tinawina
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Post by tinawina on Dec 21, 2010 21:30:28 GMT -5
People like Beyonce, Eminem, Pink, Usher, Avril, Alicia, Justin and Britney have established fanbases where they are able to shift units. I see what you are saying, but Avril and Justin have not been tested in this climate. Everyone else you mentioned has literally a decade of hits to draw from. They have built these fanbases over multiple smash albums. None of these newer people, male or female, have that yet. The only possible exception is Rihanna. Everyone else is facing a new reality... you are not going to get those sales as primarily a pop radio act. The only newer person who has done it was Gaga, and MAYBE Beiber as your brand new teen sensation. I just don't think Katy is the problem. And I'm not even a stan of hers. This just seems to be the way it is now. Basically it's going to remain to be tough for up and comers to break through and sell a lot. This. |
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pnobelysk
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Post by pnobelysk on Dec 21, 2010 21:40:15 GMT -5
i agree katy isnt a problem, if you think theres a lack of sales/profit look at her single sales.
"Taylor Swift is the only one recently on Eminem's level"
we will have to see how gaga does on her sophomore album, but i do think she is a contender to be added to that group
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pnobelysk
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Post by pnobelysk on Dec 21, 2010 21:41:31 GMT -5
Aside from Taylor Swift and Eminem, what acts who rack up decent radio hits are selling 1.5m+ albums (especially without a re-release)? BEP did with the last album, but unlikely to happen for BEP this time out. nickelback, beyonce. |
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pnobelysk
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Post by pnobelysk on Dec 21, 2010 21:43:12 GMT -5
I think the problem is Katy doesn't have a niche market as well as mass pop-appeal. To say that Pop hits / acts can't sell isn't an argument that can be made because Lady Gaga, etc, are able to sell. Lady GaGa has her gays/dance fans, Rihanna has the urban crowd, Avril has the pop-punk scene kids, etc, all in addition to their mass appeal to Pop. Katy doesn't really have anything besides pop fans, those who aren't really committed, and will just move on to the next new popular act when that time comes. Pls don't include RiRi and Avril there. RiRi can't move albums to save her life, and Avril, I won't even comment. But I do agree with everything else. Lady GaGa has her built-in fan base, same with Beyonce and Britney. rihanna will likley sell at least 1 million copies of her most recent 4 albums. thats very consistent sales. and shows a solid fanbase. avirl if really iffy, she could have a great comeback or do an xtina |
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Nadia
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Post by Nadia on Dec 21, 2010 22:05:32 GMT -5
Pls don't include RiRi and Avril there. RiRi can't move albums to save her life.. ??? RiRi is selling 350k worldwide per week? ??? ikr? some people  |
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leoapp
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Post by leoapp on Dec 21, 2010 22:36:25 GMT -5
Aside from Taylor Swift and Eminem, what acts who rack up decent radio hits are selling 1.5m+ albums (especially without a re-release)? BEP did with the last album, but unlikely to happen for BEP this time out. nickelback, beyonce. Carrie Underwood, Lady Gaga, Britney Spears |
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Dec 21, 2010 22:49:48 GMT -5
Well, Gaga, yes- but that album was released in late 2008, as was Spears, Nickelback and Beyonce. Among albums released within the last year, it's not all that many- and that probably is because of the continued decline of album sales.
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cartman2002
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Post by cartman2002 on Dec 21, 2010 23:27:35 GMT -5
This week only the #6 albums sold more copies then the albums did in the top 10 did but only by about 1000 copies
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SPRΞΞ
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Post by SPRΞΞ on Dec 22, 2010 3:23:57 GMT -5
the shade thrown at Katy in this thread is unbearable.  She is doing great! She's been relatively in the top 20 of the BB 200 ever since it's release. And lately, her numbers have only gone up. Everything is subjective. Is Rihanna selling 100k+ every week cuz she also has #1's on her album? No. Are the BEP's selling over 100k every week? No. Is Kesha selling 100k every week cuz she has #1's also? No. Should everything be compared to Eminem and Taylor? No. a lot of you whine and moan about everything, but not me. I think her numbers are pretty darn good given the climate. This isn't 2004 anymore (with Breakaway numbers). I can't believe some of you expect her to be selling millions right now. This is only her 2nd album. With over 11 million downloads WW, 3 US #1's, and a plethora of other achievements, how can anyone say she's "underperformed"? It's just imo. given the context, Rihanna's numbers are also good. She is basically on the same playing field as Katy and is selling exactly the same. Are they both underperforming? Absolutely not. Mariah is doing well also. You just can't compare 2000 sales numbers with a 2010 sales climate. If you look at the top 10 on pop, i don't really see anyone who is beating Katy in the sales department. |
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oldskool2
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Post by oldskool2 on Dec 22, 2010 3:43:33 GMT -5
Aside from Taylor Swift and Eminem, what acts who rack up decent radio hits are selling 1.5m+ albums (especially without a re-release)? BEP did with the last album, but unlikely to happen for BEP this time out. nickelback, beyonce. Alicia Keys. she moved 1.5mill copies with no Top 20 single of her album. all these with multiple #1's struggle to get past GOLD LMAO |
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Brazilian Guy
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Post by Brazilian Guy on Dec 22, 2010 8:39:43 GMT -5
Go Pink! Almost 50k for her fourth week (or is it fifth) is awesome.
