eidde
Gold Member
Joined: August 2018
Posts: 988
|
Post by eidde on Jul 18, 2021 13:06:48 GMT -5
You guys don't get it, songs that rely entirely on website sales such as Mood and MEBF would go recurrent if UGC was still part of the formula. Don't forget that Blinding Lights would barely be affected if UGC were still kept. Keep in mind that songs like One Too Many that do poorly on every metric would instantly be gone with UGC. Let that sink in for a moment.
|
|
jayhawk1117
2x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2013
Posts: 2,758 
|
Post by jayhawk1117 on Jul 18, 2021 13:12:20 GMT -5
BTS Stan clicks can only sustain chart interest by non BTS Stans for so long. When they start to pass actual legendary artists ala Michael, Madonna, Katy, etc, is when well start to see real backlash.
|
|
85la
3x Platinum Member
Joined: July 2007
Posts: 3,919
|
Post by 85la on Jul 18, 2021 14:26:55 GMT -5
The song probably wasn't submitted for certification after its initial chart run. There are a ton of classic songs from back in the day that only have a Gold record. So it's probably sold a ton worldwide (including the US) in the past 40 years, but certification wasn't a huge priority. That makes sense, but itβs still surprising to me it might be #3 all-time. If I could add one more thing to this, I would take that webpage with (more than a few grains) of salt, as numerous sales figures listed have disputed citations (including for In the Summertime), and I also noticed that in the best-selling digital singles section, several songs that should be there are missing, including the Black-Eyed Peas, Imagine Dragon's Radioactive, etc.. |
|
Gary
Diamond Member
Joined: January 2014
Posts: 45,896
|
Post by Gary on Jul 18, 2021 14:42:49 GMT -5
Wikipedia used as a basis for anything should not be considered 100% reliable - especially for any music topics
|
|
Groovy
6x Platinum Member
Joined: October 2017
Posts: 6,719
|
Post by Groovy on Jul 18, 2021 14:57:25 GMT -5
Wasn't The Scotts #1 on streaming and sales for its week at #1? It still would have not gone to #1 without the website sales. Based on Simm's prediction (which did not take into consideration website sales), Blinding Lights would have been #1 over The Scotts by a healthy margin:Β Iβm still mad that Blinding Lights lost all these weeks at 1 to these garbage number one debuts and remixes. |
|
Au$tin
Diamond Member
Pop Culture Guru
Grrrrrrrrrr. Fuckity fuck why don't you watch my film before you judge it? FURY.
Joined: August 2008
Posts: 54,625
My Charts
Pronouns: He/his/him
|
Post by Au$tin on Jul 18, 2021 15:13:51 GMT -5
You guys don't get it, songs that rely entirely on website sales such as Mood and MEBF would go recurrent if UGC was still part of the formula. Does no one seriously remember the problems UGC gave us in the first place? Swapping one issue for another is not a solution. |
|
tanooki
Diamond Member
2019 Breakthrough
lucia gta 6
Joined: August 2017
Posts: 10,118
Pronouns: they/she/fae
|
Post by tanooki on Jul 18, 2021 15:24:34 GMT -5
UGC is a way better medium for tracking music consumption than sales and radio lol
|
|
Gary
Diamond Member
Joined: January 2014
Posts: 45,896
|
Post by Gary on Jul 18, 2021 15:48:10 GMT -5
The new BTS song will be the 8th number one debut this year
Last year at this time, 6 of the record 12 had happened
|
|
|
|
Post by phieaglesfan712 on Jul 18, 2021 16:56:39 GMT -5
UGC is a way better medium for tracking music consumption than sales and radio lol As early as February 2020, fhas (who is not a fan of the removal of UGC) warned us that the removal of UGC could make it easier for sales driven songs to debut at #1. fhas posted Feb 15, 2020 at 9:10am |
|
atg
3x Platinum Member
Joined: April 2016
Posts: 3,004
|
Post by atg on Jul 18, 2021 17:21:26 GMT -5
