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Post by music on Feb 28, 2008 2:33:44 GMT -5
Yes. Mariah's music has no personality and many of her recent attempts have been pretty generic... Mariah is known for the VOICE, being insane, and having a bunch of #1 hits....but I think anybody who isn't a crazy lamb would not be able to name 5 off the top of their head. Exactly.
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mrmister
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Post by mrmister on Feb 28, 2008 12:08:48 GMT -5
Mariah has never had anything to say with her music, especially singles. It's mostly by-the-numbers love songs and things of the like. Her videos are banal and once again never dealt with any real issues. She's not a visual force and thus has no memorable images attached to her. She's made no cultural impact. She's a singer, not an artist/visionary/performer. And apparently she's fine with that and has chosen that path. So be it. But Diana Ross and Whitney Houston weren't visionaries either yet they're regarded as icons/legends.
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K Newman
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Post by K Newman on Feb 28, 2008 12:16:28 GMT -5
Mariah has never had anything to say with her music, especially singles. It's mostly by-the-numbers love songs and things of the like. Her videos are banal and once again never dealt with any real issues. She's not a visual force and thus has no memorable images attached to her. She's made no cultural impact. She's a singer, not an artist/visionary/performer. And apparently she's fine with that and has chosen that path. So be it. But Diana Ross and Whitney Houston weren't visionaries either yet they're regarded as icons/legends. People that are regarded as icons are usually the ones that are great performers. They have a personality on stage and people identify it. Mariah Carey doesn't have 1/10th the stage presence and charisma that Ross and Houston have.
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hidizzyguy
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Post by hidizzyguy on Feb 28, 2008 12:53:09 GMT -5
She's made no cultural impact. She's a singer, not an artist/visionary/performer. And apparently she's fine with that and has chosen that path. So be it. I think I responded to this type of comment earlier in this thread. This is probably the most ridiculous statement about Mariah that could ever be said.
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Post by music on Feb 28, 2008 17:03:27 GMT -5
She has zero stage presence, no skills as a live performer, a musc video catalog as banal as they come, no iconic images attached to her, and has done nothing interesting musically. (She was *not* the first singer/female singer/pop artist/whatever to put rappers on her songs, I'm tired of hearing that.)
She is well known but she is not an icon.
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Post by music on Feb 28, 2008 17:05:16 GMT -5
Mariah has never had anything to say with her music, especially singles. It's mostly by-the-numbers love songs and things of the like. Her videos are banal and once again never dealt with any real issues. She's not a visual force and thus has no memorable images attached to her. She's made no cultural impact. She's a singer, not an artist/visionary/performer. And apparently she's fine with that and has chosen that path. So be it. But Diana Ross and Whitney Houston weren't visionaries either yet they're regarded as icons/legends. Not for their talents beyond singing/vocals though. And they're not pop culture icons on the level of Elvis/The Beatles/Madonna/MJ.
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Post by music on Feb 28, 2008 17:06:09 GMT -5
But Diana Ross and Whitney Houston weren't visionaries either yet they're regarded as icons/legends. People that are regarded as icons are usually the ones that are great performers. They have a personality on stage and people identify it. Mariah Carey doesn't have 1/10th the stage presence and charisma that Ross and Houston have. Also true.
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Feb 28, 2008 18:49:05 GMT -5
^Whitney Houston IMO really doesn't seem like a "legend"...I guess it's cause she gets so little recurrent airplay, and her style was always kinda all over the place (from one CD to the next) - I just can't imagine her sellin out stadiums (but could be completely wrong lol)
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mrmister
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Post by mrmister on Feb 29, 2008 15:53:34 GMT -5
^really? Where do you live? Her songs get plenty of recurrent. Plus she gets standing ovations when she goes to events. I wish Mariah got aht kind of treatment. :( I don't know about stadiums though. I think I remember reading that she played to sold out stadiums at Wembley in teh 80s/90s. But today she lost her fans I think.
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Mar 1, 2008 13:14:16 GMT -5
^ I think I remember reading that she played to sold out stadiums at Wembley in teh 80s/90s. But today she lost her fans I think. Yeah...I guess that's what I meant (can't imagine her sellin out stadiums in the 2000s) while Mariah still can I think And yeah...basically no recurrent airplay for Whitney in Atlanta (unless it's on Urban AC)
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K Newman
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Post by K Newman on Mar 1, 2008 17:22:34 GMT -5
^Lol Mariah can't sell out stadiums. Never have, never will. She's never been a touring act. Even during her comeback, her ticket sales weren't that great. If Whitney made even a decent comeback, she would still be able to do a successful world tour. But she's been gone for so long, she alienated her fans so she can't sell out like she used to. If Mariah went away for 6 years, trust me she would do worse than Katherine McPhee on a tour.
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4 Minutes to be a Legend
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Post by 4 Minutes to be a Legend on Mar 1, 2008 19:47:05 GMT -5
Mariah works best in the studio...everyone knows that. She is a studio artist. She has an INCREDIBLE talented voice, however it is best showcased in the studio. I think she likes writing, arranging, producing, and recording more than she does promoting, singing, touring and all that. She likes the technical part of the singing aspect.