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HolidayGuy
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Post by HolidayGuy on Dec 22, 2010 8:57:00 GMT -5
Through the 11/20 chart, Keys' album was at 1.446m- so, not quite there yet. ;) Also, albums released in-between Thanksgiving week and New Year's see a nice bulk of sales in those weeks.
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slw84
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I only tolerate legends
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Post by slw84 on Dec 22, 2010 11:01:12 GMT -5
the shade thrown at Katy in this thread is unbearable. She is doing great! She's been relatively in the top 20 of the BB 200 ever since it's release. And lately, her numbers have only gone up. Everything is subjective. Is Rihanna selling 100k+ every week cuz she also has #1's on her album? No. Are the BEP's selling over 100k every week? No. Is Kesha selling 100k every week cuz she has #1's also? No. Should everything be compared to Eminem and Taylor? No. a lot of you whine and moan about everything, but not me. I think her numbers are pretty darn good given the climate. This isn't 2004 anymore (with Breakaway numbers). I can't believe some of you expect her to be selling millions right now. This is only her 2nd album. With over 11 million downloads WW, 3 US #1's, and a plethora of other achievements, how can anyone say she's "underperformed"? It's just imo. given the context, Rihanna's numbers are also good. She is basically on the same playing field as Katy and is selling exactly the same. Are they both underperforming? Absolutely not. Mariah is doing well also. You just can't compare 2000 sales numbers with a 2010 sales climate. If you look at the top 10 on pop, i don't really see anyone who is beating Katy in the sales department. True except if Riri is in the same department as Katy with having 3 more album releases with her one would think a more established fanbase is to be expected. But they are not flopping so... |
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slw84
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I only tolerate legends
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Post by slw84 on Dec 22, 2010 11:14:42 GMT -5
People like Beyonce, Eminem, Pink, Usher, Avril, Alicia, Justin and Britney have established fanbases where they are able to shift units. I see what you are saying, but Avril and Justin have not been tested in this climate. None of these newer people, male or female, have that yet. The only possible exception is Rihanna. >>>But Riri's sales are adequate (in the U.S.). Her sales are actually on par with the newers acts considering she has been in the game since 2005. I just don't think Katy is the problem. And I'm not even a stan of hers. This just seems to be the way it is now. >>>I love her personality and for me that sells me but I don't see how it is not her...I believe she is incredibly likable but if she is having huge hits and promoting her records why aren't people investing into buying her albums vs. buying her singles. People invest in Gaga, Taylor and Justin Bieber who is doing both, they invest in Em, Usher, Britney, Beyonce as well. Valid points all around but I am not in agreement totally. Gaga and Bieber will be added to that group...Beyonce considering that she will work the heck out of the album. Avril will probably be a platinum seller and I think Justin Timberlake would be added to the group as well. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2010 13:11:09 GMT -5
People like Beyonce, Eminem, Pink, Usher, Avril, Alicia, Justin and Britney have established fanbases where they are able to shift units. I see what you are saying, but Avril and Justin have not been tested in this climate. Good point. None of these newer people, male or female, have that yet. The only possible exception is Rihanna. >>>But Riri's sales are adequate (in the U.S.). Her sales are actually on par with the newers acts considering she has been in the game since 2005. Eh, I'm not sure if this is a point though. I guess you're specifically talking about "Rated R" sales but compared to the newer acts you're talking about (I'm guessing Katy and Ke$ha?), there's a big difference between the eras even though sales were similar. The way I see it, using that logic, somebody could have said the same about Britney in 2007 because of "Blackout" sales compared to some of the newer artists at that time (eg. Katy Perry OOTB, even Rihanna GGGB) even though there was also a big difference between those eras compared to Brit's even when sales were similar. Commercially, "Blackout" is seen as a dud era for Britney just like "Rated R" is generally seen as for Rihanna, especially coming right after GGGB. |
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Post by areyoureadytojump on Dec 22, 2010 13:33:15 GMT -5