I always keep pointing to the fact that the removal of UGC almost coincided with this So this is the hill you're gonna die on once BL is removed from the chart... I think he might be on to something this whole time. I listened to BL for the first time in days and the spark felt almost brand new again. Maybe thatβs why itβs sticking around. But maybe iβm not getting something because he probably listens to it 24/7 and doesnβt get tired of talking about it π. |
|
jred
Platinum Member
Joined: November 2014
Posts: 1,337
|
Post by jred on Jul 18, 2021 17:26:10 GMT -5
So this is the hill you're gonna die on once BL is removed from the chart... I think he might be on to something this whole time. I listened to BL for the first time in days and the spark felt almost brand new again. Maybe thatβs why itβs sticking around. But maybe iβm not getting something because he probably listens to it 24/7 and doesnβt get tired of talking about it π. Yeah, all this discourse aside, itβs kind of haunting how Blinding Lights hasnβt burnt out on me yet despite the overplay. Usually smash hits like BL get really tiring after like four months of overexposure, so idk what the fuck Abel did but itβs not burning out |
|
|
|
Post by phieaglesfan712 on Jul 18, 2021 17:35:09 GMT -5
I think he might be on to something this whole time. I listened to BL for the first time in days and the spark felt almost brand new again. Maybe thatβs why itβs sticking around. But maybe iβm not getting something because he probably listens to it 24/7 and doesnβt get tired of talking about it π. Yeah, all this discourse aside, itβs kind of haunting how Blinding Lights hasnβt burnt out on me yet despite the overplay. Usually smash hits like BL get really tiring after like four months of overexposure, so idk what the f**k Abel did but itβs not burning out Almost 7 years has passed by, and Uptown Funk has yet to burn out on me. I get the feeling the same will happen with Blinding Lights. |
|
|
|
Post by Limited Edition on Jul 18, 2021 17:54:07 GMT -5
I don't know how anyone can be against UGC. There's no reason why watching a user-generated lyric video on Youtube shouldn't count as a stream. It's no different than watching the official music video. For example the user-generated lyric video of Perfect has 880 MILLION views. I always choose that version when I listen to Perfect on YT
|
|
garrettlen
Gold Member
Joined: April 2017
Posts: 882
|
Post by garrettlen on Jul 18, 2021 17:56:22 GMT -5
The new BTS song will be the 8th number one debut this year Last year at this time, 6 of the record 12 had happened IMO #1 debuts donβt even feel that special anymore, as common as theyβve become these days. |
|
jred
Platinum Member
Joined: November 2014
Posts: 1,337
|
Post by jred on Jul 18, 2021 17:58:49 GMT -5
The new BTS song will be the 8th number one debut this year Last year at this time, 6 of the record 12 had happened IMO #1 debuts donβt even feel that special anymore, as common as theyβve become these days. Itβs gotten to the point that Ive seen people try to claim βBad Habitsβ has been a disappointment so far because it didnβt debut at #1. |
|
kimberly
Diamond Member
act i RENAISSANCE
Joined: May 2018
Posts: 11,930
My Charts
Pronouns: they/them
|
Post by kimberly on Jul 18, 2021 18:03:18 GMT -5
I think the problem with UGC was that its scope needed to be narrowed. Fan-made lyric videos that include the entire song, where the song itself is the driving force for the views, should be counted. I doubt many people would disagree with that. But things get blurry when we look into "TikTok compilations" (where a 15 second section of the song is played on repeat) or that one "strangers' first kiss" video that made "We Might Be Dead By Tomorrow" debut at No. 9 and drop off the chart next week because no one actually cared about the song.