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Mar 3, 2008 18:13:27 GMT -5
^Lol Mariah can't sell out stadiums. Lol had no idea (just assumed she could)...
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Post by RihannaFAN²=ColdUmbrella! on Mar 3, 2008 20:24:59 GMT -5
She has zero stage presence, no skills as a live performer, a musc video catalog as banal as they come, no iconic images attached to her, and has done nothing interesting musically. (She was *not* the first singer/female singer/pop artist/whatever to put rappers on her songs, I'm tired of hearing that.) She is well known but she is not an icon. i agree
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Post by slave4supernewty on Mar 3, 2008 22:21:41 GMT -5
Mariah never set out to influence culture. She was never about image, she was just about writing and singing songs. She was never out there being controversial like Madonna or constantly changing her image. She was just a singer.
She actually has a lot of memorable songs but they are remembered by a younger generation, people in their teens to mid-20's. This group is generally not thought about and discredited but Mariah Carey was played ALOT on radio throughout the 90's and most young people know a couple Mariah Carey songs and own an album or two. We just watched a concert at work and everyone remembered Fantasy, Dreamlover, Hero, All I Want For Christmas Is You, Emotions, Vision Of Love, even people who didn't like her.
You don't get played that much, become the #1 radio artist of the 90's and achieve as much as she has without having some significance. She definitely doesn't have the respect she deserves and people don't know how diverse and great her catalogue is. She was never super-mature like Whitney was so that could be it....Maybe one day....
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Post by slave4supernewty on Mar 3, 2008 22:44:09 GMT -5
^Lol Mariah can't sell out stadiums. Never have, never will. She's never been a touring act. Even during her comeback, her ticket sales weren't that great. If Whitney made even a decent comeback, she would still be able to do a successful world tour. But she's been gone for so long, she alienated her fans so she can't sell out like she used to. If Mariah went away for 6 years, trust me she would do worse than Katherine McPhee on a tour. It's hard for anyone to sell out stadiums. Rock acts can and Madonna can internationally. Mariah can sell out a stadium in Asia. She's soldout multiple nights at the Tokyo Dome and stadiums in China, Malaysia, Korea, The Philippenes, etc. She has zero stage presence, no skills as a live performer, a musc video catalog as banal as they come, no iconic images attached to her, and has done nothing interesting musically. (She was *not* the first singer/female singer/pop artist/whatever to put rappers on her songs, I'm tired of hearing that.) She is well known but she is not an icon. And I'll agree with you to some extent. Mariah pre-1999 had stage presence but it was because she was very confident in her voice. She dressed up and sounded great onstage. She was no Whitney but her voice just blew everything away. She's lost confidence in her voice and it's made her very awkward on stage. Mariah actually has some great videos. Her early videos are forgettable but Honey, My All, Butterfly, The Roof, Breakdown, Boy, Bringin On The Heartbreak, I Still Believe, Don't Forget About Us, Say Somethin' are great visual videos and many have influences from old movies or events. And she was not the first singer to put a rapper on her song but the first to make it very popular and mainstream and she was a pop-balladeer putting a rapper on her song. She made hip-hop cross over into pop and many hip-hop historians credit her with that.
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Mar 3, 2008 23:43:18 GMT -5
She was never about image, she was just about writing and singing songs. Really?
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Post by slave4supernewty on Mar 4, 2008 2:29:28 GMT -5
She was never about image, she was just about writing and singing songs. Really? When I say image, I mean, she wasn't controversial like Madonna or sexual like Madonna or Janet. She wasn't about having a definitive iconic look like Janet did during Rhythm Nation or Madonna did for Like A Virgin, Dick Tracey, Erotica, etc. She just released albums and sung and looked pretty. Yeah, she changed her image and started wearing less clothing starting in 1997 but she was never about the image or persona like a Madonna was. She was a singer.
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hidizzyguy
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Post by hidizzyguy on Mar 4, 2008 2:33:13 GMT -5
What kind of cultural significance did Whitney contribute?.. or celine?.... or any of the other big singers of her time..... They are known as singers, and they are known for their voices.
You guys can sit here and say she meant nothing as a cultural icon.. but, the why the hell is she up there with Elvis and the Beatles and Madonna?
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Post by RihannaFAN²=ColdUmbrella! on Mar 4, 2008 3:02:12 GMT -5
What kind of cultural significance did Whitney contribute?.. or celine?.... or any of the other big singers of her time..... They are known as singers, and they are known for their voices. You guys can sit here and say she meant nothing as a cultural icon.. but, the why the hell is she up there with Elvis and the Beatles and Madonna? whitney has the respect and stage presence mariah has not achieved.