the shade thrown at Katy in this thread is unbearable. She is doing great! She's been relatively in the top 20 of the BB 200 ever since it's release. And lately, her numbers have only gone up. Everything is subjective. Is Rihanna selling 100k+ every week cuz she also has #1's on her album? No. Are the BEP's selling over 100k every week? No. Is Kesha selling 100k every week cuz she has #1's also? No. Should everything be compared to Eminem and Taylor? No. a lot of you whine and moan about everything, but not me. I think her numbers are pretty darn good given the climate. This isn't 2004 anymore (with Breakaway numbers). I can't believe some of you expect her to be selling millions right now. This is only her 2nd album. With over 11 million downloads WW, 3 US #1's, and a plethora of other achievements, how can anyone say she's "underperformed"? It's just imo. given the context, Rihanna's numbers are also good. She is basically on the same playing field as Katy and is selling exactly the same. Are they both underperforming? Absolutely not. Mariah is doing well also. You just can't compare 2000 sales numbers with a 2010 sales climate. If you look at the top 10 on pop, i don't really see anyone who is beating Katy in the sales department. Thank you! I agree. |
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TGIF
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Post by TGIF on Dec 22, 2010 14:59:54 GMT -5
the shade thrown at Katy in this thread is unbearable. She is doing great! She's been relatively in the top 20 of the BB 200 ever since it's release. And lately, her numbers have only gone up. Everything is subjective. Is Rihanna selling 100k+ every week cuz she also has #1's on her album? No. Are the BEP's selling over 100k every week? No. Is Kesha selling 100k every week cuz she has #1's also? No. Should everything be compared to Eminem and Taylor? No. a lot of you whine and moan about everything, but not me. I think her numbers are pretty darn good given the climate. This isn't 2004 anymore (with Breakaway numbers). I can't believe some of you expect her to be selling millions right now. This is only her 2nd album. With over 11 million downloads WW, 3 US #1's, and a plethora of other achievements, how can anyone say she's "underperformed"? It's just imo. given the context, Rihanna's numbers are also good. She is basically on the same playing field as Katy and is selling exactly the same. Are they both underperforming? Absolutely not. Mariah is doing well also. You just can't compare 2000 sales numbers with a 2010 sales climate. If you look at the top 10 on pop, i don't really see anyone who is beating Katy in the sales department. people still don't understand that we're in 2010. no female popstar besides Gaga sells more than 3 million copies in the last 2 years and she is literally a phenomenon so you can't hold her as the standard for everybody else and say they're not successful if they're not selling that much |
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TGIF
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you gimme that hummingbird heartbeat!
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Post by TGIF on Dec 22, 2010 15:08:15 GMT -5
I see what you are saying, but Avril and Justin have not been tested in this climate. Good point. None of these newer people, male or female, have that yet. The only possible exception is Rihanna. >>>But Riri's sales are adequate (in the U.S.). Her sales are actually on par with the newers acts considering she has been in the game since 2005. Eh, I'm not sure if this is a point though. I guess you're specifically talking about "Rated R" sales but compared to the newer acts you're talking about (I'm guessing Katy and Ke$ha?), there's a big difference between the eras even though sales were similar. The way I see it, using that logic, somebody could have said the same about Britney in 2007 because of "Blackout" sales compared to some of the newer artists at that time (eg. Katy Perry OOTB, even Rihanna GGGB) even though there was also a big difference between those eras compared to Brit's even when sales were similar. Commercially, "Blackout" is seen as a dud era for Britney just like "Rated R" is generally seen as for Rihanna, especially coming right after GGGB. i agree with this too. i dont get why people act like its an anomaly or a bad thing for older artists if newer artists are selling the same ??? if people are saying its bad that katy & ke$ha are selling on the same level as rihanna...then what do they say about lady gaga selling more than britney and beyonce who have been around for more than 10 years? ??? |
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tinawina
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Betrayed and Heartbroken. Kelly weeps.