|
|
Gary
Diamond Member
Joined: January 2014
Posts: 45,896
|
Post by Gary on Jul 18, 2021 18:04:57 GMT -5
The new BTS song will be the 8th number one debut this year Last year at this time, 6 of the record 12 had happened IMO #1 debuts donβt even feel that special anymore, as common as theyβve become these days. Yep Heading the way of the albumβ¦looks like For the albumβ¦a number one that did not debut there is now rare. Only a matter of time for singles at this rate |
|
rimetm
2x Platinum Member
Just a Good Ol' Chart Shmuck
|
Post by rimetm on Jul 18, 2021 18:22:05 GMT -5
The dirty secret with UGC is that the types that most people consider valid, aka Song UGC, has only a modest impact. The majority of them were Non-Song UGC, the aforementioned βsnippets in unrelated videosβ type, and Iβm quite happy theyβre gone. Losing Song UGC with the arrival of the Global 200 felt like overkill, but the actual effect on the charts has been minimal.
|
|
|
|
Post by nathanalbright on Jul 18, 2021 18:28:00 GMT -5
I'm a huge Air Supply fan, and I get to see them in concert this weekend. Fitting it would be on the 40th anniversary of their only #1 hit, although they deserved quite a few more. I have always felt Lost In Love was their biggest hit. Yes I really like Air Supply as well, They have many timeless songs my favorite song from them would have to be "All Out of Love". All Out Of Love is my favorite from them as well. |
|
leoapp
4x Platinum Member
Joined: March 2008
Posts: 4,991
|
Post by leoapp on Jul 18, 2021 18:37:20 GMT -5
Someday in late 2020s, it'd be so weird, seeing this chart trivia...
Most Hot 100 #1s:
The Beatles: 20
Mariah Carey: 19
Elvis Presley: 17
Rihanna: 16 (assuming she didnt retire)
BTS: 15
Michael Jackson: 13
......
|
|
Groovy
6x Platinum Member
Joined: October 2017
Posts: 6,719
|
Post by Groovy on Jul 18, 2021 19:38:34 GMT -5
UGC streaming being banned really set off this butterfly effect of the number 1 debuts in 2020, I wonder what would the Hot 100 would look like without it.
|
|
gikem
3x Platinum Member
Joined: October 2020
Posts: 3,813
|
Post by gikem on Jul 18, 2021 20:07:25 GMT -5
UGC streaming being banned really set off this butterfly effect of the number 1 debuts in 2020, I wonder what would the Hot 100 would look like without it. I think even if it hadn't been removed, we would've seen a lot of those flash-in-the-pan #1 debuts and surges anyway because of the decline in song sales numbers and radio audience impressions. For pretty much the entire 2010s streaming era, sales and radio were able to act as a buffer keeping the biggest songs in the country stable at the top of the charts without succumbing to major releases that could debut high. Now that those numbers have dwindled, streaming mostly controls the tides of what has staying power, which decentralizes listening tastes and weakens the power of the biggest songs in the country, resulting in more opportunities for certain songs to claim the #1, sometimes in their own nefarious ways. |
|
|
|
Post by bbdenney94 on Jul 18, 2021 20:17:04 GMT -5
or that one "strangers' first kiss" video that made "We Might Be Dead By Tomorrow" debut at No. 9 and drop off the chart next week because no one actually cared about the song. Hey, I care about that song!!! (where my fellow Soko Stans at!!) |
|
fridayteenage
5x Platinum Member
Shake it Off
Joined: April 2008
Posts: 5,493
|
Post by fridayteenage on Jul 18, 2021 20:40:05 GMT -5
if permission is this year's life goes on (which remains to be seen), what artist would be hungry enough for a #1 to try for a savage love?
the writer of permission, perhaps?
|
|
Choco
Diamond Member
james dean daydream
Joined: February 2009
Posts: 27,985
My Charts
Pronouns: he/him
|
Post by Choco on Jul 18, 2021 20:58:33 GMT -5
I have a feeling that if there's some sort of undeniable #1 hit on Ed Sheeran's project, it's gonna come soon. The current single is doing really well but I don't think it's gonna approach #1.
