Billboard Hot 100: 12/18/2021

[jenglisbe]

Dec 14, 2021 9:11:05 GMT -5 Verisimilitude said:

Dec 14, 2021 9:02:49 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

Where is Taylor's song ranked on Amazon's chart?

At the moment, #22. Further proving that Amazon Music is by far the biggest streaming service for Christmas songs in the US and Kworb should add the charts to his website.

Another indication of how much a difference it makes is "Underneath the Tree" and "Santa Tell Me." "STM" is ahead on both Spotify and YouTube, but "UTT" is ahead on Amazon and on the overall Holiday Streaming chart. I know there are other platforms, but this is another example of how Amazon is important for holiday music.

[sheardbeard]

Way to go, Elton John! After not appearing on the Hot 100 since 2000, he’s gotten three entries in 2021:

“Cold Heart (PNAU Remix)” - Elton John & Dua Lipa
“ONE OF ME” - Lil Nas X (feat. Elton John)
“Merry Christmas” - Ed Sheeran & Elton John

[Deleted]

Holiday Songs Breakdown - 12/18/21

3 2 Mariah Carey - All I Want For Christmas Is You (+1)
4 3 Brenda Lee - Rockin’ Around The Christmas Tree (+1)
7 5 Burl Ives - A Holly Jolly Christmas
5 6 Bobby Helms - Jingle Bell Rock (-1)
11 10 Andy Williams - It’s The Most Wonderful Time Of The Year (+1)
15 13 Wham! - Last Christmas (+2)
16 14 Jose Feliciano - Feliz Navidad(+2)
19 17 The Ronettes - Sleigh Ride (+2)
22 18 Dean Martin - Let It Snow, Let It Snow, Let It Snow (+4)
18 20 Nat King Cole - The Christmas Song (Merry Christmas To You) (-2)
RE 21 Perry Como And The Fontane Sisters With Mitchell Ayres And His Orchestra - It’s Beginning To Look A Lot Like Christmas
27 24 Kelly Clarkson - Underneath The Tree (+3)
17 25 Darlene Love - Christmas (Baby Please Come Home) (-8)
30 26 Andy Williams - Happy Holiday/The Holiday Season (+4)
35 27 Gene Autry - Rudolph The Rednose Reindeer (+8)
25 28 Bing Crosby - White Christmas (-3)
36 30 Ariana Grande - Santa Tell Me (+6)
20 32 Michael Buble - It’s Beginning To Look A Lot Like Christmas (-12)
40 34 Chuck Berry - Run Run Rudolph (+6)
46 37 Perry Como - (There’s No Place Like) Home For The Holidays (+9)
NEW 72 Ed Sheeran & Elton John - Merry Christmas
82 74 Taylor Swift - Christmas Tree Farm (Old Timey Version) (+8)
77 79 Dan & Shay - Pick Out A Christmas Tree (-2)
NEW 97 Camila Cabello - I’ll Be Home For Christmas

Total Songs: 24
+ 1 re-entries
+ 2 new entries

# of songs in:
Top 10: 5/10
Top 20: 10/20
Top 40: 20/40



Songs that went recurrent:
Normani ft. Cardi B - Wild Side (from #63, 20 week rule below top 50)

[jenglisbe]

Dec 14, 2021 15:06:09 GMT -5 awesomecharts said:

