see a single mention of Adam Lambert in this thread – I think he definitely makes the cut (I mean...under Taylor Hicks?! I think not. hahaha).

The thread asks for the "biggest star," which to me weakens any arguments for Carrie over Kelly due to sales and touring plurality alone, whereas I think Kelly's star power especially in the past couple years has only grown, so I'd go with:
1. Kelly Clarkson
2. Carrie Underwood
3. Jennifer Hudson
4. Adam Lambert
5. Chris Daughtry

That's no knock on anyone (except maybe for Taylor lol) – all have commanded extremely successful and admirable careers.

[Jack]

Feb 17, 2020 13:23:00 GMT -5 irice22 said:

I hate to break to everyone, but Carrie Underwood is the bigger star. She’s sold more albums and her tours make a ton more money than Kelly’s.

Why do you "hate to break it"?

Second question, how is 16.3 million albums sold a bigger amount than 25million?



2015 s65 amg specs

[irice22]

If I’m not mistaken, I believe that figure is comparing Kelly’s worldwide sales to Carrie Underwood domestic sales.

[Jack]

Feb 17, 2020 14:40:12 GMT -5 irice22 said:

If I’m not mistake, I believe that figure is comparing Kelly’s worldwide sales to Carrie Underwood domestic sales.

So? It's total album sales compared to total albums sales.

If you mean "Carrie has sold more album units in North America" say that, not "Carrie has sold more albums" because she hasn't.

Or do we have to imagine the rest of the planet doesn't exist in order to make the statement true?

[Fat Ass Kelly Price]

I’d argue that Fantasia deserves a mention. She’s not Idol’s biggest star, but she’s in the league of the Adam Lamberts imo.

[Jack]

Feb 17, 2020 15:07:53 GMT -5 Fat Ass Kelly Price said:

I’d argue that Fantasia deserves a mention. She’s not Idol’s biggest star, but she’s in the league of the Adam Lamberts imo.

Yeah I agree. Fantasia gets overlooked. She has been one of the most successful female R&B stars in the last fifteen years...but since R&B and R&B females have sort of been disrespected/out of mainstream favor in that time, she doesn't get mentioned in these kind of discussions too often which she should.

[SPRΞΞ]

Katherine McPhee is bigger than Adam Lambert. She’s had a pretty successful acting career.

[irice22]

Feb 17, 2020 14:51:05 GMT -5 Jack said:

Feb 17, 2020 14:40:12 GMT -5 irice22 said:

If I’m not mistake, I believe that figure is comparing Kelly’s worldwide sales to Carrie Underwood domestic sales.

So? It's total album sales compared to total albums sales.

If you mean "Carrie has sold more album units in North America" say that, not "Carrie has sold more albums" because she hasn't.

Or do we have to imagine the rest of the planet doesn't exist in order to make the statement true?

Huh? One’s domestic sales figures should never be compared to another artist’s world wide figures.

Based on my research, I think Underwood beats Kelly in both worldwide and domestic. Sales aside, I’d concede and say the difference is pretty negligible. Underwood’s tour gross is LIGHT YEARS ahead of Clarkson’s. And this is coming from someone who prefers Kelly.

[Jack]

Feb 17, 2020 20:01:19 GMT -5 irice22 said:

Feb 17, 2020 14:51:05 GMT -5 Jack said:

So? It's total album sales compared to total albums sales.

If you mean "Carrie has sold more album units in North America" say that, not "Carrie has sold more albums" because she hasn't.

Or do we have to imagine the rest of the planet doesn't exist in order to make the statement true?

Huh? One’s domestic sales figures should never be compared to another artist’s world wide figures.

Based on my research, I think Underwood beats Kelly in both worldwide and domestic. Sales aside, I’d concede and say the difference is pretty negligible. Underwood’s tour gross is LIGHT YEARS ahead of Clarkson’s. And this is coming from someone who prefers Kelly.

What a peculiar thing to say.

So, let me get this straight. When discussing album sales, one must never mention any records sold outside North America?

No. If you’re claiming a specific achievement, the burden on you is to specify it.