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Post by tinawina on Dec 22, 2010 15:14:59 GMT -5
>>>I love her personality and for me that sells me but I don't see how it is not her...I believe she is incredibly likable but if she is having huge hits and promoting her records why aren't people investing into buying her albums vs. buying her singles. People invest in Gaga, Taylor and Justin Bieber who is doing both, they invest in Em, Usher, Britney, Beyonce as well. Valid points all around but I am not in agreement totally. Gaga and Bieber will be added to that group...Beyonce considering that she will work the heck out of the album. Avril will probably be a platinum seller and I think Justin Timberlake would be added to the group as well. Oh I get it, she has hits and she's been really really well promoted, so it seems low. But look at it this way... almost 3 years ago, in January 2008, most pop listeners never heard of the following people: Katy Perry, Lady Gaga, Jason Derulo, Kesha, B.O.B., Bruno Mars All of them are have had multiple huge hits in only the past three years. Only one of them sold, or look to sell, more than say 1.5 when all is said and done. Everyone else you mention has been out for years. Beiber's sales are certainly not driven by pop airplay, because he really doesn't get that much of it. So that's why I say its not really Katy. If there were more newer people besides Gaga doing it, then I'd say yes, its her. But honestly, Gaga really does look like the outlier to me. |
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pnobelysk
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Post by pnobelysk on Dec 22, 2010 16:09:56 GMT -5
katy and kesha can hit 1.5 million. animals already at 1 million, so if it can get two more hits off of it, maybe she could pull it off, they just need to be huge hits. katy is smashing and we dont know how many singles will be released, but with 7ish singles released she could hit 1.5
"People invest in Gaga, Taylor and Justin Bieber who is doing both"
Bieber is very different, his singles only sell decently. None of his singles have it 3 million yet ( i dont believe). he is an album seller. His hits are supported, but not that much. Compared to Gaga who has two 5 million sellers, and Taylor who has a 4 million and a 3 million seller.
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slw84
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I only tolerate legends
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Post by slw84 on Dec 22, 2010 16:48:47 GMT -5
>>>I love her personality and for me that sells me but I don't see how it is not her...I believe she is incredibly likable but if she is having huge hits and promoting her records why aren't people investing into buying her albums vs. buying her singles. People invest in Gaga, Taylor and Justin Bieber who is doing both, they invest in Em, Usher, Britney, Beyonce as well. Valid points all around but I am not in agreement totally. Gaga and Bieber will be added to that group...Beyonce considering that she will work the heck out of the album. Avril will probably be a platinum seller and I think Justin Timberlake would be added to the group as well. Oh I get it, she has hits and she's been really really well promoted, so it seems low. But look at it this way... almost 3 years ago, in January 2008, most pop listeners never heard of the following people: Katy Perry, Lady Gaga, Jason Derulo, Kesha, B.O.B., Bruno Mars All of them are have had multiple huge hits in only the past three years. Only one of them sold, or look to sell, more than say 1.5 when all is said and done. Everyone else you mention has been out for years. Beiber's sales are certainly not driven by pop airplay, because he really doesn't get that much of it. So that's why I say its not really Katy. If there were more newer people besides Gaga doing it, then I'd say yes, its her. But honestly, Gaga really does look like the outlier to me. Ok, fair enough. |
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slw84
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I only tolerate legends
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Post by slw84 on Dec 22, 2010 16:56:06 GMT -5
people still don't understand that we're in 2010. no female popstar besides Gaga sells more than 3 million copies in the last 2 years and she is literally a phenomenon so you can't hold her as the standard for everybody else and say they're not successful if they're not selling that much [/quote] But there are popstars that sell more than 1 million copies... and not after 4 singles. I get that in 2010 we are not going to see 10x platinum albums but there are certain people with their popularity on radio, image, and marketing/promo I would think should have more ease getting #1 albums, selling well over platinum and this is with multiplatinum singles. But, whatever...it is what it is.  |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Dec 22, 2010 17:32:43 GMT -5
Good point. Eh, I'm not sure if this is a point though. I guess you're specifically talking about "Rated R" sales but compared to the newer acts you're talking about (I'm guessing Katy and Ke$ha?), there's a big difference between the eras even though sales were similar. The way I see it, using that logic, somebody could have said the same about Britney in 2007 because of "Blackout" sales compared to some of the newer artists at that time (eg. Katy Perry OOTB, even Rihanna GGGB) even though there was also a big difference between those eras compared to Brit's even when sales were similar. Commercially, "Blackout" is seen as a dud era for Britney just like "Rated R" is generally seen as for Rihanna, especially coming right after GGGB. i agree with this too. i dont get why people act like its an anomaly or a bad thing for older artists if newer artists are selling the same ??? if people are saying its bad that katy & ke$ha are selling on the same level as rihanna...then what do they say about lady gaga selling more than britney and beyonce who have been around for more than 10 years? ??? Exactly. Some people are looking at the number of hit singles some popstars release but they fail to see that nowadays, you have to pretty much milk an album for it to sell even over 2 million. Popstars can have popularity on radio, image and marketing and that still isn't enough with the current industry. |
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