Holiday Songs Breakdown - 12/18/21

3 2 Mariah Carey - All I Want For Christmas Is You (+1)
4 3 Brenda Lee - Rockin’ Around The Christmas Tree (+1)
7 5 Burt Ives - A Holly Jolly Christmas
5 6 Bobby Helms - Jingle Bell Rock (-1)
11 10 Andy Williams - It’s The Most Wonderful Time Of The Year (+1)
15 13 Wham! - Last Christmas (+2)
16 14 Jose Feliciano - Feliz Navidad(+2)
19 17 The Ronettes - Sleigh Ride (+2)
22 18 Dean Martin - Let It Snow, Let It Snow, Let It Snow (+4)
18 20 Nat King Cole - The Christmas Song (Merry Christmas To You) (-2)
RE 21 Perry Como And The Fontane Sisters With Mitchell Ayres And His Orchestra - It’s Beginning To Look A Lot Like Christmas
27 24 Kelly Clarkson - Underneath The Tree (+3)
17 25 Darlene Love - Christmas (Baby Please Come Home) (-8)
30 26 Andy Williams - Happy Holiday/The Holiday Season (+4)
35 27 Gene Autry - Rudolph The Rednose Reindeer (+8)
25 28 Bing Crosby - White Christmas (-3)
36 30 Ariana Grande - Santa Tell Me (+6)
20 32 Michael Buble - It’s Beginning To Look A Lot Like Christmas (-12)
40 34 Chuck Berry - Run Run Rudolph (+6)
46 37 Perry Como - (There’s No Place Like) Home For The Holidays (+9)
NEW 72 Ed Sheeran & Elton John - Merry Christmas
82 74 Taylor Swift - Christmas Tree Farm (Old Timey Version) (+8)
77 79 Dan & Shay - Pick Out A Christmas Tree (-2)
NEW 97 Camila Cabello - I’ll Be Home For Christmas

Total Songs: 24
+ 1 re-entries
+ 2 new entries

# of songs in:
Top 10: 5/10
Top 20: 10/20
Top 40: 20/40

Thank you. I will also note there are 22 songs between "(There's No Place Like) Home for the Holidays" and "Merry Christmas" so the Hot 100 would have a lot more holiday songs if not for recurrent rules.

[sheardbeard]

^^^^ this is why recurrent rules are silly to me. Why let just “some” of the older holiday classics chart on the Hot 100 but not the others? If the Hot 100 is supposed to be an accurate representation of what’s popular in a given week, then they all should be on there. Also it’s not “Burt” Ives, it’s Burl.

[Angel]

Dec 14, 2021 13:31:02 GMT -5 phieaglesfan712 said:

Dec 14, 2021 10:01:16 GMT -5 Baby Yoda Hot100Fan said:

You mean River. That was only two years ago.

I could have sworn that was 4 years ago, and it was battling Perfect for #1. Then again, Perfect was on the charts for a long time, and I wouldn’t be surprised if it was still near the top of the UK charts a full 2 years later.

This was the top ten that week

[Envoirment]

Dec 14, 2021 16:35:58 GMT -5 Angel said:

Dec 14, 2021 13:31:02 GMT -5 phieaglesfan712 said:

I could have sworn that was 4 years ago, and it was battling Perfect for #1. Then again, Perfect was on the charts for a long time, and I wouldn’t be surprised if it was still near the top of the UK charts a full 2 years later.

This was the top ten that week

Just for some clarity regarding the UK situation with "River". "River" was basically the first Amazon exclusive Christmas song to get pushed very hard via Alexa in the UK. To the point where it would get played 2-3 times every 10 Christmas songs (example: Alex play Christmas music - "River"/song/song/"River"/song/song/song/"River"/song/song). Jonh Legend's "Happy Christmas (War Is Over)" also did well and charted at #9.

Since then, there have been more and more exclusives every year, so the push gets spread between multiple songs as opposed to just one. Which is why we're unlikely to see another "River" situation in the UK. But in saying that Christmas music still does very well on Amazon. Last year Jess Gylnne's "This Christmas" went to #3 and Justin Beiber's "Rockin' Around The Christmas Tree" went to #4. Carrie Underwood's "Favourite Time of The Year" went to #75 as well.

[Rose "Payola" Nylund]

Dec 14, 2021 17:26:40 GMT -5 Envoirment said:

Just for some clarity regarding the UK situation with "River". "River" was basically the first Amazon exclusive Christmas song to get pushed very hard via Alexa in the UK. To the point where it would get played 2-3 times every 10 Christmas songs (example: Alex play Christmas music - "River"/song/song/"River"/song/song/song/"River"/song/song).

That would get annoying real fast. No wonder I never listen to general streaming and only listen to my own playlists.

[85la]

Dec 14, 2021 15:41:38 GMT -5 sheardbeard said:

^^^^ this is why recurrent rules are silly to me. Why let just “some” of the older holiday classics chart on the Hot 100 but not the others? If the Hot 100 is supposed to be an accurate representation of what’s popular in a given week, then they all should be on there. Also it’s not “Burt” Ives, it’s Burl.