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K Newman
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Post by K Newman on Mar 4, 2008 10:52:02 GMT -5
What kind of cultural significance did Whitney contribute?.. or celine?.... or any of the other big singers of her time..... They are known as singers, and they are known for their voices. You guys can sit here and say she meant nothing as a cultural icon.. but, the why the hell is she up there with Elvis and the Beatles and Madonna? whitney started the big voiced diva thing, and was important for black women crossing over (and paved the way for celine and mariah). she's credited with that. she also recorded 'i will always love you' and 'greatest love of all' and captivated the nation with the national anthem. and she has a personality on stage and was a big touring act in her prime. celine is like the barbra streisand of today. she is known for the over the top pop ballads, her weird facial expressions and accent, for being 'uncool', great performer, she recorded 'the titanic song' her tours and vegas shows. Mariah is mostly just known for her chart accomplishements and for 'all i want for christmas'.
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hidizzyguy
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Post by hidizzyguy on Mar 4, 2008 13:36:16 GMT -5
"Mariah is mostly just known for her chart accomplishements and for 'all i want for christmas'. "
As if that means nothing........ *rolley eyes*
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K Newman
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Post by K Newman on Mar 4, 2008 14:21:53 GMT -5
"Mariah is mostly just known for her chart accomplishements and for 'all i want for christmas'. " As if that means nothing........ *rolley eyes* Its not that it doesn't mean nothing. Its just that for someone of her success and talent, her legacy should be more than that. Thats all.
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hidizzyguy
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Post by hidizzyguy on Mar 4, 2008 14:39:17 GMT -5
You make it seem as if any artist can wake up one day and say... "I think I'll have No.1 song after No. 1 song for years and years of my singing career....of which almost every one of them is co-penned and co-produced by me."
*rolley eyes*
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mikeshere
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Post by mikeshere on Mar 4, 2008 17:11:31 GMT -5
whitney has the respect and stage presence mariah has not achieved.
LOLOLOLOLOL NO REALLY..
I think Mariah has ALOT more respect in the music industry than Whitney.. be serious!!!, her stage precense is AMAZING.. she sings live like no other, and Mariah isnt just known for her chart success shes also known for having a power house of a voice and a vocal range that is in the guiness book of world records.. I dont know 1 person who doesnt have or know a Mariah song/album... my 70 yr old Grandmother has Mariah TAPES... straight down to my lil sister who is 11 and owns TEOM... if i asked her who whitney houston was she would have no idea...
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Post by hearthemusic11 on Mar 4, 2008 18:05:06 GMT -5
And she was not the first singer to put a rapper on her song but the first to make it very popular and mainstream and she was a pop-balladeer putting a rapper on her song. She made hip-hop cross over into pop and many hip-hop historians credit her with that. So it's her fault then. Although J Lo is who made it annoying as hell.
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atlantaboy
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Post by atlantaboy on Mar 4, 2008 18:33:58 GMT -5
What kind of cultural significance did Whitney contribute?.. or celine?.... or any of the other big singers of her time..... They are known as singers, and they are known for their voices. You guys can sit here and say she meant nothing as a cultural icon.. but, the why the hell is she up there with Elvis and the Beatles and Madonna? whitney has the respect and stage presence mariah has not achieved. The prob. though is that Whitney has lost it (prob. since the Bodyguard days)...really don't think she has much "respect" nowadays, but she def. did from about 1985-1993 - after that seems like it was all downhill for her In other words, if you polled Americans today, I'm pretty sure Mariah would score much higher on the "respect" scale than Whitney (but can't prove it lol)
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Post by Devil Marlena Nylund on Mar 4, 2008 19:06:33 GMT -5
I think for what Mariah HAS achieved, it has been pretty massive for her. So in looking only at the things that she's achieved and succeeded at in her career then yeah, she's huge. But in looking at the bigger picture, it's not really a *lot*. I'm not trying to diminish her achievements but in the broad scale of what a performer/singer/etc (person in the music industry) can achieve, Mariah hasn't covered a lot of that scale. But she's mastered the sections that she's covered, ie. singing and chart success.
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Post by RihannaFAN²=ColdUmbrella! on Mar 4, 2008 21:30:24 GMT -5
whitney has the respect and stage presence mariah has not achieved. The prob. though is that Whitney has lost it (prob. since the Bodyguard days)...really don't think she has much "respect" nowadays, but she def. did from about 1985-1993 - after that seems like it was all downhill for her In other words, if you polled Americans today, I'm pretty sure Mariah would score much higher on the "respect" scale than Whitney (but can't prove it lol) Whitney has great rsepect from the grammies winning ROTY and AOTY what mariah never could pull off with her being nominated many times,also whitney is also respected for her acting which we know mimi was not really successful at doing.
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Post by slave4supernewty on Mar 4, 2008 22:14:27 GMT -5
I think for what Mariah HAS achieved, it has been pretty massive for her. So in looking only at the things that she's achieved and succeeded at in her career then yeah, she's huge. But in looking at the bigger picture, it's not really a *lot*. I'm not trying to diminish her achievements but in the broad scale of what a performer/singer/etc (person in the music industry) can achieve, Mariah hasn't covered a lot of that scale. But she's mastered the sections that she's covered, ie. singing and chart success. Well singing and chart sucess is pretty much it. What she hasn't achieved is cultural significance and songs that can be considered the anthem to an era or period. I feel the younger generation relates to her more because everyone knows Mariah Carey songs. This generation just isn't recognized as being credible.
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