To say “Carrie has sold more albums” is patently false. To then say “you must never compare global sales with domestic sales” like it’s some sort rule for Gremlins rule, is strange. Carrie has sold about ten million less albums than Kelly.

Domestically, Carrie had sold, in the traditional sense, marginally more. Even then in terms of SPS/equivalent album units Kelly is close to 19 million in North America alone so I’m not even sure you can say Carrie has sold more in the USA, even, if we’re talking by 2020’s metrics.

There is no doubt Carrie is a bigger touring artist. Dominating as a genre artist has its pluses and minuses (Carrie pulling in half the streaming numbers Kelly has, via a genre that is a poor performer via that medium, has a plus in that you can cultivate a more loyal touring base). Even then, in 2019 Kelly’s brief tour was in venues of similar capacities with similar box scores per night as Carrie’s shows, so arguing today that there is a huge chasm between them as far as this is concerned doesn’t make sense.

In music there are more metrics than traditional album sales in one of hundreds of countries. There is radio play, streaming, Hot 100 number 1s, global success, single sales, global album sales, crossover success etc. All of which Kelly dominates her closet Idol rival by.

And then outside of music, you have Kelly as one of the highest paid reality tv stars on earth who just launched one of the biggest day time talk show successes in a decade off the back of her own name.

When the topic of “who has had more touring success from American Idol” is made you can convince those who think it’s Adam Lambert why they’re wrong, and when the topic of “who from Idol has sold more it’s in North America” is made you can argue why we should ignore steaming, but to “break it” to the majority of of people here who happen to think you’re incorrect is silly.

Someone coming in and saying well ‘my research’ says that Camile Velasco is the biggest star from Idol (because she sold more records in my house than anyone else and you can never compare records sold via my iTunes to the rest of the world) is cute and all, but that’s not the question that was asked.

[franklin]

I mean didn't Kelly's stylist just win stylist of the year? If that doesn't cement Clarkson's status of Queen of Idol the World.....

AND she's won the Voice like 3 times already. Like what other L E G E N D wins BOTH of TV's #1 singing competitions

We stan the GREATEST singer vocal chameleon contestant host judge L E G E N D of all time.

[Typo]

Cry Pretty outsold Meaning of Life in its debut week.
Cry Pretty Tour 360 tripled the gross of Kelly’s latest tour.
Cry Pretty produced a #1 hit at Carrie’s core format.

Who cares about The Voice? I’m sure it’s a nice check but it’s not like it’s advanced the careers of anyone but Blake and Adam. It certainly didn’t benefit the commercial prospects of the MOL era. I guess it’s still TBD if becoming the Rachel Ray of Pop will have any impact on her recording career. I doubt it.

I’m not buying that there’s some great disparity between Carrie and Kelly worldwide. It’s undeniable that Kelly had bigger hits back in the Breakaway days but she’s basically neglected that audience since then. Carrie has actually performed sold out shows overseas that are comparable to the shows Kelly performed during the AIEW tour. I feel like they have similar, relatively small but dedicated followings at this point.

Also it’s not fair to say that Carrie hasn’t branched out. She’s made a name for herself in the health and fitness world. As demonstrated by the success of CALIA and upcoming bestseller FIND YOUR PATH.

I get the sense that Kelly stans are inflating her star power because she’s on TV 24/7. Did anyone think Christina was a star because she sat in a seat?

Anyway, it’s still Carrie 🤷‍♂️

[irice22]

Feb 18, 2020 12:37:53 GMT -5 Jack said:

Feb 17, 2020 20:01:19 GMT -5 irice22 said:

Huh? One’s domestic sales figures should never be compared to another artist’s world wide figures.

Based on my research, I think Underwood beats Kelly in both worldwide and domestic. Sales aside, I’d concede and say the difference is pretty negligible. Underwood’s tour gross is LIGHT YEARS ahead of Clarkson’s. And this is coming from someone who prefers Kelly.

What a peculiar thing to Say.

I don’t understand why this is peculiar. That Kelly figure of 25 million appears to be Kelly’s Worldwide Sales, but the 16 million figure appears to be Underwood’s domestic sales. You can’t compare Kelly’s worldwide sales to Underwood’s domestic sales and say Kelly has sold more. That’s deceptive.