So by this logic, you would also want to get rid of all recurrent rules on the Hot 100 in general? If not, why grant exceptions for holiday songs?

[sheardbeard]

Dec 14, 2021 19:23:47 GMT -5 85la said:

Dec 14, 2021 15:41:38 GMT -5 sheardbeard said:

^^^^ this is why recurrent rules are silly to me. Why let just “some” of the older holiday classics chart on the Hot 100 but not the others? If the Hot 100 is supposed to be an accurate representation of what’s popular in a given week, then they all should be on there. Also it’s not “Burt” Ives, it’s Burl.

So by this logic, you would also want to get rid of all recurrent rules on the Hot in general? If not, why grant exceptions for holiday songs?

Yes, I would like to get rid of all recurrent rules on the Hot 100 in general. It just so happens that this week there are a bunch of holiday songs that should be on the chart. I’ve said before that songs should be allowed on the Hot 100 regardless of their age and shouldn’t be forced off the chart if they fall below a certain position.

[jenglisbe]

Dec 14, 2021 17:26:40 GMT -5 Envoirment said:

Dec 14, 2021 16:35:58 GMT -5 Angel said:

This was the top ten that week

Just for some clarity regarding the UK situation with "River". "River" was basically the first Amazon exclusive Christmas song to get pushed very hard via Alexa in the UK. To the point where it would get played 2-3 times every 10 Christmas songs (example: Alex play Christmas music - "River"/song/song/"River"/song/song/song/"River"/song/song). Jonh Legend's "Happy Christmas (War Is Over)" also did well and charted at #9.

Since then, there have been more and more exclusives every year, so the push gets spread between multiple songs as opposed to just one. Which is why we're unlikely to see another "River" situation in the UK. But in saying that Christmas music still does very well on Amazon. Last year Jess Gylnne's "This Christmas" went to #3 and Justin Beiber's "Rockin' Around The Christmas Tree" went to #4. Carrie Underwood's "Favourite Time of The Year" went to #75 as well.

It should also be noted songs 3-5 on that chart were affected by that UK rule where points are cut in half or whatever. "River" never would have been #1 otherwise.

[Au$tin]

Dec 14, 2021 19:39:07 GMT -5 sheardbeard said:

Dec 14, 2021 19:23:47 GMT -5 85la said:

So by this logic, you would also want to get rid of all recurrent rules on the Hot in general? If not, why grant exceptions for holiday songs?

Yes, I would like to get rid of all recurrent rules on the Hot 100 in general. It just so happens that this week there are a bunch of holiday songs that should be on the chart. I’ve said before that songs should be allowed on the Hot 100 regardless of their age and shouldn’t be forced off the chart if they fall below a certain position.

I've always wanted a recurrentless chart as well. Not as a replacement of the main chart, though. I understand the need for recurrent rules for the main chart, but it would be amazing to see a chart that combines the current and recurrent chart together.

[sheardbeard]

Dec 14, 2021 19:53:49 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

Dec 14, 2021 19:39:07 GMT -5 sheardbeard said:

Yes, I would like to get rid of all recurrent rules on the Hot 100 in general. It just so happens that this week there are a bunch of holiday songs that should be on the chart. I’ve said before that songs should be allowed on the Hot 100 regardless of their age and shouldn’t be forced off the chart if they fall below a certain position.

I've always wanted a recurrentless chart as well. Not as a replacement of the main chart, though. I understand the need for recurrent rules for the main chart, but it would be amazing to see a chart that combines the current and recurrent chart together.

But why not let the main chart (Hot 100) be the one that combines current and recurrent together? Wouldn’t a recurrent-rule-free chart make it the be-all-end-all, accurate-as-possible, all-encompassing representation of weekly song popularity rankings? That’s the definition of a “main” chart, in my eyes.

[JukeboxJacob]

Dec 14, 2021 12:34:58 GMT -5 nathanalbright said:

I worry that these may be the only top tens that Cold Heart makes, but I hope I'm just being too pessimistic.