|
|
Abbaschand
Platinum Member
Joined: July 2016
Posts: 1,638
|
Post by Abbaschand on Jul 19, 2021 0:12:58 GMT -5
if permission is this year's life goes on (which remains to be seen), what artist would be hungry enough for a #1 to try for a savage love? the writer of permission, perhaps? *doing my best phieaglesfan712 impression* Blinding Lights! |
|
Au$tin
Diamond Member
Pop Culture Guru
Grrrrrrrrrr. Fuckity fuck why don't you watch my film before you judge it? FURY.
Joined: August 2008
Posts: 54,625
My Charts
Pronouns: He/his/him
|
Post by Au$tin on Jul 19, 2021 0:29:35 GMT -5
The dirty secret with UGC is that the types that most people consider valid, aka Song UGC, has only a modest impact. The majority of them were Non-Song UGC, the aforementioned βsnippets in unrelated videosβ type, and Iβm quite happy theyβre gone. Losing Song UGC with the arrival of the Global 200 felt like overkill, but the actual effect on the charts has been minimal. This. This is the problem everyone has amnesia about. Harlem Shake, anyone? Baby Shark? Old Town Road's insane domination? The one song I don't even remember the name of that debuted at #9 and fell off the week after all because it was background noise in a viral romance video? It isn't the beautifully perfect measurement y'all are claiming it to be. I do agree it should count, but it would need to be strictly regulated, and they aren't even regulating literal cheating with website sales right now, so I highly doubt any regulations for UGC counting would be applicated. |
|
fridayteenage
5x Platinum Member
Shake it Off
Joined: April 2008
Posts: 5,493
|
Post by fridayteenage on Jul 19, 2021 0:49:44 GMT -5
i mean, old town road was #1 16 weeks in (legitimate) sales and dominated on spotify too (though the #s are a bit harder to parse due to two separate versions doing well), so it wasn't that insane.
|
|
dremolus - solarpunk
Diamond Member
ππ§π€π’ πππ‘ππ¨π©ππ£π π©π€ π©ππ ππ, ππ©π€π₯ π©ππ π.π. πππ§ ππππππ£π
Joined: August 2019
Posts: 13,326
My Reviews
Pronouns: (he/him/they)
|
Post by dremolus - solarpunk on Jul 19, 2021 0:52:06 GMT -5
The dirty secret with UGC is that the types that most people consider valid, aka Song UGC, has only a modest impact. The majority of them were Non-Song UGC, the aforementioned βsnippets in unrelated videosβ type, and Iβm quite happy theyβre gone. Losing Song UGC with the arrival of the Global 200 felt like overkill, but the actual effect on the charts has been minimal. This. This is the problem everyone has amnesia about. Harlem Shake, anyone? Baby Shark? Old Town Road's insane domination? The one song I don't even remember the name of that debuted at #9 and fell off the week after all because it was background noise in a viral romance video? It isn't the beautifully perfect measurement y'all are claiming it to be. I do agree it should count, but it would need to be strictly regulated, and they aren't even regulating literal cheating with website sales right now, so I highly doubt any regulations for UGC counting would be applicated. OTR's domination was actually one of the best chart watching moments in recent history. It going uninterrupted and blocking every A-lister at the time was amazing and it did so mostly organically And yeah, there obviously should be limits on UGC, Billboard shouldn't accept all. We dont want a repeat of The Fox, Harlem Shake, or the endless viral dance hits to clog up the charts. |
|
jthentic
Gold Member
MIA
Joined: October 2020
Posts: 738
|
Post by jthentic on Jul 19, 2021 1:26:40 GMT -5
You guys don't get it, songs that rely entirely on website sales such as Mood and MEBF would go recurrent if UGC was still part of the formula. "MEBF relies entirely on website sales". You're joking right? RIGHT π? |
|