If you want to say I have my information wrong, fine that’s okay. But as far as comparisons go, domestic should be compared with domestic and worldwide should be compared with worldwide.

[SPRΞΞ]

Carrie is bigger to the GP.
Kelly is bigger to the gays.

Carrie is a viable choice for the Superbowl, Kelly is not.

[kimberly]

Feb 19, 2020 1:26:21 GMT -5 SPRΞΞ said:

Carrie is a viable choice for the Superbowl, Kelly is not.

I disagree. Kelly's setlist would bring back memories for so many people! "Since U Been Gone," "Behind These Hazel Eyes," "My Life Would Suck Without You," "Stronger," "Breakaway," "Miss Independent" all belong there, with a stellar "Because of You" vocal showcase to end it. Crowd goes wild, her sales increase 675%, her Greatest Hits album re-enters BB200. I see it.

Carrie would be a great choice too, but she would need more than "Before He Cheats" to vow everyone, coast to coast.

[Jack]

Feb 19, 2020 0:05:08 GMT -5 irice22 said:

Feb 18, 2020 12:37:53 GMT -5 Jack said:

What a peculiar thing to Say.

I don’t understand why this is peculiar. That Kelly figure of 25 million appears to be Kelly’s Worldwide Sales, but the 16 million figure appears to be Underwood’s domestic sales. You can’t compare Kelly’s worldwide sales to Underwood’s domestic sales and say Kelly has sold more. That’s deceptive.

If you want to say I have my information wrong, fine that’s okay. But as far as comparisons go, domestic should be compared with domestic and worldwide should be compared with worldwide.

Yes. So you say "Carrie has sold marginally more traditional album sales in North America". Not "Carrie has sold more albums". Carrie has not sold more albums, that statement is false. A fact that you can't seem to get into your head.

The question of who has sold more albums needs to be an answered with...who has sold more albums. To deduct every single sale outside of the United States is the only act of slight of hand going on here and it's a little trick that goes on too often.

As far as comparisons, sales should be compared with sales, and if you want to specify the whens and wheres that's up to do you to do, specifically. What you can't do is say "Carrie has sold more albums (if we ignore the rest of the planet without saying so, which we're going to do to make my statement true)" which you seem desperate to do over and again.

I feel like I'm really having to spell this out. But once again, if you'd said "Carrie Underwood has sold more albums in America" and I said "No, Kelly has sold about ten million more", then you'd be well within sense to complain that I was comparing total domestic with total WW, but you wouldn't make any sense until that point. FURTHERMORE, I am comparing apples to apples in that it's nobody's fault that Carrie's worldwide sales look about the same as her domestic sales, as the contribution from the rest of the world to her final tally is negligible. Besides, like I say, with SPS/Equivalent Album Sales, I daresay Kelly now has Carrie beat in North America alone too, but that's a harder thing to dissect.

I can say Kelly has sold more...because Kelly has sold more. Much, much more.

There's nothing deceptive about that. Deception is saying something declarative and general, wanting people to treat it as specific, and then spitting feathers when somebody addresses what you said and not what you meant.

[Jack]

Feb 18, 2020 18:17:00 GMT -5 Typo said:

Cry Pretty outsold Meaning of Life in its debut week.
Cry Pretty Tour 360 tripled the gross of Kelly’s latest tour.
Cry Pretty produced a #1 hit at Carrie’s core format.

Who cares about The Voice? I’m sure it’s a nice check but it’s not like it’s advanced the careers of anyone but Blake and Adam. It certainly didn’t benefit the commercial prospects of the MOL era. I guess it’s still TBD if becoming the Rachel Ray of Pop will have any impact on her recording career. I doubt it.

I’m not buying that there’s some great disparity between Carrie and Kelly worldwide. It’s undeniable that Kelly had bigger hits back in the Breakaway days but she’s basically neglected that audience since then. Carrie has actually performed sold out shows overseas that are comparable to the shows Kelly performed during the AIEW tour. I feel like they have similar, relatively small but dedicated followings at this point.

Also it’s not fair to say that Carrie hasn’t branched out. She’s made a name for herself in the health and fitness world. As demonstrated by the success of CALIA and upcoming bestseller FIND YOUR PATH.