Don't worry, I have a feeling it'll end up in the top 10 for a long, long time

[Au$tin]

Dec 14, 2021 20:07:36 GMT -5 sheardbeard said:

Dec 14, 2021 19:53:49 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

I've always wanted a recurrentless chart as well. Not as a replacement of the main chart, though. I understand the need for recurrent rules for the main chart, but it would be amazing to see a chart that combines the current and recurrent chart together.

But why not let the main chart (Hot 100) be the one that combines current and recurrent together? Wouldn’t a recurrent-rule-free chart make it the be-all-end-all, accurate-as-possible, all-encompassing representation of weekly song popularity rankings? That’s the definition of a “main” chart, in my eyes.

The main chart isn't for chart watchers, it's for labels to track how the songs they are currently promoting and actively spending money on are doing.

[sheardbeard]

Dec 14, 2021 22:40:03 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

Dec 14, 2021 20:07:36 GMT -5 sheardbeard said:

But why not let the main chart (Hot 100) be the one that combines current and recurrent together? Wouldn’t a recurrent-rule-free chart make it the be-all-end-all, accurate-as-possible, all-encompassing representation of weekly song popularity rankings? That’s the definition of a “main” chart, in my eyes.

The main chart isn't for chart watchers, it's for labels to track how the songs they are currently promoting and actively spending money on are doing.

I know it’s not “for” chart watchers. Hell, most of chart watchers on this board seem to prefer the recurrent rules because they make the chart “less boring”. So if the main chart is really for the labels’ tracking purposes, wouldn’t a comprehensive chart (currents alongside recurrents) paint a more accurate picture of how the songs they’re currently promoting are actually doing?

[Au$tin]

Dec 14, 2021 23:00:49 GMT -5 sheardbeard said:

Dec 14, 2021 22:40:03 GMT -5 Au$tin said:

The main chart isn't for chart watchers, it's for labels to track how the songs they are currently promoting and actively spending money on are doing.

I know it’s not “for” chart watchers. Hell, most of chart watchers on this board seem to prefer the recurrent rules because they make the chart “less boring”. So if the main chart is really for the labels’ tracking purposes, wouldn’t a comprehensive chart (currents alongside recurrents) paint a more accurate picture of how the songs they’re currently promoting are actually doing?

No. It's to compare how the actively promoted songs are performing to each other. A label doesn't care that their artist's five year old track they aren't pouring money into is #67 on a comprehensive list, but they do care about the actively promoted song with money being spent is #82 on a list of currently promoted songs with similar attributes. Without recurrent rules, they would not be able to have that information.

Although one could argue that the main album chart doesn't have recurrent rules despite serving a similar purpose I suppose.

[fridayteenage]

The album chart is also twice as long as it is.

[JukeboxJacob]

Dec 15, 2021 1:36:24 GMT -5 fridayteenage said:

The album chart is also twice as long as it is.

I never understood why. Is anyone else annoyed by a chart having 200 positions?

[phieaglesfan712]

Dec 15, 2021 5:21:14 GMT -5 JukeboxJacob said:

Dec 15, 2021 1:36:24 GMT -5 fridayteenage said:

The album chart is also twice as long as it is.

I never understood why. Is anyone else annoyed by a chart having 200 positions?

Yes, but the album chart has no recurrent rules, so it is at least it’s accurate. I prefer a songs chart with 50 positions and an album chart with 100. Too much filler with the bottom half of both charts.

[chingaling]

Dec 15, 2021 9:54:22 GMT -5 phieaglesfan712 said:

Dec 15, 2021 5:21:14 GMT -5 JukeboxJacob said:

I never understood why. Is anyone else annoyed by a chart having 200 positions?

Yes, but the album chart has no recurrent rules, so it is at least it’s accurate. I prefer a songs chart with 50 positions and an album chart with 100. Too much filler with the bottom half of both charts.

Remember the mail purpose of these charts is to be a tool for the industry, not consumers like us.

Labels want to know how their acts are performing, of course 200 positions is very useful for them.

Keep in mind that until Michael Jackson's death, Billboard 200 had a recurrency rule in place that excluded old albums.

He had to pass away for them to allow any album to chart (he had the 5 of the 10 best selling albums in the country that week but he was excluded from BB200 top ten because of recurrency rules at that time).

[jenglisbe]

Dec 15, 2021 5:21:14 GMT -5 JukeboxJacob said:

Dec 15, 2021 1:36:24 GMT -5 fridayteenage said:

The album chart is also twice as long as it is.

I never understood why. Is anyone else annoyed by a chart having 200 positions?

If anything you'd think there would be more positions on the singles chart as presumably at any given time there are more songs released (and being promoted in some way) than albums, but maybe not. Albums chart longer, though, so maybe it's related to that.

[sheardbeard]

Dec 15, 2021 12:06:31 GMT -5 chingaling said:

Dec 15, 2021 9:54:22 GMT -5 phieaglesfan712 said:

Yes, but the album chart has no recurrent rules, so it is at least it’s accurate. I prefer a songs chart with 50 positions and an album chart with 100. Too much filler with the bottom half of both charts.

Remember the mail purpose of these charts is to be a tool for the industry, not consumers like us.

Labels want to know how their acts are performing, of course 200 positions is very useful for them.

Keep in mind that until Michael Jackson's death, Billboard 200 had a recurrency rule in place that excluded old albums.

He had to pass away for them to allow any album to chart (he had the 5 of the 10 best selling albums in the country that week but he was excluded from BB200 top ten because of recurrency rules at that time).

I just think the Hot 100 songs chart should mirror the same rules (or lack thereof) as the Billboard 200 album chart. Make a separate currents-only chart if need be, but the Hot 100 should be comprehensive.

[nathanalbright]

I don't think it would be too much work to have a Top 100 Comprehensive Songs chart that had no recurrency rules but that had the same points rules as the Hot 100 itself. It might help the industry figure out what songs had considerable legs and long-term appeal with the general public, given the tendency for chart stagnation that appears to be the present meta.

[imbondz]

When albums sold a ton pre streaming and downloads, the top 200 made sense.

[Rose "Payola" Nylund]

Dec 15, 2021 9:54:22 GMT -5 phieaglesfan712 said:

Dec 15, 2021 5:21:14 GMT -5 JukeboxJacob said:

I never understood why. Is anyone else annoyed by a chart having 200 positions?

Yes, but the album chart has no recurrent rules, so it is at least it’s accurate. I prefer a songs chart with 50 positions and an album chart with 100. Too much filler with the bottom half of both charts.

“I would prefer less information than what they presently provide (because my small mind can’t grasp the amount of content they provide? 🤯)”

I literally don’t know why else anyone would want less?

[jenglisbe]

Dec 14, 2021 8:22:30 GMT -5 Baby Yoda Hot100Fan said:

Using the stats in this video and the chart formula as we know it (but not knowing the breakdown of paid/free/programmed streams), "AIWFCIY" was ahead of "RATCT" by 25-30 chart points points.

[Baby Yoda Hot100Fan]

^Another way to see it: Radio Songs #22 AIWFCIY, #42 RATCT; Digital Song Sales #9 AIWFCIY, #11 RATCT; Streaming Songs; Streaming Songs #1 AIWFCIY, #2 RATCT. According to chartessentials @ Twitter streaming would accountrf for more than 80% of the weekly points for both songs last week.

[dremolus - solarpunk]

If anything, I want a larger chart. Go 200 songs. It's the age of streaming, everything's less centralized so charts might as well reflect that

[chanman]

Dec 15, 2021 18:15:56 GMT -5 jenglisbe said:

Dec 14, 2021 8:22:30 GMT -5 Baby Yoda Hot100Fan said:

Using the stats in this video and the chart formula as we know it (but not knowing the breakdown of paid/free/programmed streams), "AIWFCIY" was ahead of "RATCT" by 25-30 chart points points.

Oh I wouldnt trust those figures entirely. Those are not official Billboard figures even if the point difference is correct. Those belong to chart predictor - Cedric. The only correct figures are the ones Billboard stated in their Top 10 article, the rest is from Cedric.