I get the sense that Kelly stans are inflating her star power because she’s on TV 24/7. Did anyone think Christina was a star because she sat in a seat?

Anyway, it’s still Carrie 🤷‍♂️

I'll go with the post you wrote and deleted rather than the one above.

Feb 18, 2020 13:57:01 GMT -5 Typo said:

Cry Pretty outsold Meaning of Life in its debut week.

And she'll need to sell another ten million albums more than that to catch up in total. Let's all wish her luck, since, like Kelly her day as superstar of her format is done.

Feb 18, 2020 13:57:01 GMT -5 Typo said:

Cry Pretty Tour 360 grossed about 60 million. That’s roughly 3x the gross of Kelly’s latest and biggest tour.

Well it was twice as long, wasn't it, so it would stand to reason it would gross more.

60 dates grossed 3x what 28 dates did? Huge surprise, and huge win. You're right though, it was Kelly's shortest and most successful tour. Which I suppose is a bad thing when talking about her success in the current climate. Correct though, Carrie has toured much more and is a bigger touring artist.

Feb 18, 2020 13:57:01 GMT -5 Typo said:

Carrie still received more AirPlay at her core format than Kelly.

But not more airplay overall. So yes if we ignore spins in totality, like we're like to ignore the rest of the globe, I guess it's a win.

Feb 18, 2020 13:57:01 GMT -5 Typo said:

Also I’m not buying this Carrie is internationally unknown argument.

Nobody had said she is unknown.

Carrie has, like with any other success outside her core format in North America, has had no exceptional successes.

Feb 18, 2020 13:57:01 GMT -5 Typo said:

There’s no denying Kelly had bigger worldwide hits but Carrie is playing for similar crowds in the UK/Australia as Kelly. I’d say at this point their international relevance is roughly the same (not that significant) and they have similar sized followings outside of the US.

Correct, bigger worldwide hits (i.e. more than zero), a time as one of the biggest selling acts on the planet, and some of the biggest radio hits in the west of the last couple of decades.

Kelly hasn't toured globally since 2013, I'm not sure what you're comparing her international touring relevance to. Unless, again, you want to do total concert tickets globally/in totality? Or would it just suit you to compare Kelly's concert grosses (0 dollars from 0 tours) since Carrie started coming abroad with any regularity? 

A star's legacy and stats are important to a discussion like this one, so cherry picking when we talk about and where we exclude is tiring.

Carrie also has made a name for herself in the fitness/health world with CALIA and the upcoming bestseller FIND YOUR PATH.

Who cares about The Voice?

Who cares about it? The people who make it one of the highest rated television shows in America, and the television executives that make her one of the highest paid reality stars on earth (yes star, as in who is the bigger star). I know The Voice doesn't have the brand recognition/pop culture impact that...Calia does but I'd still contend it was relevant to the topic's question.

Feb 18, 2020 13:57:01 GMT -5 Typo said:

It’s only advanced the careers of Blake and Adam. It certainly didn’t benefit the Meaning of Life eras chart prospects.

Didn't you just say she'd had her biggest tour ever? I mean she's certainly had one of her biggest ever hits, which will get bigger next year, and the year after that. I suppose being one of the highest paid stars on American television on one of its biggest tv shows might have had more to do with the former than the latter. Like you say, Blake's career was helped by it, I'm hopeful Carrie can find a similar vehicle (one that doesn't rely on personality...like if Kelly were to try a fitness book, I'm not sure it would be one another's strong suit) to help reignite the hit making.

I guess it’s still TBD if becoming the Rachel Ray of Pop has any real impact on Kelly’s commercial success.

Just remember, when inevitable claims about the tone of the thread diving arises, you were the first one to be rude about the other, in order to what, hawk Carrie's new recipe book?

Feb 18, 2020 13:57:01 GMT -5 Typo said:

Anyway, I just don’t think because Kelly is regularly on TV that somehow equates to more star power. It’s still Carrie. 🤷‍♂️

Yes Kelly being one of the country's biggest a reality/television stars and now one of the country's biggest broadcasting stars has little to do with the question of how big a star she is.